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CI New Bizarre A330-300 Layout  
User currently offlinecoolfish1103 From United States of America, joined Feb 2008, 404 posts, RR: 1
Posted (3 years 7 months 1 week 5 days 5 hours ago) and read 17630 times:

I must say, it is the most bizarre layout I have ever seen. Also, since they manage to fit the same amount of seats in this configuration, it is almost certain that the Business seats in this layout is far worse.

You won't want to be on it for the Business section for sure.

China Airlines newly leased A330-300, B-18391 and B-18392, is to have the following layout.

48 Business (30 or 36 Business in other versions)
265 Economy (277 Economy in other versions)

Zone A: Economy Rows 28-39 (Approximate 31-32" pitch)

Rows 28, 39: DEFG only
Rows 29 - 38: AC - DEFG - HK

2 Toilets for 88 people = 1/44

Zone B: Business Rows 18-25 (Approximate 51" pitch, 333 = 52", 33A = 63")

Row 18: AC only
Rows 19 - 24: AC - DFG - HK
Row 25: AC and HK

2 Toilets for 48 people = 1/24 (Compare to 1/12 and 1/10 before...)
--
Zone B: Economy Rows 41-48 (Approximate 31-32" pitch)

Rows 41 - 45: AC - DEFG - HK
Rows 46: DEFG - HK
Rows 47 - 48: DEFG

2 Toilets

Zone C: Economy Rows 49-55

Row 49: DEFG
Rows 50 - 60: AC - DEFG - HK
Rows 61 - 64: AC - DFG - HK
Row 65: DFG

2 Toilets

4 Toilets for 177 people = 4/177 = 44.25 people per toilet

Obviously, you want to be in the front section no matter what... and I wonder if the Economy passengers get to get off before the Business passengers...

Basically, a downgrade on the Business product, while an upgrade on Economy.

http://www.china-airlines.com/ch/check/a330.htm

[Edited 2011-01-21 11:17:32]

30 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlinemogandoCI From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 1, posted (3 years 7 months 1 week 5 days 5 hours ago) and read 17522 times:

for starters, C class is 2-3-2 is this new funky config instead of 2-2-2

probably for some regional destination that has no C yield anyway, so they treat it as a perk for elite status FFers buying expensive econ fare codes rather than trying selling them as a true C seat (how many people need C service from TPE to HKG anyway)


User currently offlinebluewhale18210 From United States of America, joined Aug 2006, 237 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (3 years 7 months 1 week 5 days 1 hour ago) and read 16893 times:

Most likely leased for all the TPE-Mainland China route where flight hours is 2-3 hours, tops.
I have been on worse F/C product for a 2-3 hour flight... Compared to US Domestic F product 51" seat pitch with AVOD on the same segment length is pretty good. As long as they don't use it for anything else they should be able to run those with relatively profitability.



JPS on A300-600RF A319/320 B737-400/800 B757-200F B767-300F CRJ-200/900. Looking to add more.
User currently offlinetrex8 From United States of America, joined Nov 2002, 4763 posts, RR: 14
Reply 3, posted (3 years 7 months 1 week 4 days 21 hours ago) and read 16391 times:
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Do we know what MTOW these new planes are?? I would have thought it more logical to get new higher weight versions for the long haul routes and relegate the older frames to the regional routes.

When did these two get delivered or is the website ahead of itself? The next two planes Ch aviation has listed for delivery to CI are cn 1272/8, these shouldn't be delivered till later this year at earliest unless the A330 line is really out of synch as the last CI A333 delivered in Nov was cn 1177!


User currently offline777-200X From United States of America, joined Apr 2000, 30 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (3 years 7 months 1 week 4 days 7 hours ago) and read 11493 times:

The configuration is for short haul flights according to the title of the two last seat maps in Chinese. mogando1 is correct that is likely only used for regional routes.

User currently offlinesuper80 From United States of America, joined Dec 2006, 148 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (3 years 7 months 1 week 4 days 7 hours ago) and read 11462 times:

Those two planes are for short-haul only as CI stated on their web site. So, it would not be too bad with people are to fly within the region.

http://www.china-airlines.com/en/check/a330.htm


User currently offlineaerorobnz From Rwanda, joined Feb 2001, 7184 posts, RR: 13
Reply 6, posted (3 years 7 months 1 week 4 days 3 hours ago) and read 9292 times:

I'm sure they use door 2L for entry/exit on that config..

User currently offlinetrex8 From United States of America, joined Nov 2002, 4763 posts, RR: 14
Reply 7, posted (3 years 7 months 1 week 4 days 2 hours ago) and read 9130 times:
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I can't find any info anywhere on where these two planes are from, are they second hand ones which have been leased? Anyone know their cn numbers and origin?

User currently offlinecoolfish1103 From United States of America, joined Feb 2008, 404 posts, RR: 1
Reply 8, posted (3 years 7 months 1 week 4 days 2 hours ago) and read 9020 times:

By the way, the approximate 51" is just an estimate. In reality it could be worse!

While the aircraft may be used mainly for local routes, I wouldn't be surprised if it gets sent anywhere long haul.


