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CX's Upcoming HKG-ORD Service, Threat To UA?  
User currently offlinecx828 From Hong Kong, joined May 2007, 157 posts, RR: 0
Posted (3 years 5 months 2 weeks 6 days 18 hours ago) and read 8876 times:
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CX will start HKG-ORD in Sept, will that be a threat to UA's route on HKG-ORD and force them to cancel eventually as UA once have HKG-LAX and now it is only monopolized by CX???

50 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineLAXtoATL From United States of America, joined Oct 2009, 1590 posts, RR: 2
Reply 1, posted (3 years 5 months 2 weeks 6 days 18 hours ago) and read 8935 times:

Quoting cx828 (Thread starter):
will that be a threat to UA's route on HKG-ORD and force them to cancel eventually as UA once have HKG-LAX and now it is only monopolized by CX???

I doubt it. UA has a much larger hub at ORD vs LAX.


User currently offlineMercado From Canada, joined Feb 2011, 1 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (3 years 5 months 2 weeks 6 days 18 hours ago) and read 8805 times:

CX will start HKG-ORD in Sept, will that be a threat to UA's route on HKG-ORD and force them to cancel eventually as UA once have HKG-LAX and now it is only monopolized by CX???

UA will definately have some strong competition from CX. CX international service is far superior to that of UA.


User currently offlineAlasizon From United States of America, joined Apr 2007, 289 posts, RR: 0
Reply 3, posted (3 years 5 months 2 weeks 6 days 18 hours ago) and read 8788 times:

Since both have strong networks on their respective side of each hub, both UA and CX should be able to survive on the route, though the route may begin to depend slightly more on cargo.


Window seats may be over-rated, but I'll take a window seat on a DC9 anyday
User currently offlinejfk777 From United States of America, joined Aug 2006, 8280 posts, RR: 7
Reply 4, posted (3 years 5 months 2 weeks 6 days 6 hours ago) and read 8070 times:
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Quoting Mercado (Reply 2):
CX will start HKG-ORD in Sept, will that be a threat to UA's route on HKG-ORD and force them to cancel eventually as UA once have HKG-LAX and now it is only monopolized by CX???

Cathay's new US destination is a different creature then the coastal gateways it has in LAX, SFO and JFK. ORD is owned by UA, UA has lots of feed to its ORD to HKG flight, this will be hard to attack for CX. AA's feed will help some.


User currently offlineripcordd From United States of America, joined Apr 2000, 1149 posts, RR: 1
Reply 5, posted (3 years 5 months 2 weeks 6 days 6 hours ago) and read 8047 times:

AA at ORD will provide CX to take over the route yes UA will not go anywhere but CX will hurt UA on this route as CX service is amazing. CX will have feed on both ends as UA will only have 1 end = CX winner

User currently offlinecx828 From Hong Kong, joined May 2007, 157 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (3 years 5 months 2 weeks 6 days 6 hours ago) and read 7936 times:
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CX can deliver the passengers to ORD and codeshare with AA to other America destinations or to South America can really threat UA's ORD route even though ORD is a big hub for UA.

User currently offlineescapehere From Australia, joined Jan 2011, 74 posts, RR: 0
Reply 7, posted (3 years 5 months 2 weeks 6 days 5 hours ago) and read 7855 times:

Will they have changed their non-reclining Y seats by September?

User currently offlinejfk777 From United States of America, joined Aug 2006, 8280 posts, RR: 7
Reply 8, posted (3 years 5 months 2 weeks 6 days 5 hours ago) and read 7731 times:
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Quoting ripcordd (Reply 5):
AA at ORD will provide CX to take over the route yes UA will not go anywhere but CX will hurt UA on this route as CX service is amazing. CX will have feed on both ends as UA will only have 1 end = CX winner

CX will hurt UA but in SFO UA holds its own against Singapore and Cathay on nonstop flights to Hong Kong.


User currently onlineLAXdude1023 From India, joined Sep 2006, 7496 posts, RR: 24
Reply 9, posted (3 years 5 months 2 weeks 6 days 5 hours ago) and read 7608 times:

Will it hurt UA? UA will probably feel it, but ORD-HKG has been such a strong preformer them over the years that its an extremely safe and secure route.

Will they cancel it and move it to LAX? Absolutely not. ORD-HKG on UA will be around for a long time.



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User currently offlinegoblin211 From United States of America, joined Jun 2010, 1209 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (3 years 5 months 2 weeks 6 days 4 hours ago) and read 7458 times:

I would imagine it's no different than UA and AA ORD-LAX. The only reason why this might be a problem is that in the case of UA and AA they're not part of the same alliance, as is CX and UA. In this country there's always competition.


