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Southwest-AirTran Fleet Integration  
User currently offlineGizmoNC From United States of America, joined Mar 2011, 309 posts, RR: 0
Posted (3 years 5 months 1 week 4 days 14 hours ago) and read 10691 times:

SWA has commented on the estimated timeline of painting aircraft and changing over to the SWA seating:

http://www.aviationweek.com/aw/blogs...=blogScript&plckElementId=blogDest

25 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineGr8SlvrFlt From United States of America, joined Jan 2002, 1606 posts, RR: 10
Reply 1, posted (3 years 5 months 1 week 4 days 13 hours ago) and read 10596 times:

Yes. AirTran will continue operating as a separate airline. Beginning in 2012, aircraft, crews and routes will start to migrate over to Southwest. The last part of the operation to go will be international.

User currently offlineB747forever From Sweden, joined May 2007, 17066 posts, RR: 10
Reply 2, posted (3 years 5 months 1 week 4 days 12 hours ago) and read 10380 times:

Does anyone really know where FLs 717s will be used?


Work Hard, Fly Right
User currently offlineSTT757 From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 16872 posts, RR: 51
Reply 3, posted (3 years 5 months 1 week 4 days 12 hours ago) and read 10341 times:

Quoting B747forever (Reply 2):
Does anyone really know where FLs 717s will be used?

Most likely from ATL on current FL routes, and anywhere WN operates 735s like intra Texas routes.



Eastern Air lines flt # 701, EWR-MCO Boeing 757
User currently offlineRoseFlyer From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 9652 posts, RR: 52
Reply 4, posted (3 years 5 months 1 week 4 days 12 hours ago) and read 10283 times:

The one good thing is at least the 2 class Airtran 73Gs have the same capacity as WN's 1 class 73G.


If you have never designed an airplane part before, let the real designers do the work!
User currently offlineKcrwflyer From United States of America, joined May 2004, 3817 posts, RR: 7
Reply 5, posted (3 years 5 months 1 week 4 days 12 hours ago) and read 10213 times:

Quoting STT757 (Reply 3):
Most likely from ATL on current FL routes, and anywhere WN operates 735s like intra Texas routes.



I wonder about the future of the 717 in ATL. If WN want's to get as many seats as possible into ATL on limited gate and airspace, the 717 is the wrong aircraft for that.


User currently offlineSTT757 From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 16872 posts, RR: 51
Reply 6, posted (3 years 5 months 1 week 4 days 12 hours ago) and read 10204 times:

Quoting Kcrwflyer (Reply 5):

I wonder about the future of the 717 in ATL. If WN want's to get as many seats as possible into ATL on limited gate and airspace, the 717 is the wrong aircraft for that.

No doubt WN 73Gs (and 738s) will take over the more popular routes, especially to Florida.



Eastern Air lines flt # 701, EWR-MCO Boeing 757
User currently offlinedbo861 From United States of America, joined May 2004, 888 posts, RR: 1
Reply 7, posted (3 years 5 months 1 week 4 days 12 hours ago) and read 10146 times:

Quoting Kcrwflyer (Reply 5):

I wonder about the future of the 717 in ATL. If WN want's to get as many seats as possible into ATL on limited gate and airspace, the 717 is the wrong aircraft for that.

Read some of the other threads about the merger and ATL. Many of the gates at ATL are not big enough to accommodate a 737, so they are stuck using 717s for much of the ATL operation. I still see WN grabbing up much of the Mexicana 717s that are still available and using those to replace the aging 735 fleet. Until that happens, I feel that much of the 717s will be operated out of ATL.

Also, I wonder if WN will operate many 738s to ATL when they start coming online to help alleviate the limited gate situation.


User currently offlineTSS From United States of America, joined Dec 2006, 3068 posts, RR: 5
Reply 8, posted (3 years 5 months 1 week 4 days 11 hours ago) and read 10035 times:

Quoting dbo861 (Reply 7):
I still see WN grabbing up much of the Mexicana 717s that are still available and using those to replace the aging 735 fleet.

