miaintl From United States of America, joined exactly 3 years ago today! , 827 posts, RR: 0 Posted (1 year 11 months 1 week 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 2983 times:
Does anyone know how the MIA-LIS flight is performing? Any info on yields or loads yet? I know that the flight is being downgraded to 3x weekly in the winter. Also is this flight codesharing with AV and JJ by any chance?
airportugal310 From United States of America, joined Apr 2004, 3102 posts, RR: 2 Reply 1, posted (1 year 11 months 1 week 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 2815 times:
While I don't have knowledge on this, it strikes me as strange that its downgraded to 3x weekly in the winter, which is theoretically Florida's busy season...
on the other hand, however, Brazil has its Summer in the Northern Hemisphere's "Winter" so maybe its not such a popular place to be?
It might be high season in Florida, but the Portuguese tend to take their holidays during July/August and September.
Winter sun holidays are not very popular yet.
And as you mentioned they have 10 destinations in Brazil to choose from- Summer season in Brazil.
MIA is a new market, so will have to stablish itself this winter and might be upgraded next year.
Advance bookings were good as reported by TP, the week before the lauch of the route, they had 32.000 advance bookings.
MAH4546 From Sweden, joined Jan 2001, 31155 posts, RR: 76 Reply 3, posted (1 year 11 months 1 week 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 2762 times:
Quoting airportugal310 (Reply 1): While I don't have knowledge on this, it strikes me as strange that its downgraded to 3x weekly in the winter, which is theoretically Florida's busy season...
Not for Spain and Portugal. They peak in July and August in both directions - Floridians visiting Iberia and Iberians visiting Florida. Having less service in the winter makes sense.
Florida is not as seasonal as people think from Europe. July and August tend to be busier than even January and February.
From South Florida, the only market that truly peaks in winter and sees a big drop during the summer are the Scandanavian countries.
airportugal310 From United States of America, joined Apr 2004, 3102 posts, RR: 2 Reply 4, posted (1 year 11 months 1 week 1 day 5 hours ago) and read 2709 times:
Quoting santos (Reply 2): It might be high season in Florida, but the Portuguese tend to take their holidays during July/August and September.
Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 3): Not for Spain and Portugal. They peak in July and August in both directions - Floridians visiting Iberia and Iberians visiting Florida. Having less service in the winter makes sense.
Sounds plausible to me...thx guys
On a side note, being from the Northeast US, my boss once called me "a mad man" for taking a vacation to Southern FL in the summer...and I see why he said that...
(very hot, very humid, very uncomfortable...)
but if thats what the Europeans like, well, who am I to say?!
Pyrex From Portugal, joined Aug 2005, 3542 posts, RR: 28 Reply 5, posted (1 year 11 months 1 week 1 day 2 hours ago) and read 2550 times:
Quoting airportugal310 (Reply 4): On a side note, being from the Northeast US, my boss once called me "a mad man" for taking a vacation to Southern FL in the summer...and I see why he said that...
Reminds me a conversation I once had with a friend from New Orleans:
me: "I am so excited, am finally going down to visit New Orleans, and got really cheap tickets, too."
him: "That's great news, you'll love it. When are you going down?"
me: "Early August."
him: "Yeah, about that..."
Suffice to say, I found out pretty quickly why the tickets were so cheap that time of the year. Didn't stop me from absolutely loving the city, though.
Read this very carefully, I shall write this only once!
On a side note, being from the Northeast US, my boss once called me "a mad man" for taking a vacation to Southern FL in the summer...and I see why he said that...
(very hot, very humid, very uncomfortable...)
but if thats what the Europeans like, well, who am I to say?!
beats the cold waters in the northeast though...i'll take my clear blue waters and a mojito any day on a hot summer miami day over rocky shores and dark beach waters up north haha
miaintl From United States of America, joined exactly 3 years ago today! , 827 posts, RR: 0 Reply 7, posted (1 year 11 months 1 week 19 hours ago) and read 2350 times:
Im still skeptical of this route longterm success. I mean are the flights full and are the yields good, because last time i checked Lisbon is a very small market to MIA:
Rafabozzolla From Brazil, joined Apr 2000, 1165 posts, RR: 0 Reply 8, posted (1 year 11 months 1 week 19 hours ago) and read 2313 times:
Come to think of it, it does make sense. Spain, and especially Portugal, are nowhere nearly as cold as Northern Europe, the Northeast or the Midwest, so the snowbird effect is not as important.