From the airport with love
User currently offlineWestern727 From United States of America, joined Jan 2007, 743 posts, RR: 4
Reply 11, posted (3 years 5 months 2 weeks 6 days 4 hours ago) and read 7401 times:

What aircraft will CX use on the route?


Jack @ AUS
User currently offlineSCL767 From Chile, joined Feb 2006, 8752 posts, RR: 5
Reply 12, posted (3 years 5 months 2 weeks 6 days 4 hours ago) and read 7321 times:
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Quoting cx828 (Reply 6):
CX can deliver the passengers to ORD and codeshare with AA to other America destinations or to South America can really threat UA's ORD route even though ORD is a big hub for UA.

Unlike UA, AA does not operate any flights to South America from ORD. CX routes the majority of their passengers transiting between HKG and South America via JFK, LAX and SFO.

Quoting Western727 (Reply 11):
What aircraft will CX use on the route?

B773


User currently offlinewedgetail737 From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 5890 posts, RR: 6
Reply 13, posted (3 years 5 months 2 weeks 6 days 4 hours ago) and read 7321 times:
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Quoting jfk777 (Reply 8):
CX will hurt UA but in SFO UA holds its own against Singapore and Cathay on nonstop flights to Hong Kong.

But SFO has a much larger Asian market than Chicago. You don't see nearly the same amount of Asian flight activity out of ORD as you would out of SFO or LAX.


User currently offlinecx828 From Hong Kong, joined May 2007, 157 posts, RR: 0
Reply 14, posted (3 years 5 months 2 weeks 6 days 4 hours ago) and read 7204 times:
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Quoting LAXdude1023 (Reply 9):

UA is safe and secure on this route as it is the only airline which provide direct flight, I think as CX walked in to compete with UA, UA will eventually be faded out like LAX before.


User currently offlineORDFan From United States of America, joined Jun 2007, 304 posts, RR: 0
Reply 15, posted (3 years 5 months 2 weeks 6 days 4 hours ago) and read 7166 times:

Quoting Alasizon (Reply 3):
Since both have strong networks on their respective side of each hub, both UA and CX should be able to survive on the route, though the route may begin to depend slightly more on cargo.

Totally agree with this -- this is room for both on this route, though no doubt CX's product is superior. Not only is there a lot of connecting traffic to be had at both respective hubs, but both city pairs boast strong O&D demand: Chicago - China is an (some may agree it already is) increasingly important "trade route" these days, and the recent visit by the Chinese president to Chicago certainly brought a lot of attention to travel-conscious Chinese tourists, not to mention businessmen. I have several business colleagues in China who, though generally not prone to exuberance, were overjoyed that the President Hu chose to visit Chicago and have been fielding many questions from co-workers and friends who have not visited yet; granted, this "buzz" will die down, but Chinese awareness of Chicago will only increase.


User currently offlinecx828 From Hong Kong, joined May 2007, 157 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (3 years 5 months 2 weeks 6 days 4 hours ago) and read 7090 times:
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Quote form other post

UA 747 service from ORD is currently subject to loading restriction on west-bound flights and I actually have no idea how UA make the route successful one besides the current factor of monopoly. If they want to remain in the HKG-ORD (and so as one of HKG-HCM or HKG-SIN) market, they gonna need some workhorse like 77L or 77W or even 787 later on. Despite the fact that UA (plus CO) has a good connection choices at ORD, AA is no less the same and they can too interline with CX and get the same result out from the ORD hub.


When CX start ORD will at least take half the market share of UA and when UA cannot get balance and cancel this flight eventually, like LAX before, then CX can start the second daily and can concrete this route.

[Edited 2011-02-07 11:32:28 by srbmod]

User currently offlinetrex8 From United States of America, joined Nov 2002, 4692 posts, RR: 14
Reply 17, posted (3 years 5 months 2 weeks 6 days 3 hours ago) and read 6949 times:
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Quoting cx828 (Reply 17):
When CX start ORD will at least take half the market share of UA and when UA cannot get balance and cancel this flight eventually, like LAX before, then CX can start the second daily and can concrete this route.

In your dreams, a lot of those people are flying that route because they are Star Alliance. Will CX take some of the traffic and get the AA feed, sure but few AA (or other One World) pax were feeding into ORD and then taking UA.


User currently offlineairportplan From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 469 posts, RR: 3
Reply 18, posted (3 years 5 months 2 weeks 6 days 3 hours ago) and read 6808 times:

Quoting cx828 (Reply 17):
When CX start ORD will at least take half the market share of UA and when UA cannot get balance and cancel this flight eventually, like LAX before, then CX can start the second daily and can concrete this route.

