Sponsor Message:
Civil Aviation Forum
My Starred Topics | Profile | New Topic | Forum Index | Help | Search 
Who Is Carl Icahn  
User currently offlineBA-747 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Posted (13 years 1 month 3 weeks 23 hours ago) and read 1205 times:

who is he?

16 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineB747-437B From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 1, posted (13 years 1 month 3 weeks 23 hours ago) and read 1173 times:

Carl Icahn is a benevolent investment banker who specializes in financing startup carriers.

User currently offlineVirginFlyer From New Zealand, joined Sep 2000, 4537 posts, RR: 41
Reply 2, posted (13 years 1 month 3 weeks 18 hours ago) and read 1138 times:

He almost killed Continental. He destroyed TWA. He is generally despised...


"So powerful is the light of unity that it can illuminate the whole earth." - Bahá'u'lláh
User currently offlineSegmentKing From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 3, posted (13 years 1 month 3 weeks 18 hours ago) and read 1138 times:

No, TWA destroyed itself. He just tried to rescue it, but instead sold its assets  Smile/happy/getting dizzy

User currently offlineLsjef From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 4, posted (13 years 1 month 3 weeks 18 hours ago) and read 1133 times:

He is truely despised by some in aviation, especially labor. Then, too, possibly appreciated by some airline CEO's for his lightning-rod effect.

But, in all fairness, he is cut from the same cloth as some of the previous airline CEO's: shrewd businessman, ready to jump on opportunities, eager to test limits, happy to maximize profits. Not necessarily focused on the long-term stability of an airline; more inclined to buy at a fire-sale and turn a tidy profit selling out the separate units.


User currently offlineIMissPiedmont From United States of America, joined May 2001, 6287 posts, RR: 34
Reply 5, posted (13 years 1 month 3 weeks 14 hours ago) and read 1110 times:

Blamed by many for the demise of TWA, had nothing to do with Continental.


Damn, this website is getting worse daily.
User currently offlineAerLingus From China, joined Mar 2000, 2371 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (13 years 1 month 3 weeks 13 hours ago) and read 1106 times:

Put simply, the exact antithesis of Herb Kelleher.


Get your patchouli stink outta my store!
User currently offlineVirginA340 From United States of America, joined Jul 2005, 15 posts, RR: 0
Reply 7, posted (13 years 1 month 3 weeks 13 hours ago) and read 1101 times:

Frank Lorenzo and his partner in crime Frank Borman were responsible for the near disaster at CO unfortionalty Eastern Airlines wasn't that lucky to make it like CO.

Carl Ichan was bought in to help TWA get out of it's financial troubles due to bad management. Carl Ichan surprisnly tried to help the airline but when all else failed; there was just one thing left to do... Sell it of piece by peice. Of course that was nipped in the bud but the airline had suffered like a cancer patient for the 10 years it lived pulling out of europen destinations left and right and the questionalbe decisions it made in that time. Karabu was another thing but Ichan wanted his money. TWA was doomed even before Ichan. Only a matter of when and how. The managment that hired him actually wanted him bad because Lorenzo was actually supposed to come on if Ichan didn't step in. The management thought it was better to have Ichan than Lorenzo.



"FUIMUS"
User currently offlineLsjef From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 8, posted (13 years 1 month 3 weeks 12 hours ago) and read 1089 times:

As I understand the TWA history, Virgin340's statement is correct: "TWA was doomed before Icahn; only a matter of when and how".

It is ironic that TWA was recovering and could have made it recently, if not for the Karabu deal with Icahn; but, the important point to recognize is TWA would not have had the chance to restructure and upgrade their fleet if Icahn had not bailed them out years ago (with the Karabu deal). It seems strange to me that, years ago, we bailed out Chrysler, but recently, we effectively told Icahn to shove his Karabu deal so that AAL could acquire TWA. Such is politics...





User currently offlineILOVEA340 From United States of America, joined Oct 1999, 2100 posts, RR: 4
Reply 9, posted (13 years 1 month 3 weeks 12 hours ago) and read 1085 times:

TWA was doomed. Perhaps if herb had quit southwest and focused all his attention on TWA he may have been able to save some of it, but why would herb quit SWA. anyways... Icahn is not really as bad as people make him out to be.

User currently offlineLOT767-300ER From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 10, posted (13 years 1 month 2 weeks 6 days 22 hours ago) and read 1062 times:

Theres a good article on TWA in the Airliner World current issue


LOT767-300ER
http://www.geocities.com/lot767/index.html


User currently offlineLsjef From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 11, posted (13 years 1 month 2 weeks 6 days 20 hours ago) and read 1047 times:

Intersting hypothetical: if Herb Kelleher had quit SWA to save TWA...

...I strongly doubt it would have worked. Incompatible mix.


User currently offlineHypermike From United States of America, joined Dec 1999, 1001 posts, RR: 5
Reply 12, posted (13 years 1 month 2 weeks 6 days 20 hours ago) and read 1044 times:

You could compare him with Darth Vader.

