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A. Knox Flight Home; Took Up Whole 744 Upper Deck?  
User currently offlineWestern727 From United States of America, joined Jan 2007, 751 posts, RR: 4
Posted (3 years 3 weeks 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 25266 times:

Amanda Knox and her family/friends landed in SEA one hour ago on BA49, a 744 flight from LHR after she was acquitted in Italy:

http://flightaware.com/live/flight/B...9/history/20111004/1415Z/EGLL/KSEA

My question: I read in the media earlier today that the group got the whole upper deck to themselves. The FAs supposedly prevented others from going upstairs while on the flight. How common is this type of arrangement? That they were able to get the upper deck to themselves with little notice is something. Any insight would be appreciated.

AND...given that this is an aviation form please refrain from discussing the murder case itself; I am only interested in discussing the circumstances of their two flights home: FCO-LHR and LHR-SEA. Thanks in advance.


Jack @ AUS
79 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlinecrosswinds21 From Netherlands, joined Jun 2009, 699 posts, RR: 0
Reply 1, posted (3 years 3 weeks 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 25284 times:

It is also interesting that the group flew BA given that the victim in the case was British and that many people in the UK apparently believe that A. Knox was guilty (at least based on what I've read). Anyway, there were quite a few options to fly from FCO to LHR with one stop that didn't involve BA (such as LH, AA, etc.) so I wonder why they went with BA.

User currently offlineDeltAirlines From United States of America, joined May 1999, 8906 posts, RR: 12
Reply 2, posted (3 years 3 weeks 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 25253 times:

It does make some sense if the flight was not overly full in Club. From a management standpoint, it's easier to do crowd control by keeping people out of a rather secluded area rather than having a crush of people trying to get the first interview during the flight.

If you can keep distractions down, it makes it much easier for the flight crew to do their job rather than dealing with a sideshow.


User currently offlineWestern727 From United States of America, joined Jan 2007, 751 posts, RR: 4
Reply 3, posted (3 years 3 weeks 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 25197 times:

Quoting crosswinds21 (Reply 1):
there were quite a few options to fly from FCO to LHR with one stop that didn't involve BA (such as LH, AA, etc.) so I wonder why they went with BA.

Now I wonder...perhaps it's because BA offers the only service to SEA from Europe that offers a relatively-small and, more importantly, an easily-isolated section from the rest of the plane...namely the 747 upper deck. LH and DL both use single-level aircraft (330s) to SEA.



Jack @ AUS
User currently offlineDeltAirlines From United States of America, joined May 1999, 8906 posts, RR: 12
Reply 4, posted (3 years 3 weeks 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 25164 times:

Quoting crosswinds21 (Reply 1):
It is also interesting that the group flew BA given that the victim in the case was British and that many people in the UK apparently believe that A. Knox was guilty (at least based on what I've read). Anyway, there were quite a few options to fly from FCO to LHR with one stop that didn't involve BA (such as LH, AA, etc.) so I wonder why they went with BA.

Likely due to scheduling. I believe they took a relatively late morning flight out of Rome, which limits options over Europe. Additionally, it's likely they wanted to arrive into Seattle and not connect over the States to try and minimize media coverage here in the States. That limits it to AMS, CDG, FRA and LHR from Seattle. My guess is BA made the most sense logistically from a handling standpoint.

I doubt the fact that she went over London specifically had anything to do with it. They likely went with the most prudent option, which BA seems to be here (that or KLM over Amsterdam). If the most prudent option was CDG or another airport, I'm sure it would have been chosen.


User currently onlinejfk777 From United States of America, joined Aug 2006, 8437 posts, RR: 7
Reply 5, posted (3 years 3 weeks 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 25132 times:
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Surprised they didn't fly nonstop from Rome to JFK then to SEA.

User currently offlineViscount724 From Switzerland, joined Oct 2006, 25689 posts, RR: 22
Reply 6, posted (3 years 3 weeks 5 days 11 hours ago) and read 25018 times:

Quoting jfk777 (Reply 5):
Surprised they didn't fly nonstop from Rome to JFK then to SEA.

Why do that when it's much faster and more convenient to connect in Europe and take a nonstop to SEA than to connect at an east coast US airport, especially JFK which is one of the most delay-prone airports in the US. FCO-LHR-SEA is almost 900 nm shorter than FCO-JFK-SEA. In flying time alone that's a saving of at least 2 hours.


