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LAX Reverse Pattern, How Often?  
User currently offlinespeedmarque From United Kingdom, joined Jul 2005, 684 posts, RR: 1
Posted (3 years 5 months 3 weeks 6 days 16 hours ago) and read 4356 times:

Hello

In all my years of flying to LAX I have never experienced "Reverse Pattern". Am I just unlucky or is it a rare occurance?

Cheers

17 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineJKJ777 From United States of America, joined Aug 2007, 397 posts, RR: 0
Reply 1, posted (3 years 5 months 3 weeks 6 days 15 hours ago) and read 4262 times:

It is quite rare. LAX sits right next to the Pacific and the prevailing winds are mostly from west to east. When the Santa Ana's blow from the east to west, it is not uncommon to see the pattern switch. Also, when it rains (I spoke to a Polar Air pilot about this) and visibility is low, they tend to use the reverse pattern ILS. If you ever land at LAX prior to 6am, you will also land from west to east in most cases due to the noise abatement.

User currently onlineB747forever From Sweden, joined May 2007, 17061 posts, RR: 10
Reply 2, posted (3 years 5 months 3 weeks 6 days 15 hours ago) and read 4213 times:

Have only experienced reverse pattern once. We took off from runway 7L.


Work Hard, Fly Right
User currently offlineplatinumfoota From United States of America, joined Jan 2006, 556 posts, RR: 0
Reply 3, posted (3 years 5 months 3 weeks 6 days 15 hours ago) and read 4169 times:
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Quoting speedmarque (Thread starter):
or is it a rare occurance?


As rare as rain  

I have experienced it once on a 777, most likely they will reverse the pattern this weekend



Never forget United 93
User currently offlineLAXintl From United States of America, joined May 2000, 25053 posts, RR: 46
Reply 4, posted (3 years 5 months 3 weeks 6 days 13 hours ago) and read 4040 times:

Per ATC stats, LAX operates all West flow 84.29% of the time, mixed flow (West Departure / East Arrival) 14.07%, and East flow 1.64% of the time.


From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
User currently offlinedlflynhayn From United States of America, joined Apr 2008, 424 posts, RR: 1
Reply 5, posted (3 years 5 months 3 weeks 6 days 13 hours ago) and read 4030 times:

Sometimes coming in from Hawaii on a red eye you might land straight in from the Pacific ocean.I like it cause it cuts down on flight time..

User currently offlineas739x From United States of America, joined Apr 2003, 6122 posts, RR: 23
Reply 6, posted (3 years 5 months 3 weeks 6 days 13 hours ago) and read 4025 times:

Quoting JKJ777 (Reply 1):

Iv'e also seen them maintain the normal pattern while other city's experience Santa Ana winds. Santa Ana's don't seem to effect LAX as much. It generally seem more common during the winter as a low pressure system effects SoCal.



"Some pilots avoid storm cells and some play connect the dots!"
User currently offlinespeedmarque From United Kingdom, joined Jul 2005, 684 posts, RR: 1
Reply 7, posted (3 years 5 months 3 weeks 6 days 13 hours ago) and read 3997 times:

Thanks for the answers and stats. Really interesting and explains why in 20 years I've never done it!

Cheers


User currently offlinebriboy From Canada, joined Jul 2001, 366 posts, RR: 1
Reply 8, posted (3 years 5 months 3 weeks 6 days 11 hours ago) and read 3846 times:

Quoting LAXintl (Reply 4):
Per ATC stats, LAX operates all West flow 84.29% of the time, mixed flow (West Departure / East Arrival) 14.07%, and East flow 1.64% of the time.

I am curious how mixed flow works. I assume one complex is for arrivals, the other for departures. Is there a pattern for this (ie the South Complex used for arrivals generally), or is it more random?

Do the departures turn north/south upon leaving the coast to give arrivals more room, or is it separated enough?



next up: YYC, SFO, SYD, AKL, WLG, CMB, BKK, SIN, FRA, VCE, JFK
User currently offline747srule From United States of America, joined Mar 2004, 429 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (3 years 5 months 3 weeks 6 days 11 hours ago) and read 3751 times:

THey were doing reverse ops last Monday. I saw it on the webcam and was pleasantly surprised.www.cargolaw.com


Jesus is the way,the truth,and the life
User currently offlineLAXintl From United States of America, joined May 2000, 25053 posts, RR: 46
Reply 10, posted (3 years 5 months 3 weeks 6 days 10 hours ago) and read 3663 times:

Quoting briboy (Reply 8):
I am curious how mixed flow works.

