Sponsor Message:
Civil Aviation Forum
My Starred Topics | Profile | New Topic | Forum Index | Help | Search 
Why Were There So Many SYR-VCV Flights Today?  
User currently offlineSyrAlex From United States of America, joined Oct 2010, 32 posts, RR: 0
Posted (2 years 11 months 3 weeks 1 hour ago) and read 8269 times:

Hi all, I've noticed all day today we have had a ton of charters out of our Air National Guard base here in SYR. Every charter went to VCV, except for one CO/UA charter that was the Rutgers football team. I was able to catch a lot of the charters. We had Delta and Ryan International 767's, Delta 757's, Sun Country and Miami Air 737's (Miami Air was from Sunday actually), along with a USA 3000 A320. I know VCV or at least the area in Victorville has training grounds for the military, so could this just be a major training operation? This could be that obvious, but I'm just blown away with how much aircraft we had come and go, so I apologize.

Just look at the arrivals, they are almost all from SYR!:

http://flightaware.com/live/airport/KVCV

18 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineGoldenshield From United States of America, joined Jan 2001, 6027 posts, RR: 14
Reply 1, posted (2 years 11 months 3 weeks ago) and read 8178 times:

Sounds like military excercises out at Fort Irwin, of which VCV is the closest airport with the ability to handle all of the aircraft.


Two all beef patties, special sauce, lettuce, cheese, pickles, onions on a sesame seed bun.
User currently offlineGCT64 From United Kingdom, joined Nov 2007, 1398 posts, RR: 1
Reply 2, posted (2 years 11 months 2 weeks 6 days 20 hours ago) and read 7905 times:

http://www.dvidshub.net/news/77857/n...-head-out-national-training-center

NY National Guard deployment to NTC.

"More than 2,000 members of the New York Army National Guard deployed to the Army's National Training Center (NTC) at Fort Irwin, Calif., from Hancock Field Air National Guard Base Sept. 30 for a month-long training event."



Flown in: A30B,A306,A310,A319,A320,A321,A332,A333,A343,A346,A388,BA11,BU31,B190, B461,B462,(..51 types..),VC10,WESX
User currently offline5MillionMiler From Australia, joined Sep 2011, 88 posts, RR: 0
Reply 3, posted (2 years 11 months 2 weeks 6 days 19 hours ago) and read 7865 times:

It is interesting that they are flying commercial charters and not C5s/C17s or even Hercules.

Wonder if that is cost driven or capacity driven?


User currently offlineSpacepope From Vatican City, joined Dec 1999, 2930 posts, RR: 1
Reply 4, posted (2 years 11 months 2 weeks 6 days 18 hours ago) and read 7722 times:

Quoting 5MillionMiler (Reply 3):
It is interesting that they are flying commercial charters and not C5s/C17s or even Hercules.

They almost always fly commercial charters. Here at COS we get World, Omni and North American all the time with a smattering of Southwest and Miami Air charters. It's nice to see MD-11s and 767s in an otherwise mostly RJ airport.

Here's a recent one
http://flightaware.com/live/flight/O...4/history/20110929/1443Z/EINN/KCOS

It probably is also more cost effective than using heavy airlifters.



The last of the famous international playboys
User currently offline5MillionMiler From Australia, joined Sep 2011, 88 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (2 years 11 months 2 weeks 6 days 17 hours ago) and read 7580 times:

Makes one wonder why MAC doesn't just have some 767s of their own. Haha may just be proof that the private sector can be more cost effective than government, despite scale. With all the charter ops running troops, you'd think the DOD would have its own airline... the boys in Langley have lots of 767s at IAD, but those aren't for normal troop movements of course!

User currently offlineDalmd88 From United States of America, joined Jul 2000, 2554 posts, RR: 14
Reply 6, posted (2 years 11 months 2 weeks 6 days 17 hours ago) and read 7496 times:

Quoting 5MillionMiler (Reply 3):
It is interesting that they are flying commercial charters and not C5s/C17s or even Hercules.

Wonder if that is cost driven or capacity driven?

Those heavy lift aircraft are needed to support active troops in the field. It makes more sense to contract out the personnel moves and leave the out sized cargo to MAC. As for MAC operating it's own fleet, right now it seems to make sense. Once troop movement in the Middle East slows they would sit a lot.


User currently offlineGrid From Kazakhstan, joined Apr 2010, 624 posts, RR: 0
Reply 7, posted (2 years 11 months 2 weeks 6 days 17 hours ago) and read 7464 times:

Quoting 5MillionMiler (Reply 5):
Makes one wonder why MAC doesn't just have some 767s of their own. Haha may just be proof that the private sector can be more cost effective than government, despite scale. With all the charter ops running troops, you'd think the DOD would have its own airline... the boys in Langley have lots of 767s at IAD, but those aren't for normal troop movements of course!

