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MIA And TP Questions  
User currently offlinemiaintl From United States of America, joined Jun 2010, 1049 posts, RR: 0
Posted (3 years 2 months 4 days 21 hours ago) and read 3270 times:

Does anyone know how the MIA-LIS flight is performing? Any info on yields or loads yet? I know that the flight is being downgraded to 3x weekly in the winter. Also is this flight codesharing with AV and JJ by any chance?

21 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineairportugal310 From Tokelau, joined Apr 2004, 3635 posts, RR: 2
Reply 1, posted (3 years 2 months 4 days 18 hours ago) and read 3102 times:

While I don't have knowledge on this, it strikes me as strange that its downgraded to 3x weekly in the winter, which is theoretically Florida's busy season...

on the other hand, however, Brazil has its Summer in the Northern Hemisphere's "Winter" so maybe its not such a popular place to be?

or is that wrong too? aye aye aye



I sell airplanes and airplane accessories
User currently offlinesantos From United Kingdom, joined Dec 2007, 741 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (3 years 2 months 4 days 18 hours ago) and read 3088 times:

Quoting airportugal310 (Reply 1):
which is theoretically Florida's busy season...

It might be high season in Florida, but the Portuguese tend to take their holidays during July/August and September.
Winter sun holidays are not very popular yet.
And as you mentioned they have 10 destinations in Brazil to choose from- Summer season in Brazil.
MIA is a new market, so will have to stablish itself this winter and might be upgraded next year.
Advance bookings were good as reported by TP, the week before the lauch of the route, they had 32.000 advance bookings.


User currently onlineMAH4546 From Sweden, joined Jan 2001, 32781 posts, RR: 72
Reply 3, posted (3 years 2 months 4 days 17 hours ago) and read 3049 times:

Quoting airportugal310 (Reply 1):
While I don't have knowledge on this, it strikes me as strange that its downgraded to 3x weekly in the winter, which is theoretically Florida's busy season...

Not for Spain and Portugal. They peak in July and August in both directions - Floridians visiting Iberia and Iberians visiting Florida. Having less service in the winter makes sense.

Florida is not as seasonal as people think from Europe. July and August tend to be busier than even January and February.

From South Florida, the only market that truly peaks in winter and sees a big drop during the summer are the Scandanavian countries.

[Edited 2011-07-15 16:10:14]


a.
User currently offlineairportugal310 From Tokelau, joined Apr 2004, 3635 posts, RR: 2
Reply 4, posted (3 years 2 months 4 days 17 hours ago) and read 2996 times:

Quoting santos (Reply 2):
It might be high season in Florida, but the Portuguese tend to take their holidays during July/August and September.
Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 3):
Not for Spain and Portugal. They peak in July and August in both directions - Floridians visiting Iberia and Iberians visiting Florida. Having less service in the winter makes sense.

Sounds plausible to me...thx guys

On a side note, being from the Northeast US, my boss once called me "a mad man" for taking a vacation to Southern FL in the summer...and I see why he said that...

(very hot, very humid, very uncomfortable...)

but if thats what the Europeans like, well, who am I to say?!  



I sell airplanes and airplane accessories
User currently offlinePyrex From Portugal, joined Aug 2005, 4022 posts, RR: 28
Reply 5, posted (3 years 2 months 4 days 13 hours ago) and read 2837 times:

Quoting airportugal310 (Reply 4):
On a side note, being from the Northeast US, my boss once called me "a mad man" for taking a vacation to Southern FL in the summer...and I see why he said that...

Reminds me a conversation I once had with a friend from New Orleans:

me: "I am so excited, am finally going down to visit New Orleans, and got really cheap tickets, too."

him: "That's great news, you'll love it. When are you going down?"

me: "Early August."

him: "Yeah, about that..."

Suffice to say, I found out pretty quickly why the tickets were so cheap that time of the year. Didn't stop me from absolutely loving the city, though.



Read this very carefully, I shall write this only once!
User currently offlineMIASkies From United States of America, joined Jun 2004, 1347 posts, RR: 1
Reply 6, posted (3 years 2 months 4 days 9 hours ago) and read 2720 times:

Quoting airportugal310 (Reply 4):
Sounds plausible to me...thx guys

On a side note, being from the Northeast US, my boss once called me "a mad man" for taking a vacation to Southern FL in the summer...and I see why he said that...

