abibus From Mexico, joined Dec 2010, 128 posts, RR: 0 Posted (2 years 5 months 3 weeks 2 days 2 hours ago) and read 13156 times:
Ok so I am thikig so much these days about this man. A few moth ago everybody said he is crazy when he starts to say that till Paris over 500 neo will be sold and perhaps 1000, and ow once again he is right. He did so may crazy annoucement i the past and so may times people just said he is not from this world etc... but most of the times he is right, so who is he??? and is he part of the success of Airbus, I mean would Airbus be the same without him???
I do not like him to much but I have a lot of respect for him.
airfrnt From United States of America, joined Jul 2004, 2815 posts, RR: 43 Reply 1, posted (2 years 5 months 3 weeks 2 days 2 hours ago) and read 13100 times:
It's safe to say that Airbus wouldn't even be close to what it is today without him. Go read some of the accounts about how he really set the tone for Airbus not only to compete, but to dominate Boeing. It's really a remarkable story.
AirNZ From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 2, posted (2 years 5 months 3 weeks 2 days 2 hours ago) and read 13072 times:
Quoting abibus (Thread starter): Ok so I am thikig so much these days about this man. A few moth ago everybody said he is crazy when he starts to say that till Paris over 500 neo will be sold and perhaps 1000, and ow once again he is right. He did so may crazy annoucement i the past and so may times people just said he is not from this world etc... but most of the times he is right, so who is he??? and is he part of the success of Airbus, I mean would Airbus be the same without him??? I do not like him to much but I have a lot of respect for him.
But is is very important to note who those people are, and from what actual knowledge of many situations many are speaking from. He is extremely often very correct because he views the industry from a strategic viewpoint and such a position, for example, is ignored by too many on a.net (so hence he obviously talks 'rubbish'). He is very much an intregal part of Airbus' success, but so is every employee although the company certainly doesn't revolve around John Leahy.......it's success is primarily based upon it's products and he is an important, but not irraplaceable, catalyst for that.
Out of pure curiosity, could I perhaps ask how one can both not like, but respect, someone whom they don't know?
abibus From Mexico, joined Dec 2010, 128 posts, RR: 0 Reply 4, posted (2 years 5 months 3 weeks 2 days 2 hours ago) and read 12889 times:
yes he can be funny...
i just can not see airbus without him and i remember so many things he said i the past where everybody just thought he is crazy but finally he is right and he is the number one salesman in the world i think.
any info if boeing ever try to get him for sales?
EPA001 From Netherlands, joined Sep 2006, 4286 posts, RR: 37 Reply 6, posted (2 years 5 months 3 weeks 2 days 1 hour ago) and read 12679 times:
Quoting mariner (Reply 3): I would rather listen to John Leahy's analysis of the airline industry than just about anyone else on the planet.
He has been right about many topics where even CEO's of airlines initially did not agree with him. Only to admit (sometimes many years later) that he was right all along.
He is a true visionair. That does not make him holy, or always right, but he is an inspiring person with an enormous record to back that up. At some time he will go into retirement, but I am sure Airbus will continue to employ him so every now and then. Since he is too much of a trump card not to use. And I guess that John Leahy would not want to let go of Airbus himself as well. .
Fortunately JL has also built a fantastic sales team within Airbus around him, which are quite capable to do their business even if JL is not around. So he can go into retirement if he wishes to do so without leaving Airbus sales department in chaos. The competition can not lighten up, even if JL starts his retirement. .
airfrnt From United States of America, joined Jul 2004, 2815 posts, RR: 43 Reply 7, posted (2 years 5 months 3 weeks 2 days 1 hour ago) and read 12598 times:
He is definitely wrong at points - the A380 is a sterling example. Like most Sales guys, he stretches the truth when it's in his companies' interest. As a Salesman, he is unmatched in the industry. People I've talked to in the biz describe him as confident, arrogant or cocky, typically depending on their business dealings with Airbus.
Honestly, if he were not an American, he would be running EADS. Given that he is, he is just the power behind the curtain.
JBirdAV8r From United States of America, joined Jun 2001, 4472 posts, RR: 21 Reply 8, posted (2 years 5 months 3 weeks 2 days 1 hour ago) and read 12538 times:
He is a fantastic salesman. If he were my salesman, I'd be sitting on the beach in front of my $100M beach house sipping a mai tai.
