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BA/IB Domestic European Routes  
User currently offlinebonave From United Kingdom, joined Oct 2010, 10 posts, RR: 0
Posted (3 years 8 months 1 week 22 hours ago) and read 2637 times:

Now the merger is complete I see that the group has the following options for European Flights:-
1. Keep the two brands worldwide
2. Merge the brands into one in Europe
3. Expand Vueling into a pan European carrier
4. Expand IAG to include an LCC an carrier (Air Berlin, Easyjet)
5. Create a new pan-European LCC (BA can use other brands they have BEA, Caledonian)

Any thoughts?

9 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlinelhr380 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 1, posted (3 years 8 months 1 week 22 hours ago) and read 2630 times:

Quoting bonave (Thread starter):
1. Keep the two brands worldwide
2. Merge the brands into one in Europe

BA/IB will stay as 2 separate airlines, just like KLM/AF. There has never been any talk of them being "One airline" under the same name.


User currently offlineN328KF From United States of America, joined May 2004, 6489 posts, RR: 3
Reply 2, posted (3 years 8 months 1 week 22 hours ago) and read 2582 times:

Quoting lhr380 (Reply 1):
BA/IB will stay as 2 separate airlines, just like KLM/AF. There has never been any talk of them being "One airline" under the same name.

Perhaps, but there are numerous subsidiaries that could be combined, along with minority interests in airlines outside of the home countries.



When they call the roll in the Senate, the Senators do not know whether to answer 'Present' or 'Not guilty.' T.Roosevelt
User currently offlineVV701 From United Kingdom, joined Aug 2005, 7575 posts, RR: 17
Reply 3, posted (3 years 8 months 1 week 22 hours ago) and read 2507 times:

The reasons why BA and IB will keep their separate identities are:

1. Both are internationally recognised brands - see Slide 57 in BA Investors' Day Presentation linked below

2. Both operate international flights under the authority of bilateral agreements signed by the governments of their separate countries. If IB and BA were to merge their identities then both airlines would have to withdraw their services to those international destinations covered by such agreements and limit their international flights to destinations within the EU and to those other destinations covered by applicable agreements signed by the EU such as the Open Skies agreement with the USA. For further information on the complex company structure of IAG necessary to achieve this see Slide 63 in the link below.

Here is the link in which Willie Walsh reviewed the details pertaining to IAG with Investors and Financial Analysts last year:

http://media.corporate-ir.net/media_.../01_ID_2010_Full_presentations.pdf

What we have already seen is route transfer. So, as long ago as the end of March 2010, IB withdrew from their BCN-LHR-BCN services as neither of these airports were its main hub. Since then all flights on this route have been operated by BA aircraft.

The main theme of the implementation of AA/BA/IB ATI - which is also covered in the presentation linked above is what the three airlines term "metal neutrality". By this they mean that to all employees of the airlines who interface with customers and/or the general republic the livery painted on the aircraft that will operate a given flight is irrelevant to the employee. So, if he or she is in a selling mode and is employed by airline A he or she should promote airlines A, B and C with equal emphasis.


User currently offlinerobso2 From Switzerland, joined Jun 2010, 218 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (3 years 8 months 1 week 21 hours ago) and read 2414 times:

Quoting bonave (Thread starter):
5. Create a new pan-European LCC (BA can use other brands they have BEA, Caledonian)

presumably you mean Past brands?



733/4/5/6/7/8/9, 319/20/21, 752, 744, 772, 332/3, 343/6, E70/90, AT43, AR85/1, D38, D10, M82
User currently offlineFlyCaledonian From United Kingdom, joined Dec 2003, 2093 posts, RR: 3
Reply 5, posted (3 years 8 months 1 week 18 hours ago) and read 2173 times:

Quoting bonave (Thread starter):
Now the merger is complete I see that the group has the following options for European Flights:-
1. Keep the two brands worldwide
2. Merge the brands into one in Europe

No. 2 is a possible option for shorthaul given that Europe is a single internal market. Whether Willie Walsh would want to pursue it is another matter. There was talk of IB setting up a new subsiduary to handle its shorthaul flights, but whether that still emerges (and just for MAD or LHR/LGW too) remains to be seen.



Let's Go British Caledonian!
User currently offlinelhr380 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 6, posted (3 years 8 months 1 week 18 hours ago) and read 2132 times:

Quoting FlyCaledonian (Reply 5):
No. 2 is a possible option for shorthaul given that Europe is a single internal market.

No its not. Both airlines will operate as themselves. A LCC might come out of it for some routes as IB have said they might be doing, but both BA and IB will operate as themselves intra Europe.


User currently offlineBA174 From United Kingdom, joined Oct 2009, 761 posts, RR: 0
Reply 7, posted (3 years 8 months 1 week 16 hours ago) and read 1953 times:

One single brand is out of the question and has never been part of the merger. Digging up the old BE and Caledonian brands is even less likley. WW has never been in favour of a million and one spin off brands from legacy airlines hence ending EI commuter and BA Connect, Loganair, GB, BMED while at EI/BA and moved may of their routes into mainline. He wants as much core "mainline" routes as possible. Obviously because of the premium market it appeals to OpenSkies was an exeption because of the EU/US agreements.

User currently offlineTalaier From Spain, joined May 2008, 490 posts, RR: 0
Reply 8, posted (3 years 8 months 1 week 13 hours ago) and read 1750 times:

IB is going to drop most of it's marginal European network (most of Germany, Nordics, some Eastern Europe) and give it over to YW so effectively same brand, same (or even better) service in smaller planes (CRJ1000s) that will keep yields up to ensure there is connecting feed. IB will keep sending its 320s to all other destinations granting a bigger plane. The same goes for its domestic network where YW and Vueling will get most of IB's traffic. This is mostly triggered by the inability of IB to reach an agreement with its pilots and cabin crew.

As to IAG, I'm pretty sure Vueling is going to be a key player in forthcoming years and it will become a Pan-European carrier (which in many ways it already is).

However, as noted above, both brands will continue to operate as separate entities.


User currently offlineLHRFlyer From United Kingdom, joined Apr 2010, 816 posts, RR: 1
Reply 9, posted (3 years 8 months 1 week 13 hours ago) and read 1711 times:

Quoting Talaier (Reply 8):
As to IAG, I'm pretty sure Vueling is going to be a key player in forthcoming years and it will become a Pan-European carrier (which in many ways it already is).

I do whether we may see Vueling arrive at LGW and build a short-haul presence there.


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