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Rationalizing CO / US / UA Gates At BOS  
User currently offlinekgaiflyer From United States of America, joined Jul 2008, 4280 posts, RR: 1
Posted (2 years 11 months 1 week 4 days 6 hours ago) and read 9364 times:
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After several months of almost weekly speculation, the discourse has stopped on who will inhabit what gates and at what concourses in BOS.

Specifically, does Massport have any new ideas on integrating the Star Alliance carriers at BOS?

Anybody in the know?

81 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineSTT757 From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 16863 posts, RR: 51
Reply 1, posted (2 years 11 months 1 week 4 days 5 hours ago) and read 9166 times:

The last piece of news came from Dave Barger, he stated Jetblue is going to acquire all the gates in Terminal C. And to facilitate their growth MASSPORT is working to move UA to Terminal A.

Quote:
JetBlue is also trying to negotiate a deal to get control of gates used by United Airlines. That would require moving the United gates to Terminal A, which hosts Delta Airlines.
http://articles.boston.com/2011-09-2...e-barger-jetblue-providence-area/2



Eastern Air lines flt # 701, EWR-MCO Boeing 757
User currently offlineDeltAirlines From United States of America, joined May 1999, 8902 posts, RR: 12
Reply 2, posted (2 years 11 months 1 week 4 days 4 hours ago) and read 9016 times:

Quoting STT757 (Reply 1):
The last piece of news came from Dave Barger, he stated Jetblue is going to acquire all the gates in Terminal C. And to facilitate their growth MASSPORT is working to move UA to Terminal A.

He did not say that they will acquire all the gates. The exact quote from the article is:
"To support this traffic, JetBlue hopes to gain access to all of the gates at Logan’s Terminal C.

In November, JetBlue will gain access to three gates currently held by AirTran Airways, which has been acquired by Southwest Airlines. AirTran will relocate to Terminal E, which houses Southwest.

JetBlue is also trying to negotiate a deal to get control of gates used by United Airlines. That would require moving the United gates to Terminal A, which hosts Delta Airlines."

There remains the issue that United has a lease at Terminal C for another three or four years (I think thru 2015). If United doesn't want to move, then there's nothing Massport and JetBlue can do except cry amongst themselves.

I know you REALLY want United to move to Terminal A, but for the thousandth time, there simply is no room for them. Massport can only seize two more mainline gates from Delta for underuse - the agreement that Massport and Delta reached in 2006/2007 was that Massport could take up to six mainline gates and three gates at the RJ complex from Delta. Continental has six of these - four mainline, two RJ.

Keep in mind that United has multiple 757 operations into Boston - 13 tomorrow to be exact. Those all need to use the satellite, or close off a gate on the main concourse. United also needs the operational ability to bring widebodies in, as 767s are not uncommon subs on some routes. No chance in Hades that Delta gives up one of those on the satellite, given that they do run multiple widebodies a day out of their gates to Amsterdam and Heathrow (four a day this past summer, with 3 on the ground at once being common).

Overall, six mainline gates for the combined operation at Boston would be VERY tight for United. Legacy United has 27 mainline flights tomorrow and 5 more on E-170s - all of which need jetways. Legacy Continental has 15 mainline and 6 RJ/Dash 8 flights tomorrow that can use the RJ pen. Still, it's a combined 47 daily flights - 6 gates means you're running 8 flights a day out of each gate, and this is a low season - numbers tend to go up during summers. The morning rush with only 6 mainline gates and flights to San Francisco, Los Angeles, Houston, multiple Newark, multiple Chicago, Dulles and Denver all being mainline would be a pain to work logistically.

While JetBlue and Massport might want United out, I don't see them moving to Terminal A. Delta's not going to give them any more gates than they need.

I believe United still has 7 gates in Terminal C, so that does help on the mainline side (though they lose the RJ spots). United/Continental might have to do a split operation like the old Terminal A in Newark (where Boston, Dallas and Chicago were the only A flights). Operationally annoying, but could work, especially given that there wouldn't be any connecting traffic in Boston on UA/CO (unlike Delta, which does have some connectivity over Boston).


