Gonzalo From Chile, joined Aug 2005, 1677 posts, RR: 0 Posted (2 years 3 months 5 days 7 hours ago) and read 7915 times:
I was reading here and there and I have a few questions about this Dutch manufacturer.
The “old” Fokker Company went bankrupt in 1996, and was acquired by Stork Aerospace, who changed the name to Fokker Aerospace in 2009. But this “new Fokker” only provides service and support to the existing fleet of F-50/70/100, and is not building more aircraft of those types, that seems clear looking at the main page of their website…
Anybody knows why ?
There is no room in the market for a Fokker 100 NG or similar ?
Does the manufacturing plant still exists or was dismantled / sold ?
Oh and BTW, there are a company named Rekkof Aircraft ( Fokker backwards ) and they are attempting to restart the production of new models like XF70 and XF100 supported by suppliers and airlines…. Can somebody elaborate ? What airlines are the supporters ?
The name is Fokker Technologies to be precise and owned by Candover(not Stork). http://www.fokker.com/Fokker-Technologies
Read the site more careful and you'll find it consist of several divisions located in The Netherlands, US and Singapore.
Quoting Gonzalo (Thread starter): But this “new Fokker” only provides service and support to the existing fleet of F-50/70/100
Yes but not limited to..........
Again check the website and you see it is pretty hard to find an aircraft without Fokker input in one form or another.
Quoting Gonzalo (Thread starter): that seems clear looking at the main page of their website…
So maybe you have to click a bit beyond the mainpage
Quoting Gonzalo (Thread starter): There is no room in the market for a Fokker 100 NG or similar ?
There's more than enough room.
Quoting Gonzalo (Thread starter): Does the manufacturing plant still exists or was dismantled / sold ?
Although I am still working at the same location there is not much left of the original buildings at AMS.
The other locations in the Netherlands are still pretty much the same though.
Quoting Gonzalo (Thread starter): Oh and BTW, there are a company named Rekkof Aircraft ( Fokker backwards ) and they are attempting to restart the production of new models like XF70 and XF100 supported by suppliers and airlines…. Can somebody elaborate ?
CrimsonNL From Netherlands, joined Dec 2007, 1618 posts, RR: 42 Reply 2, posted (2 years 3 months 5 days 5 hours ago) and read 7573 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW CHAT OPERATOR
Quoting Gonzalo (Thread starter): Oh and BTW, there are a company named Rekkof Aircraft ( Fokker backwards ) and they are attempting to restart the production of new models like XF70 and XF100 supported by suppliers and airlines…. Can somebody elaborate ? What airlines are the supporters ?
Rekkof releases a press statement at least once a year from as far back as I can remember, that they will start with the XF100. Months ago they stated that they'd finally hauled in a lot of money for the startup. I would love to see a Dutch build plane again but I doubt they'd stand much chance looking at the heaps of competition in the RJ market. I know KL will not support them as they are phasing out their F-100's for the E90s..
Gonzalo From Chile, joined Aug 2005, 1677 posts, RR: 0 Reply 4, posted (2 years 3 months 5 days 4 hours ago) and read 7362 times:
Quoting Aviopic (Reply 1): you see it is pretty hard to find an aircraft without Fokker input in one form or another.
In the first place, many thanks for the additional info/corrections.
About the Fokker contribution to other projects, I was aware since we have here many Fokker F-16 fighter jets ( sold by NAF to Chile AF ) , and the A380 in their website also implies that they do some work in it.
My hope was the buildings for manufacturing new airframes could work again some day in a new project, but your answer is pretty clear about that
Quoting CrimsonNL (Reply 2): I doubt they'd stand much chance looking at the heaps of competition in the RJ market. I know KL will not support them as they are phasing out their F-100's for the E90s..
Sadly I have to agree with you, Embraer's aggressive marketing policy won that battle IMHO.... but I'm 100 % sure that the Dutch can do a product of the same quality at the very least, and I was hoping better news...