(very hot, very humid, very uncomfortable...)

but if thats what the Europeans like, well, who am I to say?!  

beats the cold waters in the northeast though...i'll take my clear blue waters and a mojito any day on a hot summer miami day over rocky shores and dark beach waters up north haha  



Nothing better than making love at 35K Feet!
User currently offlinemiaintl From United States of America, joined Jun 2010, 1049 posts, RR: 0
Reply 7, posted (3 years 2 months 4 days 7 hours ago) and read 2637 times:

Im still skeptical of this route longterm success. I mean are the flights full and are the yields good, because last time i checked Lisbon is a very small market to MIA:

User currently offlineRafabozzolla From Brazil, joined Apr 2000, 1229 posts, RR: 0
Reply 8, posted (3 years 2 months 4 days 6 hours ago) and read 2600 times:

Come to think of it, it does make sense. Spain, and especially Portugal, are nowhere nearly as cold as Northern Europe, the Northeast or the Midwest, so the snowbird effect is not as important.

Spaniards looking for warm winter weather head to the Canary Islands and, in TAP's case, they need the capacity in winter to cater for droves of Brazilians going to Europe during their summer holidays.


User currently offlineairportugal310 From Tokelau, joined Apr 2004, 3635 posts, RR: 2
Reply 9, posted (3 years 2 months 4 days 3 hours ago) and read 2512 times:

Quoting MIASkies (Reply 6):
beats the cold waters in the northeast though...i'll take my clear blue waters and a mojito any day on a hot summer miami day over rocky shores and dark beach waters up north haha

I would agree to a degree...our distinct "seasons" make living up here worthwhile

but thats neither here nor there  

any pics of TP at MIA out there yet?



I sell airplanes and airplane accessories
User currently offlinejonathanxxxx From United States of America, joined Feb 2011, 673 posts, RR: 1
Reply 10, posted (3 years 2 months 3 days 23 hours ago) and read 1874 times:

Quoting miaintl (Reply 7):
Im still skeptical of this route longterm success. I mean are the flights full and are the yields good, because last time i checked Lisbon is a very small market to MIA:

You just contradicted yourself there. If the yeilds are good and the flight is full. Who cares about the local market? They have tons of connections to the Iberian peninsula all over Spain and connections to Africa and Southern Europe, MIA's strongpoints. The flight can work how it is at 4 (soon to be 3X weekly). Just give it some time.


User currently onlineMAH4546 From Sweden, joined Jan 2001, 32781 posts, RR: 72
Reply 11, posted (3 years 2 months 3 days 23 hours ago) and read 1867 times:

Quoting jonathanxxxx (Reply 10):
The flight can work how it is at 4 (soon to be 3X weekly). Just give it some time.

Slight correction, but it is 5x. Reduces to 4x for the fall; 3x for the winter.



a.
User currently offlinejonathanxxxx From United States of America, joined Feb 2011, 673 posts, RR: 1
Reply 12, posted (3 years 2 months 3 days 23 hours ago) and read 1823 times:

Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 11):
Slight correction, but it is 5x. Reduces to 4x for the fall; 3x for the winter.

Thanks sorry I thought it had already been downgraded to 4X weekly. But it still proves my point that TP can do just fine on this flight. Even if its on a seasonal basis.


User currently offlineMCOGVADCA From China, joined Oct 2006, 446 posts, RR: 0
Reply 13, posted (3 years 2 months 3 days 23 hours ago) and read 1786 times:

Quoting jonathanxxxx (Reply 10):
If the yeilds are good and the flight is full. Who cares about the local market?

Right there.

Quoting jonathanxxxx (Reply 10):
They have tons of connections to the Iberian peninsula all over Spain and connections to Africa and Southern Europe, MIA's strongpoints.

Wrong there. TP is a skeleton of an airline when taking out its South American (which doesn't factor into MIA-LIS) and African ops (Maputo, Sal and Praia have major demand from Lisbon. From Miami? Not so much. Boston? Another story). Portugal demand is a major factor on this route.

[Edited 2011-07-16 10:31:09]

[Edited 2011-07-16 10:32:38]


12 months:pvg hkg bkk doh mxp nce zrh iah lhr gva iad clt lax nrt sin mnl ceb del jai gay vns szx zuh mfm icn can
User currently offlineMaverickM11 From United States of America, joined Apr 2000, 17499 posts, RR: 45
Reply 14, posted (3 years 2 months 3 days 23 hours ago) and read 1734 times:

Quoting jonathanxxxx (Reply 10):
If the yeilds are good and the flight is full. Who cares about the local market? They have tons of connections to the Iberian peninsula all over Spain and connections to Africa and Southern Europe, MIA's strongpoints.

If the local market is small, TP has to depend on flow, and that means competing with every other transatlantic carrier out of MIA--ie on price--most of whom have much larger networks. TP has very few unique destinations that are going to drive much of a premium or volume to MIA, plus the schedule is one of the latest westbound flights out of Europe. That's not to say it can't work but I'm not sure what ingredients would make it work.



E pur si muove -Galileo
User currently offlinejonathanxxxx From United States of America, joined Feb 2011, 673 posts, RR: 1
Reply 15, posted (3 years 2 months 3 days 23 hours ago) and read 1730 times:

Yes, but according to "miaintl" the flight is full and the yeilds are good. Something is driving the route. May it be connections or sudden demand, I don't know.

