Sponsor Message:
Civil Aviation Forum
My Starred Topics | Profile | New Topic | Forum Index | Help | Search 
Virgin Crew Members Face Sack Over Foul Language  
User currently offlineflyAUA From Austria, joined May 2005, 4604 posts, RR: 56
Posted (3 years 3 months 4 days 3 hours ago) and read 13483 times:

Damn, there is a "face sack" missing in the title  blush 

Apparently two crew members wanted to send the message "Wake up you cu**s" to the remaining crew still taking a rest. Due to a mistake in the personal message system, this was transmitted to all of the premium economy passengers instead. Ouch!!   

Link: http://au.news.yahoo.com/thewest/a/-...-staff-face-sack-for-foul-message/

[Edited 2011-06-22 05:05:32]


Not drinking, also isn't a solution!
63 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineJackbr From Australia, joined Dec 2009, 666 posts, RR: 0
Reply 1, posted (3 years 3 months 4 days 2 hours ago) and read 13198 times:

Such class, such style.

In all seriousness I feel bad for the caught crew. The term, while very vulgar, has taken upon an almost "friendly" useage amongst gen Ys (don't believe me, listen to how a lot of teenagers greet eachother - "'sup c****")

I bet they were likely a crew who got on quite well with eachother and made the stupid decision of extending their friendly "interactions" via technology. Silly billies.

Either that or it was one irritable Cabin Manager


User currently offlineflyAUA From Austria, joined May 2005, 4604 posts, RR: 56
Reply 2, posted (3 years 3 months 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 12960 times:

Quoting Jackbr (Reply 1):

That's also how I see it. If I were on board I would have laughed about it, but I guess most pax are more stuck up about it, and one thing probably lead to another. Poor crew. This was really only a silly mistake!



Not drinking, also isn't a solution!
User currently offlineditzyboy From Australia, joined Feb 2008, 718 posts, RR: 1
Reply 3, posted (3 years 3 months 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 12958 times:

Reminds me of the time I answered an interphone call using somewhat non-standard language to find I had pressed the PA button. Step learning curve.

User currently offlineshufflemoomin From Denmark, joined Jun 2010, 480 posts, RR: 2
Reply 4, posted (3 years 3 months 3 days 21 hours ago) and read 12483 times:

I'm shocked anyone would actually be sacked over that. Hardly the end of the world.

User currently offlineOA260 From Ireland, joined Nov 2006, 27007 posts, RR: 57
Reply 5, posted (3 years 3 months 3 days 21 hours ago) and read 12435 times:

Im not so sure its still very vulgar in my work place and social circle. Not a nice word at all. I wouldnt go as far as sacking them though as it was a mistake. An appology should have been given to the passengers in Prem Y over the PA ( maybe it was ) and that would have been enough. Some parents still dont want their kids to learn such words. I know I wouldnt want my younger Sister learning such things.

User currently offlineTomFoolery From Austria, joined Jan 2004, 529 posts, RR: 2
Reply 6, posted (3 years 3 months 3 days 21 hours ago) and read 12312 times:

Wow! if ever there was an interesting "how did you lose your job" story, this one definitely gets the prize of the day!

Yes, I realize this is not a flattering or even professional term, so don't flame me...but

...if I saw this on my IFE, I would have had a good laugh.



Paper makes an airplane fly
User currently offlineeljonno From Australia, joined Sep 2008, 172 posts, RR: 0
Reply 7, posted (3 years 3 months 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 12144 times:

Quoting Jackbr (Reply 1):

In all seriousness I feel bad for the caught crew. The term, while very vulgar, has taken upon an almost "friendly" useage amongst gen Ys (don't believe me, listen to how a lot of teenagers greet eachother - "'sup c****")
Quoting flyAUA (Reply 2):
That's also how I see it. If I were on board I would have laughed about it, but I guess most pax are more stuck up about it, and one thing probably lead to another. Poor crew. This was really only a silly mistake!

It is a foul term and I have no sympathy for them at all because it shows a serious lack of professionalism and disrepect to both their colleagues and the passengers who were exposed to their dialogue.
It's use in any situtation is completely unacceptable in my opinion and I would fully expect to be reprimanded for using it in any social or professional context. Other curses can be forgiven in most situations (to a degree and depending on circumstances) but I really hate this particular word and I know that most people in my social and professional circles would be equally offended by it.

