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Thai To Acquire 6 77W, 8 B787, 12 A350, 11 A320  
User currently offlineLAXDESI From United States of America, joined May 2005, 5086 posts, RR: 48
Posted (2 years 10 months 1 week 6 days 1 hour ago) and read 17806 times:

Interesting mix of aircraft with purchase and leases.
http://www.flightglobal.com/articles...s-and-12-a350s-in-37-aircraft.html
Quote:
Thai plans to purchase 15 aircraft and acquire the remaining 22 on operating leases. It will purchase six Boeing 777-300ERs, to be delivered in 2014 and 2015, four Airbus A350-900s (2016 and 2017) and five Airbus A320-200s (2014 and 2015).

It also plans to acquire six 787-8s and two 787-9s from US lessor International Lease Finance (ILFC) on operating leases. The -8s will be delivered in 2014 and 2015, while the -9s will be delivered in 2017.

In addition, Thai will lease six A350-900s from Aviation Lease and Finance, to be delivered in 2017, and two A350-900s from CIT Aerospace International, which will deliver the aircraft in 2016. The airline will also lease six A320-200s from RBS Aerospace International, to be delivered in 2012 and 2013.

All the operating leases have terms of 12 years each, said Thai.

[Edited 2011-06-12 21:45:23]

67 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineCentre From United States of America, joined Mar 2010, 487 posts, RR: 0
Reply 1, posted (2 years 10 months 1 week 6 days 1 hour ago) and read 17757 times:

Did the Paris show start already?


I have cut 4 times, and it's still short.
User currently offline9V-SVC From Singapore, joined Oct 2001, 1795 posts, RR: 10
Reply 2, posted (2 years 10 months 1 week 6 days 1 hour ago) and read 17740 times:

Excellent order, but where did you get the 11 A332 order from? Didnt see it in the article.


Airliners is the wings of my life.
User currently onlineBMI727 From United States of America, joined Feb 2009, 15484 posts, RR: 26
Reply 3, posted (2 years 10 months 1 week 6 days 1 hour ago) and read 17671 times:

Quoting 9V-SVC (Reply 2):
where did you get the 11 A332 order from?

Typo, it should be A320s as cited in the linked article.



Why do Aerospace Engineering students have to turn things in on time?
User currently offlineLAXDESI From United States of America, joined May 2005, 5086 posts, RR: 48
Reply 4, posted (2 years 10 months 1 week 6 days 1 hour ago) and read 17600 times:

Quoting BMI727 (Reply 3):
Typo, it should be A320s as cited in the linked article.

Thanks for catching it. I have corrected the title.

Looking at the Thai fleet, it would seem that the B788s are to replace some of the 17 A300s in service. B77W are expected to replace 77W leased from Jet and replace some of the B744. A359 should replace some of the older B772s.


User currently offlineEK413 From Australia, joined Nov 2003, 4685 posts, RR: 4
Reply 5, posted (2 years 10 months 1 week 6 days 1 hour ago) and read 17564 times:

Quoting BMI727 (Reply 3):
Quoting 9V-SVC (Reply 2):
where did you get the 11 A332 order from?

Typo, it should be A320s as cited in the linked article.

As usual TG always filled with surprises... I don't understand why the mix of aircraft and why they haven't stuck to one type of aircraft for the mission?
Any hows, well done Airbus and Boeing...

EK413



Good evening, ladies and gentlemen. We are tonight’s entertainment!
User currently offlinesomething From United Kingdom, joined May 2011, 1633 posts, RR: 21
Reply 6, posted (2 years 10 months 1 week 6 days 1 hour ago) and read 17489 times:

Thai colored A320s?  Did not see that coming.

Quite the mixed fleet the boys in purple will be flying. A333, A345, A346, A359, A388 and 772, 773, 744, 788 and 789. I understand it's really ''only'' 6 different family types and the rest are subtypes, but it's still pretty diverse. I assume by the time these new aircraft have arrived, the 737s and A300s will have left the Thai fleet?