User currently offlinekgaiflyer From United States of America, joined Jul 2008, 4280 posts, RR: 1
Reply 3, posted (2 years 11 months 1 week 4 days 4 hours ago) and read 8989 times:
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Quoting STT757 (Reply 1):
Quote:
JetBlue is also trying to negotiate a deal to get control of gates used by United Airlines. That would require moving the United gates to Terminal A, which hosts Delta Airlines.
http://articles.boston.com/2011-09-2...rea/2

For whatever reason, the link seems to be dead.

Vis-a-vis terminal A, I know it's divided into two sections. CO AFAIK occupies 2 gates. AS has one gate. Delta and Delta Connection have the remaining 18.

If I remember correctly, UA has 4 gates in terminal C. So . . . where would you think UA could be put?


User currently offlineSTT757 From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 16863 posts, RR: 51
Reply 4, posted (2 years 11 months 1 week 4 days 4 hours ago) and read 8959 times:

I think 7 mainline gates that included 6 UA and one shared gate with DL that could handle the 757s would not be that hard to work out. The UA domestic 757s are on their way out over the next few years replaced by PMCO 737-900ERs, and with regards to the occasional 767 flight that will all but cease as the domestic 767-300s are converted to International configurations and put into higher utilization.


Eastern Air lines flt # 701, EWR-MCO Boeing 757
User currently offlinetu154 From United States of America, joined Dec 2004, 375 posts, RR: 4
Reply 5, posted (2 years 11 months 1 week 4 days 4 hours ago) and read 8948 times:

Couldn't UA take back the three gates leased to B6 on the UA side or f terminal ? B6 will have the former airtran gates in
november.

With that, CO can move to C and use those 3 gates and can operate under one roof.

From what I understand UA's baggage system was recently put in and a very good system at that. UA will also need
space for UnitedClub, as well as office space for ground ops as well as a flight attendant base.

Our domicile manager has gone on record saying Massport is going to have to offer a VERY, VERY sweet deal for UA
to move, and also terminal A will not fit our operation unless DL vacates................not happening.



FIRST ON THE ATLANTIC.....FIRST ON THE PACIFIC.....FIRST IN LATIN AMERICA...FIRST 'ROUND THE WORLD.....PAN AM!!
User currently offlinekgaiflyer From United States of America, joined Jul 2008, 4280 posts, RR: 1
Reply 6, posted (2 years 11 months 1 week 4 days 4 hours ago) and read 8918 times:
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Quoting DeltAirlines (Reply 2):
He did not say that they will acquire all the gates. The exact quote from the article is:
"To support this traffic, JetBlue hopes to gain access to all of the gates at Logan’s Terminal C.

In November, JetBlue will gain access to three gates currently held by AirTran Airways, which has been acquired by Southwest Airlines. AirTran will relocate to Terminal E, which houses Southwest.

JetBlue is also trying to negotiate a deal to get control of gates used by United Airlines. That would require moving the United gates to Terminal A, which hosts Delta Airlines."

There remains the issue that United has a lease at Terminal C for another three or four years (I think thru 2015). If United doesn't want to move, then there's nothing Massport and JetBlue can do except cry amongst themselves.

I know you REALLY want United to move to Terminal A, but for the thousandth time, there simply is no room for them. Massport can only seize two more mainline gates from Delta for underuse - the agreement that Massport and Delta reached in 2006/2007 was that Massport could take up to six mainline gates and three gates at the RJ complex from Delta. Continental has six of these - four mainline, two RJ.

Keep in mind that United has multiple 757 operations into Boston - 13 tomorrow to be exact. Those all need to use the satellite, or close off a gate on the main concourse. United also needs the operational ability to bring widebodies in, as 767s are not uncommon subs on some routes. No chance in Hades that Delta gives up one of those on the satellite, given that they do run multiple widebodies a day out of their gates to Amsterdam and Heathrow (four a day this past summer, with 3 on the ground at once being common).

Overall, six mainline gates for the combined operation at Boston would be VERY tight for United. Legacy United has 27 mainline flights tomorrow and 5 more on E-170s - all of which need jetways. Legacy Continental has 15 mainline and 6 RJ/Dash 8 flights tomorrow that can use the RJ pen. Still, it's a combined 47 daily flights - 6 gates means you're running 8 flights a day out of each gate, and this is a low season - numbers tend to go up during summers. The morning rush with only 6 mainline gates and flights to San Francisco, Los Angeles, Houston, multiple Newark, multiple Chicago, Dulles and Denver all being mainline would be a pain to work logistically.