[Edited 2011-06-22 11:56:46]

[Edited 2011-06-22 12:08:11]

User currently offlineanstar From United Kingdom, joined Nov 2003, 5245 posts, RR: 6
Reply 8, posted (3 years 3 months 3 days 19 hours ago) and read 11989 times:

What I find outrageous is that for a 10 hour flight there is no crew rest facilities!

User currently offlineDeltaMD90 From United States of America, joined Apr 2008, 7915 posts, RR: 52
Reply 9, posted (3 years 3 months 3 days 18 hours ago) and read 11721 times:

Quoting eljonno (Reply 7):
I really hate

Which is your opinion. I doubt he'd say it to random people, I'm sure he knows the crew very well. This age of PC is getting really annoying


I just have a question, how is this any different from the WN pilot? I mean, I know there are some differences, but in this thread people are a lot more forgiving than the other thread.....



Ironically I have never flown a Delta MD-90 :)
User currently offline1stfl94 From United Kingdom, joined May 2006, 1455 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (3 years 3 months 3 days 18 hours ago) and read 11673 times:

I'm surprised Virgin is actually taking the step of firing the crew. It's not generally a sackable offence especially as the message wasn't aimed deliberately at passengers.

User currently onlineScottB From United States of America, joined Jul 2000, 6767 posts, RR: 32
Reply 11, posted (3 years 3 months 3 days 17 hours ago) and read 11585 times:

Quoting OA260 (Reply 5):
Some parents still dont want their kids to learn such words. I know I wouldnt want my younger Sister learning such things.

Kids are going to hear and learn words like that eventually; it is important to educate them as to why those words are inappropriate in most circumstances rather than pretend that they do not exist. The N-word gets used pretty heavily in certain types of music, but if we don't explain to kids why that word is hurtful, they might just end up repeating it without knowing any better.


User currently offlineditzyboy From Australia, joined Feb 2008, 718 posts, RR: 1
Reply 12, posted (3 years 3 months 3 days 17 hours ago) and read 11455 times:

Quoting anstar (Reply 8):
What I find outrageous is that for a 10 hour flight there is no crew rest facilities!

Where does it say that?


User currently offlineG-CIVP From United Kingdom, joined Mar 2001, 1326 posts, RR: 10
Reply 13, posted (3 years 3 months 3 days 17 hours ago) and read 11407 times:

It's gross misconduct, pure and simple. Doesn't matter if it was 'an accident'. I would be surprised if they get 'let off'.

If I were a Crew Member involved, I'd submit my resignation now and hope Virgin doesn't disclose to my future employer that I left my previous employment while suspended subject to disciplinary proceedings.


User currently offlineRussianJet From Belgium, joined Jul 2007, 7704 posts, RR: 21
Reply 14, posted (3 years 3 months 3 days 16 hours ago) and read 11270 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

If they were my employees jeopardising my business, they would certainly be facing discipline.


✈ Every strike of the hammer is a blow against the enemy. ✈
User currently offline1stfl94 From United Kingdom, joined May 2006, 1455 posts, RR: 0
Reply 15, posted (3 years 3 months 3 days 16 hours ago) and read 11166 times:

Quoting G-CIVP (Reply 13):

It's gross misconduct, pure and simple. Doesn't matter if it was 'an accident'. I would be surprised if they get 'let off'.

If I were a Crew Member involved, I'd submit my resignation now and hope Virgin doesn't disclose to my future employer that I left my previous employment while suspended subject to disciplinary proceeding

Did they put aircraft and passengers at risk? No
Did they intend to offend passengers? No.

It's an offence, certainly if they worked for me they would get a shouting at and a warning but its not what I would call sackable.


User currently offlineAesma From France, joined Nov 2009, 6672 posts, RR: 11
Reply 16, posted (3 years 3 months 3 days 16 hours ago) and read 11144 times:

English is not my first language and there is no equivalent to that term in French (well there are a lot of equivalents, but not used in that context), so, is this a "fouler" word because it describes the female genitalia, and if so, isn't it discrimination ? 