User currently offlineDeltAirlines From United States of America, joined May 1999, 8906 posts, RR: 12
Reply 7, posted (3 years 3 weeks 5 days 11 hours ago) and read 24821 times:

Quoting Viscount724 (Reply 6):
Why do that when it's much faster and more convenient to connect in Europe and take a nonstop to SEA than to connect at an east coast US airport, especially JFK which is one of the most delay-prone airports in the US. FCO-LHR-SEA is almost 900 nm shorter than FCO-JFK-SEA. In flying time alone that's a saving of at least 2 hours.

Not to mention from a PR handling perspective, she'd be "welcomed" to the States upon getting off at JFK. At least at Heathrow, it's an airside transfer, so no seeing the British media there and then allows them to control the press more upon a return at Seattle.


User currently offlinenotaxonrotax From Ecuador, joined Mar 2011, 500 posts, RR: 0
Reply 8, posted (3 years 3 weeks 5 days 11 hours ago) and read 24542 times:
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Cold question: who paid for the whole upperdeck?
Is it business class?

No Tax On Rotax



For anybody that happens to be wondering:"yes, owning your own aircraft is a 100% worth it!"
User currently offlineqf002 From Australia, joined Jul 2011, 2990 posts, RR: 2
Reply 9, posted (3 years 3 weeks 5 days 10 hours ago) and read 24437 times:

Quoting notaxonrotax (Reply 8):
Cold question: who paid for the whole upperdeck?

Nobody I'm guessing -- they just didn't fill the additional seats. I imagine the seats for those seated up there were paid for by the family -- they're hardly going to be short of money over the next little while.

As for my opinion on this -- why not? It keeps the media furor down, it gives paying passengers a quieter and less disrupted trip, makes the job of the crew that much easier and allows this particular passenger (guilty or not) some peace and quiet on her trip home. In any case, I doubt that J is packed flying LHR to SEA so I doubt that this move actually cost the airline any money in lost fares -- it might have annoyed one or two pax who enjoy the upper deck but that's all.


User currently offlinemayor From United States of America, joined Mar 2008, 10524 posts, RR: 14
Reply 10, posted (3 years 3 weeks 5 days 9 hours ago) and read 23806 times:

I also noticed than when the 744 was taxiing to the gate at SEA that there was only a winglet on the right wing. Is that a normal occurence?


"A committee is a group of the unprepared, appointed by the unwilling, to do the unnecessary"----Fred Allen
User currently offlineGunsontheroof From United States of America, joined Jan 2006, 3508 posts, RR: 10
Reply 11, posted (3 years 3 weeks 5 days 8 hours ago) and read 23667 times:

Quoting jfk777 (Reply 5):
Surprised they didn't fly nonstop from Rome to JFK then to SEA.

Initial rumors indicated that this was the case. As far as I know, the fact that she was on a BA flight didn't surface until the plane arrived at SEA. I saw BA49 approaching final today and had no idea that it was the "celebrity" flight at the time...



Next Flight: 9/17 BFI-BFI
User currently offlineRamblinMan From United States of America, joined Oct 2010, 1138 posts, RR: 1
Reply 12, posted (3 years 3 weeks 5 days 7 hours ago) and read 23278 times:

Quoting Gunsontheroof (Reply 13):
Initial rumors indicated that this was the case. As far as I know, the fact that she was on a BA flight didn't surface until the plane arrived at SEA.

No, it was well-known what flight she was on. There were even some pictures this morning of her party transferring at LHR. British news site whose name I can't recall.


User currently offlinejetjack74 From United States of America, joined Jul 2003, 7414 posts, RR: 50
Reply 13, posted (3 years 3 weeks 5 days 7 hours ago) and read 22828 times:
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The Telegraph reported her trip through LHR late last night


Made from jets!
User currently offlinenighthawk From UK - Scotland, joined Sep 2001, 5168 posts, RR: 33
Reply 14, posted (3 years 3 weeks 5 days 6 hours ago) and read 21996 times:

Quoting RamblinMan (Reply 15):
No, it was well-known what flight she was on. There were even some pictures this morning of her party transferring at LHR. British news site whose name I can't recall.

It was indeed well known, at least here in the UK. It was on the BBC Radio 1 news all day that she was flying through Heathrow, even before her flight had left Rome.



That'll teach you
User currently offlinejamake1 From United States of America, joined May 2004, 1016 posts, RR: 2
Reply 15, posted (3 years 3 weeks 5 days 6 hours ago) and read 21822 times:

I believe the upper deck on BA is World Traveler (Economy) is it not?