While JetBlue and Massport might want United out, I don't see them moving to Terminal A. Delta's not going to give them any more gates than they need.

I believe United still has 7 gates in Terminal C, so that does help on the mainline side (though they lose the RJ spots). United/Continental might have to do a split operation like the old Terminal A in Newark (where Boston, Dallas and Chicago were the only A flights). Operationally annoying, but could work, especially given that there wouldn't be any connecting traffic in Boston on UA/CO (unlike Delta, which does have some connectivity over Boston).

Sounds like nothing has changed.

I'd sure hate to have Massport as a landlord.


User currently offlinetu154 From United States of America, joined Dec 2004, 375 posts, RR: 4
Reply 7, posted (2 years 11 months 1 week 4 days 4 hours ago) and read 8919 times:

Quoting kgaiflyer (Reply 3):
If I remember correctly, UA has 4 gates in terminal C. So . . . where would you think UA could be put?

UA uses gates 15-21 in terminal C. 11,12, and 14 are leased to B6 which makes a total of 10 UA gates.



FIRST ON THE ATLANTIC.....FIRST ON THE PACIFIC.....FIRST IN LATIN AMERICA...FIRST 'ROUND THE WORLD.....PAN AM!!
User currently offlinetu154 From United States of America, joined Dec 2004, 375 posts, RR: 4
Reply 8, posted (2 years 11 months 1 week 4 days 4 hours ago) and read 8877 times:

................Or, move AA out of B, connect the two sides of the terminal via the newest US wing and VOILA!

A star alliance terminal!



Since B6 and AA are getting closer, and AA is downsizing in BOS, they could co-exist in terminal C.   



FIRST ON THE ATLANTIC.....FIRST ON THE PACIFIC.....FIRST IN LATIN AMERICA...FIRST 'ROUND THE WORLD.....PAN AM!!
User currently offlineDeltAirlines From United States of America, joined May 1999, 8902 posts, RR: 12
Reply 9, posted (2 years 11 months 1 week 4 days 4 hours ago) and read 8829 times:

Quoting kgaiflyer (Reply 3):
Vis-a-vis terminal A, I know it's divided into two sections. CO AFAIK occupies 2 gates. AS has one gate. Delta and Delta Connection have the remaining 18.

Continental currently has A5, A6, A7 and A8. They also have the rights to use two of the seven parking positions in the RJ complex that comprises gates A9-A12.

Delta has A1-A4 on the main terminal, plus all ten gates (A13-A22) on the satellite. I believe the gate that Alaska uses is a Delta gate and used by Delta at times when Alaska is not using it. I know this is the type of operation that Alaska uses in Minneapolis and Atlanta.

A2 and A3 are used by the LaGuardia Shuttle. A1 has been used primarily for DCA. A4 sees some random mainline flying.

Amsterdam uses A14 each day and subsequently shuts A15 down. Heathrow uses A19 and I believe shuts down A20 (might be A18). Either way, around 400p-500p you've got a rush hour over on A-Satellite, with 2 757s to Atlanta (neither on the ground simultaneously), a 757 to Salt Lake, an A320 to Detroit, an A320 to Cincinnati, Heathrow, Amsterdam, Alaska to Portland, a CRJ-900 to Memphis, a CRJ-700 to National and a few other flights. Mornings have 2 Atlanta flights, two Detroit flights, a Minneapolis flight, Orlando, Memphis, Cincinnati, Kennedy, National and more all leaving before 700a, so towing would be difficult then.

Quoting STT757 (Reply 4):
I think 7 mainline gates that included 6 UA and one shared gate with DL that could handle the 757s would not be that hard to work out. The UA domestic 757s are on their way out over the next few years replaced by PMCO 737-900ERs, and with regards to the occasional 767 flight that will all but cease as the domestic 767-300s are converted to International configurations and put into higher utilization.

That is true that the 757s are going to be leaving, but they will be around for a while still. And Boston will continue to see them for a while over the 737-900ER - slightly more seats, especially in the pointy end of the plane - and United does quite well (anecdotally) in First Class on the San Francisco routes. Having an extra four first class seats to sell is probably a good thing on this route, since they do tend to sell and not be upgrades. The 767 is more for equipment swaps; UA hasn't flown a widebody into Boston for a few years now on a scheduled basis, but when IROPS happen, it's not uncommon for them to drop a 767 or 777 into Boston from San Francisco or O'Hare to move people around - especially from Chicago, since you can dump a 777 in there in between Europe trips if needed after a blizzard. You can't just drop a widebody into any station based on parking, ramp equipment, etc. United does keep that functionality on hand at Boston for these events, as they do happen enough to warrant it.

