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TP MIA-LIS Downgraded To 3x Weekly For Winter 2012  
User currently offlinemiaintl From United States of America, joined Jun 2010, 1020 posts, RR: 0
Posted (3 years 2 months 2 weeks 5 days 16 hours ago) and read 3093 times:

I have just checked the TP schedule and noticed that it downgraded its service to MIA to 3x weekly for winter season 2011-12. Does anyone know the reason for this downgrade?

14 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently onlinejfk777 From United States of America, joined Aug 2006, 8289 posts, RR: 7
Reply 1, posted (3 years 2 months 2 weeks 5 days 14 hours ago) and read 3026 times:
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Lots of Portugesse go to Brazil for the winter. Its summer in Rio when its winter in Miami, its the best time to be in Miami. TAP is probably using Miami to expand there service to the USA( Newark is their only destination) and needs the A330 for more service to Brazil in the northern winter.

User currently offlinesomething From United Kingdom, joined May 2011, 1633 posts, RR: 21
Reply 2, posted (3 years 2 months 2 weeks 5 days 13 hours ago) and read 2933 times:

It was scheduled to go from 5 weekly down to 4 weekly from September on from the start. Given that Southern Florida is a popular (northern hemisphere) winter destination though, the further reduction most likely reflects horrendous booking numbers, rather than an unforeseen need for the aircraft.

In light of Portugal's current economic situation it's not very surprising though that tourism wanes. Private sector austerity measures.

[Edited 2011-05-13 17:11:28]


..sick of it. -K. Pilkington.
User currently offlinemiaintl From United States of America, joined Jun 2010, 1020 posts, RR: 0
Reply 3, posted (3 years 2 months 2 weeks 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 2888 times:

Quoting something (Reply 2):

If thats the case then why did TP start the MIA route to begin with? This flight has not even started yet and it is already doing poorly, yet MIA-LIS is a highly seasonal market and popular mostly in the summer. This big european bubble that we had at MIA was short lived and burst quickly. I mean we first had MUC with LH being axed, then UN MIA-DME got downgraded and now TP is being downgraded. I wonder how much longer till KL goes?!


User currently offlinesomething From United Kingdom, joined May 2011, 1633 posts, RR: 21
Reply 4, posted (3 years 2 months 2 weeks 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 2849 times:

Quoting miaintl (Reply 3):
why did TP start the MIA route to begin with?

Looking at some of their business moves, the question after the 'why' is something even the people at TAP can't answer you. Maybe they thought the huge South American diaspora there would make things work.

Quoting miaintl (Reply 3):
I wonder how much longer till KL goes?!

The KLM service to MIA is somewhat inherited from Martinair who used to fly 5 weekly AMS-MIA on 767 equipment, compared to 4 weekly MD11 equipment by KLM. If KLM managed to secure Martinair's old charter contracts (note: there's a 15 months gap lying between Martinair's departure and KLM arrival) and additionally acquired some lucrative cargo partners, I'm quite optimistic about that particular routes prosperity.

Quoting miaintl (Reply 3):
MUC with LH being axed

That, so I am given to understand, happened to keep seat numbers at present levels after the A380 introduction on that route and as a positive side effect help the DUS flights.



..sick of it. -K. Pilkington.
User currently offlineHB-IWC From Greece, joined Sep 2000, 4498 posts, RR: 72
Reply 5, posted (3 years 2 months 2 weeks 5 days 10 hours ago) and read 2691 times:

Quoting miaintl (Reply 3):
If thats the case then why did TP start the MIA route to begin with? This flight has not even started yet and it is already doing poorly

Strange, since only a couple of weeks ago you posted that every single TP flight on the route was already fully booked for the summer.


User currently offlinejj8080 From Brazil, joined Aug 2008, 932 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (3 years 2 months 2 weeks 5 days 10 hours ago) and read 2686 times:

TP is also going to begin LIS-POA, and will need A332 for that.


100 146 319/20/21 332 722 732/3/4/5/G/W/8/H/9 742/3/4 752/3 762/3 772/W BE2 BET E75 CNJ CR2 D10 F27 F50 ER4 LRJ M11 M80
User currently offlinemiaintl From United States of America, joined Jun 2010, 1020 posts, RR: 0
Reply 7, posted (3 years 2 months 2 weeks 5 days 7 hours ago) and read 2595 times:

Quoting HB-IWC (Reply 6):

Those are the summer bookings that were almost sold out. This topic is on the winter months. Also Mark, these are not apocolyptic posts but true and genuine analyzations of the recent failures of numerous MIA-EU flights. Plus I am not alone at making these analyzations, as many on these blogs have already pointed out to you. I think the MIA-EUROPE market has become oversaturated and were seeing the drawbacks of that now. The officials at MIA should look at securing new routes from untapped markets like Asia or Africa instead of dumping all this extra European traffic on MIA.

