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Emirates Announces DXB-SEA, DXB-DFW  
User currently offlinegoldenstate From United States of America, joined Feb 2010, 573 posts, RR: 4
Posted (2 years 11 months 3 weeks 3 days 10 hours ago) and read 35230 times:

Emirates, the largest international airline, said it will add flights to Seattle and Dallas, taking the number of U.S. destinations served to six as it seeks to channel Asian and Middle Eastern traffic via its Dubai hub.

Emirates will begin daily services to Dallas starting Feb. 2 and to Seattle from March 1 using Boeing Co. 777 widebody planes, President Tim Clark said in an interview. It already operates to New York, Houston, Los Angeles and San Francisco.


http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2011-0...tle-dallas-flights.html?cmpid=yhoo

I didn't expect these two cities to be their next US destinations. Interesting.

[Edited 2011-09-28 04:02:19]

210 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlinecommavia From United States of America, joined Apr 2005, 11604 posts, RR: 61
Reply 1, posted (2 years 11 months 3 weeks 3 days 10 hours ago) and read 35253 times:

Now that is cool!

Speaking about DFW, it was only a matter of time until Emirates or Etihad added a flight to DFW - the market is demographically large and growing, economically strong (relatively speaking), and has a substantial market especially to India and South Asia. This may be the straw that breaks the camel's back for KLM or Lufthansa, though - both airlines have struggled since AA/BA got their ATI/JV and bolstered DFW-LHR, and I'm not sure if the market will grow sufficiently large sufficiently quickly to support not only 8-9 daily flights to Europe, but also now a nonstop to the Mid East.

SEA is also logical - I understand the tech market back and forth with India is huge, and this will definitely provide tons of new connections.

Awesome!

[Edited 2011-09-28 04:17:06]

User currently offlineGunsontheroof From United States of America, joined Jan 2006, 3505 posts, RR: 9
Reply 2, posted (2 years 11 months 3 weeks 3 days 10 hours ago) and read 35211 times:

Can't say I saw this one coming! DFW was on the short list of potential new US destinations for EK, but I figured SEA would be four or five years down the road...they should do well here with outstanding first/business product and connectivity to India. Really nice surprise to hear this!

So, when do we hear the news about the AS-EK codeshare?  Smile

*Edited for spelling

[Edited 2011-09-28 04:11:17]

[Edited 2011-09-28 04:16:40]


Next Flight: 9/17 BFI-BFI
User currently offlineCXfirst From Norway, joined Jan 2007, 3067 posts, RR: 1
Reply 3, posted (2 years 11 months 3 weeks 3 days 10 hours ago) and read 35211 times:

Not surprised about DFW, but I am surprised about SEA. Well, at least wasn't expecting SEA so soon.

Where next for EK, don't think they're done yet for this year (possibly no more USA, but other destinations).

-CXfirst



From Norway, live in Australia
User currently offlineSQno1 From United Kingdom, joined Sep 2004, 687 posts, RR: 1
Reply 4, posted (2 years 11 months 3 weeks 3 days 10 hours ago) and read 34918 times:

Schedule:

Dallas (From 2nd February 2012 until 10th March 2012)

DXB-DFW 02:45-09:05 16hrs 20mins D 77L
DFW-DXB 11:50-12:20 + 1 14hrs 30mins D 77L

Dallas (From 11th March 2012)

DXB-DFW 02:45-10:05 16hrs 20mins D 77L
DFW-DXB 12:50-12:20 + 1 14hrs 30mins D 77L

Seattle (From 1st March 2012 until 10th March 2012)

DXB-SEA 09:50-13:10 15hrs 20mins D 77W
SEA-DXB 17:10-19:40 + 1 14hrs 30mins D 77W

Seattle (From 11th March 2012)

DXB-SEA 09:50-13:50 15hrs D 77W
SEA-DXB 17:25-18:55 + 1 14hrs 30mins D 77W


User currently onlinejfk777 From United States of America, joined Aug 2006, 8370 posts, RR: 7
Reply 5, posted (2 years 11 months 3 weeks 3 days 10 hours ago) and read 34761 times:
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Where is Miami in Emirates plans ? DFW surprises since EK flies to Houston. Seattle could be " the next best thing" to serving Vancouver since Canada has been so anti-Emirates.

User currently offlineRWA380 From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 3245 posts, RR: 5
Reply 6, posted (2 years 11 months 3 weeks 3 days 10 hours ago) and read 34752 times:

Welcome to SEA EK! I do hope they do some kind of EK/AS code shared flights especially PDX, as there is Intel, Nike and Adidas here. Among several other specialty hi-tec firms. I think a codeshare with AS, brings the entire NW to EK's door. Or maybe they could just run a quick 30 min tag run down to PDX, though it would be the first Intl carrier to fly this tag. I suspect there would not be enough year round traffic to make it worth all the extra fuel and crew rotations. Therefore as AS are liberal with their codesharing, I'd expect EK to codeshare partner with AS.

Who knows, maybe EK has already started the process, which is why the SEA announcement came as a surprise to us and before other destinations that seemed more probable, like MIA or ORD.

[Edited 2011-09-28 04:53:44]


AA-AC-AQ-AS-BN-BD-CO-CS-DL-EA-EZ-HA-HP-KL-KN-MP-MW-NK-NW-OO-OZ-PA-PS-QX-RC-RH-RW-SA-TG-TW-UA-US-VS-WA-WC-WN
User currently onlineMAH4546 From Sweden, joined Jan 2001, 32777 posts, RR: 72
Reply 7, posted (2 years 11 months 3 weeks 3 days 10 hours ago) and read 34678 times:

I am not surprised whatsoever, but I am surprised they come before Chicago, Miami and/or Washington.