It's also important to note that all great salesman aren't "snake-oil salesmen"--to be as successful as Leahy, you have to have a world-class, stellar company to back up your sales pitches. John Leahy has that luxury.
ruscoe From Australia, joined Aug 1999, 1477 posts, RR: 2 Reply 12, posted (2 years 5 months 3 weeks 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 12145 times:
The success of Airbus is not just because of John L, it is because of the low risk environment that the early Airbus operated in because of it's structure, and the type of financing given it by European Govt.
Its all about risk.
This allowed it to take risks which no prudent company would.
I know Airbus does not operate in that envornmrnt now, but its legacy of wanting to be the largest Commercial aircraft producer lives on.
Where are the profrits to match the selling success?
Why isn't the sales success reflected in the share price?
Airportugal310 From United States of America, joined Apr 2004, 3324 posts, RR: 2 Reply 13, posted (2 years 5 months 3 weeks 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 12095 times:
Quoting JBirdAV8r (Reply 8): It's also important to note that all great salesman aren't "snake-oil salesmen"--to be as successful as Leahy, you have to have a world-class, stellar company to back up your sales pitches. John Leahy has that luxury.
Correct. To add to this, his ethics and integrity play a big part of his success...in this industry, having a bad reputation will haunt you if you're not careful.
Admittedly I have burned a bridge or two, none too bad to be repaired. But boy do people remember things...even from years ago!
ebbuk From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 14, posted (2 years 5 months 3 weeks 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 12053 times:
Quoting ruscoe (Reply 12): The success of Airbus is not just because of John L, it is because of the low risk environment that the early Airbus operated in because of it's structure, and the type of financing given it by European Govt.
Well no one has suggested that Airbus "is" because of JL. But you mention it just so that you can turn the conversation into an ideological argument. Please stay away!
I love JL till death. He doesn't always get it right but he is always out there! Not sure if actually I love Airbus because of him or inspite of him.
XT6Wagon From United States of America, joined Feb 2007, 3276 posts, RR: 4 Reply 20, posted (2 years 5 months 3 weeks 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 11926 times:
Quoting airfrnt (Reply 1): It's safe to say that Airbus wouldn't even be close to what it is today without him.
Clearly since the A320NEO is in a race with the A350XWB to be the first project he has headed up that hasn't cost them more than they got back. Its going to only be 20+ years in the home office for him to achieve that mark.
airfrnt From United States of America, joined Jul 2004, 2815 posts, RR: 43 Reply 21, posted (2 years 5 months 3 weeks 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 11909 times:
Quoting AirNZ (Reply 15): How do you see that, or in what respect?
The decision to go after the VLA market with that particular albatross has been a disaster. Leahy was not the only person involved in that decision, but his constant derision of anyone who was a critic of the 380 program early left a phenominal amount of egg on his face on a program that just not is starting to break even on a operational basis, and has little hope of ever achieving a break-even basis to say nothing about RoI.
his instance that the 330 was enough to take on the 787, then his statement that the original 350 was the right plane, and his constant attacks on Boeing made spinning the fact that the 787 was the fastest selling plane in history (until Boeing pulled their own 380 debacle out of the hat) also made him look foolish.
ER757 From Cayman Islands, joined May 2005, 2349 posts, RR: 7 Reply 22, posted (2 years 5 months 3 weeks 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 11875 times:
Quoting astuteman (Reply 9): He can turn on the blarney (BS?) with the best of them,
As any good salesman can
I've really grown to respect and admire him over the years. I used to think he was just a blowhard shill for Airbus, but he's very knowledgeable and I find his occasional self-depricating humor to be refreshing.
mariner From New Zealand, joined Nov 2001, 23932 posts, RR: 87 Reply 24, posted (2 years 5 months 3 weeks 1 day 19 hours ago) and read 11633 times:
Quoting ruscoe (Reply 12): The success of Airbus is not just because of John L, it is because of the low risk environment that the early Airbus operated in because of it's structure, and the type of financing given it by European Govt.
Few great organizations are due entirely to one person - not even Steve Jobs, whose early decisions at Apple almost brought the company to its knees.
But I very much doubt that Airbus would be what it is today without John Leahy. The A300 had sold well but not great - it never cracked 1000 frames.