As do I, but one of our members here claims to have "inside information" (I can't say with any certainty that he doesn't) and swears up and down that all the Mexicana 717s are spoken for by other carriers and that none will go to Southwest. Due to my generally skeptical nature I doubt this, but I've adopted a "wait and see" attitude until the ex-Mexicana birds start appearing in service- either with Southwest or with other carriers.



Able to kill active threads stone dead with a single post!
User currently offlineWeb From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 427 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (3 years 5 months 1 week 4 days 10 hours ago) and read 9886 times:

Does anyone have information on the market for 717s? That is, who (if anyone) is selling, and who is buying? Have all the YX 717s been spoken for, or are some still looking for homes? Is WN even looking at acquiring more 717s?

Also, will the engine choice of FL's 73Gs lead to any sub-fleeting in the combined WN-FL fleet? As I recall, FL ordered 73Gs with the lowest-thrust CFM56s available. Is this an issue, or does it not really matter?

Forgive me if any of this has been discussed before; I don't have time to read every response to every thread!



Next flight: GRR-ORD-PDX-SEA-ORD-GRR
User currently offlinerl757pvd From United States of America, joined Dec 1999, 4676 posts, RR: 11
Reply 10, posted (3 years 5 months 1 week 4 days 10 hours ago) and read 9778 times:

Quoting Kcrwflyer (Reply 5):
I wonder about the future of the 717 in ATL. If WN want's to get as many seats as possible into ATL on limited gate and airspace, the 717 is the wrong aircraft for that.

The kicker is that FL was able to gain a few gates at ATL by re-striping and reconfiguring gates for the 717, While I expect they will switch it over to all/mostly 737 gates, they may loose a gate or two in the process.



Experience is what you get when what you thought would work out didn't!
User currently offlineLV From United States of America, joined Jun 2001, 2005 posts, RR: 0
Reply 11, posted (3 years 5 months 1 week 4 days 9 hours ago) and read 9644 times:

Quoting dbo861 (Reply 7):
Read some of the other threads about the merger and ATL. Many of the gates at ATL are not big enough to accommodate a 737, so they are stuck using 717s for much of the ATL operation. I still see WN grabbing up much of the Mexicana 717s that are still available and using those to replace the aging 735 fleet. Until that happens, I feel that much of the 717s will be operated out of ATL

Almost word for word was I was going to say. but as rl757pvd said

Quoting rl757pvd (Reply 10):
The kicker is that FL was able to gain a few gates at ATL by re-striping and reconfiguring gates for the 717, While I expect they will switch it over to all/mostly 737 gates, they may loose a gate or two in the process

and WN might make the choice to lose a gate or too. Really though I think the 717s present a great opportunity for WN to increase frequency on markets that need less capacity and to move to more of a multiple hub system like it seems to be doing (as places like MDW, ATL, etc max out on number of flights they can handle they will focus more on O&D and move connecting to places like STL, BNA, etc.)


User currently offlineCubsrule From United States of America, joined May 2004, 23035 posts, RR: 20
Reply 12, posted (3 years 5 months 1 week 4 days 6 hours ago) and read 9211 times:

Quoting LV (Reply 11):
and WN might make the choice to lose a gate or too.

No doubt - FL's utilization at ATL is pretty bad. Aren't they around 225 daily flights and 33 gates? WN could lose 4 or 5 gates and keep the same number of flights without too much trouble.



I can't decide whether I miss the tulip or the bowling shoe more
User currently offlineKELPkid From United States of America, joined Nov 2005, 6392 posts, RR: 3
Reply 13, posted (3 years 5 months 1 week 4 days 6 hours ago) and read 9119 times:

Quoting Cubsrule (Reply 12):
No doubt - FL's utilization at ATL is pretty bad. Aren't they around 225 daily flights and 33 gates? WN could lose 4 or 5 gates and keep the same number of flights without too much trouble.