New Technology is the name we give to stuff that doesn't work yet. Douglas Adams
User currently offlineflyAUA From Austria, joined May 2005, 4604 posts, RR: 56
Reply 17, posted (3 years 3 months 3 days 16 hours ago) and read 11138 times:

Quoting anstar (Reply 8):
What I find outrageous is that for a 10 hour flight there is no crew rest facilities!

Becoming more and more common. See for example the thread about the SIA crew resting in the cabin. I think the general etiquette is to have a curtain though whenever there is no dedicated crew resting area...

Quoting DeltaMD90 (Reply 9):
I just have a question, how is this any different from the WN pilot?

Please fill me in... no idea what happened there!

Quoting ScottB (Reply 11):
Kids are going to hear and learn words like that eventually; it is important to educate them as to why those words are inappropriate in most circumstances rather than pretend that they do not exist. The N-word gets used pretty heavily in certain types of music, but if we don't explain to kids why that word is hurtful, they might just end up repeating it without knowing any better.
Quoting TomFoolery (Reply 6):
...if I saw this on my IFE, I would have had a good laugh.
Quoting shufflemoomin (Reply 4):
I'm shocked anyone would actually be sacked over that. Hardly the end of the world.

Totally agree with all of you



Not drinking, also isn't a solution!
User currently offlineRussianJet From Belgium, joined Jul 2007, 7704 posts, RR: 21
Reply 18, posted (3 years 3 months 3 days 16 hours ago) and read 11122 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

Quoting 1stfl94 (Reply 15):
Did they put aircraft and passengers at risk? No
Did they intend to offend passengers? No.

Did they offend passengers? Almost certainly yes.
Did they potentially damage the good name and image of the company? Oh yes.
Were they grossly careless? Certainly looks that way.

Whether or not sacking is in order is a matter for the company's internal policies, but I could understand the result which ever way it went.



✈ Every strike of the hammer is a blow against the enemy. ✈
User currently offlineeljonno From Australia, joined Sep 2008, 172 posts, RR: 0
Reply 19, posted (3 years 3 months 3 days 16 hours ago) and read 11087 times:

Quoting DeltaMD90 (Reply 9):
Which is your opinion. I doubt he'd say it to random people, I'm sure he knows the crew very well. This age of PC is getting really annoying

So we'll just all go around calling each other c***s and f****wits then shall we? Nice.

I wouldn't refer to my colleagues in that way because I have a professional relationship with them and I think that showing respect towards the people you work and engage with is far more condusive to getting on with them and doing a good job.
From another perspective: if someone were to refer to me in that way, I would take issue with them because of what that term infers about their opinion of me. If it was in the pub, then it would probably be ok to laugh it off, but in a working environment one has to be aware of what others may hear you saying out of context and thus how it may potentially reflect on your professionality.

Quoting G-CIVP (Reply 13):
It's gross misconduct, pure and simple. Doesn't matter if it was 'an accident'. I would be surprised if they get 'let off'.

If I were a Crew Member involved, I'd submit my resignation now and hope Virgin doesn't disclose to my future employer that I left my previous employment while suspended subject to disciplinary proceedings.
Quoting RussianJet (Reply 14):
If they were my employees jeopardising my business, they would certainly be facing discipline.

Agreed.

[Edited 2011-06-22 16:06:57]

User currently offlineKFitz From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 20, posted (3 years 3 months 3 days 16 hours ago) and read 11023 times:

perfect examples of why FA's have representation

User currently offlineltbewr From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 13116 posts, RR: 12
Reply 21, posted (3 years 3 months 3 days 14 hours ago) and read 10841 times:

The increasing coarseness in day to day language, including the use of the c-word or n-word or other like 'bad' words in the UK and elsewhere is the problem. You get so use to using such terms among peers that you forget to check your words in more 'public' situations. I am aware that the c-word is a common slang word in the UK, it is very offensive to many women anywhere and thus should mean a strong penalty for these crew memeber who used it. They are a modern company and like any other does not want to offend and turn away customers in a highly competitive business.

User currently offlineDeltaMD90 From United States of America, joined Apr 2008, 7915 posts, RR: 52
Reply 22, posted (3 years 3 months 3 days 14 hours ago) and read 10753 times:

Quoting eljonno (Reply 19):
So we'll just all go around calling each other c***s and f****wits then shall we? Nice.