Private sector does not lavish cheap but excellent health insurance for life and the option of retiring when you're 50 on its employees.



ATR72 E120 E140 E170 E190 Q200 717 727 737 747 757 767 777 A319 A320 A321 A330 A340 MD11 MD82 MD83 MD88 MD90
User currently offlinemhkansan From United States of America, joined Jan 2010, 681 posts, RR: 1
Reply 8, posted (2 years 11 months 2 weeks 6 days 16 hours ago) and read 7345 times:

On days that troop movements are happening at nearby Fort Riley, MHK sees about 6-7 VCV-MHK round trips on commercial 757s or 737 equipment. Not that uncommon for military movements, and it seems VCV is used as the military's "hub" for worldwide troop movements where they transfer to military C-17s and such to go wherever they go.

User currently offlineWNwatcher From United States of America, joined Mar 2010, 275 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (2 years 11 months 2 weeks 6 days 12 hours ago) and read 6869 times:

Looks like DL sent an A333 and a 763 to CAE and then on to VCV, Been a long time since I've seen something that large there....


meepmeep
User currently offlineSyrAlex From United States of America, joined Oct 2010, 32 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (2 years 11 months 2 weeks 6 days 11 hours ago) and read 6297 times:

Quoting WNwatcher (Reply 9):
Looks like DL sent an A333 and a 763 to CAE and then on to VCV, Been a long time since I've seen something that large there....

Exactly why I was curious and surprised. Besides weather diversions from NYC, I've never seen so many "uncommon" aircraft at SYR(You don't see a 767-300, let alone more than one, here everyday)! Thanks for the info folks, I tried finding out what was going on, but found nothing.


User currently offlineapache323 From United States of America, joined Mar 2008, 18 posts, RR: 0
Reply 11, posted (2 years 11 months 2 weeks 6 days 10 hours ago) and read 5591 times:

I just left NTC on the 29th and VCV is the closest airport for such movements. We flew VCV to SVN on a Sun Country 737. Right before the big SYR movement there was a lot of flights to POB bringing back the 82nd airborne troops. I am very glad to be out of that place although VCV is a very interesting airport.

User currently offline5MillionMiler From Australia, joined Sep 2011, 88 posts, RR: 0
Reply 12, posted (2 years 11 months 2 weeks 6 days 7 hours ago) and read 4689 times:

Am glad the troops get commercial service around the country and to the Gulf (a lot), as it is nicer for them than being on a cargo plane. Have spoken to a number of captains in the US who have said flying the troops is one of the best parts of their jobs. Most were ex-military themselves.

Seat allocation must be fun, as now there are some nice seats to be sought after... versus the sling racks, worn-out chairs and two tiny windows you might be lucky enough to locate on a MAC flight. First and business seats must be a real prize! Hope they give them good food and IFE too.

I remember seeing the "Freedom Bird" that was a jam packed DC-8 cattle car from Frankfurt for US MIlitary personnel and their families. Nice to see that at least they can now get decent comfort transport (at a better value) especially coming to and from the war zones. Any little nice touch for them is good by me.

Out of curiosity, it would be interesting to see what the rate for a 763 cross-country on the GSA rate is. Wonder if it is flat rate, or their is also a variable component on weight?


User currently offlineapache323 From United States of America, joined Mar 2008, 18 posts, RR: 0
Reply 13, posted (2 years 11 months 2 weeks 6 days 6 hours ago) and read 4436 times:

Getting your seat is simple we load from the back to the front by alphabetical order so if you are lucky you get a window seat otherwise you get what you get. If you are of high rank or volunteer for baggage detail you are last to board and usually get first class if the particular aircraft is equipped. On my return flight from Afghanistan we were on a Ryan International 767 leaving from Kyrgystan I was lucky enough to get first class that was very nice for such a long flight all I had to do was load the aft baggage compartment. I will say though that any seat on a commercial flight is much better then a mac flight especially a C-130 which could not be more uncomfortable. C-17s are fine however they have passenger seat pallets. Meal service is good to always a hot meal kind of like the better days of flying. Hope that enlightens you all some.