I don't think anyone can hold a candle to WN when it comes to gate utilization...  



Celebrating the birth of KELPkidJR on August 5, 2009 :-)
User currently offlineTZTriStar500 From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 1452 posts, RR: 9
Reply 14, posted (3 years 5 months 1 week 4 days 5 hours ago) and read 8802 times:

Quoting dbo861 (Reply 7):
I still see WN grabbing up much of the Mexicana 717s that are still available and using those to replace the aging 735 fleet. Until that happens, I feel that much of the 717s will be operated out of ATL.
Quoting TSS (Reply 8):
As do I, but one of our members here claims to have "inside information" (I can't say with any certainty that he doesn't) and swears up and down that all the Mexicana 717s are spoken for by other carriers and that none will go to Southwest. Due to my generally skeptical nature I doubt this, but I've adopted a "wait and see" attitude until the ex-Mexicana birds start appearing in service- either with Southwest or with other carriers.
Quoting Web (Reply 9):
Does anyone have information on the market for 717s? That is, who (if anyone) is selling, and who is buying? Have all the YX 717s been spoken for, or are some still looking for homes? Is WN even looking at acquiring more 717s?

I'm the guy that said WN is not a prospective customer and I stand by that. BCC that owns the 25 ex-YX aircraft have been speaking to multiple carriers with imminent lease agreements expected. I am involved in a certain capacity and cannot divulge who that is until public. I will not risk my livelyhood in a public forum. As far as I know, these 25 are the only 717s on the market at this time.



35 years of American Trans Air/ATA Airlines, 1973-2008. A great little airline that will not be soon forgotten.
User currently offlinetimf From United States of America, joined Mar 2003, 970 posts, RR: 1
Reply 15, posted (3 years 5 months 1 week 4 days 4 hours ago) and read 8708 times:
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Quoting TZTriStar500 (Reply 14):
I'm the guy that said WN is not a prospective customer and I stand by that. BCC that owns the 25 ex-YX aircraft have been speaking to multiple carriers with imminent lease agreements expected. I am involved in a certain capacity and cannot divulge who that is until public. I will not risk my livelyhood in a public forum. As far as I know, these 25 are the only 717s on the market at this time.

It sounds like it may be related to this.

VIM-Avia Acquiring 717s? (by dtw9 Apr 16 2011 in Civil Aviation)


User currently offlineABQopsHP From United States of America, joined May 2006, 851 posts, RR: 3
Reply 16, posted (3 years 5 months 1 week 4 days 2 hours ago) and read 7440 times:

Spoke to a WN supervisor on Weds. He said there were a few headaches to be expected with the integration. The biggest one being, Pilot integration. He said DAL corporate was reviewing the ATL HUB, to see how that would fit into the WN model. As for where the 717s may operate, he didnt have a true answer, however he did say, they were expecting an CRP-ATL nonstop to be brought on, later this year. Im not sure if WN can make the flight work, if EV was not doing too well in the market, and EA tried it years ago, then put the 2 flights back to 1 stop service either via SAT or IAH. We will see how it plays out.
JD CRPXE



A line is evidence that other people exist.
User currently offlineCubsrule From United States of America, joined May 2004, 23035 posts, RR: 20
Reply 17, posted (3 years 5 months 1 week 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 7104 times:

Quoting ABQopsHP (Reply 16):
he didnt have a true answer, however he did say, they were expecting an CRP-ATL nonstop to be brought on, later this year.

They don't fly CRP-DAL or CRP-MDW - why would they fly CRP-ATL?

CRP-DAL = 175 PDEW
CRP-CHI = 20 PDEW
CRP-ATL = 10 PDEW.