User currently offlinetrex8 From United States of America, joined Nov 2002, 4763 posts, RR: 14
Reply 9, posted (3 years 7 months 1 week 4 days ago) and read 8824 times:
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Its probably accurate enough, their A343 has a similar zone B layout with a handicapped toilet aft and a closet/galley forward and with 32in Y pitch you have 18 rows on the A343, here you can fit 8 rows of 50in J seats and 5 rows of Y.

User currently offlinebrenintw From Taiwan, joined Jul 2006, 1633 posts, RR: 1
Reply 10, posted (3 years 7 months 1 week 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 8482 times:

These aircraft are probably going to be based at TSA and used exclusively on TSA - HND and TSA-PRC routes. They probably won't go any further afield.


I'm tired of the A vs. B sniping. Neither make planes that shed wings randomly!
User currently offlineCXfirst From Norway, joined Jan 2007, 3061 posts, RR: 1
Reply 11, posted (3 years 7 months 1 week 3 days 18 hours ago) and read 8303 times:

In Taipei, do they usually use Door 1L or 2L when boarding and deboarding passengers. If they use 2L (or both), there will be no problem getting C class passengers off first.

But still, a very bizarre config. However, CI is not the first carrier to have a lower class in front of a higher class. IIRC, BA has Y+ infront of the C class passengers on the 747's with 52 business class seats.

-CXfirst



From Norway, live in Australia
User currently offlinejgw787 From United States of America, joined Dec 2010, 208 posts, RR: 0
Reply 12, posted (3 years 7 months 1 week 3 days 18 hours ago) and read 8252 times:

i dont get the point of having J in the middle (except for BA)...Ci and air asia x are the only ones that I know that do it...any more???

User currently offlineBirdwatching From Germany, joined Sep 2003, 3821 posts, RR: 51
Reply 13, posted (3 years 7 months 1 week 3 days 16 hours ago) and read 8047 times:

Quoting jgw787 (Reply 12):
i dont get the point of having J in the middle (except for BA)...Ci and air asia x are the only ones that I know that do it...any more???

Also, on some of their 747-200s, BA used to have World Traveler in the upper deck. I once flew fron LGW to MCO in 1997 in the upper deck in Economy, a great experience.

Soren   



All the things you probably hate about travelling are warm reminders that I'm home
User currently offlineSlinky09 From United Kingdom, joined Jun 2009, 830 posts, RR: 0
Reply 14, posted (3 years 7 months 1 week 3 days 16 hours ago) and read 7966 times:

Weren't these two aircraft originally destined for VS - perhaps they were fitted with the VS A333 initial seating which had no true J, just Y / PE / Y while they worked out the new suite issues?

User currently offlinetrex8 From United States of America, joined Nov 2002, 4763 posts, RR: 14
Reply 15, posted (3 years 7 months 1 week 3 days 5 hours ago) and read 7225 times:
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Quoting Slinky09 (Reply 14):
Weren't these two aircraft originally destined for VS -

Do you have any more info on this? Per airlinerlist.com, VS first aircraft are cn 1195, then 1201 and 1205 (ch aviation has 1195, 1201, 1206). For sure the most recent A delivery of a A333 to CI was cn 1177 in Nov 2010 (leased thru Guggenheim Aviation). The last one before that was in 2008, cn 920 leased thru ILFC. There are no planes in the A cn list which are not accounted for from 1177 to 1195 unless these were previously listed as not built ones which have been built.

Where are these planes B 18391/2 coming from? Are they GE powered like the rest of the fleet?


User currently offlineBAViscount From United Kingdom, joined Mar 2004, 2338 posts, RR: 4
Reply 16, posted (3 years 7 months 1 week 3 days 4 hours ago) and read 7180 times:

Quoting Birdwatching (Reply 13):
Also, on some of their 747-200s, BA used to have World Traveler in the upper deck.

On the 747-400s too. I once flew PIT-IAD-LHR on the upper deck in economy.



Ladies & gentlemen this is Captain Tobias Wilcock welcoming you aboard Coconut Airways flight 372 to Bridgetown Barb
User currently offlinebmibaby737 From United Kingdom, joined Jun 2005, 1806 posts, RR: 9
Reply 17, posted (3 years 7 months 4 days 2 hours ago) and read 6175 times:

Quoting Slinky09 (Reply 14):
Weren't these two aircraft originally destined for VS - perhaps they were fitted with the VS A333 initial seating which had no true J, just Y / PE / Y while they worked out the new suite issues?

Correct these are to be Virgin Atlantic aircraft that have long been rumoured to be heading to Asia. Planespotters.net is reporting the first one.

http://www.planespotters.net/Product...30/1206,G-VLUV-Virgin-Atlantic.php

I believe G-VSXY (1195) & G-VGEM (1215) will also go to China Airlines. As of 18 January 2011 Astraeus is currently marketing G-VINE (1231) for ACMI Lease with a C59Y253 configuration.


User currently offlinetrex8 From United States of America, joined Nov 2002, 4763 posts, RR: 14
Reply 18, posted (3 years 7 months 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 6127 times:
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Why aren't VS taking these planes?

