LAXDESI From United States of America, joined May 2005, 5085 posts, RR: 48 Posted (2 years 5 months 3 weeks 6 days 9 hours ago) and read 17558 times:
Interesting mix of aircraft with purchase and leases. http://www.flightglobal.com/articles...s-and-12-a350s-in-37-aircraft.html
Thai plans to purchase 15 aircraft and acquire the remaining 22 on operating leases. It will purchase six Boeing 777-300ERs, to be delivered in 2014 and 2015, four Airbus A350-900s (2016 and 2017) and five Airbus A320-200s (2014 and 2015).
It also plans to acquire six 787-8s and two 787-9s from US lessor International Lease Finance (ILFC) on operating leases. The -8s will be delivered in 2014 and 2015, while the -9s will be delivered in 2017.
In addition, Thai will lease six A350-900s from Aviation Lease and Finance, to be delivered in 2017, and two A350-900s from CIT Aerospace International, which will deliver the aircraft in 2016. The airline will also lease six A320-200s from RBS Aerospace International, to be delivered in 2012 and 2013.
All the operating leases have terms of 12 years each, said Thai.
LAXDESI From United States of America, joined May 2005, 5085 posts, RR: 48 Reply 4, posted (2 years 5 months 3 weeks 6 days 9 hours ago) and read 17352 times:
Quoting BMI727 (Reply 3): Typo, it should be A320s as cited in the linked article.
Thanks for catching it. I have corrected the title.
Looking at the Thai fleet, it would seem that the B788s are to replace some of the 17 A300s in service. B77W are expected to replace 77W leased from Jet and replace some of the B744. A359 should replace some of the older B772s.
something From United Kingdom, joined May 2011, 1633 posts, RR: 20 Reply 6, posted (2 years 5 months 3 weeks 6 days 8 hours ago) and read 17241 times:
Thai colored A320s? Did not see that coming.
Quite the mixed fleet the boys in purple will be flying. A333, A345, A346, A359, A388 and 772, 773, 744, 788 and 789. I understand it's really ''only'' 6 different family types and the rest are subtypes, but it's still pretty diverse. I assume by the time these new aircraft have arrived, the 737s and A300s will have left the Thai fleet?
BMI727 From United States of America, joined Feb 2009, 15058 posts, RR: 26 Reply 7, posted (2 years 5 months 3 weeks 6 days 8 hours ago) and read 17225 times:
Quoting EK413 (Reply 5): I don't understand why the mix of aircraft and why they haven't stuck to one type of aircraft for the mission?
A split A350 and 787 order makes sense. The 787 will probably be a little bit better on regional flights plus having a slightly smaller seat count and the A350 packs in a few more seats and has a bit better range although it will weigh a bit more. Not much different than how many airlines fly A330s and 777s.
The numbers are a bit baffling. I'd say that both fleets are likely to grow, as the deliveries are likely too far out for either to be a stopgap measure. Perhaps they are in talks now, or want to wait and get better performance data.
Why do Aerospace Engineering students have to turn things in on time?
aviasian From Singapore, joined Jan 2001, 1472 posts, RR: 15 Reply 10, posted (2 years 5 months 3 weeks 6 days 8 hours ago) and read 16945 times:
Thai is keeping up with its tradition of having lots of types and sub-types ... not the most efficient way of doing what is already a most complicated business but that is just the way that TG has always been.