ORD-HKG is very different than LAX-HKG. ORD-HKG is a pure business route. UA has the largest frequent flyer program in the world. It also has many corporate contracts with large international firms that are based in the metro Chicago area who do a lot of business in China (Abbott Labs, McDonald, Motorola, etc.). Those UA frquent flyers will not be flying CX. CX/AA are very late to the game on this route. UA has flown this route since 1998 and has had up to 2 frequencies per day on this route in the past. Rather than poaching UA passengers all CX/AA will really be doing on the route is capturing One World passengers who were previously feed though other gateways (LAX/SFO/JFK/NRT). Also most ORD-Asia Pacific routes are served by multiple carriers anyway (ICN-KE/OZ, NRT-AA/JL/NH/UA, PEK-AA/UA, PVG-AA/UA). HKG was the lone exception.


User currently onlineLAXdude1023 From India, joined Sep 2006, 7496 posts, RR: 24
Reply 19, posted (3 years 5 months 2 weeks 6 days 2 hours ago) and read 6482 times:

Quoting cx828 (Reply 14):
UA is safe and secure on this route as it is the only airline which provide direct flight, I think as CX walked in to compete with UA, UA will eventually be faded out like LAX before.

Im afriad thats not based in reality. UA used to fly LAX-HKG but did poorly on it. ORD-HKG has always done well and there is no reason ORD-HKG cant support two carriers.



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User currently offlinecx828 From Hong Kong, joined May 2007, 157 posts, RR: 0
Reply 20, posted (3 years 5 months 2 weeks 6 days 2 hours ago) and read 6422 times:
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Just like CX in JFK, only CO has HKG-EWK, UA or AA didn;t launch HKG-JFK and only CX has that direct flight.

User currently offlinecx828 From Hong Kong, joined May 2007, 157 posts, RR: 0
Reply 21, posted (3 years 5 months 2 weeks 6 days 2 hours ago) and read 6403 times:
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By the way, why UA can do good on ORD but poor on LAX, while both are UA's big hubs??

User currently offlineUAL777UK From United Kingdom, joined Nov 2005, 3356 posts, RR: 1
Reply 22, posted (3 years 5 months 2 weeks 6 days 2 hours ago) and read 6230 times:

Quoting cx828 (Reply 23):
By the way, why UA can do good on ORD but poor on LAX, while both are UA's big hubs??

LAX is the weak link in all of UA's hubs or should I say was before the merger. Comparing ORD with LAX is like comparing night with day!


User currently offlinewowpeter From Hong Kong, joined Oct 2006, 151 posts, RR: 0
Reply 23, posted (3 years 5 months 2 weeks 6 days 2 hours ago) and read 6435 times:

Quoting airportplan (Reply 19):
ORD-HKG is very different than LAX-HKG. ORD-HKG is a pure business route. UA has the largest frequent flyer program in the world. It also has many corporate contracts with large international firms that are based in the metro Chicago area who do a lot of business in China (Abbott Labs, McDonald, Motorola, etc.). Those UA frquent flyers will not be flying CX. CX/AA are very late to the game on this route. UA has flown this route since 1998 and has had up to 2 frequencies per day on this route in the past. Rather than poaching UA passengers all CX/AA will really be doing on the route is capturing One World passengers who were previously feed though other gateways (LAX/SFO/JFK/NRT). Also most ORD-Asia Pacific routes are served by multiple carriers anyway (ICN-KE/OZ, NRT-AA/JL/NH/UA, PEK-AA/UA, PVG-AA/UA). HKG was the lone exception.

For some reason, I have a feelings that many large corporations, when given a choice, they will consider alternatives, especially if CX offer a competitive pricing on it superior products that will save those corporation money. I really don't think the accounting / corporate travel department cares which alliance or which airlines their employee fly, so long as it saves them money.

However, having said all that, I personally think UA will continue to do well in this route due to the large corporate contracts already in place, however this route will probably become less profitable for them over time due to the increase competitive by CX, especially for the front end business. As for the back end EY product, UA has very very competitive pricing on this routes, sometimes their price are so cheap that I think CX will have a hard time competiting on price with UA. However, CX probably doesn't need to compete with UA on price as CX does offer a much better products even in EY. One thing is certain, all premium back end traffic on this route will probably all migrate to CX start flying to ORD.

Just my two cents.