Spaniards looking for warm winter weather head to the Canary Islands and, in TAP's case, they need the capacity in winter to cater for droves of Brazilians going to Europe during their summer holidays.
airportugal310 From United States of America, joined Apr 2004, 3102 posts, RR: 2 Reply 9, posted (1 year 11 months 1 week 16 hours ago) and read 2225 times:
Quoting MIASkies (Reply 6): beats the cold waters in the northeast though...i'll take my clear blue waters and a mojito any day on a hot summer miami day over rocky shores and dark beach waters up north haha
I would agree to a degree...our distinct "seasons" make living up here worthwhile
jonathanxxxx From United States of America, joined Feb 2011, 639 posts, RR: 1 Reply 10, posted (1 year 11 months 1 week 12 hours ago) and read 1587 times:
Quoting miaintl (Reply 7): Im still skeptical of this route longterm success. I mean are the flights full and are the yields good, because last time i checked Lisbon is a very small market to MIA:
You just contradicted yourself there. If the yeilds are good and the flight is full. Who cares about the local market? They have tons of connections to the Iberian peninsula all over Spain and connections to Africa and Southern Europe, MIA's strongpoints. The flight can work how it is at 4 (soon to be 3X weekly). Just give it some time.
jonathanxxxx From United States of America, joined Feb 2011, 639 posts, RR: 1 Reply 12, posted (1 year 11 months 1 week 12 hours ago) and read 1536 times:
Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 11): Slight correction, but it is 5x. Reduces to 4x for the fall; 3x for the winter.
Thanks sorry I thought it had already been downgraded to 4X weekly. But it still proves my point that TP can do just fine on this flight. Even if its on a seasonal basis.
MCOGVADCA From China, joined Oct 2006, 442 posts, RR: 0 Reply 13, posted (1 year 11 months 1 week 12 hours ago) and read 1499 times:
Quoting jonathanxxxx (Reply 10): If the yeilds are good and the flight is full. Who cares about the local market?
Right there.
Quoting jonathanxxxx (Reply 10): They have tons of connections to the Iberian peninsula all over Spain and connections to Africa and Southern Europe, MIA's strongpoints.
Wrong there. TP is a skeleton of an airline when taking out its South American (which doesn't factor into MIA-LIS) and African ops (Maputo, Sal and Praia have major demand from Lisbon. From Miami? Not so much. Boston? Another story). Portugal demand is a major factor on this route.
[Edited 2011-07-16 10:31:09]
[Edited 2011-07-16 10:32:38]
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MaverickM11 From United States of America, joined Apr 2000, 15810 posts, RR: 50 Reply 14, posted (1 year 11 months 1 week 12 hours ago) and read 1447 times:
Quoting jonathanxxxx (Reply 10): If the yeilds are good and the flight is full. Who cares about the local market? They have tons of connections to the Iberian peninsula all over Spain and connections to Africa and Southern Europe, MIA's strongpoints.
If the local market is small, TP has to depend on flow, and that means competing with every other transatlantic carrier out of MIA--ie on price--most of whom have much larger networks. TP has very few unique destinations that are going to drive much of a premium or volume to MIA, plus the schedule is one of the latest westbound flights out of Europe. That's not to say it can't work but I'm not sure what ingredients would make it work.
jonathanxxxx From United States of America, joined Feb 2011, 639 posts, RR: 1 Reply 15, posted (1 year 11 months 1 week 12 hours ago) and read 1443 times:
Yes, but according to "miaintl" the flight is full and the yeilds are good. Something is driving the route. May it be connections or sudden demand, I don't know.
miaintl From United States of America, joined exactly 3 years ago today! , 827 posts, RR: 0 Reply 16, posted (1 year 11 months 1 week 10 hours ago) and read 1215 times:
Sorry that was a typo, i did not mean that the yields and loads are doing good on the TP flight, i meant to ask it as a question. In my opinoin this flight will be axed by this time next year. Out of all the new european service to MIA, only KL is proving to be a success (considering its now going to be upgraded to 5x weekly next summer).
jonathanxxxx From United States of America, joined Feb 2011, 639 posts, RR: 1 Reply 17, posted (1 year 11 months 1 week 10 hours ago) and read 1185 times:
Quoting miaintl (Reply 16): Sorry that was a typo, i did not mean that the yields and loads are doing good on the TP flight, i meant to ask it as a question. In my opinoin this flight will be axed by this time next year. Out of all the new european service to MIA, only KL is proving to be a success (considering its now going to be upgraded to 5x weekly next summer).