..sick of it. -K. Pilkington.
User currently onlineBMI727 From United States of America, joined Feb 2009, 15484 posts, RR: 26
Reply 7, posted (2 years 10 months 1 week 6 days ago) and read 17473 times:

Quoting EK413 (Reply 5):
I don't understand why the mix of aircraft and why they haven't stuck to one type of aircraft for the mission?

A split A350 and 787 order makes sense. The 787 will probably be a little bit better on regional flights plus having a slightly smaller seat count and the A350 packs in a few more seats and has a bit better range although it will weigh a bit more. Not much different than how many airlines fly A330s and 777s.

The numbers are a bit baffling. I'd say that both fleets are likely to grow, as the deliveries are likely too far out for either to be a stopgap measure. Perhaps they are in talks now, or want to wait and get better performance data.



Why do Aerospace Engineering students have to turn things in on time?
User currently offlineStitch From United States of America, joined Jul 2005, 29689 posts, RR: 84
Reply 8, posted (2 years 10 months 1 week 6 days ago) and read 17448 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

ILFC converted 34 of their 787-8s to 787-9s. We now know where 2 have gone.

User currently offlinescbriml From United Kingdom, joined Jul 2003, 12040 posts, RR: 47
Reply 9, posted (2 years 10 months 1 week 6 days ago) and read 17281 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

Quoting LAXDESI (Thread starter):
Thai will lease six A350-900s from Aviation Lease and Finance

It seems ALF will be ordering A350s soon then.



Hey AA, the 1960s called. They want their planes back!
User currently offlineaviasian From Singapore, joined Jan 2001, 1483 posts, RR: 15
Reply 10, posted (2 years 10 months 1 week 6 days ago) and read 17193 times:

Thai is keeping up with its tradition of having lots of types and sub-types ... not the most efficient way of doing what is already a most complicated business but that is just the way that TG has always been.

KC Sim


User currently offlineLAXDESI From United States of America, joined May 2005, 5086 posts, RR: 48
Reply 11, posted (2 years 10 months 1 week 6 days ago) and read 17102 times:

It is being reported by Bangkok Post that Thai will be placing another order for 38 aircraft in the next 3 months, for delivery between 2018 and 2022. The second batch will be all outright purchase and not involve any leases.

Could A350-10 be part of the mix in the next round along with 77W to replace additional B744s?
http://www.bangkokpost.com/business/...-woos-thai-with-aggressive-pricing


User currently offlineAsiaflyer From Singapore, joined May 2007, 1111 posts, RR: 0
Reply 12, posted (2 years 10 months 1 week 5 days 23 hours ago) and read 16926 times:

Quoting Centre (Reply 1):
Did the Paris show start already?

This comes straight from the mouth of the horse.  http://thai.listedcompany.com/newsroom/2011-06-13_THAI_EN.pdf



SQ,MI,MH,CX,KA,CA,CZ,MU,KE,OZ,QF,NZ,FD,JQ,3K,5J,IT,AI,IC,QR,SK,LF,KL,AF,LH,LX,OS,SR,BA,SN,FR,WF,1I,5T,VZ,VX,AC,NW,UA,US,
User currently offlineflythere From Hong Kong, joined May 2010, 398 posts, RR: 0
Reply 13, posted (2 years 10 months 1 week 5 days 23 hours ago) and read 16913 times:

Seems that this round of order only cater for fleet renewal rather than for further growth....

Would expect they have a larger order than such....


User currently offlinePanAm_DC10 From Australia, joined Aug 2000, 4096 posts, RR: 90
Reply 14, posted (2 years 10 months 1 week 5 days 23 hours ago) and read 16782 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW
COMMUNITY MANAGER

Quoting scbriml (Reply 9):
It seems ALF will be ordering A350s soon then.

True though this is ALAFCO and they already have 12 A359s on order.

Regards

Paul.