But Seattle and Dallas aren't it. One more U.S. city will be announced shortly:

Quote:
The carrier plans to start flights to Dallas and Seattle from its Dubai base early next year, boosting the number of destinations in what has been its fastest-growing market to six from four, with another yet-to-be-identified destination to be announced shortly.
http://www.marketwatch.com/story/emi...es-2011-09-28?reflink=MW_news_stmp



[Edited 2011-09-28 05:03:29]


a.
User currently offlinegdg9 From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 641 posts, RR: 0
Reply 8, posted (2 years 11 months 3 weeks 3 days 9 hours ago) and read 34317 times:

Flight EK221 serves DXB-DFW, 16h 20m
Flight EK222 serves DFW-DXB, 14h 30m


User currently offlineseabosdca From United States of America, joined Sep 2007, 5459 posts, RR: 6
Reply 9, posted (2 years 11 months 3 weeks 3 days 9 hours ago) and read 34211 times:

Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 7):
But Seattle and Dallas aren't it. One more U.S. city will be announced shortly

I bet this is Miami. Washington (especially) and Chicago have more competition for EK's core business.


User currently offlineRWA380 From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 3245 posts, RR: 5
Reply 10, posted (2 years 11 months 3 weeks 3 days 9 hours ago) and read 34155 times:

Anyone figure the third, to be announced city will be one of the more expected cities? I say ORD. Or as I suggested in my previous reply, they will add a PDX tag on the SEA flight. Big grin

[Edited 2011-09-28 05:32:54]


AA-AC-AQ-AS-BN-BD-CO-CS-DL-EA-EZ-HA-HP-KL-KN-MP-MW-NK-NW-OO-OZ-PA-PS-QX-RC-RH-RW-SA-TG-TW-UA-US-VS-WA-WC-WN
User currently onlineMAH4546 From Sweden, joined Jan 2001, 32777 posts, RR: 72
Reply 11, posted (2 years 11 months 3 weeks 3 days 9 hours ago) and read 34100 times:

Quoting seabosdca (Reply 9):
Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 7):
But Seattle and Dallas aren't it. One more U.S. city will be announced shortly

I bet this is Miami. Washington (especially) and Chicago have more competition for EK's core business.

Maybe, but I can't see Miami coming before Chicago. Then again, I would never have seen Seattle and Dallas before Chicago, either.

I know EK officials and MIA officials have met very recently and talks were apparently going very well. An MIA delegation was in Dubai at EK HQ just a few months ago, in May, IIRC.



a.
User currently offlinedfwdfw From United States of America, joined Aug 2011, 35 posts, RR: 0
Reply 12, posted (2 years 11 months 3 weeks 3 days 9 hours ago) and read 33924 times:

Wow I never thought this day would come. EK just suprised us all.

User currently offlinegdg9 From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 641 posts, RR: 0
Reply 13, posted (2 years 11 months 3 weeks 3 days 9 hours ago) and read 33731 times:

No doubt Emirates got rebates, free landing fees for a year or two from DFW to get things started... more action in Terminal D!

I wonder how much traffic goes from DFW-IAH-DXB currently? Probably just a handful of folks a day? I wonder how EK will hurt LH and KL (their planned spring return) on Indian connections...


User currently offlineAAExecPlat From United States of America, joined Sep 2009, 635 posts, RR: 4
Reply 14, posted (2 years 11 months 3 weeks 3 days 9 hours ago) and read 33715 times:

And another great route opportunity gone for AA...DFW-DXB that is...

User currently offlineDFWHeavy From United States of America, joined Jul 2011, 560 posts, RR: 0
Reply 15, posted (2 years 11 months 3 weeks 3 days 8 hours ago) and read 33648 times:

I love EK and I'm so glad they are expanding to DFW. I know they will be successful here and wouldn't be surprised if this becomes an A380 a few years from now.

I am however, surprised that they are using the 77L instead of the 77W. I knew they had some slack in their 77L operations, but committing planes for a daily flight over that distant is quite a bit. After they add this, does anyone know how many more long haul routes EK could launch with its existing 77Ls?



Christopher W Slovacek
User currently offlineCubsrule From United States of America, joined May 2004, 22991 posts, RR: 20
Reply 16, posted (2 years 11 months 3 weeks 3 days 8 hours ago) and read 33616 times:

Quoting AAExecPlat (Reply 14):
And another great route opportunity gone for AA...DFW-DXB that is...

How? The traffic flows that AA and EK would/will serve on DFW-DXB are totally different. AA's massive hub is at DFW and EK's is at DXB.



I can't decide whether I miss the tulip or the bowling shoe more
User currently offlinepeanuts From Netherlands, joined Dec 2009, 1438 posts, RR: 4
Reply 17, posted (2 years 11 months 3 weeks 3 days 8 hours ago) and read 33452 times:

At some point, EK will basically force its competition to react. EK can afford to expand during an economic downturn. Other carriers may be too late to the party if they are waiting for the economy to rebound before new flying is done.

The trend will show us that KL's huge transfer traffic at AMS is under major assault. Same for LH and BA. But we know KL's AMS transfer traffic is its bread and butter.

DL will have to restart non-stop US-India flights to remain viable against EK. (which ironically would also hurt its partner KL @ AMS).
East-Africa should also be on DL's to-do list. (e.g. NBO if issues get resolved).

EK is making sweat bullets in many airliner board rooms.