Traveling via a connection over a European hub is much more preferable than having to clear customs at the first point of entry into the U.S.



United's B747-400. "She's a a cruel lover."
User currently offlineUpperDeck From United Kingdom, joined Nov 2010, 76 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (3 years 3 weeks 5 days 5 hours ago) and read 21669 times:

Quoting jamake1 (Reply 18):
I believe the upper deck on BA is World Traveler (Economy) is it not?

Nope...all Club World.


User currently offlineEagleboy From Niue, joined Dec 2009, 1853 posts, RR: 2
Reply 17, posted (3 years 3 weeks 5 days 4 hours ago) and read 20833 times:
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Quoting DeltAirlines (Reply 2):
It does make some sense if the flight was not overly full in Club. From a management standpoint, it's easier to do crowd control by keeping people out of a rather secluded area .............
If you can keep distractions down, it makes it much easier for the flight crew to do their job rather than dealing with a sideshow.

This is the correct answer. BA would want to keep her presence discreet onboard so I'm sure a mgnr/supervisor was smart enough to keep other seats in that area free.


User currently offlinenclmedic From United Kingdom, joined Oct 2009, 345 posts, RR: 0
Reply 18, posted (3 years 3 weeks 5 days 4 hours ago) and read 20699 times:

Quoting Gunsontheroof (Reply 13):
Initial rumors indicated that this was the case. As far as I know, the fact that she was on a BA flight didn't surface until the plane arrived at SEA. I saw BA49 approaching final today and had no idea that it was the "celebrity" flight at the time...

This just isn't true! I suppose the time difference means much of the overnight media coverage in the USA was missed, but there was lots of footage of Amanda et al boarding through the BA gate at FCO, and then transferring at LHR. Seeing as there's only 1 flight from LHR to SEA from T5, it was always going to be BA49.

In terms of the organisation of the whole trip, I still very much doubt this was all booked online at BA.com and the whole party turned up for normal check-in. She has a fairly high profile PR team who would have been talking through their options overnight with BA. If the flight was already rammed full they may well have taken another carrier.


User currently offlineBongodog1964 From United Kingdom, joined Oct 2006, 3638 posts, RR: 3
Reply 19, posted (3 years 3 weeks 5 days 4 hours ago) and read 20327 times:

I would doubt there were many seats left on the upper deck once the Knox party had boarded. She seemed to be accompanied by a fairly sizeable entourage, enough to take the majority of the 20 seats upstairs. BA won't have been doing this for the publicity, as far as the UK media is concerned we only saw fleeting glimpses, enough for aviation enthusiasts to know who the carrier was, but no sight of tailplanes etc.

Is LHR - SEA normally flown with Mid J or Hi J ? if its usually Mid J, they might have swapped planes in order to provide more J seats. This of course would only work if WT was underbooked.


User currently offlineJEKY From Italy, joined Mar 2005, 30 posts, RR: 0
Reply 20, posted (3 years 3 weeks 5 days 3 hours ago) and read 19821 times:

Side toughts:

apart from all the guessing on who paid what for her flight home, how comes she obtained new passport (old beeing expired) in just 2/3 hours at FCO (according to the media), when we have to wait the holy bible time for ours to be renewed here in Italy?
All in all it smells of another mess from italian autorithies....



Fell in love with a 747
User currently offlineDellatorre From Brazil, joined May 2000, 1088 posts, RR: 2
Reply 21, posted (3 years 3 weeks 5 days 2 hours ago) and read 19132 times:

Quoting JEKY (Reply 23):

Side toughts:

apart from all the guessing on who paid what for her flight home, how comes she obtained new passport (old beeing expired) in just 2/3 hours at FCO (according to the media), when we have to wait the holy bible time for ours to be renewed here in Italy?
All in all it smells of another mess from italian autorithies....

Oh please don't be so naive....Do you really think a simple passport would be stopping her show... Awaiting Amanda Knox in the next season of Dancing with the stars.....


User currently offlineORDBOSEWR From United States of America, joined Jun 2011, 451 posts, RR: 0
Reply 22, posted (3 years 3 weeks 5 days 2 hours ago) and read 19489 times:

Quoting JEKY (Reply 23):
apart from all the guessing on who paid what for her flight home, how comes she obtained new passport (old beeing expired) in just 2/3 hours at FCO (according to the media), when we have to wait the holy bible time for ours to be renewed here in Italy?

