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A380 Ryanair-esque Airline On The Cards?  
User currently offlinemikey72 From United Kingdom, joined Oct 2009, 1780 posts, RR: 2
Posted (3 years 3 months 3 weeks 6 days 9 hours ago) and read 10745 times:

With the advent of the A380 (and who knows what to follow) will we one day see a long-haul Ryanair-esque type airline equipped with a fleet of all economy A380's ?

Bearing this in mind are the established co-operating legacy carriers drawing up plans so as not to be caught short like they did with short-haul ?

Is it possible to have a show-up and pay hand baggage only intra-alliance multi brand (hence cost limiting) long-haul airline ?


Flying is like sex - I've never had all I wanted but occasionally I've had all I can stand.
22 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently onlinetravelavnut From Netherlands, joined May 2010, 1619 posts, RR: 7
Reply 1, posted (3 years 3 months 3 weeks 6 days 9 hours ago) and read 10745 times:

Quoting mikey72 (Thread starter):
With the advent of the A380 (and who knows what to follow) will we one day see a long-haul Ryanair-esque type airline equipped with a fleet of all economy A380's ?

Well Air Austral (not really a Ryanair-esque airline IIRC) is planning on deploying a 800+ seat A380 to Reunion. This would be the first (almost?) all economy version. So who knows, maybe after this it will catch. I'm not an expert, but an 800+ seater looks to me like a CASM-killer (if you can fill the seat of course).



Live From Amsterdam!
User currently offlineCHRISBA777ER From UK - England, joined Mar 2001, 5964 posts, RR: 62
Reply 2, posted (3 years 3 months 3 weeks 6 days 9 hours ago) and read 10720 times:

Air Asia X will be first to go down this route - although as Trav notes above, Air Austral are a high density, Y-heavy carrier.

I could see the UK charter carriers go down that route first though - all Y class cattle cars doing LGW and MAN - Orlando etc.



What do you mean you dont have any bourbon? Do you know how far it is to Houston? What kind of airline is this???
User currently offlinebreiz From France, joined Mar 2005, 1917 posts, RR: 2
Reply 3, posted (3 years 3 months 3 weeks 6 days 9 hours ago) and read 10720 times:

Not Ryanair-esque, but it is the intention of Emirates to possibly use an all A380 fleet when all ac ordered are delivered.
As far as Ryanair is concerned, we still need to see how such a model would work on long-haul traffic.
Intra-Europe traffic for example cannot sustain short to medium A380 operations.
In Japan, B747s may eventually be replaced by A380s on national flights.


User currently onlinetravelavnut From Netherlands, joined May 2010, 1619 posts, RR: 7
Reply 4, posted (3 years 3 months 3 weeks 6 days 9 hours ago) and read 10662 times:

Quoting breiz (Reply 3):
but it is the intention of Emirates to possibly use an all A380 fleet when all ac ordered are delivered.

They ordered 70 A350s and almost 50 77Ws, so I doubt this is really their intention.



Live From Amsterdam!
User currently offlinehuaiwei From Singapore, joined Oct 2008, 1114 posts, RR: 2
Reply 5, posted (3 years 3 months 3 weeks 6 days 8 hours ago) and read 10470 times:

Quoting CHRISBA777ER (Reply 2):
Air Asia X will be first to go down this route - although as Trav notes above, Air Austral are a high density, Y-heavy carrier.

SQ's LCC offshoot may very well beat them to it. 10 years down the road they will again pre-maturely retire their A380s and viola, off they go to the LCC! 



It's huaiwei...not huawei. I have nothing to do with the PRC! :)
User currently offlinerichardw From United Kingdom, joined May 2001, 3750 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (3 years 3 months 3 weeks 6 days 8 hours ago) and read 10340 times:

What would the turnaround time be for an 800 seater A380 be?

User currently offlineRaptor1090 From United Arab Emirates, joined May 2011, 82 posts, RR: 0
Reply 7, posted (3 years 3 months 3 weeks 6 days 8 hours ago) and read 10244 times:

Quoting travelavnut (Reply 4):
but it is the intention of Emirates to possibly use an all A380 fleet when all ac ordered are delivered.

They ordered 70 A350s and almost 50 77Ws, so I doubt this is really their intention.

It wouldn't be surprising for them to do something of this sort though. Probably not in the near future, but maybe in 20 years time? They might do something interesting once Al Maktoum International opens.