Ask the impossible to achieve the best possible
User currently onlinekiwiandrew From New Zealand, joined Jun 2005, 8492 posts, RR: 14
Reply 15, posted (2 years 10 months 1 week 5 days 23 hours ago) and read 16723 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

Quoting something (Reply 6):
Quite the mixed fleet the boys in purple will be flying. A333, A345, A346, A359, A388 and 772, 773, 744, 788 and 789. I understand it's really ''only'' 6 different family types and the rest are subtypes, but it's still pretty diverse

It must be in their blood, dont forget that SK helped set them up many years ago and we know what SK thinks about maintaining fleet "diversity"  



Moderation in all things ... including moderation ;-)
User currently offlineAsiaflyer From Singapore, joined May 2007, 1111 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (2 years 10 months 1 week 5 days 23 hours ago) and read 16700 times:

Quoting something (Reply 6):
Thai colored A320s? Did not see that coming.

Don't be surprised if you see A320NEO in next order batch.



SQ,MI,MH,CX,KA,CA,CZ,MU,KE,OZ,QF,NZ,FD,JQ,3K,5J,IT,AI,IC,QR,SK,LF,KL,AF,LH,LX,OS,SR,BA,SN,FR,WF,1I,5T,VZ,VX,AC,NW,UA,US,
User currently offlineflythere From Hong Kong, joined May 2010, 398 posts, RR: 0
Reply 17, posted (2 years 10 months 1 week 5 days 22 hours ago) and read 16047 times:

Quoting something (Reply 6):
Thai colored A320s?

perhaps that's for their newly set up LCC subsidary.


User currently onlineBMI727 From United States of America, joined Feb 2009, 15484 posts, RR: 26
Reply 18, posted (2 years 10 months 1 week 5 days 22 hours ago) and read 15794 times:

Quoting flythere (Reply 17):

Are they starting another one? But, it might make sense for at least some of them to be assigned to Nok Air.



Why do Aerospace Engineering students have to turn things in on time?
User currently offlineSASMD82 From Netherlands, joined Mar 2007, 710 posts, RR: 0
Reply 19, posted (2 years 10 months 1 week 5 days 22 hours ago) and read 15795 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

Quoting something (Reply 6):

I bet that the A350 and B787 replace A340-500/600 and B777-200 and that the A380 will replace the B747s.


User currently offlinesomething From United Kingdom, joined May 2011, 1633 posts, RR: 21
Reply 20, posted (2 years 10 months 1 week 5 days 21 hours ago) and read 15584 times:

Quoting kiwiandrew (Reply 15):
It must be in their blood, dont forget that SK helped set them up many years ago and we know what SK thinks about maintaining fleet "diversity"

Maybe their staff are closet spotters   And from an aviation enthusiast point of view, I'm quite pleased to be treated to such a fleet variety, but I don't really see the point in it. Especially the 2x 789 and 12xA359 duality leaves me baffled. There's more to come I'm sure, but why not keep it 788, A359, 77W, A388 only?

And what will replace their A300s? LH originally intended to use A333s but the wingspan prohibited it (wouldn't fit into a 'box' at TXL and couldn't use the usual gates at HAM). Will TG face similar problems or are their A300 destinations spacious enough?

[Edited 2011-06-13 01:11:53]


..sick of it. -K. Pilkington.
User currently offlineGiancavia From Vatican City, joined Feb 2010, 1303 posts, RR: 0
Reply 21, posted (2 years 10 months 1 week 5 days 21 hours ago) and read 15106 times:

Maybe fleet commonality is less important then we always hear, I was under the impression after 15/20 or so frames it doesnt really make much difference but maybe i was informed wrong?

Cool to see an airline not stick with 1 or 2 types from a photography point of view!


User currently offlineOyKIE From Norway, joined Jan 2006, 2673 posts, RR: 4
Reply 22, posted (2 years 10 months 1 week 5 days 20 hours ago) and read 14514 times:

This is very good news! Congratulations to Airbus, Boeing and Thai. It will be interesting to see what routes these planes will be used for. Hope to see more exciting planes here at OSL.   We have had Thai A340-500 and the 772ER has taken over more of the regular flying.