The passport would have been issued by the US Embassy, given she is a US citizen. Given the high profile nature of the case the US embassy would have put a rush on the request and it can be done very quickly if they need or want it to be.
I am guessing that the request for the passport was made immediately following the verdict announcement (by other members of the Knox family or support team). This would have given the embassy overnight to do what needed to be done with the italian authorities.


User currently offlineGunsontheroof From United States of America, joined Jan 2006, 3508 posts, RR: 10
Reply 23, posted (3 years 3 weeks 5 days 2 hours ago) and read 19259 times:

Quoting RamblinMan (Reply 15):
No, it was well-known what flight she was on. There were even some pictures this morning of her party transferring at LHR. British news site whose name I can't recall.
Quoting nclmedic (Reply 21):
This just isn't true! I suppose the time difference means much of the overnight media coverage in the USA was missed, but there was lots of footage of Amanda et al boarding through the BA gate at FCO, and then transferring at LHR. Seeing as there's only 1 flight from LHR to SEA from T5, it was always going to be BA49.

I spent most of the early part of this week working overnight. What little information about this that I acquired indicated that A. Knox was flying FCO-JFK-SEA, though all the stories I read were breaking at the time and have since been updated rather than archived. It was false information, but I assure all of you that it was out there for some time early Tuesday morning. I didn't realize that BA49 was the flight we're talking about here until several hours ago...I've seen that plane come into SEA for most of my life and didn't think anything of it until I had a chance to check the news. You're both correct, but I assure you that there was misleading information printed in the local press yesterday that has since been revised.



Next Flight: 9/17 BFI-BFI
User currently offlinedfambro From United States of America, joined Nov 2009, 333 posts, RR: 0
Reply 24, posted (3 years 3 weeks 5 days 2 hours ago) and read 19233 times:

Quoting JEKY (Reply 23):
apart from all the guessing on who paid what for her flight home, how comes she obtained new passport (old beeing expired) in just 2/3 hours at FCO (according to the media), when we have to wait the holy bible time for ours to be renewed here in Italy?

If she obtained/renewed her US passport prior to her study abroad trip, then it's got ~6 years left before expiration.