I can't decide whether I miss the tulip or the bowling shoe more
User currently offlinedbo861 From United States of America, joined May 2004, 888 posts, RR: 1
Reply 18, posted (3 years 5 months 1 week 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 6949 times:

Quoting TZTriStar500 (Reply 14):
I'm the guy that said WN is not a prospective customer and I stand by that. BCC that owns the 25 ex-YX aircraft have been speaking to multiple carriers with imminent lease agreements expected. I am involved in a certain capacity and cannot divulge who that is until public. I will not risk my livelyhood in a public forum. As far as I know, these 25 are the only 717s on the market at this time.


Interesting. Do you know how soon this will become public?


User currently offlineTZTriStar500 From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 1452 posts, RR: 9
Reply 19, posted (3 years 5 months 1 week 3 days 22 hours ago) and read 5839 times:

Quoting dbo861 (Reply 18):
Interesting. Do you know how soon this will become public?

I can't speculate when, but there are on-going active and serious discussions.



35 years of American Trans Air/ATA Airlines, 1973-2008. A great little airline that will not be soon forgotten.
User currently offlinetype-rated From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 20, posted (3 years 5 months 1 week 3 days 18 hours ago) and read 5102 times:

I imagine they'll standardize the cabins before they start painting planes.

User currently offlineABQopsHP From United States of America, joined May 2006, 851 posts, RR: 3
Reply 21, posted (3 years 5 months 1 week 3 days 14 hours ago) and read 4225 times:

Quoting Cubsrule (Reply 17):

Quoting ABQopsHP (Reply 16):
he didnt have a true answer, however he did say, they were expecting an CRP-ATL nonstop to be brought on, later this year.

They don't fly CRP-DAL or CRP-MDW - why would they fly CRP-ATL?

CRP-DAL = 175 PDEW
CRP-CHI = 20 PDEW
CRP-ATL = 10 PDEW.

I agree! I do not see how this will work. It hasnt before.
JD CRPXE



A line is evidence that other people exist.
User currently offlineKELPkid From United States of America, joined Nov 2005, 6392 posts, RR: 3
Reply 22, posted (3 years 5 months 1 week 3 days 4 hours ago) and read 3592 times:

Quoting type-rated (Reply 20):
I imagine they'll standardize the cabins before they start painting planes.

Wonder how many FL customers will be ticked when first class goes bye-bye  



Celebrating the birth of KELPkidJR on August 5, 2009 :-)
User currently offlineUSXguy From United States of America, joined Jan 2006, 1017 posts, RR: 5
Reply 23, posted (3 years 5 months 1 week 3 days 2 hours ago) and read 3445 times:

Quoting Cubsrule (Reply 12):
No doubt - FL's utilization at ATL is pretty bad. Aren't they around 225 daily flights and 33 gates? WN could lose 4 or 5 gates and keep the same number of flights without too much trouble.

Not sure where you gather that - ATL is a pure HUB... there are times that every gate is being utilized. WN is more of a "rolling" type operation that isn't defined by hub - and - spoke.



xx
User currently offlineKcrwflyer From United States of America, joined May 2004, 3817 posts, RR: 7
Reply 24, posted (3 years 5 months 1 week 3 days 2 hours ago) and read 3359 times:

Quoting USXguy (Reply 23):
WN is more of a "rolling" type operation that isn't defined by hub - and - spoke.

Generally, yes.. but they've reworked some schedules to allow for more connections. There's been speculation as to whether they can even make ATL work with additional flights if they don't treat it as a "hub" airport. Largely because FL relies on feed there.


User currently offlineCubsrule From United States of America, joined May 2004, 23035 posts, RR: 20
Reply 25, posted (3 years 5 months 1 week 3 days 1 hour ago) and read 3258 times:

Quoting USXguy (Reply 23):
Not sure where you gather that - ATL is a pure HUB... there are times that every gate is being utilized. WN is more of a "rolling" type operation that isn't defined by hub - and - spoke.

I don't see your point. You seem to have laid out why WN will need fewer gates - WN rolls their hubs and always has. That's one of the big ways they keep costs down at a place like MDW or BWI.



I can't decide whether I miss the tulip or the bowling shoe more
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