User currently offlineZANL188 From United States of America, joined Oct 2006, 3521 posts, RR: 0
Reply 14, posted (2 years 11 months 2 weeks 6 days 6 hours ago) and read 4130 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

Quoting 5MillionMiler (Reply 5):
Makes one wonder why MAC doesn't just have some 767s of their own.
Quoting Dalmd88 (Reply 6):
Those heavy lift aircraft are needed to support active troops in the field. It makes more sense to contract out the personnel moves and leave the out sized cargo to MAC. As for MAC operating it's own fleet, right now it seems to make sense. Once troop movement in the Middle East slows they would sit a lot.
Quoting 5MillionMiler (Reply 12):
Seat allocation must be fun, as now there are some nice seats to be sought after... versus the sling racks, worn-out chairs and two tiny windows you might be lucky enough to locate on a MAC flight. First and business seats must be a real prize! Hope they give them good food and IFE too.

Ok, first a bit of news. MAC has been gone nearly 20 years!! Gone the way of SAC & TAC....

Second, Air Mobility Command flies cargo on C-17s, C-5s, & freighters and people on commercial charters. It's most efficient and best use of resources. Yes, there are exceptions.

Third, VCV is not a hub to transload passengers for other destinations...



Legal considerations provided by: Dewey, Cheatum, and Howe
User currently offlineRIXrat From United States of America, joined Nov 2005, 789 posts, RR: 0
Reply 15, posted (2 years 11 months 2 weeks 6 days 4 hours ago) and read 3663 times:

Quoting ZANL188 (Reply 14):
Ok, first a bit of news. MAC has been gone nearly 20 years!! Gone the way of SAC & TAC....



You don't say. I remember the days when MAC was MATS (Military Air Transportation Service). Time passes real fast.


User currently offlinenycdave From United States of America, joined Aug 2010, 547 posts, RR: 1
Reply 16, posted (2 years 11 months 2 weeks 6 days 2 hours ago) and read 3165 times:

Quoting 5MillionMiler (Reply 5):
Haha may just be proof that the private sector can be more cost effective than government, despite scale

well, normally I'd disagree, but the military is pretty notorious for profligate overspending (remember $600 hammers and thousand dollar toilet seats?)... though, to be fair, most of that is overspending on purchases from the private sector contractors that they're required by law to farm things out to.


User currently offlinewjcandee From United States of America, joined Jun 2000, 5162 posts, RR: 22
Reply 17, posted (2 years 11 months 2 weeks 6 days ago) and read 2881 times:

A seat on a charter may be nice, but I have to say that the comfort and particularly the legroom in the passenger section of a C-5 is nothing to sneeze at.

User currently offlineZANL188 From United States of America, joined Oct 2006, 3521 posts, RR: 0
Reply 18, posted (2 years 11 months 2 weeks 5 days 20 hours ago) and read 2750 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

Quoting nycdave (Reply 16):
but the military is pretty notorious for profligate overspending (remember $600 hammers and thousand dollar toilet seats?).

Don't be mislead... Most of that kind of talk was congressional staffers twisting the truth.... The thousand dollar toilet seat was in fact a shroud for the toilet bowl & mechanism. Yes, it had a toilet seat attached. Price actually seemed reasonable when you looked at what it actually was.

Quoting wjcandee (Reply 17):
A seat on a charter may be nice, but I have to say that the comfort and particularly the legroom in the passenger section of a C-5 is nothing to sneeze at.

If you don't mind inefficient, assuming it's working at all, heating & aircon and the lack of windows riding on the troop deck wasn't bad



Legal considerations provided by: Dewey, Cheatum, and Howe
Top Of Page
Forum Index

This topic is archived and can not be replied to any more.

Printer friendly format

Similar topics:More similar topics...
Why Are There SO Many Airline Bankruptcy.... posted Tue Nov 30 1999 08:22:06 by Gundu
Why Are There So Few Int'l Flights At BWI? posted Thu Jul 24 2003 22:01:36 by Nm19371
Why So Many DFW-COS Flights? posted Fri Sep 7 2001 00:40:22 by BA
Why So Many LAX-LAS Flights? posted Sun Mar 25 2001 10:05:00 by Ironchain15
Why Are There So Few Lufthansa Commercials? posted Wed Jun 11 2008 07:04:52 by LH4116
Why Were There Three UA Aircraft At SYD? posted Sun Apr 20 2008 16:32:54 by Nickofatlanta
Why Was There A PIA A310 In Boston (BOS) Today? posted Fri Sep 15 2006 04:59:40 by Reggaebird
Why EWR Has So Many Delays In The Evening posted Thu Dec 22 2005 04:10:33 by JerseyGuy
Why Was There An Aeroflot IL62 In Tacoma Today? posted Tue Aug 2 2005 01:23:47 by Clickhappy
Why Isn't There Food On Long RJ Flights? posted Fri Feb 27 2004 04:21:19 by Nycfuturepilot