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Does DL Screw Their F/A's Like This Often?  
User currently offlineairtran737 From United States of America, joined Apr 2004, 3690 posts, RR: 12
Posted (2 years 8 months 3 weeks 2 days 1 hour ago) and read 14857 times:
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Today has been a travel day from hell. I am sitting in the GRR airport and have been here for 12 hours trying to get to ATL. My flight from GRR to ATL (DL2113) went AOG as soon as it landed with a hydraulic leak. The flight attendants were doing a change on this flight. Our departure time was originally scheduled for 12:15 pm. When the plane arrived the crew informed the gate that the plane was tech. DL elected to have their own mechanics drive from DTW to GRR with parts to fix the plane. We were told that the plane would leave at 1900L. DL attempted to re-book me on another carrier, but everyone was full, so I elected to fly GRR-DCA-ATL. This routing went to hell when we went on a ground stop as soon as we got to the runway (the f/a actually told me about it as soon as we closed the door which pissed me off because I have better things to do than sit on a CRJ for two hours waiting for a hold to lift. If you know you have a minimum of an hour and a half then don't board the plane). Needless to say when we had to return to the gate for fuel, I got off. So here sit the same DL f/a's 11 hours later. DL scheduling wouldn't let them go to the hotel, and they will eventually operate the flight from GRR to ATL tonight when it arrives from ATL. Now I tend to have minimum sympathy for f/a's, but making them sit in the airport the whole time is ridiculous. This is why a union would be helpful to them.


Nice Trip Report!!! Great Pics, thanks for posting!!!! B747Forever
28 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineooer From United States of America, joined Oct 2005, 1440 posts, RR: 2
Reply 1, posted (2 years 8 months 3 weeks 2 days 1 hour ago) and read 14786 times:

This is correct. I actually know one of the f/a's and was communicating with her almost all day. They had been arguing with scheduling all day because ATL was saying that their duty day hadn't started yet when it actually started 1 hour prior to the original departure time.

Welcome to the family I guess...


User currently offlineMarkATL From United States of America, joined Jul 2004, 539 posts, RR: 8
Reply 2, posted (2 years 8 months 3 weeks 2 days ago) and read 14666 times:

Don't mean to start an argument, but if you were on a CRJ wouldn't the people "screwing" the F/As be the DCI carrier operating the flight and not DL?


"...left my home in Georgia, 'n headed for the "Frisco" Bay...
User currently offlineDLX737200 From United States of America, joined May 2001, 1891 posts, RR: 20
Reply 3, posted (2 years 8 months 3 weeks 2 days ago) and read 14650 times:

Quoting airtran737 (Thread starter):
If you know you have a minimum of an hour and a half then don't board the plane

Sometimes ground holds get lifted and it helps if you're at the end of a runway ready to go! Sounds like this wasn't the case for you but sometimes...



The public: They always know better, even though they often know nothing
User currently offlineSWALUVFA From United States of America, joined May 2002, 277 posts, RR: 6
Reply 4, posted (2 years 8 months 3 weeks 2 days ago) and read 14582 times:

Quoting airtran737 (Thread starter):

Oh cry me a river airtran737......

Most FA's have can be scheduled to a 13 to 14 hour duty day. It can be extended to 16 hours. Hotel rooms are usually available on a sit time of 4 hours or more (depending on the airline). But during a "creeping delay" when you don't know when you will leave, scheduling usually keeps you at the airport in case of a last minute A/C swap.

And in your response to having minimum sympathy towards FAs........believe me, we FAs have minimum sympathy towards your self important, entitled self. Gone are the days where your "I shouldn't have to put up with this because its me" attitude will get you anywhere. Its 2011 civil aviation, get in line like the rest of them, and get a grip on reality. SH** happens.......

Safe Travels!!!!!  


User currently offlinebreaker1011 From United States of America, joined Nov 2007, 938 posts, RR: 2
Reply 5, posted (2 years 8 months 3 weeks 2 days ago) and read 14564 times:

Sorry about your bad time, I've been in the same boat here and there over the years.

Quoting MarkATL (Reply 2):
Don't mean to start an argument, but if you were on a CRJ wouldn't the people "screwing" the F/As be the DCI carrier operating the flight and not DL?

I think he's referring to the DL FA's originally working canceled 2113, the CRJ was a failed side-effort to get out of GRR. Now the last flight GRR ATL is delayed until almost 12M tonight, and the 2113 FA's I guess were going to work it home. Sounds like just a really ugly day for anyone at GRR.