Lol I've been called much worse, and by my friends too! I don't get all whiney because of it. I'm not talking about some random new guy coming into work calling you a cunt, I'm talking about friends badmouthing each other. I mean yeah they goofed up by saying it over the PA, but to call them unprofessional for what they say in private (or at least what they think is private) is a bit far. I'm sure there are somethings you do or say that "offend" someone... learn to suck it up!

Quoting flyAUA (Reply 17):
Quoting DeltaMD90 (Reply 9):
I just have a question, how is this any different from the WN pilot?

Please fill me in... no idea what happened there!
Southwest Pilot Rant Locks Out Freq. (by type-rated Jun 21 2011 in Civil Aviation)



Ironically I have never flown a Delta MD-90 :)
User currently offlinegoblin211 From United States of America, joined Jun 2010, 1209 posts, RR: 0
Reply 23, posted (3 years 3 months 3 days 13 hours ago) and read 10336 times:

Quoting shufflemoomin (Reply 4):
I'm shocked anyone would actually be sacked over that. Hardly the end of the world.

I agree but Virgin needs to do it probably to avoid a lawsuit.



From the airport with love
User currently offlinebreaker1011 From United States of America, joined Nov 2007, 938 posts, RR: 2
Reply 24, posted (3 years 3 months 3 days 11 hours ago) and read 9381 times:

If an employee screws up like this, and damages the reputation of the company in the eyes of even just a couple of customers, enough to make the headlines, they should be termed. Jokes turning into accidents just happen, some are forgivable, some aren't. It's business. There's a written code of conduct in trade for your paycheck. I'll fly Virgin again just for knowing they make the tough calls when necessary in the interest of protecting their reputation and those of their customers and employees.

If the identity of the WN pilot is ascertained, he should get the same. His accidental public rant made the news and potentially damaged the company in the eyes of someone, somewhere (frankly likely lots of folks that could care less about what us A-Netters think about it.)



