rwessel From United States of America, joined Jan 2007, 1989 posts, RR: 2 Posted (1 year 10 months 4 weeks 7 hours ago) and read 9626 times:
"EVERETT, Wash., June 27, 2011 /PRNewswire/ -- Boeing (NYSE: BA) yesterday started Function & Reliability (F&R) testing and extended operations (ETOPS) demonstrations on the 787 Dreamliner. This is the final phase of flight testing prior to certification of the airplane.
'We are ready for this final phase of flight testing,' said Scott Fancher, vice president and general manager of the 787 program. 'The team has created a solid plan for accomplishing the hours and test points required for F&R and ETOPS testing in support of delivery to our customer ANA in the August to September time period.' "
SCL767 From Chile, joined Feb 2006, 8265 posts, RR: 5 Reply 1, posted (1 year 10 months 4 weeks 6 hours ago) and read 9487 times:
Glad to hear that
Quote: Boeing continues certification testing on 787s with General Electric engines and will conduct a separate F&R/ETOPS test program for that version of the airplane.
tdscanuck From Canada, joined Jan 2006, 12709 posts, RR: 81 Reply 3, posted (1 year 10 months 4 weeks 5 hours ago) and read 9283 times:
Quoting YXXMIKE (Reply 2):
What exactly does F&R testing include?
It comes out of a very general FAR that the OEM prove that the product works properly in a realistic operating environment. Basically, operate it like an airline would for a bunch of hours.
DocLightning From United States of America, joined Nov 2005, 16812 posts, RR: 57 Reply 4, posted (1 year 10 months 4 weeks 5 hours ago) and read 9256 times:
Quoting tdscanuck (Reply 3):
Airports and turns yes, but no particular requirement for people and luggage.
Really? Opening and closing the doors and bins and throwing heavy stuff around in them isn't necessary?
Hacku From United Arab Emirates, joined Apr 2011, 16 posts, RR: 0 Reply 8, posted (1 year 10 months 4 weeks ago) and read 8639 times:
Quoting YXXMIKE (Reply 2):
What exactly does F&R testing include? Will they add passengers? Move into airports and simulate a turnaround with people and luggage?
Boeing must demonstrate that the aircraft is able to divert to an airport on one engine, in more than an one hour flight.
fpetrutiu From United States of America, joined Aug 2007, 754 posts, RR: 0 Reply 9, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 6 days 21 hours ago) and read 8417 times:
Quoting Hacku (Reply 8): engine, in more than an one hour flight.
Aren't they trying for ETOPS 330? wouldn't that require the 787 to fly on one engine for 5.5 hours?
SCL767 From Chile, joined Feb 2006, 8265 posts, RR: 5 Reply 10, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 6 days 21 hours ago) and read 8352 times:
Quoting fpetrutiu (Reply 9): Aren't they trying for ETOPS 330? wouldn't that require the 787 to fly on one engine for 5.5 hours?
That is correct!
Quote: "Because of a recent change to the rules, we need to make a software adjustment. [330min ETOPS certification] will be done in time for when it is needed [as a customer requirement]" said Boeing.
tdscanuck From Canada, joined Jan 2006, 12709 posts, RR: 81 Reply 11, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 6 days 19 hours ago) and read 8107 times:
Quoting DocLightning (Reply 4): Really? Opening and closing the doors and bins and throwing heavy stuff around in them isn't necessary?
I'd figure that would be very necessary.
It is necessary, just not to show F&R compliance. Baggage handling is certified in other testing.
Quoting silentbob (Reply 5): Don't those designs have to be tested and certified prior to being placed in the aircraft? Seems like overkill to do it all again.
Exactly.
Quoting oldeuropean (Reply 7): Quoting flipdewaf (Reply 6):
You mean crashing luggage carts into it and having sex in the toilet whilst flying?
Where can I make an application for this job?
You really want to drive a baggage loader that badly?
Quoting Hacku (Reply 8): Boeing must demonstrate that the aircraft is able to divert to an airport on one engine, in more than an one hour flight.
That's an ETOPS requirement, not an F&R requirement.
Quoting fpetrutiu (Reply 9): Aren't they trying for ETOPS 330? wouldn't that require the 787 to fly on one engine for 5.5 hours?