And again, United can only pick up 2 mainline gates from Massport/Delta. It's not known (at least in what I've read) if it's specific to the main terminal (which would likely mean A3/A4) or if it's any gate in Terminal A.


User currently offlineN1120A From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 26481 posts, RR: 75
Reply 10, posted (2 years 11 months 1 week 4 days 3 hours ago) and read 8644 times:

Quoting tu154 (Reply 5):

This is actually the best idea, but B6 keeps whining and Massport seems to want to kowtow to them.

Quoting tu154 (Reply 8):

Since B6 and AA are getting closer, and AA is downsizing in BOS, they could co-exist in terminal C.  

LOL. That won't happen. AA is WAY too big at BOS to do that.



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User currently offlineDeltAirlines From United States of America, joined May 1999, 8902 posts, RR: 12
Reply 11, posted (2 years 11 months 1 week 4 days 3 hours ago) and read 8523 times:

Quoting N1120A (Reply 10):

LOL. That won't happen. AA is WAY too big at BOS to do that.

AA is down to 31 flights/day out of Boston in December - 8x DFW, 3x JFK, 3x LAX, 2x LHR, 7x MIA and 8x ORD (plus a token flight on Saturdays to St. Thomas).

Still, I don't see AA leaving B. The six gates on the pier are sufficient for their operation and they can give up the Eagle gates.

If they could build an airside connector between the B sides (such as the one between the WN and US sides in PHX, or C-G in MSP), then it might be a possibility to move United/Continental to B in a few years. Until then though, leases are signed with UA, AA, US, etc., and the only way to reshuffle is to get about six gates together and UA/CO need about 8.


User currently offlinewashingtonian From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 12, posted (2 years 11 months 1 week 4 days 3 hours ago) and read 8415 times:

Related question: What about DCA? I think BOS and DCA are the two most complicated airports for the merged airline to figure out.

User currently offlineapodino From United States of America, joined Apr 2005, 4272 posts, RR: 6
Reply 13, posted (2 years 11 months 1 week 4 days 2 hours ago) and read 8353 times:

Quoting kgaiflyer (Reply 3):

If I remember correctly, UA has 4 gates in terminal C. So . . . where would you think UA could be put?

UA has a lot more than that. They currently have all the gates on the hammerhead (Which I believe is eight gates), plus one gate on the stem that they currently use as an RJ gate.

Quoting DeltAirlines (Reply 2):

He did not say that they will acquire all the gates. The exact quote from the article is:
"To support this traffic, JetBlue hopes to gain access to all of the gates at Logan’s Terminal C.

In November, JetBlue will gain access to three gates currently held by AirTran Airways, which has been acquired by Southwest Airlines. AirTran will relocate to Terminal E, which houses Southwest.

JetBlue is also trying to negotiate a deal to get control of gates used by United Airlines. That would require moving the United gates to Terminal A, which hosts Delta Airlines."

There remains the issue that United has a lease at Terminal C for another three or four years (I think thru 2015). If United doesn't want to move, then there's nothing Massport and JetBlue can do except cry amongst themselves.

It is well known that one of the reasons that Massport is building the central checkpoint is for B6 connections that don't have to leave security. The funny thing is the gates that FL will be vacating are C40-42 use yet a separate checkpoint and there is no way to link those gates to the two hammerheads without significant construction, which is not going to happen.

Quoting DeltAirlines (Reply 11):
AA is down to 31 flights/day out of Boston in December - 8x DFW, 3x JFK, 3x LAX, 2x LHR, 7x MIA and 8x ORD (plus a token flight on Saturdays to St. Thomas).

Still, I don't see AA leaving B. The six gates on the pier are sufficient for their operation and they can give up the Eagle gates.

If they could build an airside connector between the B sides (such as the one between the WN and US sides in PHX, or C-G in MSP), then it might be a possibility to move United/Continental to B in a few years. Until then though, leases are signed with UA, AA, US, etc., and the only way to reshuffle is to get about six gates together and UA/CO need about 8.