Life's tough. It's even tougher if you're stupid. J. Wayne
User currently offlineooer From United States of America, joined Oct 2005, 1440 posts, RR: 2
Reply 6, posted (2 years 8 months 3 weeks 2 days ago) and read 14523 times:

Ok just got the scoop from my friend. They're still at the airport. Delta has them working a flight leaving at 1:30 am and getting to ATL at 3:15 am or so...that will put them at over 16 and a 1/2 hours on duty for the day. Welcome aboard...

User currently offlinevulindlela744 From United States of America, joined Jan 2000, 518 posts, RR: 0
Reply 7, posted (2 years 8 months 3 weeks 2 days ago) and read 14459 times:

If they had a contract this wouldn't happen

User currently offlineDLX737200 From United States of America, joined May 2001, 1891 posts, RR: 20
Reply 8, posted (2 years 8 months 3 weeks 2 days ago) and read 14459 times:

Quoting SWALUVFA (Reply 4):

Welcome to my respected user list! Love your reply!



The public: They always know better, even though they often know nothing
User currently offlinebreaker1011 From United States of America, joined Nov 2007, 938 posts, RR: 2
Reply 9, posted (2 years 8 months 3 weeks 2 days ago) and read 14374 times:

Ok, so this is now a pro-AFA plug from a someone at an AFA carrier that self-professes not to care much about FA's. If that's the case, can we just all say ishkabibble, have a diet coke, and move to another thread?


Life's tough. It's even tougher if you're stupid. J. Wayne
User currently offlineooer From United States of America, joined Oct 2005, 1440 posts, RR: 2
Reply 10, posted (2 years 8 months 3 weeks 2 days ago) and read 14354 times:

Quoting SWALUVFA (Reply 4):
Most FA's have can be scheduled to a 13 to 14 hour duty day. It can be extended to 16 hours.

Most union f/a's cannot be scheduled to 14 hours. Most are somewhere between 12-13 and can walk at 14-15. Non-union Delta of course is 14 scheduled and 16 max. These poor f/a's are now at over 16 and a half hours on duty...let's see what happens to them.

They should call their union rep and get to a hotel. Oh wait...Delta f/a's voted down unionization by a margin of 165 swing votes. Too bad.


User currently offlineooer From United States of America, joined Oct 2005, 1440 posts, RR: 2
Reply 11, posted (2 years 8 months 3 weeks 2 days ago) and read 14275 times:

They just got released...they're headed back to the hotel for the night. Praise the lord...

User currently offlineIPFreely From United States of America, joined Dec 2006, 229 posts, RR: 0
Reply 12, posted (2 years 8 months 3 weeks 2 days ago) and read 14230 times:

Quoting SWALUVFA (Reply 4):
Oh cry me a river airtran737......

.... Gone are the days where your "I shouldn't have to put up with this because its me" attitude will get you anywhere. Its 2011 civil aviation, get in line like the rest of them, and get a grip on reality. SH** happens.......

Awesome reply. Airtrian737 is whining about sitting in Grand Rapids for 12 hours waiting for a flight to Atlanta? It's only a 12 1/2 hour drive. If he had rented a car and started driving instead of sitting and whining for 12 hours he would have been in Atlanta long before his flight ever left Grand Rapids.


User currently offlineairtechy From United States of America, joined Dec 2006, 463 posts, RR: 0
Reply 13, posted (2 years 8 months 3 weeks 2 days ago) and read 14194 times:

So let me guess....at 16 hours you would walk off the airplane and leave the passengers stranded? The problem with "rules" is they don't take into account that once in a while they need to be violated for the sake off all parties concerned. The fact that on rare occasions it might help out both the customers and the company is in my mind just a plus. And please spare me the "unsafe" argument.

User currently offlineStuckInCA From United States of America, joined Oct 2005, 1922 posts, RR: 0
Reply 14, posted (2 years 8 months 3 weeks 2 days ago) and read 14151 times:

I can't begin to count how many 16 hour days I've worked. Is it really that big a deal? I mean, I'd prefer the FA's aren't exhausted, so this would preferably not be a weekly occurence, but otherwise, roll with the punches...

User currently offlineDeltaMD90 From United States of America, joined Apr 2008, 7276 posts, RR: 52
Reply 15, posted (2 years 8 months 3 weeks 2 days ago) and read 14113 times:

And I know a DL F/A who has happy with her day today and is anti-union and very happy with DL....