Quoting Centre (Reply 1):
Did the Paris show start already?

June seems to become a very interesting month this year  
Quoting LAXDESI (Reply 11):
delivery between 2018 and 2022. The second batch will be all outright purchase and not involve any leases.

It seems like the only way to get early 787/A350 is through leases. Is it possible for more airlines to get early slots through leases or are they now mostly spoken for?



Dream no small dream; it lacks magic. Dream large, then go make that dream real - Donald Douglas
User currently offlinePM From India, joined Feb 2005, 6840 posts, RR: 64
Reply 23, posted (2 years 10 months 1 week 5 days 20 hours ago) and read 14470 times:

If TG choose RR on their 787s (and something tells me they will   ), they'll be the first airline to order all six versions of the Trent.   

(Of course, SQ could beat them to it if they order the T1000 pretty promptly.)


User currently offlinesomething From United Kingdom, joined May 2011, 1633 posts, RR: 21
Reply 24, posted (2 years 10 months 1 week 5 days 20 hours ago) and read 14469 times:

Quoting Giancavia (Reply 21):
Maybe fleet commonality is less important then we always hear, I was under the impression after 15/20 or so frames it doesnt really make much difference but maybe i was informed wrong?

The economies of scale will start to dimish, yes. But there is more to airline operations. Training pilots, cabin crew, scheduling etc. If a 789 goes mx, and all you've got spare is an A359 you will need a whole new set of crew. Maybe the airport at the receiving end doesn't have towing equipment for A350s? And the ripple effects will be much longer lasting.

There is also a fair number of advantages that come with fleet differentiation, but ''the easier the better'' really holds true here for the most part.