User currently offlineRaptor1090 From United Arab Emirates, joined May 2011, 82 posts, RR: 0
Reply 8, posted (3 years 3 months 3 weeks 6 days 8 hours ago) and read 10168 times:

Quoting richardw (Reply 6):
What would the turnaround time be for an 800 seater A380 be?

The shortest turnaround of an active A380 flight that I know of is 1:40 for EKs 517 seater DXB-MAN route. For an 800 seating A380, I would guess it should be around 2:30.


User currently onlinetravelavnut From Netherlands, joined May 2010, 1619 posts, RR: 7
Reply 9, posted (3 years 3 months 3 weeks 6 days 8 hours ago) and read 10118 times:

Quoting Raptor1090 (Reply 7):
It wouldn't be surprising for them to do something of this sort though. Probably not in the near future, but maybe in 20 years

Possibly, but I think even in 20 years not every EK route will warrant an A380, right? But I'm no expert so I'll happily stand corrected  



Live From Amsterdam!
User currently offlineWoof From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 10, posted (3 years 3 months 3 weeks 6 days 8 hours ago) and read 10114 times:

Quoting richardw (Reply 6):
What would the turnaround time be for an 800 seater A380 be?

If they (FR) stuck with the free-seating model I would say boarding time would be around 2 weeks.

Imagine being the last passenger to board a full flight. Trying to find the sole remaining seat would be the proverbial needle in a haystack search.


User currently offlineQuokka From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 11, posted (3 years 3 months 3 weeks 6 days 7 hours ago) and read 10094 times:

Quoting Raptor1090 (Reply 7):
It wouldn't be surprising for them to do something of this sort though.

Given that EK includes in its marketing the image of flying in comfort and style, boasting private suites in first, chauffeur-drive transfers, with connectivity being the major selling point, it would be a major change in strategy to follow the model set by Ryanair. Ryanair offers point to point, no-frills travel which appears to be quite a different model. Each model has proven successful in their respective market segments.

Now if you said flydubai, then you might be on to something, although they still have growing to do.


User currently offlinemikey72 From United Kingdom, joined Oct 2009, 1780 posts, RR: 2
Reply 12, posted (3 years 3 months 3 weeks 6 days 7 hours ago) and read 9955 times:

Could BA and AA, LH and UA or AF and DL (with all the benefits of anti-trust etc) offer A380 shuttle type all economy (cheap flights) across the pond from non hub airports ? (So as not to impact on mainline premium) Basically before someone else does.

All I'm saying is that if i'd walked into any boardroom of any airline in the world 25 years ago with a crystal ball............

[Edited 2011-06-06 06:33:12]


Flying is like sex - I've never had all I wanted but occasionally I've had all I can stand.
User currently offlineYULWinterSkies From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 2180 posts, RR: 5
Reply 13, posted (3 years 3 months 3 weeks 5 days 21 hours ago) and read 8568 times:

Quoting mikey72 (Thread starter):
With the advent of the A380 (and who knows what to follow) will we one day see a long-haul Ryanair-esque type airline equipped with a fleet of all economy A380's ?

If there would be such an airline with all-economy 77W today flying, say, LTN-BDL as a proxy for LON-NYC, I would probably say yes, but we are not quite there yet.
I think the added revenue of offering J seats is not worth the venture, and it's more the opposite that we are currently seeing, such as J-only "low-cost" airlines (open skies) who want to get rid of the low fares for the masses.

Quoting travelavnut (Reply 9):
Possibly, but I think even in 20 years not every EK route will warrant an A380, right? But I'm no expert so I'll happily stand corrected

You're right, their 167th city in Europe then will not warrant an A380 as it will be a route launch.



When I doubt... go running!
User currently offlinegoblin211 From United States of America, joined Jun 2010, 1209 posts, RR: 0
Reply 14, posted (3 years 3 months 3 weeks 5 days 21 hours ago) and read 8352 times:

By Ryanir-esque do you mean LCCs? If so, there'd only be certain ones that could/would use the 380 but it depends on the routes, demand, etc.


From the airport with love
User currently offlineAirCanada787 From Canada, joined Nov 2010, 283 posts, RR: 0
Reply 15, posted (3 years 3 months 3 weeks 5 days 17 hours ago) and read 6803 times:

Quoting Raptor1090 (Reply 7):
Quoting travelavnut (Reply 4):
but it is the intention of Emirates to possibly use an all A380 fleet when all ac ordered are delivered.