25 elmothehobo : You can get an emergency passport same day. IIRC it does not have the biometrics that the new permanent passports have, and it's laminated rather tha
26 Bongodog1964 : It was known in advance that the verdict was expected on Monday, due to the high profile of the case the US consulate will have been involved in the c
27 notaxonrotax : Sorry to bang on about this, but sending 20+ people Business Class; WHO on earth paid for that? Please correct me, but we're talking US$ 35.000+ here,
28 Bongodog1964 : Unless Italian justice is unlike here in the UK, the prosecution will now have to pick up the Knox family legaL bills. In addition the media here has
29 brj : Transit in Europe makes complete sense, as she would not have had to clear immigration and customs until she arrived in Seattle. A transfer at JFK wo
30 qf002 : Agreed... I guess it's important to consider first that she will be a multimillionaire by the end of the month. The US Authorities would probably als
31 Bongodog1964 : Google is our friend !! Who released the Amanda Knox story with exclusive interviews with the family a few months back - answer ABC. Good chance they
32 Post contains links flyingdoctorwu : I read somewhere that there was an offer from many media companies of a private plane for the return flight.. But that the Knoxes turned it down... In
33 bjorn14 : It could be as simple as BA wanting to avoid a circus and updgraded them to the upper deck.
34 BA174 : Most people in the UK seem to think she is guilty. Which person who is sane cartweels through police stations when they have just been arrested for m
35 jfk777 : Transiting the UK with a murdered Brit in this case could have lead to her arrest in LHR if a UK warrant was out for her. Transiting JFK to SEA is a
36 Post contains images airbazar : Really? You think BA is only interested in publicity in the UK? I guarantee you BA bent over backwards to accomodate her and her party on the upper d
37 bojangles : My understanding is that neither Knox nor Solecitto are entitled to any meaningful compensation for wrongful conviction, unless it can be proved that
38 Post contains links SOBHI51 : She could have been issued one of this, it only take a picture and a stamp. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Travel_document A laissez-passer (from the Fr
39 Post contains links VV701 : That would have been a total wasete of time and probably more costly. BA553 FCO-LHR is scheduled at LHR at 1330. BA49 LHR-SEA has a scheduled departu
40 bojangles : Er, but there was no such warrant issued. She was acquitted of murder, in the country where she was accused of committing the crime.
41 Bralo20 : There is somewhere on the internet a quite resonable story about her online. About how she acted, etc... You may forget that she was 20 at the time b
42 Plainplane : On CNN the other day, Donald Trump said he had been providing the Knox family with financial support, so could have something to do with it I think.
43 Post contains links VV701 : The British courts have no jurisdiction over crimes committed outside the UK. The only circumstances that could have resulted in her being arrested a
44 Grid : Why couldn't it have been done in advance, as soon as her old one was expired? Is being incarcerated in a foreign prison some sort of a impediment to
45 usafret : I applaud them for having privacy from everyone else, less disturbance for the other passengers. I worked passport issues at a military base and the E
46 qf002 : Does anyone know which flight the party took from FCO-LHR? I imagine that they curtained off the front of the plane in Club or something? (We've had v
47 777ord : Not that it may make a difference. But, does anyone know what seat she sat in/ tail number? It'd be kind of interesting to be that next guy to sit in
48 janmnastami : The Italian press reported that she had standby tickets, requested by a friend that works for BA. Italian authorities can release a passport in a few
49 qf002 : Aircraft was G-BNLK, I doubt we'll ever know the seat...
50 stlgph : ABC didn't pay for their plane tickets home.
51 cvg2lga : That is a senseless statement. Regardless of what someone may have done, been accused of doing or did, unless it was a serious strike against aviatio
52 Post contains links ks5114 : Did anyone else notice the nose cone on the BA 744 she flew home on? http://news.yahoo.com/photos/world-e...da-knox-taxis-photo-011227032.html http://
53 Post contains images ltbewr : From news reports here last night, the Knox's and those with them boarded the a/c at LHR separately from other pax as well as they disembarked it. No
54 B727FA : Huh? That makes NO sense. I can't even begin to respond to that--it's warped on so many levels.
55 trigged : The only thing that was probably expired, which would likely cause Italy to deport her to her country of origin. US passports are good for 10 years a
56 777STL : No, the UK wouldn't have any jurisdiction here - that doesn't make much sense. Oh, please. Do you really think someone who had just been acquitted of
57 Bongodog1964 : Wheres the upside in transporting a person and her entourage when the media dont even show which carrier she travelled on, as I said earlier I doubt
58 GQfluffy : This poster wins.
59 ACDC8 : IIRC, BA's 747-200s had World Traveller on the upper deck ... or at least some of them did but the -400s are CW as UpperDeck pointed out.
60 JAAlbert : Hey, don't diss my show! Jeez, I was on the edge of my seat watching it last night. Anyways, I too wonder who paid for the 20 something business clas
61 jayhup : You are correct. There were a few -200's that had a World Traveler upper deck. The a/c in question were what I called the "X-Rays"...G-BDXM, etc. The
62 jfk777 : 777STL, what is ambigious ? If the UK had a warrant for her that didn't know about I would avoid London in case of a London "surprise". Flying nonsto
63 Babybus : That is probably what she was flying home for.
64 xdlx : In order to enter the country the document can be expired.
65 Post contains links VV701 : Yes. All a-netters who read Reply 39! See above. On the contrary many TV channels showed the aircraft touching down at SEA or have mentioned that the
66 Grid : What?
67 janmnastami : I don't understand what the Italians paid to Kercher's family.
68 seabosdca : You do realize BA is a private company, right?
69 Grid : You know, I may have my facts wrong.
70 Viscount724 : More often than not, it's the opposite. Longer, less convenient connections are less attractive products and are thus very frequently priced lower th
71 777STL : The entire premise of what you're stating doesn't make any sense. The UK doesn't have jurisdiction over a crime that took place in Italy thus there's
72 VV701 : You are getting repetitive. Earlier you said: I replied: At the risk of being repetitive myself, the English (not British as I said before) courts ha
73 tsully : That, my friend, is the difference between our two countries. In America, you can obtain a passport in the same day (provided you have proof of impen
74 Post contains images qf002 : Correct -- the party used the 'Windsor Suite' at LHR which is reserved for Royalty, politicians and celebrities. Apparently opening it up costs $3,60
75 UpperDeck : No disrespect mate but having you in this forum worries me more.
76 janmnastami : It's the same in Italy, you have to prove that there's an urgent reason (for example, showing a plane ticket).
77 flyawa : Which media documented the secluded use of the upper deck? It would seem to me that upper deck seats would have been reserved weeks earlier by other B
78 sw733 : Yeah but a seat request is just that - a request. There is no guarantee you will get a seat where you request it.
79 qf002 : Plenty of J seats downstairs -- BA use Hi-J 744s to SEA and it was hardly in peak business season being a Tuesday in early October...
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