[Edited 2011-09-28 06:25:00]


Question Conventional Wisdom. While not all commonly held beliefs are wrong…all should be questioned.
User currently offlinesimairlinenet From United States of America, joined Oct 2005, 915 posts, RR: 2
Reply 18, posted (2 years 11 months 3 weeks 3 days 8 hours ago) and read 33433 times:

Quoting commavia (Reply 1):
SEA is also logical - I understand the tech market back and forth with India is huge, and this will definitely provide tons of new connections.
Quoting Gunsontheroof (Reply 2):
I figured SEA would be four or five years down the road...they should do well here with outstanding first/business product and connectivity to India.

How much of the SEA-India market is not Microsoft, who flies on Delta and got their second SEA-AMS flight the last few years?


User currently offlinepeanuts From Netherlands, joined Dec 2009, 1438 posts, RR: 4
Reply 19, posted (2 years 11 months 3 weeks 3 days 8 hours ago) and read 33240 times:

The ultimate *major city* battle between EK and the other major carriers of the world: 1 or 2 connections?
EK is seeking to make earth mostly a "one connection" travel endeavor while the competition, at this pace, is increasingly looking at offering the world on "two connections".



Question Conventional Wisdom. While not all commonly held beliefs are wrong…all should be questioned.
User currently offlineblink182 From Azerbaijan, joined Oct 1999, 5482 posts, RR: 15
Reply 20, posted (2 years 11 months 3 weeks 3 days 8 hours ago) and read 33066 times:

And so the territorial land grab continues. What's the third US city to be launched for 2012?
I think EK may have caught EY sleeping on DFW and went for it. I was very convinced that EY would fly to DFW before EK, and now I wonder whether EY may ever enter the market. I know that while load factors out of DFW should work, these forums have often discussed that premium yields have been questionable at DFW in the past. I wonder what changed?

Quoting DFWHeavy (Reply 15):
I am however, surprised that they are using the 77L instead of the 77W.

I think it may be a range issue. I know that IAH, despite its success, only sees 77L 2x daily, and the LAX 77W takes weight penalties.

As for SEA, I'm not as familiar with the market beyond technology and tourism(which are both very strong), but given a catchment area that may YVR, this route should probably be okay.

Anybody want to take bets on where EY and QR go now? I wonder if one of them will claim ATL, MIA, BOS, or what about DEN?



Give me a break, I created this username when I was a kid...
User currently offlineGunsontheroof From United States of America, joined Jan 2006, 3505 posts, RR: 9
Reply 21, posted (2 years 11 months 3 weeks 3 days 8 hours ago) and read 33064 times:

Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 7):
I am not surprised whatsoever, but I am surprised they come before Chicago, Miami and/or Washington.

Hadn't even thought about that...the fact that these routes were announced before ORD (in particular, but all seem like more obvious destinations) is really surprising.

Quoting simairlinenet (Reply 18):
How much of the SEA-India market is not Microsoft, who flies on Delta and got their second SEA-AMS flight the last few years?

For one thing, SEA-AMS is only 2x daily in the summer and for another, SEA-AMS-BLR never materialized as announced some years ago (it was to be a NW route before the merger). Microsoft is hardly the only employer in the Puget Sound region that attracts Indian talent/travel--granted, it's heavily high-tech, but it's not just Microsoft.



Next Flight: 9/17 BFI-BFI
User currently offlineusdcaguy From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 971 posts, RR: 2
Reply 22, posted (2 years 11 months 3 weeks 3 days 8 hours ago) and read 32992 times:

Quoting peanuts (Reply 19):
The ultimate *major city* battle between EK and the other major carriers of the world: 1 or 2 connections?
EK is seeking to make earth mostly a "one connection" travel endeavor while the competition, at this pace, is increasingly looking at offering the world on "two connections".

Can you explain? KL from SEA can offer one-stop connections over AMS to most places business travelers fly to. No need to transfer over both AMS and CDG. Most international carriers fly nonstop from most cities served by EK from the US to Europe and offer transfers to the same cities. In this case, the issue at hand is excess capacity. There's no way there is enough demand from SEA to places in the Middle East and India to fill a daily 777 and drive significant revenue. The effect on revenue for UA/LH/DL/KL will clearly be negative as they compete to fill the plethora of seats available. Your earlier reply on the AMS hub was spot on; any ideas on how KL/AF might react?


User currently offlineDFWHeavy From United States of America, joined Jul 2011, 560 posts, RR: 0
Reply 23, posted (2 years 11 months 3 weeks 3 days 8 hours ago) and read 32963 times:

I understand the 77W would take a bit of a hit in penalty due to the range, but I figured it's shorter than LAX and I didn't know they still had that much slack in their 77L fleet. Since DFW is shorter than LAX, would it not make since to make the 2nd flight at LAX the 77L and move the 77W to DFW?

Either way, the 77W is going to take a hit, but I would guess it would take less of a hit on the DFW leg since it is shorter...am I wrong?



Christopher W Slovacek
User currently offlinecommavia From United States of America, joined Apr 2005, 11604 posts, RR: 61
Reply 24, posted (2 years 11 months 3 weeks 3 days 8 hours ago) and read 32967 times:

Quoting AAExecPlat (Reply 14):
And another great route opportunity gone for AA...DFW-DXB that is...

Hardly. DFW-DXB was never an opportunity for AA - that is a market AA would never have flown. The way DFW was going to get a nonstop flight to the Mid East was always going to be either an Emirates or Etihad flight to either DXB or AUH, respectively.