Thanks for your inputs.
exFATboy From United States of America, joined Jul 2003, 2974 posts, RR: 9 Reply 5, posted (2 years 3 months 5 days 4 hours ago) and read 7292 times:
Quoting Gonzalo (Thread starter): Oh and BTW, there are a company named Rekkof Aircraft ( Fokker backwards ) and they are attempting to restart the production of new models like XF70 and XF100 supported by suppliers and airlines…. Can somebody elaborate ? What airlines are the supporters ?
Do a search on the word "Rekkof" and you'll see many threads going back to at least 2005 on this.
Although there are some A.Net members who think they stand a chance, he general A.net consensus is that Rekkof (or "NG Aircraft", as they're now called) is not going to get this project in the air (pun intended) as there are too many better-capitalized, experienced manufacturers in this segment already, Rekkof is insufficiently capitalized to develop the project and build the manufacturing and support structure needed, and that anyone who wanted to invest in a plane in this category would support a "clean sheet" approach from an established manufacturer.
That said, Rekkof did get a loan of EUR 20 million from the Netherlands government toward the project.
Since the last thread on Rekkof I've found that their parent company, Panta Holdings (which used to own two airlines, Denim Air and VLM), has a substantial investment in a Canadian company called Avcorp Industries (not to be confused with Avcorp Int'l. of North Carolina), which is or has been a subcontractor for Bombardier, Cessna, Boeing, and BAE Systems, so there is apparently some manufacturing expertise at least tangentally attached to the endeavour.
At this time, no airline has officially indicated interest in the project as it currently stands, although it's generally assumed that KLM has some interest, having a fleet of Fokkers to replace in the KLM Cityhopper subsidiary, although Cityhopper has already bought some E190s.
Given the capitalization issue and the competition, I still don't believe Rekkof/NG Aircraft will succeed in producing the update F70/F100 aircraft.
Aviopic From Netherlands, joined Mar 2004, 2681 posts, RR: 46 Reply 6, posted (2 years 3 months 5 days 3 hours ago) and read 7131 times:
Quoting Gonzalo (Reply 4): In the first place, many thanks for the additional info/corrections.
You're welcome.
Quoting Gonzalo (Reply 4): My hope was the buildings for manufacturing new airframes could work again some day in a new project, but your answer is pretty clear about that
The old buildings are not needed.
Quoting Gonzalo (Reply 4): and I was hoping better news...
This is not bad news.
Things are looking good.
It took a long time but finally all EU faces(the biggest problem) are looking in the same direction and the finances are nearly completed.
The engineering changes for the demonstrator(PH-MKH) have been completed.
Coming weeks are exciting and a final Yes or no is expected within a couple of months.
Cheers,
The truth lives in one’s mind, it doesn’t really exist
Kent350787 From Australia, joined May 2008, 888 posts, RR: 0 Reply 7, posted (2 years 3 months 5 days 2 hours ago) and read 7021 times:
Thanks for the updates on Fokker, and clarification of NG. I assume there has now been suffcient time for the Fokker name rather than Stork to be used?
I enjoyed this from the Fokker history page "2010 Fokker Technologies rebranded to Fokker Technologies"
An F27 was the first commercial aircraft on which I flew, and definitely preferred flying the F50 over SAABs and DHC8-100/200. Maybe with so many F100s here in Australia I'll fly one in the future, although there are few flying scheduled services on the East coast....
Gonzalo From Chile, joined Aug 2005, 1677 posts, RR: 0 Reply 8, posted (2 years 3 months 5 days 1 hour ago) and read 6915 times:
Quoting Aviopic (Reply 6): Things are looking good.
It took a long time but finally all EU faces(the biggest problem) are looking in the same direction and the finances are nearly completed.
The engineering changes for the demonstrator(PH-MKH) have been completed.
Coming weeks are exciting and a final Yes or no is expected within a couple of months.
Great !! Many thanks for all your clarifications, and specially for the good news !!!