Life's tough. It's even tougher if you're stupid. J. Wayne
25 GT4EZY : It was a stupid thing to do and disciplinary is justified but sacking/firing them is just pandering to the media and to the pax involved. We can be pr
26 Post contains images Quokka : An apology to passengers should also be made not simply to "pander" to them but because a passenger pays for a service and does not expect to be addre
27 skygirl1990 : Some people just get upset far too easily. To be totally honest, had I been a pax and seen that coming up on my IFE I would have found that absolutely
28 Post contains images breaker1011 : Opinions of young folks may change as time goes on. Most people eventually become someone on the other end of the 'joke' per se, and feel the embarras
29 Post contains images KPDX : Same.. I laughed effin' hard when I read what happened.
30 cschleic : What would have happened if some passengers had yelled that in the cabin? Probably kicked off. If it's good enough for passengers, it's good enough fo
31 mal787 : Lightenup people. I read this and was ROFLMFAO for ages,i even told all the guys in the office and they thought the same thing. Opps these guys F%$#@*
32 workhorse : Oh, I guess this could be translated in French as "Reveillez-vous, bande de petits c...!" I actually find the story quite funny (except for the sacke
33 anstar : deleted.. fliller filler filler[Edited 2011-06-22 22:56:21]
34 Flying Belgian : Indeed it's more funny than anything else, sad story, not honouring VS by the way.
35 AR385 : I don´t think that the issue here is the actual "word" although in the English I was taught it is hugely vulgar and used primarily with the intent no
36 Post contains images RussianJet : AHAHAHA!!!! I'm glad I don't employ you. Ever hear of a little word called 'professionalism'?? You can't be serious, or are you? Should the crew also
37 G-CIVP : Pandering to the media? Your profile says you are Cabin Crew. If you were offensive to me in the same context, when the Cabin Crew are supposed to be
38 bjorn14 : Huh? To pull stupid stunts like this and be able to get away with it? If I ever said this to a female colleague I would be fired on the spot. They mi
39 Eurohub : Agreed - now granted I don't work in the airline industry, but in my company "Objectionable and/or Insulting Behaviour" which is the closest thing in
40 Post contains images MorcegoA330 : IMHO people need to understand the contest of when a "bad" word is said. I would find it offensive if it was deliberately fired at someone to cause h
41 planesmith : I would suggest that there are geographical limitations to words being acceptable or otherwise. That particular word may be acceptable in Australia. P
42 fsnuffer : I wonder how many of the posters here saying they should just let this go would change their minds if the had sent the message "Wake up you fa**ots".
43 EI320 : Disciplinary action is certainly in order, but this is not a sackable offence IMO. I'd be truly shocked if anyone (in any company for that matter) was
44 bjorn14 : It shows lack of respect for your colleagues and ultimately the company you work for.
45 sq_ek_freak : Guys, crew bunks also have IFE units - at least in newer aircraft. So what might have happened is that the crew involved intended to send it to the u
46 starguy : VS crew bunks do not have IFE. The VS A330's do not have crew bunks. The crew were resting in the passenger cabin.
47 anstar : The VS A330's dont have bunks.
48 MbahGondrong : Just unlucky for the crew I guess. Sometimes in office I also talk some non-appropiate language with some my work frineds but it's just for laugh or j
49 delta fly boy : Good point. And I would find it hilarious. And I'm gay. I work for an airline and consider myself to be quite professional at work (No comment Rick i
50 rl757pvd : Why cant we have a facebook like button on here?
51 GT4EZY : Hang on mate, you are the only person who seems to be taking the incident out of context aswell as taking my comments out of context too. I'm not con
52 DeltaMD90 : Sounds like a lot of posters have never made a mistake in life. Wish I could be like them!
53 G-CIVP : GT4EZY Irrespective of whether it was a joke, was supposed to be good for cabin crew morale, it is unacceptable bahaviour. Irrespective of the industr
54 RussianJet : The thing is this is far from just being about what the pax may or may not have thought. Think about the high standards of behaviour you would expect
55 GT4EZY : I didn't mention anything about staff morale. I didn't condone the behaviour I didn't say or indicate that disciplinary isn't warranted.......I think
56 GT4EZY : Absolutely. And that is my whole bloody point. I have not trivialised the offence in any way other than to say most passengers would not want to see
57 Post contains images flythere : Perhaps time to get a sensor programme in the onboard text msg system then? LOL
58 workflyer : [quote=G-CIVP,reply=53]Irrespective of whether it was a joke, was supposed to be good for cabin crew morale, it is unacceptable bahaviour. Irrespectiv
59 Post contains images flyAUA : Thanks for that! Since I work in ATC, I can tell you how that is different from what happened on the Virgin flight. With the Southwest Pilot, the iss
60 RussianJet : Potentially yes. It would be foolish for any disciplinary procedure not to take account of all factors, including performance to date, experience, se
61 Post contains images sq_ek_freak : Ah gotcha thanks for clarifying.
62 type-rated : The WN pilot used hate speech and derogatory language towards his co workers. I think the F/A involved here was just being silly when he did that. BU
63 EDICHC : If I referred to my colleagues in these terms and within earshot of my patients I would be facing dismissal and rightly so. Gross misconduct indeed a
Top Of Page
Forum Index

This topic is archived and can not be replied to any more.

Printer friendly format

Similar topics:More similar topics...
Stories From 747 Crew Members? posted Sun Dec 20 2009 19:18:45 by 747400sp
Virgin Atlantic Sues Over Copied J Class Seating posted Sun Oct 21 2007 14:20:26 by Singapore_Air
Virgin To Take Over JM Kingston Route posted Mon May 28 2007 11:47:35 by Kaitak
Female Cabin Crew Grounded Over Flab posted Thu Oct 12 2006 23:28:56 by Braybuddy
Mandated Working Hours For Crew Members posted Thu Jul 27 2006 19:02:09 by Historic747
Virgin A340-600 Over Manchester Today posted Sun Oct 16 2005 20:36:47 by HARLEYF150
Any NY Crew Members Here? posted Thu Jul 21 2005 19:12:04 by Dtwclipper
Untrained Crew Members posted Sun Sep 5 2004 02:20:42 by Mrniji
Non Certified Crew Members posted Fri Mar 26 2004 16:15:47 by LMML 14/32
Any SAA Crew Members? posted Mon Nov 10 2003 19:40:14 by Moolies