User currently offlinemiaintl From United States of America, joined Jun 2010, 1049 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (3 years 2 months 3 days 21 hours ago) and read 1502 times:

Quoting jonathanxxxx (Reply 15):

Sorry that was a typo, i did not mean that the yields and loads are doing good on the TP flight, i meant to ask it as a question. In my opinoin this flight will be axed by this time next year. Out of all the new european service to MIA, only KL is proving to be a success (considering its now going to be upgraded to 5x weekly next summer).


User currently offlinejonathanxxxx From United States of America, joined Feb 2011, 673 posts, RR: 1
Reply 17, posted (3 years 2 months 3 days 21 hours ago) and read 1472 times:

Quoting miaintl (Reply 16):
Sorry that was a typo, i did not mean that the yields and loads are doing good on the TP flight, i meant to ask it as a question. In my opinoin this flight will be axed by this time next year. Out of all the new european service to MIA, only KL is proving to be a success (considering its now going to be upgraded to 5x weekly next summer).

I have to disagree there. I mean the flight probably will not be axed. If anything it will become seasonal because in the Summer it supposedly does well. The Winter on the otherhand my not be the best. If anything it can be just 2X weekly service. A route does not have to be daily or axed. The route can easily be 5X weekly in the summer and 2X weekly in the Winter. TP knows that they have to fit the flight to the correct demand. Look at AB everyone thought the TXL flight would be horrible. Just look at it now. Its fine at 3X weekly. UN too. They are slowly stimulating the market. Even with just 1X weekly 744. The flight will stay until TP finds a better oppurtunity to make money on (which I'm unsure about, there are just that many places LIS can support a flight too).


User currently offlineflymia From United States of America, joined Jun 2001, 7174 posts, RR: 9
Reply 18, posted (3 years 2 months 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 1383 times:

Quoting miaintl (Reply 16):
Sorry that was a typo, i did not mean that the yields and loads are doing good on the TP flight, i meant to ask it as a question. In my opinoin this flight will be axed by this time next year. Out of all the new european service to MIA, only KL is proving to be a success (considering its now going to be upgraded to 5x weekly next summer).

Would love to see FACTS and STATS that prove what your saying. You make these threads and same the same thing every time but never have anything to prove it.



"It was just four of us on the flight deck, trying to do our job" (Captain Al Haynes)
User currently offlinesantos From United Kingdom, joined Dec 2007, 741 posts, RR: 0
Reply 19, posted (3 years 2 months 3 days 18 hours ago) and read 1300 times:

Quoting miaintl (Reply 16):
In my opinoin this flight will be axed by this time next year. Out of all the new european service to MIA, only KL is proving to be a success (considering its now going to be upgraded to 5x weekly next summer).



How can you presume that the route will be axed by next summer? The route only has been operating for 7 weeks, you have no access or knowledge of the loads, yields, etc... If you had any information i might believe you, but you don't.
Going 4x weekly in the fall and 3x weekly in the winter makes perfect sense as i said before, the Portuguese tend to travel between July/August/September.


User currently onlineMAH4546 From Sweden, joined Jan 2001, 32781 posts, RR: 72
Reply 20, posted (3 years 2 months 3 days 16 hours ago) and read 1247 times:

Quoting santos (Reply 19):
How can you presume that the route will be axed by next summer? The route only has been operating for 7 weeks, you have no access or knowledge of the loads, yields, etc... If you had any information i might believe you, but you don't.
Going 4x weekly in the fall and 3x weekly in the winter makes perfect sense as i said before, the Portuguese tend to travel between July/August/September.

He is not able to back up anything he says. It's best to ignore it, especially when one claims that only KLM is successfulnof the recent MIA Europe launches, which isn't true (KLM is doing well, but most everything else is, too, sans LH now gone MUC).



a.
User currently onlineairbazar From United States of America, joined Sep 2003, 8368 posts, RR: 10
Reply 21, posted (3 years 2 months 3 days 2 hours ago) and read 1072 times:

Quoting airportugal310 (Reply 1):
While I don't have knowledge on this, it strikes me as strange that its downgraded to 3x weekly in the winter, which is theoretically Florida's busy season...

That's negative and a huge mis-conception. Florida is only popular in Winter for people from New England and Canada  
Summer is the busy season not just for Florida in general, but for TATL flying too. All you have to do is try to look up timeshare prices in Florida and you'll see that Summer is the busy season.
I just came back from a vacation in Florida last week and loved it. I'd been there in the Winter and Spring before and didn't like it at all. The weather was too inconsistent and not hot enough. Summer is the time to go in my opinion. 85F every day. Can't complain about that  Smile

[Edited 2011-07-17 07:04:25]

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