..sick of it. -K. Pilkington.
25 parapente : For this big order (both Boeing and Airbus) to be annouced (got out of the way) just prior to Paris.It makes me wonder just what headline grabbing ord
26 AirNZ : Whilst certainly important, I can assure that it certainly isn't to the extent of being anywhere near the Holy Grail as often stated on here. There a
27 Post contains images scbriml : My bad, I was confusing them with SUH's Air Lease Corp.
28 Post contains images EPA001 : Don't forget RR who I think will also be in the mix. . But it is good news indeed for all parties involved. And they have divided the order nicely be
29 jfk777 : You need a PHD from MIT to figure this out. Why is Thai leasing 3 planes from every leasing firm on teh world ? They couldn't lease 8 A350'sfrom one
30 Post contains images PM : Hardly. A slight exaggeration, perhaps? They are leasing eight 787s. All from ILFC. How eccentric. Perhaps not. ALFACO have twelve on order. Perhaps
31 Post contains images deltamartin : Ofcourse there are savings to be made by having fleet commonality, but as with everything, there are pros and cons with everything. But i agree, that
32 United_fan : Nice to see more 77W orders. Boeing really hit it out of teh park on that one. I wonder how long till the -300 will surpass the -200's?
33 scbriml : I don't see selecting the 789 vs 788 makes anything more complex. I also think many Asian carriers consider the 788 to be too small for their needs.
34 EK413 : Understand a number of carriers opt to have various types for different missions, however I don't understand in TG's case why don't they order; A320
35 jfk777 : Every major leasing firm, RBS, CIT, Aviation Lease & Finance and ILFC. How many more leasing firms would you like ?
36 Coal : Aren't the A388s complimentary to the 77Ws, such as SQ is doing (SQ effectively replaced the 744s with 77Ws). I would imagine the A320s are to replace
37 Post contains images SASDC8 : Wow congrats to Airbus, Boeing, Thai and surely RR I did not expect the order from TG to be this diverse, but hey fun for us TG spotters Second that T
38 Post contains images PM : No, not "every", not by a long way... But, again, I can't see what your problem is. Different lessors with different types, different business models
39 LAXDESI : Likely breakdown for the second batch of order: B788/789.....8 (replacement of remaining A300 and some growth) A359...........6 (replacement of remai
40 Stitch : For those scratching their heads, take a look at the delivery positions and how they map to their previously-announced fleet replacement plans. Throug
41 worldliner : Good news for Thai. Love their livery so the more planes the better!!! Is the A320 a new type for them or do they operate them already?
42 Stitch : It's new, at least for TG. One of their joint-venture airlines, Thai Tiger Airways, has also ordered the A320.
43 YULWinterSkies : I think it will be an increasingly common sight to have split orders between 787 and A350. they are not quite in the same size category, so it makes
44 LAXDESI : So going by your summary of Thai's stated plans, one could expect the following breakdown for the second batch of order: A320/NB........17 (38(total
45 Stitch : At the moment, they have stated they don't believe they can make money with the A380. So I expect future orders for the type will be dependent on how
46 kaitak : We can expect more; no way will they just have two. Agree; sadly no 748s for TG This is great news (not the lack of 748s, but the TG order overall!);
47 Post contains images LAXDESI : I wonder what would replace the A333s many years(10-15?) down the road. B787-10(a simple stretch) may be an ideal replacement for medium haul routes
48 AF022 : Can someone help me understand why they would order 787s and A350s instead of just focusing on one aircraft type? Is there really that much of a diffe
49 328JET : That is a perfect fleet! I am bit surprised that no B748I will be ordered.[Edited 2011-06-13 16:11:26]
50 Viscount724 : Most TG decisions never seem to make much sense. Far too much politcal interference, and even the CEO and other senior management often changes whene
51 Post contains images Stitch : Different missions require different equipment. Also, the 787 and A350 are not really "interchangeable parts" because if they were, an airline would
52 LAXDESI : Would it make sense for TG to cancel the A380 order fully/partially and apply the deposit towards a likely A350 order? I would hate to see them go th
53 Stitch : They wanted to, but Airbus refused. So they either had to take the A380s or forfeit some $900 million in deposits and progress payments.
54 328JET : When? I heard that TG is going to double its A380 order.
55 PM : The two reports are not mutually exclusive. They couldn't cancel so they build the fleet to a viable number. I'm assuming that the next order will in
56 LAXDESI : Perhaps 4-6 more? That would leave 15-17 for the smaller widebodies, and perhaps the following split: A380.....4-6 B789 ....8-10 77W......6-8
57 IslandRob : I'm relatively new here, so please forgive me if I ask a stupid question. With that disclaimer, why couldn't TG give away (i.e., re-sell) its unwante
58 Stitch : I expect part of the reason is that TG's airframes will be delivered with different interiors, which would need to be removed and replaced. And then
59 Post contains images PM : Sounds about right. I'm not sure about the 77Ws but more 787-9s are a given. There's no way TG will operate just the two on lease. There are no stupi
60 LAXDESI : Not disagreeing with what you are suggesting, but it is possible that if they don't have routes on which 6 A380 can be profitable, then the economies
61 Burkhard : JL will be happy to see other 320OEO sold, since with A320NEO selling itself, A330 selling itself, A350 and A380 sales only limited by availability se
62 Post contains images frigatebird : Yes, it leaves a distinct gap in their widebody aircraft operated portfolio. They should pay more attention to our TG fleet speculation threads Serio
63 Airbusa322 : A320's will be going to Tiger.
64 IslandRob : My appreciation to both Stitch and PM for enlightening me on why it might be difficult for TG to just unload their A380s on another airline. I can un
65 jfk777 : Thai's A380 will see Europe and Australia, those are the two long haul markets where they have scale. LAX just doesn't seem to make sense for Thai &a
66 EddieDude : How about ARN?
67 flythere : Of course the diminishing marginal returns would be there the case when a single type of plane increases in number, but they are never a negative num
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