They ordered 70 A350s and almost 50 77Ws, so I doubt this is really their intention.

It wouldn't be surprising for them to do something of this sort though. Probably not in the near future, but maybe in 20 years time?

Wouldn't it be hard to operate an 'all A380 fleet'? For example to launch a new route with an A380 you would have to be very, very sure that you were going to have healthy loads and yields. Or if a destination experienced a reduction in its passenger levels what would you do?

While I know of course that Emirates will operate the largest A380 fleet I think they will always need aircraft such as the 77W and upcoming A350s for routes were an A380 would be too much aircraft or for routes where they will prefer to operate multiple flights a day with a smaller plane than one flight a day with an A380.



The mind, like a parachute, functions only when open.
User currently onlineastuteman From United Kingdom, joined Jan 2005, 10071 posts, RR: 97
Reply 16, posted (3 years 3 months 3 weeks 5 days 15 hours ago) and read 6152 times:
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Quoting mikey72 (Thread starter):
With the advent of the A380 (and who knows what to follow) will we one day see a long-haul Ryanair-esque type airline equipped with a fleet of all economy A380's ?

Air Austral's A380's will be equipped with 840 economy class seats.
Although I understand this will be a "ful-service" arrangement.

Rgds


User currently offline9252fly From Canada, joined Sep 2005, 1393 posts, RR: 0
Reply 17, posted (3 years 3 months 3 weeks 5 days 15 hours ago) and read 5887 times:

Quoting astuteman (Reply 16):
Air Austral's A380's will be equipped with 840 economy class seats.

I personally wouldn't want to be on that aircraft from ORY - RUN when all the lavatories due to some system failure go inoperative after the meal service halfway through the flight.


User currently offlinemikey72 From United Kingdom, joined Oct 2009, 1780 posts, RR: 2
Reply 18, posted (3 years 3 months 3 weeks 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 5024 times:

Quoting goblin211 (Reply 14):
By Ryanir-esque do you mean LCCs?

Yes but hopefully not as tawdry as some LCC's. The scope would be very limited - some flights in the world are relatively short in duration (so do-able) like European cities to NYC but have constant huge volumes of passengers.

I just want to know if the A380 makes the idea workable/solvent ?



Flying is like sex - I've never had all I wanted but occasionally I've had all I can stand.
User currently offlineBA6590 From UK - England, joined Jul 2007, 132 posts, RR: 0
Reply 19, posted (3 years 3 months 3 weeks 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 4964 times:

Quoting 9252fly (Reply 17):
I personally wouldn't want to be on that aircraft from ORY - RUN when all the lavatories due to some system failure go inoperative after the meal service halfway through the flight.

Wouldn't it be the same as being on any long-haul flight when the lavs go inoperable? I personally wouldn't want to be on ANY aircraft without functioning lavatories.
But I guess having that many people will create a "huge" mess  



"Never forget, the higher we soar, the smaller we appear to those who cannot fly" - Nietzsche -
User currently onlinetravelavnut From Netherlands, joined May 2010, 1619 posts, RR: 7
Reply 20, posted (3 years 3 months 3 weeks 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 4881 times:

Quoting 9252fly (Reply 17):
personally wouldn't want to be on that aircraft from ORY - RUN when all the lavatories due to some system failure go inoperative after the meal service halfway through the flight.



Lol, I can imagine this would warrant an full-blown emergency haha. Makes me wonder, is lavatory reliability taken into account with the ETOPS restrictions? 



Live From Amsterdam!
User currently offlineBurkhard From Germany, joined Nov 2006, 4398 posts, RR: 2
Reply 21, posted (3 years 3 months 3 weeks 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 4858 times:

Quoting richardw (Reply 6):
What would the turnaround time be for an 800 seater A380 be?

That depends on the number of doors you use, and the way you organize it. Filling 800 seats through 5 doors, it made well, lasts as long as 160 seats through one, provided you get the people to the right door.


User currently offlinespr773 From India, joined Jun 2008, 162 posts, RR: 0
Reply 22, posted (3 years 3 months 3 weeks 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 4560 times:

Keeping in mind the business model of Ryanair and the size of the A380 , maybe they will rip out the seats and herd folk in an airconditioned cattle car. So that would be a fraction of the price of a normal LCC and then maybe those who pay LCC fares would get a hard bench. Just imagine the possibilites. The denser than the densest configurations would be possible for this Ryanair-esque airline.

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