I guess we'll be hearing some news here in A.net the day after the final decision
DALCE From Netherlands, joined Feb 2007, 1582 posts, RR: 7 Reply 9, posted (2 years 3 months 4 days 12 hours ago) and read 5499 times:
Quoting Aviopic (Reply 6): Things are looking good.
It took a long time but finally all EU faces(the biggest problem) are looking in the same direction and the finances are nearly completed.
The engineering changes for the demonstrator(PH-MKH) have been completed.
Coming weeks are exciting and a final Yes or no is expected within a couple of months.
How I love to believe all this, I still doubt any production line can/will be started sometime soon.
I used to be rather positive, but after all the delays, renamings, discussions here on a.net, I start to believe this is more dream than reality.
But I would love to be wrong on this one
flown on : F50,F70,CR1,CR2,CR9,E75,143,AR8,AR1,733,735,736,73G,738,753,744,319,320,321,AB6. Next flights AMS-ZRH-AMS on
Revelation From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 10481 posts, RR: 20 Reply 10, posted (2 years 3 months 4 days 12 hours ago) and read 5293 times:
Quoting Aviopic (Reply 6): The engineering changes for the demonstrator(PH-MKH) have been completed.
Last seen in the a.net database in 2006 testing SOSTAR ground search radar:
Aviopic From Netherlands, joined Mar 2004, 2681 posts, RR: 46 Reply 11, posted (2 years 3 months 4 days 12 hours ago) and read 5139 times:
Quoting DALCE (Reply 9): How I love to believe all this
It has nothing to do with believe, it's just the current status.
Concerning MKH I meant obviously that the Design engineering phase has been completed(including aero design at NLR).
If you have twitter check DickBerlijn.
Quoting Revelation (Reply 10): Last seen in the a.net database in 2006 testing SOSTAR ground search radar
MKH has flown beyond 2006 because it is still in use as certification aircraft if required.
The truth lives in one’s mind, it doesn’t really exist
PH-BFA From Netherlands, joined Apr 2002, 559 posts, RR: 1 Reply 12, posted (2 years 3 months 4 days 11 hours ago) and read 4858 times:
Quoting Aviopic (Reply 11): If you have twitter check DickBerlijn.
'Vorige week voor Rekkof naar Turkije. Nieuw vliegtuig (100+ seater) dat aanmerkelijk zuiniger is dan competitie. Turkije heeft ambitie.'
(Visited Turkey last week on behalf of Rekkof. New airplane (100+ seater) which is considerably more fuel efficient than its near competitors. Turkey has ambition.)
Very interesting indeed.... Was this trip related to the development/production or to potential operators?
BrouAviation From Netherlands, joined Jun 2009, 981 posts, RR: 1 Reply 14, posted (2 years 3 months 4 days 7 hours ago) and read 2839 times:
Quoting Aviopic (Reply 1): There's more than enough room.
Yep, but there won't be any room left when the first Fokker NG's come of the line, even in the most optimistic scenario.
It will all be filled up by Embraers, Sukhoi's, Mitsubishi's, COMAC's, Bombardiers and the lot.
Quoting A342 (Reply 3): Stop dreaming, the ship has sailed.
I'm afraid you're quite right.
Never ask somebody if he's a pilot. If he is, he will let you know soon enough!
Revelation From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 10481 posts, RR: 20 Reply 15, posted (2 years 3 months 4 days 7 hours ago) and read 2745 times:
Quoting BrouAviation (Reply 14): Quoting A342 (Reply 3):
Stop dreaming, the ship has sailed.
I'm afraid you're quite right.
Yes, but some times dreams come true.
This is a.net, and many of us love the little Fokkers!
I know I do, and I hope you do to.
I first road on one back when it was in service with US Air, and although the airline was crap, the plane was great!
So I hope they do find some investors interested in making them again.
I first road on one back when it was in service with US Air, and although the airline was crap, the plane was great!
You can bet I do !!!
The time when I flew on Fokkers I was a child, but I still can remember how I love every flight on those beautiful aircraft.
That's the reason why I hope some day a NG version will come true.... dreaming is ( still ) for free !!!
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