AA has poured so much money into the facility in B over the years that they are not about to move. I believe the Admirals club was recently renovated as well. They won't get a facility like that for a new Admirals club in C. That being said, they do not need all the gates they have either. Most noteably would be the former Pan Am gates that are now being used by Eagle. With Eagle going away, you can create some room for UA there. I believe what Massport wants to do is link the Eagle gates with the US Shuttle gates and house CO/UA there, which essentially turns most of B into a Star Alliance terminal (Aside from AA who has practically whats left) other than LH. Since there are some gates in B that could handle widebodies, if they wanted to they could move LH departures to B. I don't think this will happen though. The other option could be for B6 and US to trade places, putting B6 in B (They would have access to more gate space in B), and then moving US to the C-25-36 pier in C and AC to C40-42. I doubt this scenario will happen though.


User currently offlineDeltAirlines From United States of America, joined May 1999, 8902 posts, RR: 12
Reply 14, posted (2 years 11 months 1 week 4 days 2 hours ago) and read 8199 times:

Quoting apodino (Reply 13):
I doubt this scenario will happen though.

Doubt it will happen too, as B6 put a good bit of money into revamping their pier on C after Delta moved out, and US did drop a decent bit of money in the past 10-15 years on the Shuttle pier.


User currently offlineDeltAirlines From United States of America, joined May 1999, 8902 posts, RR: 12
Reply 15, posted (2 years 11 months 1 week 4 days 2 hours ago) and read 8101 times:

Quoting washingtonian (Reply 12):
Related question: What about DCA? I think BOS and DCA are the two most complicated airports for the merged airline to figure out.

A big part of DCA will likely depend on the status of the US Airways-Delta slot swap. If it goes through, it could mean US Airways picking up the United gates in the central pier, Delta giving up gates in their pier and United picking them up.

Would be nice if US Airways took over the Red Carpet Club should this situation arise and make it a US Airways Club.


User currently offlinetu154 From United States of America, joined Dec 2004, 375 posts, RR: 4
Reply 16, posted (2 years 11 months 1 week 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 8064 times:

Quoting DeltAirlines (Reply 14):
Doubt it will happen too, as B6 put a good bit of money into revamping their pier on C after Delta moved out, and US did drop a decent bit of money in the past 10-15 years on the Shuttle pier.

Very true....... but ALL airlines in BOS have put a lot of money into their aging terminals.

It will be interesting to see how this all plays out. As I said before, If B6 wants all of terminal C, the deal has to be extremely sweet for UA.



FIRST ON THE ATLANTIC.....FIRST ON THE PACIFIC.....FIRST IN LATIN AMERICA...FIRST 'ROUND THE WORLD.....PAN AM!!
User currently offlinewarreng24 From United States of America, joined Nov 2005, 707 posts, RR: 0
Reply 17, posted (2 years 11 months 1 week 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 8050 times:

Quoting DeltAirlines (Reply 9):
The 767 is more for equipment swaps; UA hasn't flown a widebody into Boston for a few years now on a scheduled basis, but when IROPS happen, it's not uncommon for them to drop a 767 or 777 into Boston from San Francisco or O'Hare to move people around - especially from Chicago, since you can dump a 777 in there in between Europe trips if needed after a blizzard. You can't just drop a widebody into any station based on parking, ramp equipment, etc. United does keep that functionality on hand at Boston for these events, as they do happen enough to warrant it.

I'm not a big fan of UA moving to A. However, once the lease is up, Massport may choose not to renew UA's lease at C. So, UA will mostly likely be forced to move once the lease is up.

Does Massport have buses? Perhaps during IRROPS, UA could park the widebody at a remote stand and bus the passengers in (similar to BKK or FRA).


User currently offlineDeltAirlines From United States of America, joined May 1999, 8902 posts, RR: 12
Reply 18, posted (2 years 11 months 1 week 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 7836 times:

Quoting tu154 (Reply 16):
It will be interesting to see how this all plays out. As I said before, If B6 wants all of terminal C, the deal has to be extremely sweet for UA.

Agreed. It could be rather lucrative to United as they have all the leverage here.