Bad stuff happens with every airline every day, and good stuff happen with every airline everyday. I look at the last DL F/A union vote and conclude big bad DL isn't that bad after all...



Ironically I have never flown a Delta MD-90 :)
User currently offlineooer From United States of America, joined Oct 2005, 1440 posts, RR: 2
Reply 16, posted (2 years 8 months 3 weeks 2 days ago) and read 14065 times:

Quoting airtechy (Reply 13):
So let me guess....at 16 hours you would walk off the airplane and leave the passengers stranded?

Absolutely. Not even burger king workers are expected to work for 16 hours. But you expect flight crews to do it?


User currently offlineooer From United States of America, joined Oct 2005, 1440 posts, RR: 2
Reply 17, posted (2 years 8 months 3 weeks 2 days ago) and read 14041 times:

Quoting DeltaMD90 (Reply 15):
And I know a DL F/A who has happy with her day today and is anti-union and very happy with DL....

Of course she is. She's making wages below the industry average, and the executives are making the MOST in the industry. What is there to not be happy about?


User currently offlineooer From United States of America, joined Oct 2005, 1440 posts, RR: 2
Reply 18, posted (2 years 8 months 3 weeks 2 days ago) and read 14043 times:

Quoting DeltaMD90 (Reply 15):
I look at the last DL F/A union vote and conclude big bad DL isn't that bad after all...

50.8% of Delta flight attendants voting against unionization tells you all that?


User currently offlineairtran737 From United States of America, joined Apr 2004, 3690 posts, RR: 12
Reply 19, posted (2 years 8 months 3 weeks 2 days ago) and read 14016 times:
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Quoting SWALUVFA (Reply 4):
Oh cry me a river airtran737......

Don't try to test me. Strap your ass to a MD-11F for 40 hours straight on a trip around the world and we can chat about getting screwed. I tend to have little because working for an ACMI carrier will teach you how to max out duty days. 17 hours is more than normal 20:55 happens a lot.

My whole point was that DL knew the moment that their flight canceled and they decided to drive mechanics in from Detroit, that they should have sent the f/a's to the hotel. They just now left for the hotel. That is way too long to sit around an airport. They were basically trying to make them start their trip while fatigued.

Quoting airtechy (Reply 13):
So let me guess....at 16 hours you would walk off the airplane and leave the passengers stranded?

Absolutely. It is an unfortunate thing to do, but if you bend the rules once, then you can bend them twice, then three times.

Quoting IPFreely (Reply 12):
Awesome reply. Airtrian737 is whining about sitting in Grand Rapids for 12 hours waiting for a flight to Atlanta? It's only a 12 1/2 hour drive. If he had rented a car and started driving instead of sitting and whining for 12 hours he would have been in Atlanta long before his flight ever left Grand Rapids.

I'm not whining, four hours after my flight canceled I was on another flight. I can deal with that, but things went south from there. Delta has paid me $450 bucks today and fed me twice. And it is longer than 12 hours to drive from GRR to ATL, plus why should I pay for a rental car and gas? Last time I checked it wasn't my fault that a DC-9 decided to piss its hydraulic fluid all over the ramp.

Quoting DLX737200 (Reply 3):
Sometimes ground holds get lifted and it helps if you're at the end of a runway ready to go! Sounds like this wasn't the case for you but sometimes...

I agree. I used to be a gate agent, and there are times when you board it up and send it out. The f/a saw my crew tag and felt it necessary to inform me as the door closed that we were screwed and I would miss my connection.

Quoting breaker1011 (Reply 9):
Ok, so this is now a pro-AFA plug from a someone at an AFA carrier that self-professes not to care much about FA's. If that's the case, can we just all say ishkabibble, have a diet coke, and move to another thread?

The f/a's at my carrier are IBT not AFA, but this wouldn't happen in the NW days, that's for sure.

Quoting SWALUVFA (Reply 4):
And in your response to having minimum sympathy towards FAs........believe me, we FAs have minimum sympathy towards your self important, entitled self. Gone are the days where your "I shouldn't have to put up with this because its me" attitude will get you anywhere. Its 2011 civil aviation, get in line like the rest of them, and get a grip on reality. SH** happens.......

And another reminder why I like cargo, thanks for that. I have no sense of entitlement. I know exactly who I am, and that is just another number without a face to the corporate office. I don't expect anything other than my paycheck in full for doing my job. I have sympathy for any employee who is getting screwed over by their company, and these three were getting the shaft.