The company needed a super-salesman and found that in him and the A320 and JL were a wonderful marriage.
25 col: Those people who are negative to JL, let me ask you a question. Would you employ him? Now the 380. Is it finished in production? Have they stopped sel
26 bristolflyer: Makes you hate all those Wall Street execs even more. They'd laugh at that salary.
27 WarpSpeed: Absolutely! I'll admit to JL getting under my skin more than a few times, but I've come to admire him. He's the penultimate salesman and quite entert
28 Baroque: That is probably his greatest value to Airbus. The aspects that Mariner refers to are probably what we tend to assess him on - but likely the tip of
29 ferpe: You got the wrong Leahy, this guy is a CFO of an American company, our Leahy is COO customers. Hes salary should be at least several times that IMHO.
30 ebbuk: I'm talking about real people not journalists trying to sell papers. They don't count. No I have never run a business, nor as far as I'm aware, has J
31 mdword1959: Considering the hit EADS shareholders took in 2006, while Leahy and other insiders lined their pockets sparking a criminal investigation of misconduc
32 astuteman: It has? Well you're welcome to your opinion, I guess. But this is a marathon, not a sprint We're a long way from the fat lady singing on that one. A
33 GBan: Do you want to say that Airbus lost money with all their programs until now???
34 Baroque: Of "course" GBan, it has been in so many threads, Airbus has been bankrupt for years and it only keeps money on hand BECAUSE it is so bankrupt. The A
35 XT6Wagon: He left Airbus NA in 1994 to become the COO of customers at Airbus. First awesome idea he has is the A340NG. Yah, billions down the drain... sweet. H
36 scbriml: Yes, that much was clear from the Air Asia press conference.
37 DocLightning: In fact, a few former Airbus execs have retired to their own private yachts that sail the Greek islands. Thanks in no small part to JL. He's high-wat
38 col: So what I think you mean is that he has learnt by his mistakes. Remember the mirror in your car is smaller than the front wind shield for a reason. T
39 BMI727: No small feat considering that the competition is giving away 737s from a windowless van with "free jetliners" spray painted on the side. Basically t
40 brons2: Are you for real? It was the right plane, had they stuck to it, they probably would have delivered close to on-time in 2010 and they would have sold
41 AirNZ: Oh, it has....in what way? Hmmm! sounds very familiar to many here on a.net, and who still can't seem to accept that the likes of SQ, LH, EK etc know
42 mdword1959: There was never really a question whether operators could profitably deploy this aircraft. What remains an open question (hardly confined to A.net) i
43 glideslope: Thank you. It's always nice to see the world as it truly is.
44 Wilco777: In my opinion, John Leahy surely is a remarkable man and is incredibly talented at what he does and does it probably better than anyone else in the fi
45 lhrnue: Well first of all, the orders at the airshow are not coming as a surprise. for sure he knew at this time that these orders will come. Anyway that's o
46 Wilco777: Negotiations can take around 18 months before anything materialises. So people are very much mistaken if they believe through the media that deals are
47 Wsp: War is peace, freedom is slavery and ignorance is strength. Clearly nothing makes you more guilty than being cleared of the charges multiple times. E
48 PW100: Well, let's see. We are now 4.5 years after first delivery. Airbus has sold over 250 A380's. The original business case was supposed to have break ev
49 EPA001: The A380 already is a wonderful product. But no doubt she will be joined by the B787 and the A350 in that department. And of course then they will ha
50 mariner: Absolutely, I would imagine that even in Mr.Leahy's own department some of the most valuable people are the unsung researchers. In this celebrity obs
51 abba: One of the most fascinating things about John Leahy is how extremely controversial his is as a person. I fail to think about any other person in a pos
52 airfrnt: Guys, I know it's verboten to pretend that Airbus has had anything but a string of unquestionable successes, but it's simply not true. When you fail t
53 mariner: Which assumes Mr. Udvar-Hazy had no agenda. Qantas publicly said that there was little to choose between the 787 and the (then) A350, that Being offe
54 airfrnt: Of course he did, but he was far from a voice in the wilderness. And I appreciate that you live in that part of the world, but Qantas was hardly the
55 Viscount724: There are dozens of people I have never met but can't stand based on their personality or way of life, but at the same time I respect them for their
56 airfrnt: In America, the financial regulations are far far stricter about disclosure about conflicts of interests, as well as pay structure and corporate trans
57 EPA001: Funny that the original A350 sold over 200 copies and also won quite a number of campaigns, but lost out 2/3 to Boeing due to the incredible hype. An