Quoting blink182 (Reply 20):
I think EK may have caught EY sleeping on DFW and went for it. I was very convinced that EY would fly to DFW before EK, and now I wonder whether EY may ever enter the market.

I, too, must say I'm surprised it was Emirates instead of Etihad. Given Etihad's codeshare with AA, I thought they were more likely to launch DFW.

Now with Emirates in the market, I would be surprised if Etihad entered - I firmly believe the market can support one nonstop route to the Mid East, but not two.


25 Gunsontheroof : You really think that EK decided to serve SEA before ORD, MIA and IAD without analyzing the prospective profitability of the route? I'm as surprised
26 Drerx7 : Only sees? 2xdaily IAH-DXB would deserve a little better verbage than 'only'. EK has swapped the 77W for the 77L frequently on the route, albeit at a
27 blink182 : You may very well be right; I'm no expert on range numbers, so I could never go into specifics. My reasoning is that LAX is already proven, hence the
28 Cubsrule : I think you missed his point. As far as aircraft size, IAH can support larger aircraft, but as far as range, it really needs to be the 77L if the air
29 seabosdca : That fits EK's typical practice. With so much expansion to far-flung US destinations, they're going to need to upgrade the MTOWs of more of their 77W
30 JAAlbert : SEA!? I can't wait for EK to begin A380 service to SAN. If SEA's on the list, surely SAN can't be far behind!
31 yellowtail : EK may be doing some pe-emptive strikes. If MIA is announced I would say definitely pre-emptive against AA C A R G O
32 AA777223 : I think they need the seats on LAX. That's the whole reason they didn't go 77L on both LAX flights all along. On DFW, they can do with fewer seats, b
33 blueflyer : I think KL will go before LH if for no other reason than the O/D market is larger in FRA than AMS. Once KL leaves the market, LH should be fine still
34 ordjoe : Start sending an A380 to chicago
35 Gunsontheroof : I don't think EK needs to worry about AA...they're much, much more likely to launch this route first and even if they are the second carrier to arriv
36 FlyingHollander : I was just looking on the EK website for DXB-SEA roundtrip but it only shows me the westbound journey. Eastbound it sends me through SFO or LAX. Anyon
37 blueflyer : Non-stop from Microsoft's home office to Microsoft's largest office outside the US. That alone should be worth a few premium seats at the very front
38 gdg9 : Unproven but they are jumping in firmly with daily service right off the bat!
39 Drerx7 : Emirates would not do it any other way. I am surprised they started DFW with having double daily at IAH, but I think the DFW flight will last.
40 wedgetail737 : Could Air Canada or AS increase the size of the aircraft between YVR and SEA to accommodate EK's flight? The Vancouver BC area has a high Indian and M
41 Gunsontheroof : Right there with ya...read my earlier posts! And Boeing, for that matter. The spares distribution center is right across the highway from SEA. Do not
42 SunriseValley : Their timetable times are only 5 or 10-min difference which suggests the ESAD or airways distances are about the same. I would expect that their payl
43 seabosdca : A 77W or 77L loaded for a trip to DXB could never get off the SAN runway.
44 commavia : Agreed. BA is obviously not going anywhere, and in a three-way contest between Lufthansa, Emirates and KLM, I definitely think KLM will be the first
45 Post contains images BoeingGuy : That was actually my first thought too. And it would be a smart move on EK's part due to the large number of AS Mileage plan members and connecting o
46 hohd : I am not surprised at the DFW addition. I have seen significant number of passengers connecting to DFW from the EK's IAH flight. However I always thou
47 CargoLex : I'm somewhat surprised at the SEA announcement. I honestly did not think we'd see EK here anytime soon. However, I did wonder why a carrier like AI, 9
48 er757 : **Ding ding ding** we have a winner. One word: Boeing. Spares for EK aircraft alone will half fill the cargo hold. Glad to see this one publically an
49 jr : Wow, that is surely a surprise. Never expected DFW that quick. The timing is pretty interesting too. It is nicely set to come in and leave before most
50 gdg9 : It's good to see! I hope so! This is the only DFW-Mid East route of course.
51 Jacobin777 : With what plane would AA fly to DXB with? It would really be pushing AA's B77E. Now ORD-DXB is a route I've been harping about for > 1/2 decade. I
52 Post contains images Coronado990 : It would have to be SAN-MAN-DXB with the 77W and might be a smart move on EK's part. Or they can convince Miramar to bring in the A380 there. It can
53 BoeingGuy : Or if EK signs a partnership with AS, the can code share on the QX Q400s for the SEA-YVR flights.
54 Post contains images FlyASAGuy2005 : I predicted DFW not too long ago but was shot down by everyone..hmmm
55 yellowtail : With DFW announced...I be curious to see if Ek drops some frequencies at IAH....With 2 flights...LFs have been struggling (albeit yields + cargo are s
56 wedgetail737 : TG used to serve SEA back in the 1980's. I think TG used to fly A310's between Asia-SEA-YYZ. I'm surprised SEA doesn't have a carrier to HKG. I would
57 kaitak : There's a big Indian population in Vancouver and that was probably a big factor; the airline will be looking to attract a fair bit of traffic from YVR
58 LAXDESI : Dallas(MSA) has an Indian population of about 100,000, which is 10,000 more than Houston MSA. Emirates should be able to garner a significant share of
59 Post contains images lightsaber : I guessed wrong. Kudoes to EK! Am I the only one who thinks that YVR will not be a significant source of feed for this EK flight? I was just at YVR an
60 goldenstate : Agree completely. These are good markets and EK will do well, but I didn't expect them so soon. Of course, EK has an analytical process on this where