I have to disagree there. I mean the flight probably will not be axed. If anything it will become seasonal because in the Summer it supposedly does well. The Winter on the otherhand my not be the best. If anything it can be just 2X weekly service. A route does not have to be daily or axed. The route can easily be 5X weekly in the summer and 2X weekly in the Winter. TP knows that they have to fit the flight to the correct demand. Look at AB everyone thought the TXL flight would be horrible. Just look at it now. Its fine at 3X weekly. UN too. They are slowly stimulating the market. Even with just 1X weekly 744. The flight will stay until TP finds a better oppurtunity to make money on (which I'm unsure about, there are just that many places LIS can support a flight too).
flymia From United States of America, joined Jun 2001, 6323 posts, RR: 6 Reply 18, posted (1 year 11 months 1 week 9 hours ago) and read 1096 times:
Quoting miaintl (Reply 16): Sorry that was a typo, i did not mean that the yields and loads are doing good on the TP flight, i meant to ask it as a question. In my opinoin this flight will be axed by this time next year. Out of all the new european service to MIA, only KL is proving to be a success (considering its now going to be upgraded to 5x weekly next summer).
Would love to see FACTS and STATS that prove what your saying. You make these threads and same the same thing every time but never have anything to prove it.
"It was just four of us on the flight deck, trying to do our job" (Captain Al Haynes)
santos From United Kingdom, joined Dec 2007, 711 posts, RR: 0 Reply 19, posted (1 year 11 months 1 week 7 hours ago) and read 1013 times:
Quoting miaintl (Reply 16): In my opinoin this flight will be axed by this time next year. Out of all the new european service to MIA, only KL is proving to be a success (considering its now going to be upgraded to 5x weekly next summer).
How can you presume that the route will be axed by next summer? The route only has been operating for 7 weeks, you have no access or knowledge of the loads, yields, etc... If you had any information i might believe you, but you don't.
Going 4x weekly in the fall and 3x weekly in the winter makes perfect sense as i said before, the Portuguese tend to travel between July/August/September.
MAH4546 From Sweden, joined Jan 2001, 31155 posts, RR: 76 Reply 20, posted (1 year 11 months 1 week 5 hours ago) and read 960 times:
Quoting santos (Reply 19): How can you presume that the route will be axed by next summer? The route only has been operating for 7 weeks, you have no access or knowledge of the loads, yields, etc... If you had any information i might believe you, but you don't.
Going 4x weekly in the fall and 3x weekly in the winter makes perfect sense as i said before, the Portuguese tend to travel between July/August/September.
He is not able to back up anything he says. It's best to ignore it, especially when one claims that only KLM is successfulnof the recent MIA Europe launches, which isn't true (KLM is doing well, but most everything else is, too, sans LH now gone MUC).
airbazar From United States of America, joined Sep 2003, 6952 posts, RR: 7 Reply 21, posted (1 year 11 months 6 days 15 hours ago) and read 785 times:
Quoting airportugal310 (Reply 1): While I don't have knowledge on this, it strikes me as strange that its downgraded to 3x weekly in the winter, which is theoretically Florida's busy season...
That's negative and a huge mis-conception. Florida is only popular in Winter for people from New England and Canada
Summer is the busy season not just for Florida in general, but for TATL flying too. All you have to do is try to look up timeshare prices in Florida and you'll see that Summer is the busy season.
I just came back from a vacation in Florida last week and loved it. I'd been there in the Winter and Spring before and didn't like it at all. The weather was too inconsistent and not hot enough. Summer is the time to go in my opinion. 85F every day. Can't complain about that
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