User currently offlineMCOtoATL From United States of America, joined Sep 1999, 474 posts, RR: 4
Reply 13, posted (13 years 1 month 2 weeks 6 days 17 hours ago) and read 1039 times:

I think that all of the above statements are somewhat true, and it is all based primarily on one's opinion. If you are organized labor, you despise Icahn and Frank Lorenzo. On the other hand, the folks at TWA practically begged Carl Icahn to take over (so that Lorenzo could not.) While TWA was in deep trouble long before Icahn ever entered the picture, and his Karabu deal was a settlement made because TWA was unable to pay money that supposedly they owed him. But guys like him hurt the aviation industry because they don't focus on employee morale, which is a key ingredient to a successful airline (just look at SWA.)


User currently offlineVirginA340 From United States of America, joined Jul 2005, 15 posts, RR: 0
Reply 14, posted (13 years 1 month 2 weeks 6 days 12 hours ago) and read 1030 times:

Long before Ichan it was Howard Hughes that messed it up good. According to the veterns he was called the "Carl Ichan with a heart" He was great with the employees; until his 1947 firing of Jack Frye. He was the one wanting to save the airline but his advisor was no where near as caring he was twice as bad as Ichan. By the time Hughes had stopped listening to him. It was too late. The employees hated him and never trusted him again. The other reason TWA went under was the deal they made with PA. They were given antitrust immunity in 1975 to perform route cutbacks In that deal TW would stop service Eat of BOM and west of LAX cutting out HKG, Okinawa, Guam and suspending flights to PA's Euro hub at FRA while PA dramatically redued flight's to TWA's hub at CDG, as well as Spain, Portigual and Maracco ans also pulled their DTW-London. TWA also pulled out of Ireland and several points in Africa. The result was grounding of 24 L-1011s and 4 747s. This cutback would only last 5 years but by that time TWA was in debt. They returned to FRA and HNL. They never returend to the far east.

Comapred to PA I don't think TWA would have a chance in hell. I'm surprised they didn't cut out BOM soom enough. Due to firece competition by PA, AI and BA among others.

But for those of you who state that when PA went uder TWA could've made a comeback. Don't even try. UAL bought the enire package incuding 16 747SPS and alot of PA's L-1011-500s including Intra Asian routes. TWA's problem would also be compounded by NWA they are neck to neck with UAL in the Pacific. TWA with only a little over than 6 destinations with only so amny flights wouldn't be able to compete.

TWA was great while it lasted but theres only so much money that can be invested and so much that can be done. The plug had to be pulled before the operating costs went any higher. Their credit and finacial situation was too far beyond damage control. I don't think Gordon Bethune could've saved this one. They only way to prevent TWA from going under was to buy it out or let it die.



"FUIMUS"
User currently offlineILOVEA340 From United States of America, joined Oct 1999, 2100 posts, RR: 4
Reply 15, posted (13 years 1 month 2 weeks 6 days 12 hours ago) and read 1029 times:

does anyone have a map of the extent of the TWA route network at its peak??? if so please contact me at
Basler__Fasnacht@hotmail.com


User currently offlineVirginA340 From United States of America, joined Jul 2005, 15 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (13 years 1 month 2 weeks 6 days 3 hours ago) and read 1019 times:

I would also like a route network at their peak; Even though TWA wasn't no where near spread out like PA but they did circle the globe even though TWA only had about 6 or so destination in the Pacific. The route map I have doesn't incude the pacific destinations but they did fly to BOM, Turkey. Middle East. But the route map I have doesn't have them in Africa or Asia aside from BOM.


"FUIMUS"
Top Of Page
Forum Index

This topic is archived and can not be replied to any more.

Printer friendly format

Similar topics:More similar topics...
Carl Icahn Is Hungry To Invest In A Airline posted Mon Jun 25 2001 06:13:03 by Defunctairline
Who Is This? posted Sat Dec 2 2006 20:04:31 by CodyKDiamond
Who Is N527AD (B733) Going To Be Deliverd To? posted Thu Oct 26 2006 19:16:14 by Tomascubero
Who Is ATC Out There? posted Fri Oct 20 2006 02:21:48 by Avsfan
Who Is This 744F / 744ERF For? posted Fri Oct 6 2006 11:18:38 by N754PR
Who Is Blue Sky posted Wed Oct 4 2006 09:46:28 by GARUDAROD
Who Is SkyKing Airlines? posted Sun Oct 1 2006 11:52:39 by Sflaflight
Tech Delay, Who Is Responsable For PAX posted Sun Sep 10 2006 05:38:30 by GoBlue
Who Is 20 B-777 & 5 B-787 UFOs? posted Tue Aug 29 2006 11:02:00 by KC135TopBoom
1970 TWA Schedule, Who Is That Guy! posted Fri Aug 25 2006 19:32:29 by Falstaff