Yes. The Flightglobal article says they're going for 180 minutes now and 330 later...since all it sounds like they're doing is a software change to the fuel quantity system, it would make sense to fly 330 now and just use that data when the update the software.
Antoniemey From United States of America, joined Dec 2005, 1504 posts, RR: 4 Reply 12, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 6 days 19 hours ago) and read 7844 times:
Quoting tdscanuck (Reply 11): You really want to drive a baggage loader that badly?
When in good condition, bag tugs and beltloaders can be a LOT of fun to drive. Container loaders, though... those seem like they'd be a bit sluggish... (never got the chance to drive one, sadly.)
Make something Idiot-proof, and the Universe will make a more inept idiot.
Markam From United States of America, joined Jan 2008, 277 posts, RR: 2 Reply 13, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 6 days 17 hours ago) and read 6765 times:
Quoting Antoniemey (Reply 12): When in good condition, bag tugs and beltloaders can be a LOT of fun to drive. Container loaders, though... those seem like they'd be a bit sluggish... (never got the chance to drive one, sadly.)
It has to be a mighty LOT of fun if it is to compete with the other "required task"
Quoting oldeuropean (Reply 7): Quoting flipdewaf (Reply 6):
You mean crashing luggage carts into it and having sex in the toilet whilst flying?
CitationJet From United States of America, joined Mar 2003, 2229 posts, RR: 3 Reply 14, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 6 days 16 hours ago) and read 6199 times:
The F&R requirement is found in 14 CFR 21.35(b) and (f):
(b) Upon showing compliance with paragraph (a) of this section, the applicant must make all flight tests that the FAA finds necessary--
(1) To determine compliance with the applicable requirements of this subchapter; and
(2) For aircraft to be certificated under this subchapter, except gliders and except airplanes of 6,000 lbs. or less maximum certificated weight that are to be certificated under Part 23 of this chapter, to determine whether there is reasonable assurance that the aircraft, its components, and its equipment are reliable and function properly.
......
(f) The flight tests prescribed in paragraph (b)(2) of this section must include--
(1) For aircraft incorporating turbine engines of a type not previously used in a type certificated aircraft, at least 300 hours of operation with a full complement of engines that conform to a type certificate; and
(2) For all other aircraft, at least 150 hours of operation.
DocLightning From United States of America, joined Nov 2005, 16812 posts, RR: 57 Reply 15, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 6 days 16 hours ago) and read 5949 times:
Quoting tdscanuck (Reply 11):
You really want to drive a baggage loader that badly?
He wants to drive something, but I don't think the baggage loader is what interested him.
AA777223 From United States of America, joined Feb 2006, 1112 posts, RR: 7 Reply 17, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 6 days 16 hours ago) and read 5622 times:
Quoting flipdewaf (Reply 16): After the state of the F/As on the last AA flight I took the baggage loader thing seems like it could be the best option.
Am I the only one who saw the AA FA joke coming from, like, 10 miles away?
goblin211 From United States of America, joined Jun 2010, 1209 posts, RR: 0 Reply 20, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 6 days 9 hours ago) and read 2350 times:
How long will the test take? It seems like all of them so far have been taking forever.
Stitch From United States of America, joined Jul 2005, 26693 posts, RR: 83 Reply 21, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 6 days 9 hours ago) and read 2277 times:
Quoting goblin211 (Reply 20): How long will the test take? It seems like all of them so far have been taking forever.
I have read that the ETOPS certification does not require a specific amount of hours, just reaching various thresholds. Boeing believes they can meet all these with 300 flight hours, so we're likely looking at around 6 weeks (since there will be downtime for maintenance and such).
DocLightning From United States of America, joined Nov 2005, 16812 posts, RR: 57 Reply 23, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 6 days 5 hours ago) and read 1307 times:
Quoting AA777223 (Reply 17): Am I the only one who saw the AA FA joke coming from, like, 10 miles away?
An AA F/A joke is NEVER ten miles away. In fact, they're so plentiful there are at least six or seven at arm's reach at any given time.
aklrno From United States of America, joined Dec 2010, 683 posts, RR: 0 Reply 24, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 6 days 5 hours ago) and read 1292 times:
Quoting Spacepope (Reply 19): Just out of curiosity, anyone know what BOE flight number they're using? A few 787s are active today.
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