61 ck8msp : stupid question, but will the SEA flights go east or west?
62 SCL767 : Don't forget EK will soon add two new destinations in South America to its growing network. Starting in January, EK will launch DXB-GIG-EZE daily (B7
63 BoeingGuy : Not a stupid question. I assume they will go over the pole.
64 canyonblue17 : I'm waiting for DXB - PBI.....shouldn't be long now!
65 kaitak : Not a stupid question at all; I believe they actually go north first, over northern Canada, then over the pole, into Russia and down through Iran. I
66 gdg9 : KLM apparently has these loaded up for summer schedule... I would have to wonder though... I think EK will hurt LH's India feed at DFW too.
67 Malayil : This is fantastic news, now I'm hoping for EWR but that is a long shot. Hopefully they can convince the Indian government to allow them more access to
68 Post contains images AirIndia : YVR is a huge VFR market esp for North India. SEA has a sizable Indian diaspora in and around Now EK would hope for renewed negotiations with India o
69 EricR : Agreed. While Chicago is a large metro area with a lot of business traffic, there is a lot of competition. AA & AI have direct flights from ORD t
70 DFWHeavy : I understand EK has a few 77W that have a slightly higher MTOW. What is special about these planes? Is it just a paper change to increase thrust outpu
71 Post contains images lightsaber : Thank you for the numbers. SEA also has enough 'tech' to help fill the forward cabin. Then again, I expected SFO-DXB to be doing better in the premiu
72 longhauler : I agree. With many airlines already providing one stop service from YVR to India, I can't see the 3 hour drive plus Customs being all that attractive
73 kiwiandrew : I recall BKK-FUK-SEA-DFW with 747-200s. The A310's which TG inherited from the merger with Thai ( the domestic carrier) were, to the best of my knowl
74 IrishAyes : WOW!!! What a great year for DFW! First QF, now EK! Way to go, North Texas While I knew this was potentially on the horizon, I did not expect this to
75 Post contains links and images longhauler : Thai used A310-304s from SEA-YYZ-SEA to connect with their SEA-BKK flights. View Large View MediumPhoto © Trevor Ogle
76 Post contains links and images FoxBravo : They did use A310s for a time on SEA-YYZ--I believe they were based in North America: View Large View MediumPhoto © Trevor Ogle Unusual route indeed
77 FoxBravo : Ah, you beat me to it![Edited 2011-09-28 11:22:48]
78 HB-IWC : The new DFW flight will replace the second IAH flight, which is planned to stop operating when the DFW flight comes online. The DFW schedule EK221/22
79 Post contains images DFWHeavy : Houston is losing it's 2nd daily DXB flight I thought they were doing very well with both flights...is that not the case?
80 Post contains images seabosdca : Nothing to do with thrust -- just some paperwork. It's "paying the fee" that's the hard part. Not cheap .
81 BoeingGuy : A thrust bump also requires a software change in AIMS. They need to add the selections to the CDU Thrust Limit page.
82 Post contains images SunriseValley : With tongue firmly in cheek, how about EK flying the DFW-SYD sector for it's first around the world service to gazump QF who are still not able to do
83 yellowtail : No 1. EK was doing very very well...incl Cargo. When EK added a second flight...the market did not really grow enough, so it just diluted the loads.
84 Post contains links ukoverlander : I'm curious about the suggestion that EK can draw Asian traffic on flights to Seattle via Dubai? I suspect the focus here is really just connecting t
85 blink182 : Its interesting that this comment has been regularly brought up in this thread, because either I'm a total idiot(has been confirmed many a time), or
86 SunriseValley : At about 172 degrees of longitude apart their initial heading could be either direction depending on the forecast winds as is JFK-HKG.
87 RJAF : Congratulations to DFW and SEA! I believe this is the first Arab carrier ever to fly to these two destinations?
88 goldenstate : New York is not a suitable gateway? The fact that the flight was pulled 2-3 years ago when US-India was flooded with capacity is not necessarily an i
89 IrishAyes : NYC already has two airlines that serve nonstop to India: UA/CO (@EWR) and AI @ JFK. These two essentially pushed DL out of JFKBOM. In fact, IIRC, JF
90 bartond : Heck, BA's explosion at DFW has hurt both KL and LH's connecting traffic to the Middle East and India so EK entering the market should make both of t
91 Post contains links thomasphoto60 : Looks like IAH will be the sacrificial lamb here by losing it's morning flight, nice while it lasted. http://aviationblog.dallasnews.com/archives/dfw-
92 Ordcargo : We already have Emirates Cargo 744F flying it every thursday night, so hopefully soon we will get the passenger too here in ORD.
93 yellowtail : I note he says "borrow" so my bet the 2nd IAH will be back once they get some eqp. But I also bet QR is looking at this now thinking....jump on the 2
94 Kamloops : Sounds Like Emirates has found away around the Canadian Government to service the Vancouver Market (High Population of Asian's & South East Asian'
95 thomasphoto60 : Good catch, I noticed that too, but it did not register. Keeping my fingers crossed.
96 SEA : Very excited to see this new service to SEA. Also, I wouldn't be surprised to see some sort of Alaska/Emirates code share for SEA connections.
97 ikramerica : Which would only demonstrate that the Canadian government is correct and that EK is looking to poach customers for connecting to destinations already
98 Post contains images commavia : Several things from that interview I find particularly interesting: * They hope to "do a lot better perhaps than we would have done over the Houston
99 AA777223 : That is one heck of a polar route, if ever I saw one!