LAXDESI From United States of America, joined May 2005, 5085 posts, RR: 48 Reply 11, posted (2 years 5 months 3 weeks 6 days 7 hours ago) and read 16854 times:
It is being reported by Bangkok Post that Thai will be placing another order for 38 aircraft in the next 3 months, for delivery between 2018 and 2022. The second batch will be all outright purchase and not involve any leases.
kiwiandrew From New Zealand, joined Jun 2005, 8442 posts, RR: 14 Reply 15, posted (2 years 5 months 3 weeks 6 days 7 hours ago) and read 16475 times:
Quoting something (Reply 6): Quite the mixed fleet the boys in purple will be flying. A333, A345, A346, A359, A388 and 772, 773, 744, 788 and 789. I understand it's really ''only'' 6 different family types and the rest are subtypes, but it's still pretty diverse
It must be in their blood, dont forget that SK helped set them up many years ago and we know what SK thinks about maintaining fleet "diversity"
Moderation in all things ... including moderation ;-)
something From United Kingdom, joined May 2011, 1633 posts, RR: 20 Reply 20, posted (2 years 5 months 3 weeks 6 days 5 hours ago) and read 15336 times:
Quoting kiwiandrew (Reply 15): It must be in their blood, dont forget that SK helped set them up many years ago and we know what SK thinks about maintaining fleet "diversity"
Maybe their staff are closet spotters And from an aviation enthusiast point of view, I'm quite pleased to be treated to such a fleet variety, but I don't really see the point in it. Especially the 2x 789 and 12xA359 duality leaves me baffled. There's more to come I'm sure, but why not keep it 788, A359, 77W, A388 only?
And what will replace their A300s? LH originally intended to use A333s but the wingspan prohibited it (wouldn't fit into a 'box' at TXL and couldn't use the usual gates at HAM). Will TG face similar problems or are their A300 destinations spacious enough?
OyKIE From Norway, joined Jan 2006, 2647 posts, RR: 4 Reply 22, posted (2 years 5 months 3 weeks 6 days 4 hours ago) and read 14266 times:
This is very good news! Congratulations to Airbus, Boeing and Thai. It will be interesting to see what routes these planes will be used for. Hope to see more exciting planes here at OSL. We have had Thai A340-500 and the 772ER has taken over more of the regular flying.
something From United Kingdom, joined May 2011, 1633 posts, RR: 20 Reply 24, posted (2 years 5 months 3 weeks 6 days 4 hours ago) and read 14221 times:
Quoting Giancavia (Reply 21): Maybe fleet commonality is less important then we always hear, I was under the impression after 15/20 or so frames it doesnt really make much difference but maybe i was informed wrong?
The economies of scale will start to dimish, yes. But there is more to airline operations. Training pilots, cabin crew, scheduling etc. If a 789 goes mx, and all you've got spare is an A359 you will need a whole new set of crew. Maybe the airport at the receiving end doesn't have towing equipment for A350s? And the ripple effects will be much longer lasting.
There is also a fair number of advantages that come with fleet differentiation, but ''the easier the better'' really holds true here for the most part.
..sick of it. -K. Pilkington.
25 parapente: For this big order (both Boeing and Airbus) to be annouced (got out of the way) just prior to Paris.It makes me wonder just what headline grabbing ord
26 AirNZ: Whilst certainly important, I can assure that it certainly isn't to the extent of being anywhere near the Holy Grail as often stated on here. There a
27 scbriml: My bad, I was confusing them with SUH's Air Lease Corp.
28 EPA001: Don't forget RR who I think will also be in the mix. . But it is good news indeed for all parties involved. And they have divided the order nicely be
29 jfk777: You need a PHD from MIT to figure this out. Why is Thai leasing 3 planes from every leasing firm on teh world ? They couldn't lease 8 A350'sfrom one
30 PM: Hardly. A slight exaggeration, perhaps? They are leasing eight 787s. All from ILFC. How eccentric. Perhaps not. ALFACO have twelve on order. Perhaps
31 deltamartin: Ofcourse there are savings to be made by having fleet commonality, but as with everything, there are pros and cons with everything. But i agree, that
32 United_fan: Nice to see more 77W orders. Boeing really hit it out of teh park on that one. I wonder how long till the -300 will surpass the -200's?
33 scbriml: I don't see selecting the 789 vs 788 makes anything more complex. I also think many Asian carriers consider the 788 to be too small for their needs.