User currently offlineapodino From United States of America, joined Apr 2005, 4272 posts, RR: 6
Reply 19, posted (2 years 11 months 1 week 3 days 23 hours ago) and read 7555 times:

Quoting warreng24 (Reply 17):

Does Massport have buses? Perhaps during IRROPS, UA could park the widebody at a remote stand and bus the passengers in (similar to BKK or FRA).

Massport actually does have buses. They used these years ago back when the CRJ first came out to bus passengers from E to the AC plane if it was a CRJ. That being said, unless the international terminal was full, UA could actually park a plane at E if need be, especially if it was an international arrival because E has customs. If it was just an overflow, I believe gates 2A and 2B can be configured as domestic gates (NW used these gates this way for many years).

Quoting N1120A (Reply 10):

This is actually the best idea, but B6 keeps whining and Massport seems to want to kowtow to them.

I have mentioned this in previous threads, but Massport needs to be very careful here. Many airports have had airlines with similar operations to the B6 set up in BOS or at least what B6 wants to turn it into, and when they cater to that airline and forget the others, often times the environment changes and then that carrier downsizes significantly to the point where the airport is scrambling to fill empty space. Ironically, this very situation happened in BOS with DL not too long ago when the new terminal was built (If DL had scrapped the new terminal A right after 9-11, B6 would never have had any room to grow incidentally) because DL didn't need all the gates and club space they built in A, so Massport convinced CO to move back to A to partially avoid the new terminal becoming a white elephant.

Other airports where this kind of thing happened would be PIT (New terminal was designed with a USAirways hub in mind, with a commuter terminal and all, now look what US has made PIT), IND (City spent millions to help UA build a large maintenance facility, only to have it dumped by Glenn Tilton during the UA bankruptcy), and MKE (Part of the D gate jetways were removed for a commuter ramp for YX, now F9 took over and parked the ERJ's on Jetways, and now the ERJ's are being parked period).

Quoting tu154 (Reply 16):

Very true....... but ALL airlines in BOS have put a lot of money into their aging terminals.

It will be interesting to see how this all plays out. As I said before, If B6 wants all of terminal C, the deal has to be extremely sweet for UA.

That is so true, and even though Massport doesn't get any taxpayer money, don't expect them to pony up all the money either. B6 is going to have to contribute if this is what they want. And even though their part of C is arguably one of the worst segments of the airport, what is being proposed in Terminal B is going to need some serious work before you even get a facility that will replace C. (New food court, possibly new baggage claim, and a new United Club)


User currently offlinedelta2ual From United States of America, joined Dec 2007, 620 posts, RR: 1
Reply 20, posted (2 years 11 months 1 week 3 days 16 hours ago) and read 6993 times:

Quoting tu154 (Reply 8):
Since B6 and AA are getting closer, and AA is downsizing in BOS, they could co-exist in terminal C.  

Since Eagle is out of BOS, why couldn't this happen? Could AA and B6 share all of C? Is there enough room? It would certainly bring them closer together. Plus, it would make B a Star Alliance terminal. What will happen to the vacated CO gates in Terminal A?



From the world's largest airline-to the world's largest airline. Delta2ual
User currently offlineflyby519 From United States of America, joined Jul 2007, 1141 posts, RR: 0
Reply 21, posted (2 years 11 months 1 week 3 days 15 hours ago) and read 6839 times:

Check out the web address:

http://www.massport.com/logan-airpor...tml#/terminal/B/zone/Departures-UA

Terminal B- UA Departures??



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User currently offlinekgaiflyer From United States of America, joined Jul 2008, 4280 posts, RR: 1
Reply 22, posted (2 years 11 months 1 week 3 days 15 hours ago) and read 6739 times:
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Quoting flyby519 (Reply 21):
Check out the web address:

http://www.massport.com/logan-airpor...tml#/terminal/B/zone/Departures-UA

Terminal B- UA Departures??

Flyby,

This looks to me like a gaff -- the hyperlink actually takes me to US.Airways gates instead of UA gates.

Do you know something that the rest of us don't?


User currently offlineSTT757 From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 16863 posts, RR: 51
Reply 23, posted (2 years 11 months 1 week 3 days 15 hours ago) and read 6736 times:

Quoting DeltAirlines (Reply 9):

That is true that the 757s are going to be leaving, but they will be around for a while still. And Boston will continue to see them for a while over the 737-900ER - slightly more seats, especially in the pointy end of the plane - and United does quite well (anecdotally) in First Class on the San Francisco routes. Having an extra four first class seats to sell is probably a good thing on this route, since they do tend to sell and not be upgrades

PMCO 737-800s are already flying BOS-SFO.