100 gdg9 : For my first visit to Emirates website, they seem have a terrible system to 'book' flights. I went to make a 'booking' just to see what the fares are.
101 gdg9 : That would be the first 77W to DFW from any carrier. Who knows, perhaps someday you'll see 380s from BA, QF and EK side by side in DFW!
102 seabosdca : My understanding is that all of EK's 77Ws (regardless of MTOW) already have the thrust bump -- it's just a matter of increasing the weight rating.
103 bjorn14 : Probably take a huge penalty at least in summer.
104 SunriseValley : My impression was that the issue between Canada and the UAE was a frequency from YYZ greater than what is already allowed under the present agreement
105 IrishAyes : Nope. The issue is that the current UAE-Canada bilateral agreement only allows seven weekly flights between the two countries on UAE carriers. EK and
106 MillwallSean : Dallas I could see coming but not Seattle. I need to have more drinks with EK people... I like the thoughts behind that though. Much better than going
107 BC77008 : Well you know, all of the residents of Houston (myself included) stayed up last night and voted, out of the generosity of our hearts, to give Dallas
108 gdg9 : We're glad to have it! IAH has been hogging a lot of the good metal for a while!
109 nomoreRJs : As a native of Chicago, I think that STL and MKE to DXB on EK are more likely than ORD.
110 crAAzy : You're kidding right? EK in Milwaukee? That will happen right after the AA 757 service to LHR ... LOL. Anyway, it's nice to see DFW getting another i
111 longhauler : Both EK and EY were offered access to both YVR and YYC, which they declined. With their bluff being called, clearly it is YYZ and YYZ only to which t
112 pnwtraveler : AC won't add volume to Seattle. With the cross Atlantic co-op agreement with LH, UA and AC it is far more advantageous to hub people through elsewher
113 travelin man : Most tech flies coach. (speaking as a "tech" employee). The technology industry has a mostly economy class policy for everyone but executives, with s
114 jcs17 : Great for DFW, and the nice part is that the flights are well-timed for connections -- something that sometimes lacks from North America to the Middle
115 crAAzy : It's going to be interesting to see what, if any, response AA/OW might have at DFW if the EK flight turns out to be a significant threat. Doubtful AA
116 flythere : Even SEA is ahead of likes of ORD, IAH, BOS and MIA!! That's a weird yet interesting move!
117 thomasphoto60 : Ahead in what? IAH has EK service since '06'
118 Post contains images airbazar : Yes but we pay full fare Y My company only lets us fly Y but they don't care how much we pay for it. Just last week 2 co-workers of mine flew BOS-DFW
119 IrishAyes : Yes, but again because the bilateral agreement is for only 3 flights for each UAE carrier, 7 total amongst both of them per week. Do you really think
120 5MillionMiler : Gotta hand it to to EK... they are such a force to be reckoned with. Totally beat EY on what should have been a great move to secure an EY-AA setup at
121 Post contains images PlanesNTrains : It will take quite an imagination, as I think they only have 70 A350's on order. -Dave
122 Post contains images Eightball : After I graduate from college at the end of next year, I'll fly on EK in J-class to Jeddah by upgrading my Y-class ticket with Skywards miles. Now tha
123 Post contains links anrec80 : Lol. Now we are going to have yet another fun EK-Canada thread. OK - what KL, BA and LH are doing on nearly daily basis in YYZ and YVR then (along wit
124 marco : Canada is insignficant in the grand scheme of things, and this includes to EK. This does not mean that EK will give up on landing rights to Canada but
125 anrec80 : Even though I am Canadian, it's hard to argue with this statement. Yes, population-wise Canada is a small 30+ million country. Unfortunately, Canada
126 kiwiandrew : Wow, I learned something new today. Thanks
127 HB-IWC : If EK wanted to, the airline could take the 77L of the DXB PER route where its range is not really needed. Overall, EK could make different use of it
128 5MillionMiler : Ahhh... indeed! LOL good point. I guess I was thinking Timmy buys every new toy and had assumed they would get 787-10s but think you are right that n
129 tdscanuck : That's like saying Saudi Arabia is insignificant in the grand scheme of things...you're talking about a country with about the same population and so
130 jfk777 : Since Emirates has been able to use the 77W to LAX and SFO the 777LR is being used to open new routes until the market can fill a 777-300ER. DFW may
131 MSN007 : If EK is successful along with the LH and the likes, I can see TK eying SEA as well in the near future.
132 Post contains images lightsaber : Yea... I don't get those visas either... Very interesting! Interesting. I know quite a few who ride upfront in J to/from India, Thailand, Malaysia, a
133 SunriseValley : These agreements are supposed to be reciprocal. What can UAE offer Canada in that respect? Perhaps a code share for a designated Canadian carrier on
134 goldenstate : Those are some pretty definitive statements on your part. I think your analysis is a bit simplistic. It was not a zero-sum competitive environment, a
135 CuriousFlyer : Yes I fully agreee that having YVR close by is a smart way to go around the Canadians' opposition to EK service to their country. Especially now that
136 RWA380 : The TG services to SEA at first went BKK-NRT-SEA-DFW on 742's, then changed to a BKK-TPE-SEA-YYZ routing on 743's then switched to a M11. At some sta
137 Post contains images Quokka : If Seattle was chosen to get up the nose of Harper, can we expect Buffalo to be next? Seriously, for the US market this is good news as travellers in
138 lightsaber : I didn't see *any* Westjet flights to SEA on their routemap. Why would anyone fly Yxx to YVR and then drive to SEA?!? Is Westjet planning a SEA expan