User currently offlineDFWEagle From United States of America, joined Dec 2006, 1071 posts, RR: 9
Reply 24, posted (3 years 5 months 2 weeks 6 days 2 hours ago) and read 6440 times:

In addition to the Cathay/Dragonair network and frequent flyer base on the Hong Kong end of the route, CX will have access to AA's domestic system from Chicago providing extensive connectivity throughout a large part of the US. This will be a hub-to-hub route for oneworld, and will be marketed by AA (code-share) as well as CX itself. Combined with CX's competitive cost structure and reputation for excellent inflight service/product, I expect them to compete very effectively on the route against UA. United is well entrenched and has a portfolio of corporate contracts and so they should also compete effectively, though their profits on the route will definitely take a hit as their long-standing monopoly is broken. Also, I would not be surprised to see CX increase to 2x daily before very long, and if that happens, the pressure on UA will only increase.

Quoting cx828 (Reply 22):
UA or AA didn;t launch HKG-JFK and only CX has that direct flight.

Actually, UA did attempt JFK-HKG, but it failed rather quickly.



Ryan / HKG
25 sshank : Not sure what you are smoking. Corporations consolidate their travel with one or two with preferred carriers who can take their employees where ever
26 bobnwa : LAX is a big UA hub? Since when? That would be great news to both UA and LAX if true.
27 SCL767 : CX will certainly affect UA's current monopoly on the ORD-HKG route once it's broken, but as most have already mentioned, UA will not drop that route
28 LAXdude1023 : Whats the point? As of now, if they need to double connect, they can just go GRU-MIA-ORD-XXX. The only way that would work is if there is an ORD-LIM
29 trex8 : And in my experience generally higher fares than other carriers. It used to be cheaper for me to take CO ORD-EWR-HKG than doing AA to west coast and
30 AeroWesty : A lot of corporate contracts are written in a manner of total $ volume over a specified period of time will = a certain % discount. If a corporation
31 IrishAyes : Other than GRU, where else does UA serve nonstop from ORD to South America that helps feed the UA ORD-HKG flight?? Unless you have experience working
32 SCL767 : LIM is a growing oneworld hub. Pax from ASU, BSB, COR, EZE, GRU, GIG, GYE, IGU, MVD, ROS, SCL, UIO, etc. will be able to connect onwards to ORD via L
33 SCL767 : UA's Star Alliance partner TAM Brasil provides many connections from deep South America onto UA's GRU-ORD service (and HKG is only one of the connect
34 IrishAyes : Right, but with the exception of GRU, it seems like most of the ORD-deep South America flights have failed in the past.
35 SCL767 : Times have changed and South America's economy is booming! LAN has a much lower cost-structure as compared to AA and UA, plus LAN can offer more conn
36 IrishAyes : Of course, I lived in Latin America for a period of time and am aware of the growing economy. But what aircraft would be appropriate to serve ORD-LIM
37 Alasizon : It could be a perfect route for a 763 or a 788.
38 SCL767 : Pax are tired of connecting via MIA and AA knows this very well! AA will operate MIA-LIM 2x daily with the B752 this summer. The B763 of course will
39 SSTsomeday : Is that true. Hong Kong all the way to L.A? That must be deadly. How awful. edit: Oh wait. 'Just looked on another site. They have the "slide forward
40 hz747300 : That's the general rub though. CX is rarely price competitive, including versus UA on the same routes. Corporations can guarantee lower fares, or mor
41 washingtonian : How long has SQ operating SF0-HKG (and ICN/SIN)?
42 VC10er : Yes, CX has great service. They may take a bite out of coach. But UA's new C and especially F is not bad at all. All of UA's GS, 1K etc and Star Gold
43 LAXdude1023 : I cant imagine ORD-LIM will happen. It doesnt seem like a good use of the aircraft.
44 AeroWesty : 4/4/79, via Honolulu (and Guam?).
45 SCL767 : It will happen, LAN is not going to give up a potentially lucrative cargo route to UA. LAN Peru just renewed its operational permits to operate LIM-I
46 LAXdude1023 : We are going to have to agree to disagree. I dont think it will work or that it will happen. Pretty much every ORD-South America route outside of GRU
47 IrishAyes : If ORD-LIM was feasible it would have happened by now, and would have happened before ORD-EZE (tried and failed). If DFW-LIM cannot work, then I have
48 SCL767 : No, they wouldn't have since LAN never offered as many connections via LIM as they do now, (which will continue to grow with new regional routes). Al
49 RAGAZZO777 : You sure about that ? Well, LAX is barely a 'hub' for United Airlines.. I think the Boeing 767-300ER would be perfect for the route. Any other aircra
50 srbmod : Since this discussion has veered into a discussion not regarding the original topic, this thread is now locked. If you wish to discuss LAN or any othe
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