34 EK413: Understand a number of carriers opt to have various types for different missions, however I don't understand in TG's case why don't they order; A320
35 jfk777: Every major leasing firm, RBS, CIT, Aviation Lease & Finance and ILFC. How many more leasing firms would you like ?
36 Coal: Aren't the A388s complimentary to the 77Ws, such as SQ is doing (SQ effectively replaced the 744s with 77Ws). I would imagine the A320s are to replace
37 SASDC8: Wow congrats to Airbus, Boeing, Thai and surely RR I did not expect the order from TG to be this diverse, but hey fun for us TG spotters Second that T
38 PM: No, not "every", not by a long way... But, again, I can't see what your problem is. Different lessors with different types, different business models
39 LAXDESI: Likely breakdown for the second batch of order: B788/789.....8 (replacement of remaining A300 and some growth) A359...........6 (replacement of remai
40 Stitch: For those scratching their heads, take a look at the delivery positions and how they map to their previously-announced fleet replacement plans. Throug
41 worldliner: Good news for Thai. Love their livery so the more planes the better!!! Is the A320 a new type for them or do they operate them already?
42 Stitch: It's new, at least for TG. One of their joint-venture airlines, Thai Tiger Airways, has also ordered the A320.
43 YULWinterSkies: I think it will be an increasingly common sight to have split orders between 787 and A350. they are not quite in the same size category, so it makes
44 LAXDESI: So going by your summary of Thai's stated plans, one could expect the following breakdown for the second batch of order: A320/NB........17 (38(total
45 Stitch: At the moment, they have stated they don't believe they can make money with the A380. So I expect future orders for the type will be dependent on how
46 kaitak: We can expect more; no way will they just have two. Agree; sadly no 748s for TG This is great news (not the lack of 748s, but the TG order overall!);
47 LAXDESI: I wonder what would replace the A333s many years(10-15?) down the road. B787-10(a simple stretch) may be an ideal replacement for medium haul routes
48 AF022: Can someone help me understand why they would order 787s and A350s instead of just focusing on one aircraft type? Is there really that much of a diffe
49 328JET: That is a perfect fleet! I am bit surprised that no B748I will be ordered.[Edited 2011-06-13 16:11:26]
50 Viscount724: Most TG decisions never seem to make much sense. Far too much politcal interference, and even the CEO and other senior management often changes whene
51 Stitch: Different missions require different equipment. Also, the 787 and A350 are not really "interchangeable parts" because if they were, an airline would
52 LAXDESI: Would it make sense for TG to cancel the A380 order fully/partially and apply the deposit towards a likely A350 order? I would hate to see them go th
53 Stitch: They wanted to, but Airbus refused. So they either had to take the A380s or forfeit some $900 million in deposits and progress payments.
54 328JET: When? I heard that TG is going to double its A380 order.
55 PM: The two reports are not mutually exclusive. They couldn't cancel so they build the fleet to a viable number. I'm assuming that the next order will in
56 LAXDESI: Perhaps 4-6 more? That would leave 15-17 for the smaller widebodies, and perhaps the following split: A380.....4-6 B789 ....8-10 77W......6-8
57 IslandRob: I'm relatively new here, so please forgive me if I ask a stupid question. With that disclaimer, why couldn't TG give away (i.e., re-sell) its unwante
58 Stitch: I expect part of the reason is that TG's airframes will be delivered with different interiors, which would need to be removed and replaced. And then
59 PM: Sounds about right. I'm not sure about the 77Ws but more 787-9s are a given. There's no way TG will operate just the two on lease. There are no stupi
60 LAXDESI: Not disagreeing with what you are suggesting, but it is possible that if they don't have routes on which 6 A380 can be profitable, then the economies
61 Burkhard: JL will be happy to see other 320OEO sold, since with A320NEO selling itself, A330 selling itself, A350 and A380 sales only limited by availability se
62 frigatebird: Yes, it leaves a distinct gap in their widebody aircraft operated portfolio. They should pay more attention to our TG fleet speculation threads Serio