58 UALWN: Sorry, what will end? And what mega-collapse are you talking about? Thanks.
59 EPA001: Which US company is very forthcoming in doing so if they are not obliged to. Since law is a very big practive in the US, I guess there must be a reas
60 mariner: Indeed. As I said, Dr. Humbert panicked. Rightfully? Well, maybe. But how long did Dr. Humbert ("Airbus listens to its customers") last as CEO at Air
61 airfrnt: The very very lax reporting rules for companies that allow them to play all sort of merry hobbs with their books. We will see what happens when the 7
62 Wsp: I am not sure what uncertainty around Airbus specifically you mean. But as a starting point the full copy of Airbus S.A.S.' annual financial statemen
63 airfrnt: Honestly, the effects of the newest Oil Shock, similar to what was occurring when the 787 came out, are only starting to make themselves felt. I thin
64 airfrnt: Yep, and compare it some time to the full book of disclosed information from Lockheed or Boeing. Quarterly. I recently watched a video where a Americ
65 EPA001: There are many European companies reporting quarterly. Actually, most of the meaningful companies I know in Europe do so. Reality was projected at 25
66 mdword1959: Where did I say Mr. Leahy was "guilty" of something? Why would a "bad" business case for manufacturing the A380 necessarily preclude Mr. Leahy from b
67 airfrnt: Because they do business in the United States.. Or Asia. And even then, the reporting has little controls on it, and subject to abuse. Sooner or late
68 mdword1959: On a side note, last fall, Dr. Enders predicted "building" 700-800 A380s over the next 40-50 years.
69 U2380: We get the point. You don't like Europe or Airbus. You've made your point so move along now, Europe won't be collapsing any time soon. Just because s
70 mariner: Ahhhh - I agree that perception may be perceived as reality at the time. I don't know if it is the truth. I don't know, for example, that the A380 wa
71 Wsp: You said there is uncertainty around Airbus and that "EADS makes a conscious effort to obscure the facts". So what information is missing from these
72 ruscoe: Here is an example where more clarity would be nice. Take a look at the 2010 Airbus and Boeing Commercial figures and do some rough calculations, and
73 mdword1959: Seems to me even the appearence of impropriety as evidenced by being the subject of both civil and criminal investigations for alleged wrongdoing in
74 UALWN: Since I guess these "very very lax reporting rules" in Europe have been in place since ever, I would assume any ensuing problem should have already m
75 mdword1959: I'm not following....where is "order backlog" classified on the balance sheet?
76 airfrnt: That's not my point. And frankly, the only way you've not realized that is because you don't want to read my point, and would rather just call me rac
77 mariner: It may be, but at the time the Airbus took the A380 decision the 744 was Boeing's VLA and my point was that Airbus didn't have one, whatever the mode
78 Baroque: WIth the very restricted windows within which sales could take place, a quick look at a calendar always suggested those charges were pretty much boun
79 airfrnt: Not at all. The charge has been laid against me - thrice - that I hate Europe and Airbus, by some of the more... reactionary - of the Airbus vanguard
80 UALWN: NIce try. However, I was careful enough to write that no mega-crash had happened in Europe that had not been exported from the USA. And there's no di
81 GBan: I'm sorry, but I think this tells much more about the executive in question than about the reporting requirements in Europe and the US. These kind of
82 AirNZ: But no-one is challenging your right to having whatever viewpoint you choose, but what I feel is wrong is that you are basing that viewpoint on no fa
83 airfrnt: DB was one of two companies that invented the CDO structures, and largest commercial banking investor in CDOs. They also sold the financial instrument
84 Baroque: Also a nice try, but you don't explain what that extravangance took nearly 20 years to cause a global collapse. Meanwhile this offering: http://www.g
85 UALWN: DB did that because it was allowed. US banks weren't allowed. Maybe, given that US banks were operating under a different regulatory environment, the
86 airfrnt: CATIA 4 to CATIA 5 was, just like the 787, a failure of program management. Given that the plane has been flying for a few years commercially, without
87 airfrnt: That's what you don't get. DB's wasn't sounder. They just got bailed out by the exact same things that bailed out the US banks - commercial arms, mas