Eastern Air lines flt # 701, EWR-MCO Boeing 757
User currently offlineORDBOSEWR From United States of America, joined Jun 2011, 437 posts, RR: 0
Reply 24, posted (2 years 11 months 1 week 3 days 14 hours ago) and read 6584 times:

Quoting STT757 (Reply 23):
PMCO 737-800s are already flying BOS-SFO.

one flight a day out of 6 total is on PMCO and that flight is out of the A terminal (as I am sure most would expect given it is a PMCO flight)

It is like saying that PMUA is flying EWR-SFO, technically correct but a fraction of the overall flights flown by UCH.


25 Post contains images washingtonian : STT757 exaggerating to make EWR and/or CO look better?! Impossible!!
26 STT757 : In five years I think you will be seeing all 737-800s and 737-900ERs on BOS-SFO. This one flight, which is being flown prior to SOC, is just a hint a
27 STT757 : Lol, where did I mention EWR on this thread?
28 warreng24 : That's only a seasonal change of gauge. PMCO on BOS-SFO ends 05 NOV. After 05 NOV, there's no PMCO on BOS-SFO or BOS-LAX through end of schedule.
29 flyby519 : No, I dont know anything at all. I was just wondering if Massport has worked a plan to move UA into the current USAirways gates in B. Maybe UA/CO in
30 kgaiflyer : Washingtonian, Your comments are ad hominem and don't encourage discourse.
31 apodino : SEA is an apples to oranges comparison to BOS. In SEA there is one central terminal where all the airlines are and all the gates are linked on the se
32 Post contains images kgaiflyer : As a matter of fact, for anyone connecting from 9K (terminal C) to CO (terminal A) or US (terminal B), don't expect to see any checked luggage for a
33 United777ORD : Is it possible for Massport to build a terminal for Jetblue next to the current International Terminal? Perhaps one option could be to build a satelli
34 TOMMY767 : Again, there has only been speculation and NO FIRM FACTS on the fact that United will replace all or most of their 757s within 5 years. That's a BS s
35 apodino : Plans a long time ago for Logan included a Terminal F to be built to the west of the current Terminal E. If these plans were revisited, you could set
36 STT757 : Check out the UA 757 leases that are expiring over the next five years, then weigh that with the fact the CO/ UA has well over 50+ 737-900ERs on firm
37 United777ORD : Is it possible for Massport to build extension fingers on the current Terminal C concourses?
38 ScottB : The "hangars" across from the US Airways side of Terminal B are the cargo facilities, and while there is vacant land adjacent to the harbor at the so
39 apodino : Even if Massport could take back two 757 gates on the midfield I don't think they would do so. UA/CO would not want to run an operation from A where
40 apodino : No it is not. The C fingers as built run very close to Taxiway A, and you could not extend the C25-36 in either direction, because then you would blo
41 CODC10 : There may not be a press release, but it's far from BS speculation. I (and others) do not pull these numbers out of thin air. It's a fact that UA is
42 apodino : The question is going to be, is it going to cost more for UA to take delivery of those firm orders, or to continue to lease the 757s? Depending on wh
43 TOMMY767 : BOS-SFO would be too risky for a 739 during the winter. There would be diversions as those flights can get up and over 7 hours in duration. I think t
44 CODC10 : Quite a bit has to do with fuel, but do not kid yourself. These are firm orders, many of which have delivery schedules. The expense associated with b
45 STT757 : UA, after the merger with CO closed, already exercised an option for an additional 19 737-900ERs this past May. They are not slowing down, but rather
46 United777ORD : I think Massport should move United into Terminal B and construct a landside concourse/walkway between landside Terminal A and Terminal B. That way Un
47 tu154 : The AA eagle side of the terminal will have to be completely rebuilt for UA to move. It's old, dank and dark. No food options and very dated. Massport
48 Post contains images kgaiflyer : I don't know if you've ever tried it, but you can walk from C over to the Parkade and then from the Parkade to terminal A. Takes about 35 minutes. It
49 usflyer msp : Where is AC going to go? Personally, I think the combined UA staying in C is the most logical move. In C, they can have their own self-contained, per
50 apodino : A couple of issues with your scenario. One, B1-3 isn't even linked to the US gates airside, and that would require construction as well. Two, if the