139 RWA380 : Also consider the EK flight from SEA will also be receiving traffic from PDX, with Intel, Nike & Adidas here, there is bound to be connecting traf
140 MAH4546 : But EK is not. There is no incentive to codeshare when interlining keeps more of the revenue with EK.
141 5MillionMiler : TG also ran 743s to DFW for a while -- I believe they were the only ones ever to serve DFW with the 743. I used to see them at the far gate at old 2-
142 BoeingGuy : I think it would be tremendously in EK's benefit to a least form a FF partnership with AS given the huge number of AS Mileage Plan members in the lov
143 Viscount724 : And all those serves were highly unprofitable. I doubt any TG services to North America have ever been profitable. Rude? In my experience AC's servic
144 Gunsontheroof : This route is about as polar as they come--I've noticed before when tracking deliveries flying PAE-DXB. Should be a cool routing for enthusiasts! We'
145 DTWLAX : Yeah... especially for secondary cities other than BOM and DEL. High hopes eh? How about BOS or ATL.... if EK enters ATL, then I guess it will bring
146 F9Animal : This is awesome news! I can't wait to see their planes at SEA. Their is no doubt in my mind that they will fill those birds out of here. But a 777? Ca
147 aa757first : SFO is home to most of the world's technology firms and also home to a huge number of ethnic Indians and 9W couldn't even make that route work. I dou
148 LipeGIG : Well done EK ! SEA is not a major hub but a strong industrial area with limited service to many regions of the globe. EK is just a player that take fu
149 RWA380 : One thing unmentioned here so far in regards to draw from YVR is the cargo. There are currently no aircraft flying YVR-SEA that could carry any tangib
150 B595 : Off topic, but I have the distinct recollection of seeing those TG 743's at DFW multiple times when I was there in '87-'89. I'm glad someone else has
151 Gunsontheroof : No. For that matter, the Port of Seattle said years ago that they wouldn't be making the necessary upgrades to do so (probably because of the extreme
152 RWA380 : No saying Westjet couldn't start a run YVR-SEA-YVR on a 737 to match up with EK's flight timing. It would also possibly help lower fares for local tr
153 hal9213 : We have to keep in mind, that contrary to other airlines, EK does not utilise their aircraft by their capabilities, but mostly by capacity. Not a sin
154 Post contains images lightsaber : But is there any real chance of that? Note: I'm asking. I've only heard AS/EK codeshare here on a.net as a rumor and thus I'm a wee bit skeptical. Li
155 IrishAyes : Delta has been servicing India for decades now. When they operated a hub at FRA, they flew to DEL and BOM, then for awhile from CDG to BOM. They have
156 Viscount724 : There's nothing referring to EK/WS codesharing in their recent announcement. They've just signed a standard interline agreement that permits a carrie
157 Post contains images jonathanxxxx : Great News For SEA! I think the flight can definitely work. With the tech industry, a possibility of a WS SEA-YVR to feed, and a plethora of connectio
158 bartond : Amen, brotha! Even their E90's on cross-country flights are great. I take one DEN-YYZ and/or DEN-YUL every once in a while and their service and infl
159 USXguy : An EK codeshare would require bilateral approval from the US DOT and Canadians to put their code on the QX/AS flights (or anyones) for that matter...
160 er757 : A family member works for Port of Seattle and that's pretty much word for word what I was told when I asked about making SEA A-380 compliant. But eve
161 FSDan : Well, it looks like EK's US route map is going to be skewed way to the west for a little while, with only JFK east of the Mississippi. Seems likely th
162 5MillionMiler : A would imagine that while AA/BA have nice accounts with Exxon, Emirates will quickly get a lot of business as they did in Houston. While AA is a loc
163 longhauler : The main advantage SEA has over YVR to say south Asia, are the huge amount of taxes and fees added onto all Canadian fares. So if one flew on LH (for
164 RWA380 : I still think EK needs a feed into SEA to keep a daily 777 profitable. At least from PDX & YVR. But if they ink some kind of deal with AS, then EK
165 JAAlbert : Uh, no . . . I said it in jest. (perhaps I should have used the appropriate smiley face) SAN is stuck with the 320s and 737s of the world - with the
166 airbazar : I don't know why people keep bringing up BOS. Boston and greater Boston area don't exactly have big ties with the Middle East and South Asia. IIRC th
167 RoseFlyer : Many are posting about how important marketing agreements are for EK to codeshare. However, EK gladly sells tickets via interline agreements with pret
168 er757 : Yeah - I am sure EK would set up a cargo receiving facility via a ground handling agent in YVR and offer the YVR/SEA leg via truck to catch the fligh
169 Viscount724 : What advantage are you referring to? Taxes and fees are very similar for travel originating in both the US and Canada and in fact are higher for trav
170 longhauler : Wow, that's amazing. I had always thought it was cheaper to fly from the United States than Canada.
171 Viscount724 : Just noticed that the US fees in my example should be $5 higher. Had 2 amounts on one line and forgot to add one of the more exotic US fees, the $5 U
172 SunriseValley : I believe you have missed the HST on the air fare. I just checked an EK fare out of YYZ and to the same destination out of JFK. The YYZ fare was $240
173 Viscount724 : HST/GST only applies on domestic fares, not international fares. The only HST/GST on international fares from Canada is on the AIF (Airport Improveme
174 RWA380 : In the good old days UA & NW used to operate DC-10's SEA-PDX, L1011's on EA & DL, A-300's on EA, 747's on BN & NW. But yes I agree trucki