88 EPA001: That was never predicted. And we see more orders coming in, also this year. And the less time Airbus needs for producing the A380's, and that is a tr
89 airfrnt: We can look at the end of 2020, but given that they just now are starting to make a operational profit there is no way on God's green earth that they
90 UALWN: DB were bailed out by their own commercial arm! That hardly a bail-out at all. Well, you did say that they started it off, as in they triggered it, w
91 EPA001: Since the costs are sunk costs, they are at present more or less irrelevant. We can argue until 2135 about the issue if the A380, B747-8 , B787 or th
92 Baroque: To which one might add as best as can be worked out by least squares regression, asking nicely and enhanced methods of interrogation, it was not caus
93 airfrnt: ARGH. People just don't read. That was only a bit of the bailout. They also accessed the United States of America's Federal Reserve "Discount Window"
94 abba: What it says? Perhaps the following: the present production within Airbus consists primarily of 320s and 330s with a few 380s. Within their backlog t
95 flipdewaf: Well they are probably making around $60-80million a piece on them so shouldn't be too bad to pay that off around 450 orders should do that, coincide
96 UALWN: I do read. All I was saying is that there's a difference between DB being (partially) bailed out by DB's own commercial arm, and Merrill Lynch being
97 XT6Wagon: If you are talking about the A380, Airbus has said it will take till 2014 to produce a A380 that costs less than they sell it for.
98 flipdewaf: Ah yes, so the frames wont make profit till 2014/15 then after that they have $12bn to write off in 5/6 years. ~2bn/year ~40frames/year ~50million /f
99 airfrnt: 24 billion, not 12.[Edited 2011-06-26 17:43:54]
100 GBan: This is not a financial rule, and I even if it was I think other companies aren't any better regarding delivering their promises at the promised time
101 flipdewaf: Go and look back at the previous threads that discussed the topic. It is $12bn if you are using the fact that early frames are still being sold at a
102 Baroque: Fair suck of the sauce bottle Fred, this is a double decker plane, so it is OK to double all the costs. What else would you do? Got to wonder though
103 airfrnt: Airbus has never revealed the split between operational costs and development costs. For tax purposes, they would have split it. Regardless, my under
104 airfrnt: I would be fired if I delivered my products at twice the expected cost, and at half the sales. In fact, my predecessor was fired for missing it by on
105 GBan: Even if you are fired for missing your targets, you still haven't broken any financial rule by missing the targets. But anyway, if you miss your busi
106 mdword1959: Airbus benefitted at least as much by a "strategic" policy of the Boeing Co. (circa 1996-2004) not to seek/defend market share via "aggressive" pricin
107 mariner: Actually, it ended a wee bitty before the 787. The rethink began after JetBlue went to Airbus and Frontier switched, but the real change happened aft
108 Baroque: And your evidence for this is???????? You do not suppose quality of product just might possibly even a teensy weeny bit played a part?
109 Autothrust: What a rubbish , the A380 was launched because there was and is demand for it. Airlines like Emirates even told Airbus to make it bigger. What milest
110 sebolino: ?? What's wrong with the A380 ? Leahy is an strange position, were many Americans just hate him for being at Airbus, like a traitor. You can feel it
111 zeke: JL was not responsible for the 1000 prediction, that was someone from Morgan Stanley. He actually said he thought that was too high and thought it wo
112 airfrnt: Read this thread. Read this thread. Incorrect. I'm looking right now at the Forecast from Airbus, published officially that says 1,100 plus units ove
113 mdword1959: Zeke is talking about Heidi Wood's (Morgan Stanley) forecast in January of potential A320NEO orders thru the Paris Airshow.
114 GBan: Incorrect: Zeke was responding to the prediction of 1000 NEO orders until Paris. Read the post
115 flipdewaf: No one has said they made an additional $10bn? where did you get that from? Good job it's only been flying for 6 then! no no, he can go on working as
116 zeke: He actually said in Paris under European pension laws he will have to go at 62, if he is wrong take it up with him. A good article on the history of
117 qfa787380: Love him or hate him, he's entertaining and provokes a lot of discussion.