51 bos2laf : I've heard a few things from CO and UA employees in BOS that seem to support the theory of connecting the two Terminal B buildings. - UA employees in
52 Revelation : And now we have news that AA is retiring up to 11 757s in 2012.[Edited 2011-10-11 05:01:09]
53 STT757 : Exactly, AA and DL are in the process of retiring/replacing their 757s which makes me perplexed as to why some believe UA would choose a different st
54 BOStonsox : I think it would be ironic if B6 and AA merged down the road. Then they would have only 26-gates in Terminal C while Terminal B gets a new connector
55 Post contains images bos2laf : Don't hold your breath, even though this is a popular rumor with B6 pilots (almost as popular as B6 to DTW and MSP ). AA barely has money to survive
56 kgaiflyer : This is not unlike B6, FL, and WS departing international gates at SFO. Few complaints from clients there, since they're the newest facilities at the
57 qf002 : When did Canada become part of the USA?
58 Cubsrule : I think you are missing a distinction here, though. The 752 is not an appropriate airplane for ORD-DCA, ATL-JAX or DFW-STL - all routes that have see
59 airbazar : Not a bad idea considering they are the only(?) airlines serving international destinations, making for easy towing between terminals. The airline bu
60 kgaiflyer : Great question. Since Canadian airports with trans-border traffic have US Customs and Immigration on-site, Canadian travelers don't go through immigr
61 Post contains images bomber996 : I'm not sure on the specifics of where WS flies from SFO, but Canada does have a lot of airports with Pre-Clearence therefore eliminating the needs f
62 Post contains images kgaiflyer : Ten minutes? Neat? I've done 9K to both US and CO. Granted I'm a card-carrying AARP member, but I'd have to tie my rollerbag around my waist with rop
63 apodino : They fly to both YVR and YYC from SFO, which are both preclear stations. About the preclear, over the weekend the canadian version of TSA was protest
64 Atlwest1 : FL sfo flights dont depart from the international terminal in sfo they leave from the continental gates and ghave recently moved to Wn gates.
65 Cubsrule : It's not uncommon. NW dedicated one customs gate at DTW to Saab flights from Canada, and the OO (? - UA Express) YXU flights arrive at Terminal 5 at
66 kgaiflyer : Yes -- of course. I should have known that.
67 Post contains images qf002 : Lol how stupid of me -- of course
68 kgaiflyer : You mean IAD, yes? IAD rental cars are off airport property but focused on one street (like in DEN). DCA 's major rental car companies are all in Gar
69 Post contains images airbazar : If you're going outside then you're taking the more convoluted approach which is probably why it's taking you a long time Terminals C and B are conne
70 jawake : Anyone think there is a chance that UA/CO will increase capacity at neighboring airports like MHT to deal with this problem? Reduce flights out of BOS
71 apodino : It would make a bit of sense, but UA for a few years ran a split operation between B and C, where they used what is now gates B37 and B38 for some of
72 STT757 : Not a chance.
73 apodino : Very little chance of that. MHT just went all Express on the UA side so it is not a mainline station anymore. UA wouldn't have done this if that wasn
74 jawake : Not to be off topic, but hasn't' UA open up mainline service again elsewhere? I think it is a long shot, but I think it could be possible UA would re
75 ScottB : I've done that walk a number of times and it's definitely not ten minutes with luggage. Yes, the current setup with all the different rental car lots
76 Post contains images airbazar : Not really. B and C are not connected airside. The scenario I'm suggesting would connect both terminals beyond security. As a passenger you'd depart
77 ORDBOSEWR : This is not an accurate statement. The combined UACO operation can fit in C, but Massport is hellbent on getting B6 what they want. After all B6 is g
78 STT757 : Several as a result of the merger with CO.
79 airbazar : Well the assumption is that UA will not get the gates it originally had in C. That was implied in my statement. It's not that Massport is hellbent on
80 apodino : I know the garage is one selling point that the B carriers love to tout when they try to get passengers to fly them out of BOS, but at the same time,
81 Post contains images airbazar : That's what moving walkways are for, for those who are averse to walking a few hundred yards Also, the distance between the main terminal A is about
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