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Airbus/Eastern Deals.... Why Not Done Today?  
User currently offline727LOVER From United States of America, joined Oct 2001, 6285 posts, RR: 17
Posted (2 years 11 months 3 weeks 14 hours ago) and read 2605 times:

Back in the mid 70s, Eastern retired its DC-8 fleet without any replacement. This left a huge gap in it s fleet between the 727-200 & L-1011. Around this time, Airbus, wanting to get a foothold into the North American market, offered a sweet deal to the airline. It would pay for all of Eastern s training and operational costs for the airline to operate 4(?) aircraft on trial basis for evaluation. Eastern apparently was pleased with the aircraft s performance and eventually, ended up ordering a bunch, thus becoming the launch customer in North America for Airbus.


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My question is:

Why aren' t deals like this done today?

Granted, impossible to do with a paper airplane, so that leaves Cseries out, but would it not be in Airbus s intetest to do this approach.
Yes, current A320 family is not the same as NEO, but can it hurt? Or Boeing, with say AC or BA.



The point is, why aren' t deals like the one Eastern got done today?


Listen Betty, don't start up with your 'White Zone' s*** again.
10 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineStitch From United States of America, joined Jul 2005, 30388 posts, RR: 84
Reply 1, posted (2 years 11 months 3 weeks 14 hours ago) and read 2516 times:
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Quoting 727LOVER (Thread starter):
Why aren' t deals like this done today?

I imagine modern computer modeling tools are advanced enough that an airline can with sufficient clarity how a model will perform for them so there is no need to take a "test flight".


User currently offlinehomsar From United States of America, joined Jan 2010, 1148 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (2 years 11 months 3 weeks 10 hours ago) and read 2190 times:

I'd say the main reason is because in the late 70s/early 80s, Airbus needed customers outside of western Europe (was anybody in North America flying Airbuses then?).

Today, Airbus doesn't need any "help" selling jets, so why should they give them away? A320s and A330s are flown all over the world, with order backlogs stretching to the end of the decade.

In the 1970s, Airbus had planes built with nobody to buy them.



I was raised by a cup of coffee.
User currently offlinebrilondon From Canada, joined Aug 2005, 4097 posts, RR: 1
Reply 3, posted (2 years 11 months 3 weeks 10 hours ago) and read 2170 times:

Quoting 727LOVER (Thread starter):
Or Boeing, with say AC or BA.



I don't think that AC is looking for that type of aircraft. They are acquiring quite the fleet of E Jets and those seem to fit the bill at this time.



Rush for ever; Yankees all the way!!
User currently onlineEA CO AS From United States of America, joined Nov 2001, 13469 posts, RR: 62
Reply 4, posted (2 years 11 months 3 weeks 10 hours ago) and read 2170 times:
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Quoting 727LOVER (Thread starter):
Why aren' t deals like this done today?

You already know the answer. It's because, as you said...

Quoting 727LOVER (Thread starter):
wanting to get a foothold into the North American market,

Airbus doesn't need any help moving their product anymore - everyone knows about it, and for the most part, the stigma of buying an airplane built overseas has disappeared.



"In this present crisis, government is not the solution to our problem - government IS the problem." - Ronald Reagan
User currently offlineAFGMEL From Australia, joined Jul 2007, 744 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (2 years 11 months 3 weeks 10 hours ago) and read 2151 times:

The USA was and is a very large market for aircraft. At the time everyone believed that the US built the best of everything. It was a daunting task to get a European aircraft in there although the Caravelle had had some success as well.

Airlines are now run by accountants and hubris is very seldom an issue. The best aircraft for the job at the best price is what sells. As already said, with a huge backlog of orders for both major manufacturers why would they offer freebies?



B 727-44/200 732/3/4/8/9 767-3 742/3/4, 772/3, A319/20/21 332/333 342/3 , DC3/4/10, F28/50/100, ATR72
User currently offlineckfred From United States of America, joined Apr 2001, 5153 posts, RR: 1
Reply 6, posted (2 years 11 months 3 weeks 9 hours ago) and read 2082 times:

Didn't AA get a very sweet deal from McDonnell Douglas? I seem to recall that McD delivered 20 planes to AA. AA got to fly them for X amount of time. If AA wasn't happy, it could return the planes and owe nothing.

Quoting Stitch (Reply 1):
I imagine modern computer modeling tools are advanced enough that an airline can with sufficient clarity how a model will perform for them so there is no need to take a "test flight".

How good were the computer modeling tools, when McDonnell Douglas was selling the MD-11? AA got its first planes, and the range wasn't what McD promised. Bob Crandall threatened to cancel the order and return the aircraft that had been delivered. Although AA took delivery of the full order of 19 aircraft, they were eventually sold to FedEx as the 772s started to arrive.


User currently offlinezippyjet From United States of America, joined Sep 2001, 5467 posts, RR: 13
Reply 7, posted (2 years 11 months 3 weeks 2 hours ago) and read 1876 times:

Quoting homsar (Reply 2):
d say the main reason is because in the late 70s/early 80s, Airbus needed customers outside of western Europe (was anybody in North America flying Airbuses then?).

I believe Eastern was the first customer in the USA to fly Airbus planes. I remember seeing pictures of these birds back in the day and I wondered what type of airliner was it? I was a lad in my late teens and there was no such thing as the Internet and obviously A. Net. I actually had to ask an Eastern customer service agent at BWI about this mysterious new wide bodied bird. The Airbus being the first wide bodied twin engine. Remember, the only twin at the time was the small in size comparison 737 and Eastern never flew them. And not to get off topic but, I feel the white bodied Eastern planes now look better than the silver ones. Especially the A-300's and L 1011's.

Regarding non USA made aircraft let us not forget the Vickers Viscount. There were more turbo prop/jet Vicks flying than the Caravelle. UA was the only USA airline that flew them if I'm not mistaken. Going way back actually before my time, the Viscount was a big hit with the now defunct Capital Airlines. Capital was aquired by UA so UA flew the Viscounts into the 1960's. Northeast also flew the Viscount but, I for the life of my can't find a picture of a Northeast Viscount even here at A-Net. Capital seemed to have a penchant for crashes and accidents luckilly when UA absorbed them they didn't inherit their accident laden record.



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User currently onlineEA CO AS From United States of America, joined Nov 2001, 13469 posts, RR: 62
Reply 8, posted (2 years 11 months 2 weeks 6 days 8 hours ago) and read 1460 times:
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Quoting zippyjet (Reply 7):
I believe Eastern was the first customer in the USA to fly Airbus planes.

And they took a little heat for it at first, although it quickly dissipated.



"In this present crisis, government is not the solution to our problem - government IS the problem." - Ronald Reagan
User currently offlinesparky35805 From United States of America, joined Dec 2007, 274 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (2 years 11 months 2 weeks 6 days 4 hours ago) and read 1329 times:
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No one took Airbus seriously untill Eastern ordered their aircraft.The A300 had been in service for at least two years when Eastern got those first four on loan,which they eventually bought.Sales ahd been slow,with most deliveries going to Air France and Lufthansa.The Eastern Deal jump started sales and started Airbus on the road to where they are today.
Sparky


User currently offlineBurkhard From Germany, joined Nov 2006, 4376 posts, RR: 2
Reply 10, posted (2 years 11 months 2 weeks 6 days ago) and read 1192 times:

Airbus and Boeing are sold out for half a decade, so they have no need for such deals. And their aircraft models are well known and well established, nobody needs to verify this.

I could see the Chinese and Russian to be more motivated to go such a route - to test a Superjet or C919 or MS21.


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