Mixed flow occurs only late night (after midnight/1am) as a noise abatement practice. In general the longer runway Southside of the airport is used for takeoff, while Northside if for landings with aircraft maintaining visual separation from each other. However with low traffic volume I've seen landings and takeoff's occur on opposite ends same runway also.

Only other time this operation takes place is during times like 4th of July or New Years, with ATC not wanting aircraft to be hit with gunfire, so its keeps all ops over water as a safety measure.

If winds, or low ceilings preclude mixed flow, then the traditional West or East flow is continued which allows for IFR ops.



From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
User currently offlinejohns624 From United States of America, joined Jul 2008, 911 posts, RR: 0
Reply 11, posted (3 years 5 months 3 weeks 6 days 9 hours ago) and read 3569 times:

In around fifteen roundtrips in/out of LAX, I've had it happen once. It was a flight DTW-LAX on a NW 752 and we landed from the west in the rain. I was surprised because I didn't feel any of the turns...

User currently offlineafbua1k2mm From United States of America, joined Jan 2011, 27 posts, RR: 0
Reply 12, posted (3 years 5 months 3 weeks 6 days 3 hours ago) and read 3273 times:

In years past when UAX did the ONT/LAX shuttle flights the first early morning departure from ONT always used the reverse pattern since arrival was before 6 am in EB120's pulling into the mid-field temporary terminal between DL and UA hangars. Of course, those days are long gone and now I have to take the LA freeway pattern commute from the Inland Empire which from my house is 75 miles taking anywhere from less than 90 minutes or up to 3.5 hours!

User currently offlinedc9northwest From Switzerland, joined Feb 2007, 2279 posts, RR: 7
Reply 13, posted (3 years 5 months 3 weeks 6 days 2 hours ago) and read 3221 times:

Quoting JKJ777 (Reply 1):
It is quite rare. LAX sits right next to the Pacific and the prevailing winds are mostly from west to east. When the Santa Ana's blow from the east to west, it is not uncommon to see the pattern switch. Also, when it rains (I spoke to a Polar Air pilot about this) and visibility is low, they tend to use the reverse pattern ILS. If you ever land at LAX prior to 6am, you will also land from west to east in most cases due to the noise abatement.

Yes, I believe that when my flight from OGG on a DL 764 landed at LAX, we used the southernmost runway, 7R. I'm not completely sure, but about 90%... Because I was sitting in the middle row of seats at the time. It was about 5.20 in the morning IIRC, so the night-time noise abatement was probably in effect. After we landed, the pilot took a wrong turn and we waited for almost 15' on the taxiway, making it hard to forget.


User currently offlinephllax From United States of America, joined Jan 2006, 436 posts, RR: 0
Reply 14, posted (3 years 5 months 3 weeks 6 days 2 hours ago) and read 3220 times:

In 12 years in LA I've had 3 East departures and 6 over-water/East landings, only 1 of them during late evening/early morning mixed flow. Problem with East landings is that they have to stay at 10,000 until they hit the beach on the downwind leg and then start down.

User currently offlinenetjetsintl From United States of America, joined Jul 2009, 593 posts, RR: 0
Reply 15, posted (3 years 5 months 3 weeks 5 days 17 hours ago) and read 3005 times:

14 years of flying, i've never landed Eastbound at LAX, not even as a passenger

User currently offlinecrosswinds21 From Netherlands, joined Jun 2009, 698 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (3 years 5 months 3 weeks 5 days 17 hours ago) and read 2984 times:

Quoting netjetsintl (Reply 15):
14 years of flying, i've never landed Eastbound at LAX, not even as a passenger

The only one time I've landed east at LAX was on the early QF flight from SYD. I recall that after we landed, there was one more plane right after us that also landed east, but everything thereafter started going west.


User currently offlinecrazyfoo88 From Canada, joined Feb 2005, 81 posts, RR: 1
Reply 17, posted (3 years 5 months 3 weeks 5 days 17 hours ago) and read 2972 times:

Flew into LAX for the first time last week and we landed reverse pattern!

http://a8.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc6/184014_1539179693289_1648800085_1155218_3402918_n.jpg



crazyfoo88
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