Anyone know what WV model they are? I assume they will be higher MTOW versions.

[Edited 2011-01-29 15:00:30]

User currently offlinesutrakhk From Hong Kong, joined Apr 2008, 116 posts, RR: 0
Reply 19, posted (3 years 7 months 3 days 19 hours ago) and read 5733 times:

Just wondering with the 2-3-2 layout in Business class, would it be the Y+ seat using in VS?

User currently offlinetrex8 From United States of America, joined Nov 2002, 4763 posts, RR: 14
Reply 20, posted (3 years 7 months 3 days 9 hours ago) and read 5211 times:
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Quoting sutrakhk (Reply 19):
Just wondering with the 2-3-2 layout in Business class, would it be the Y+ seat using in VS?

CI are leasing at least 2 planes for only 2 years (there are varying reports as to whether they are getting 5 or 7 A333s in the next few years but at least 2 of these are for a 2 year lease) ,presumably the VS planes may be the ones involved. Maybe with such a short lease they don't want the expense of putting in the J seats they have on the other planes in their fleet though why they would move the Y+ seats to cabin B is beyond me - everything I have searched for a VSA333 seat plan shows the Y+ in cabin A.
Also per JP fleets the VS planes are 233K MTOW, these would be higher than anything else in the present CI fleet (though I don;t know what the MTOW of the latest one leased from GAP is) yet they seem to be planning, according to everyone else here, using these for TSA- mainland China (and maybe HND) routes rather than the longer haul A333 routes!!


User currently offlineVAAengineer From United States of America, joined Jul 2007, 90 posts, RR: 0
Reply 21, posted (3 years 7 months 3 days 7 hours ago) and read 5042 times:

Yes they are VS A333 CI are subleasing #3,4,5,6 from VS as I read yesterday in a company email.


God's Gift To Aviation
User currently offlineVimanav From India, joined Jul 2003, 1516 posts, RR: 14
Reply 22, posted (3 years 7 months 3 days 6 hours ago) and read 4842 times:

I remember a long time ago when TG operated DC-10-30ERs (HS-TMA, TMB, TMC), they used to have J/cl right up front followed by 10 F/cl seats and then Y/cl.

Seemed strange then too...

brgds//Vimanav



Sarfaroshi kii tamannaa ab hamaare dil mein hai, Dekhnaa hai zor kitnaa baazu-e-qaatil mein hai
User currently offlineflyinghippo From United States of America, joined Aug 2005, 684 posts, RR: 1
Reply 23, posted (3 years 7 months 3 days 6 hours ago) and read 4752 times:

Quoting trex8 (Reply 20):
Also per JP fleets the VS planes are 233K MTOW, these would be higher than anything else in the present CI fleet (though I don;t know what the MTOW of the latest one leased from GAP is) yet they seem to be planning, according to everyone else here, using these for TSA- mainland China (and maybe HND) routes rather than the longer haul A333 routes!!

They're on a short lease, it is not cost effective to retrofit a plane into CI's interior if they're only going to have it for 2 years.

What routes does CI need a higher MTOW A333s on? VIE?


User currently offlinesutrakhk From Hong Kong, joined Apr 2008, 116 posts, RR: 0
Reply 24, posted (3 years 7 months 3 days 5 hours ago) and read 4660 times:

Quoting trex8 (Reply 20):
Maybe with such a short lease they don't want the expense of putting in the J seats they have on the other planes in their fleet though why they would move the Y+ seats to cabin B is beyond me - everything I have searched for a VSA333 seat plan shows the Y+ in cabin A.

Can it be the following situations:
1. VS will have 2 kinds of A333 in the future, one is 2-Class (Y+/Y), another one is 3-Class (J/Y+/Y)
2. According to another post, the new J seats is not ready for VS, so they will have 2-Class A333 first.
3. VS leases A333s to CI, putting Y in cabin A, Y+ in cabin B, Y in cabin C
4. When the lease ended, VS remove the Y in cabin A and put the new J in it, and to be a 3-Class A333.

PS: According to a Hong Kong forum, CI want 7 A333, BR want 3 and GE want 1


25 trex8 : So VS orders 10 A333s, 6 directly from A and 4 via Aercap, though all 10 will eventually be owned by Aercap and leased to VS. First delivery was supp
26 pugsley : Re: AirAsia configuration on their A340 and having economy seats first and then their premium seats either side of doors two, then more economy all th
27 coolfish1103 : Well, the current CI 333 has less Dynasty (Business) seats in the front and apparently does not have issues with the even distribution of seats... so
28 flyinghippo : Thanks for the info... I wonder what are the main differences between the different versions of A333. Did they get the increased MTOW on new engines?
29 Slinky09 : VS stated not, that the 2 class was temporary until ... You're right, the new J / UCS is not ready to install, thing is, VS said this would happen in
30 Post contains links trex8 : Interesting thought but their A330s have a full Y cabin B and even less premium seats in cabin A than the A340 I'd have to agree with it is a little
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