Nice Trip Report!!! Great Pics, thanks for posting!!!! B747Forever
User currently offlineairtechy From United States of America, joined Dec 2006, 463 posts, RR: 0
Reply 20, posted (2 years 8 months 3 weeks 2 days ago) and read 13965 times:

ooer....with all due respect, your attitude is precisely why I fly only Delta. It goes back many years to an incident where a union carrier stranded me because of a "work rule". I now only fly Delta because the employees work for the airline and not a union.

User currently offlineooer From United States of America, joined Oct 2005, 1440 posts, RR: 2
Reply 21, posted (2 years 8 months 3 weeks 2 days ago) and read 13932 times:

Quoting airtran737 (Reply 19):
I don't expect anything other than my paycheck in full for doing my job. I have sympathy for any employee who is getting screwed over by their company, and these three were getting the shaft.

Hey look...at least someone still gives a $hit about the workers. All the other posters in this thread sold the f/a's down the river a Loooooooooooooong time ago. Welcome to America!


User currently offlineEWRCabincrew From United States of America, joined May 2006, 5523 posts, RR: 56
Reply 22, posted (2 years 8 months 3 weeks 1 day 23 hours ago) and read 13852 times:

This isn't a thread about union v. non union, but how DL scheduling is perceived to treat crew. For the record, it is not unique to DL.

Two words: shit happens.

Yes, union or not, f/a have work rules/contractual rules. Sometimes, these rules are broken to meet company operations. It happens rarely, but it does happen. If I had a dime my duty day was extended because the company saw fit for its operational needs, I'd be rich. It happens. Its why we are "flexible". Does it make it right? No. Does it happen? Yes, and somewhere right now it's happening again. As it will in the future.

It's part of what we like to do. Ok, maybe not that part, but still.

Bottom line, it happens and makes for a long ass day.

My two cents.



You can't cure stupid
User currently offlinerunner13 From United States of America, joined Jun 2010, 237 posts, RR: 0
Reply 23, posted (2 years 8 months 3 weeks 1 day 23 hours ago) and read 13852 times:

It is what it is, this is the airline industry of today. I have worked numerous days of over 20 hours as a ramp/gate agent, sometimes several days in a row, while sleeping on a cot in the sups office because going home wasn't worth it after closing when our last flight came in at 2am, and opening at 4am that same day. If it was such a big deal, why didn't you rent a car and drive to DTW, and get a flight to ATL. I know there are numerous flights. I think you should spend more time worrying about yourself, and not others. Flight attendants know how it is these days and choose to do their jobs, espicially with the DCI carrier.

User currently offlineGunsontheroof From United States of America, joined Jan 2006, 3493 posts, RR: 10
Reply 24, posted (2 years 8 months 3 weeks 1 day 23 hours ago) and read 13852 times:

Quoting IPFreely (Reply 12):
Awesome reply. Airtrian737 is whining about sitting in Grand Rapids for 12 hours waiting for a flight to Atlanta? It's only a 12 1/2 hour drive. If he had rented a car and started driving instead of sitting and whining for 12 hours he would have been in Atlanta long before his flight ever left Grand Rapids.

How many folks here have ever shrugged off a delay, hopped in their car and driven (only) 12 hours to get where they were trying to go? Forgive me for being presumptuous, but I doubt that anyone here (let alone anyone in the traveling public at large) looks at their flight itinerary, notes the departure/arrival times and proceeds to make driving plans on the off chance something goes wrong with the flight...

I get it--sh*t happens and sometimes you have to roll with the punches, but suggesting that a fare-paying passenger dealing with a delay should drive from Grand Rapids to Atlanta is pretty absurd. If most people were capable of driving 12.5 hours on a whim, commercial aviation would all but cease to exist in much of the world.

Also, I noticed that the OP used the "U" word. Have a nice flame-war.



Next Flight: 9/17 BFI-BFI
25 Alasizon : While I feel for the FA's that were involved, this is their job and in this industry, things don't always go according to plan. I have seen worse and
26 airtechy : I just see the whole thing as a bunch of employees trying to work an irregular operation to the best of their ability and to least inconvenience their
27 silentbob : Please tell me they get paid for cancellations?
28 acidradio : This thread had become a fight. It didn't start that way but, well, you add the words "Delta", "F/A" and "union" into one paragraph and things become
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