[Edited 2011-05-13 23:08:29]

[Edited 2011-05-13 23:09:11]

User currently offlinemah4546 From Sweden, joined Jan 2001, 32620 posts, RR: 72
Reply 8, posted (3 years 2 months 2 weeks 5 days 5 hours ago) and read 2538 times:

Quoting miaintl (Reply 7):
Also Mark, these are not apocolyptic posts but true and genuine analyzations of the recent failures of numerous MIA-EU flights. Plus I am not alone at making these analyzations, as many on these blogs have already pointed out to you

Nobody has pointed that out whatsoever. You fail to realize that airlines are constantly fluxing schedules around, and take the slightest shift as being the end of the world. You need to understand how airlines schedule flights before making it seem like the slightest reduction is the end of the world...it's not! Miami-Europe capacity remains at very helthy levels, as I pointed out months ago. A reduction in service by one weekly flight is not a sign of failure or over capacity. Shortly after Swissair started Miami, it was reduced from daily to five weekly. Ten years later, MIAZRH is the third largest U.S.-Switzerland local maket and the yields are outstanding.



a.
User currently offlinemiaintl From United States of America, joined Jun 2010, 1020 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (3 years 2 months 2 weeks 5 days 5 hours ago) and read 2498 times:

Quoting mah4546 (Reply 8):

Can the same be said about KL and the soon to be FRA 380 service? I will be flying KL to AMS in June and I will be curious to find out the loads of that flight, because just today i hear that AF is canceling its planned 77W to MIA, and i am curious if KL had soemthing to do with that recent decision. Plus MIA officals need to still look elsewhere to secure new flights because Europe is quickly becoming an over-saturated market, and unlike South America it does not have a endless supply of traffic going to MIA.


User currently onlinesantos From United Kingdom, joined Dec 2007, 740 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (3 years 2 months 2 weeks 5 days 5 hours ago) and read 2483 times:

[quote=miaintl,reply=3]Quoting something (Reply 2):

If thats the case then why did TP start the MIA route to begin with? This flight has not even started yet and it is already doing poorly. How do you know is doing badly, advance bookings are really good, 3x weekly in the winter seems normal a the Portuguese tend to take their holidays from July to September, they are not like other northern European nations that love to to take winter sun holidays. The 3x weekly may actually improve yields.


User currently offlinemah4546 From Sweden, joined Jan 2001, 32620 posts, RR: 72
Reply 11, posted (3 years 2 months 2 weeks 5 days 4 hours ago) and read 2447 times:

Quoting miaintl (Reply 9):
will be flying KL to AMS in June and I will be curious to find out the loads of that flight, because just today i hear that AF is canceling its planned 77W to MIA, and i am curious if KL had soemthing to do with that recent decision.

Do you realize that the 747 has more seats, in both coach and business, than the 77W? So why on earth would KLM affect e decision of the Air France to keep more seats in the market? Other than, obviously, the fact that KLM is doing very well (which, BTW, it is).



a.
User currently offlineSCL767 From Chile, joined Feb 2006, 8757 posts, RR: 5
Reply 12, posted (3 years 2 months 2 weeks 5 days 4 hours ago) and read 2396 times:
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Quoting something (Reply 4):
That, so I am given to understand, happened to keep seat numbers at present levels after the A380 introduction on that route and as a positive side effect help the DUS flights.

IIRC, LH is not operating DUS-MIA this summer. LH will resume DUS-MIA 5x weekly in October.


User currently offlineLipeGIG From Brazil, joined May 2005, 11420 posts, RR: 58
Reply 13, posted (3 years 2 months 2 weeks 4 days 20 hours ago) and read 2111 times:
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Quoting miaintl (Thread starter):
I have just checked the TP schedule and noticed that it downgraded its service to MIA to 3x weekly for winter season 2011-12. Does anyone know the reason for this downgrade?

Higher demand for South America (i.e. Brazil) and less demand for Miami during IATA winter.

Quoting mah4546 (Reply 11):
Do you realize that the 747 has more seats, in both coach and business, than the 77W? So why on earth would KLM affect e decision of the Air France to keep more seats in the market? Other than, obviously, the fact that KLM is doing very well (which, BTW, it is).

AF 77W new config have 42J, against 40J on 744, and offers the new business class cabin.



New York + Rio de Janeiro = One of the best combinations !
User currently onlinesantos From United Kingdom, joined Dec 2007, 740 posts, RR: 0
Reply 14, posted (3 years 2 months 2 weeks 2 days 19 hours ago) and read 1579 times:

TP today announced that the Miami route has alreay 32.000 bookings so far. (Route is yet to start)They will adjust their schedule offer, probably reduce flights when there is less demand, and offer more during peak times like xmas and other holidays.

Sorry link only in Portuguese:
http://www.presstur.com/site/news.asp?news=30587


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