175 LAXdude1023 : As a resident DFW cheerleader on a.net, this is really exciting for us. It was only a matter of time before one stepped in. But, I had my money on EY
176 ojas : I really thought Irving was already taken over by Indians!!! But yes agree, plano and murphy are packed with Indians and when I did a IAHDOH flight l
177 wedgetail737 : I would be surprised to see a YVR-SEA like the days of Pacific Western or Alaska. Although, never say never...the airline industry has done more weir
178 pnwtraveler : This is correct. The cost differential only becomes more sigificant when you compare flying US domestic vs, Canada US crossborder. BUF and SeaTac vs.
179 BA : Speaking of this, how are they doing in SEA, especially with DL on the route now?
180 BoeingGuy : Only for YYJ, YVR, YYC and YLK. The Canadians wouldn't have to approve any other AS/EK codeshare out of SEA (or SFO for that matter). I assume the Ca
181 SunriseValley : Based on your understanding of the taxes on air fares can you explain why a return fare from YYZ -LGW on Air Transat in November is quoted at $449.00
182 ConcordeLoss : I may be wrong, but I dont think that EK is too crazy about ORD. I really don't think that the market can support a third Middle Eastern carrier.
183 Viscount724 : The $522.14 includes a $340 Air Transat fuel surcharge which isn't a tax but is really part of the fare but is shown separately. The actual governmen
184 SunriseValley : Ah, thanks for the explanation. Of course it is a mis-truth. There is no way you could have a $340 fuel surcharge on a $282.14 fare unless the fare w
185 nomoreRJs : EK is not coming to ORD. As much as I want to see it, EY in the market and SEA and DFW over ORD and IAD makes me think ORD is not in the cards anytime
186 airbazar : IMO, ORD (and IAD) are basically in the same situation as BOS (reply 166). Too much 1-stop competition to S.Asia and Middle East dragging down yields
187 Post contains images peanuts : LOL. I like it. Well, EK if not now, it will be soon, IS in the business of dragging down yields. Watch BA, QF and many others in years to come... Do
188 IrishAyes : I think you need to go easy on the cynical comments man. Remember that EK's competitors do employ human beings whose livelihoods (as well as their fa
189 Post contains images LAXdude1023 : I dont think BA and QF are going to be the main ones affected by EK's expansion. KLM should be very, very worried however. It will probably drive KLM
190 peanuts : Meaning of Cynical: Doubtful as to whether something will happen. Sorry, I'm definitely not being cynical. And remember: EK also employs human beings
191 IrishAyes : The fact that KL is down to a seasonal flight, and flies 4 (or is it 5?) times weekly when it is in season at DFW means that it is already in a far w
192 IrishAyes : Does BOS really have all that much competition to S Asia and the Middle East? I know that BOS is decently well-connected to Europe, but IAD and ORD h
193 LAXdude1023 : The fact that DFW-FRA is much, much larger than DFW-AMS and its also higher yielding makes it more unstable. KLM depends on connections from DFW almo
194 Gunsontheroof : I think that connecting passenger demand from Canada would have to be pretty considerable for this to happen. The carriers flying YVR-SEA pulled thei
195 YTZ : Part of me sincerely wishes that the Government of Canada had shown the same immaturity that the Emiratis did and shown exactly how insignificant Can
196 darkroast : Amen to that. EK is really cattle class in Y (even on their A380s). AC is way better in Y, and possibly in J too. I think 9W does a decent one-stop t
197 airbazar : Not really. Like everyone else they're in the business of making money. The fact that they will serve only 1 city East of the Mississippi should be a
198 IrishAyes : Boston definitely has plenty of options, you proved your point. However, ORD and IAD have far more and, most importantly, they are more well-rounded
199 peanuts : Duh. But HOW is EK going about it? They will be driving down yields for the competition. It's a huge part of their strategy in ordering A380's. EK is
200 Post contains links airbazar : Again, they can't create a market that doesn't exist, or grow one where they have no permission to do so. I don't know what the demand is from ORD or
201 IrishAyes : Again, you have no basis to make this statement. Are you actually employed by the airline? If so, are you permitted to make such bold statements??? M
202 Post contains images Jacobin777 : IIRC its daily..when did it go down to 6x/weekly? EK many times isn't the cheapest carrier.
203 peanuts : Not what was said or was implied. This discussion has gone way over your head. Never mind. And that should frighten the living daylights out of the o
204 Post contains links IrishAyes : There was a seasonal reduction during the summer months (May-October). I should have clarified. http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/ameri...83867-aa-cuts-
205 wedgetail737 : Because an international carrier doesn't have a codeshare does not prevent a traveler to connect from AS to another carrier. I'm sure helps, though.
206 Gunsontheroof : Very true, but having a local connection is definitely going to help a previously unestablished international carrier in the long-term. Granted, we'r
207 hohd : I will agree with you for travel to DEL (most VFR Canadians go to DEL) or BOM, that EK will not get many passengers. However it is worth the extra do
208 MPDPilot : Talking about the Seattle flight taking passenger that drive from Canada. Fun piece of information: Emirates recently posted a number of Sales Manager
209 wedgetail737 : Don't forget that seasonal SEA-FRA by Condor which just started this summer. Maybe someday a KE or HU flight from SEA to MEX will become a reality. A
210 IrishAyes : According to the 06OCT11 GDS timetable, KLM loaded DFWAMS for next summer, re-commencing with 4 weekly flights on 25MAR and going up to 5 weekly on 1
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