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BA To Add 3rd Daily MIA & 8th Daily JFK  
User currently offlinesantos From United Kingdom, joined Dec 2007, 738 posts, RR: 0
Posted (2 years 6 months 1 week 2 days 10 hours ago) and read 17607 times:

British Airways in Summer 2012 season is adding 3rd Daily service to Miami and 8th Daily service to New York JFK, out of London Heathrow.

Effective 25MAR12
Schedules:

London Heathrow – Miami Increases from 2 to 3 Daily
BA207 LHR1105 – 1515MIA 744 D
BA209 LHR1335 – 1745MIA 744 D
BA205 LHR1455 – 1920MIA 772 124
BA205 LHR1500 – 1925MIA 772 x124

BA206 MIA1720 – 0640+1LHR 744 D
BA208 MIA2035 – 0955+1LHR 744 1
BA208 MIA2040 – 1000+1LHR 744 x1
BA204 MIA2230 – 1200+1LHR 772 D

London Heathrow – New York JFK Increases from 7 to 8 Daily
BA117 LHR0830 – 1100JFK 744 D
BA175 LHR1000 – 1240JFK 744 D
BA173 LHR1130 – 1400JFK 744 D
BA177 LHR1300 – 1540JFK 744 D
BA115 LHR1505 – 1740JFK 744 D
BA113 LHR1600 – 1840JFK 744 D
BA179 LHR1800 – 2050JFK 744 D
BA183 LHR2000 – 2235JFK 744 D

BA178 JFK0800 – 1940LHR 744 D
BA112 JFK1840 – 0635+1LHR 744 D
BA174 JFK1910 – 0655+1LHR 744 14
BA174 JFK1910 – 0700+1LHR 744 x14
BA176 JFK1930 – 0720+1LHR 744 D
BA116 JFK2040 – 0835+1LHR 744 D
BA172 JFK2125 – 0915+1LHR 744 D
BA114 JFK2155 – 0935+1LHR 744 D
BA182 JFK2235 – 1030+1LHR 744 D

75 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently online727LOVER From United States of America, joined Oct 2001, 5955 posts, RR: 17
Reply 1, posted (2 years 6 months 1 week 2 days 8 hours ago) and read 17283 times:

How many seats is that on JFK-LHR daily?

Do they still do JFK-LGW?



Listen Betty, don't start up with your 'White Zone' s*** again.
User currently offlinejfk777 From United States of America, joined Aug 2006, 8090 posts, RR: 7
Reply 2, posted (2 years 6 months 1 week 2 days 8 hours ago) and read 17248 times:
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Quoting 727LOVER (Reply 1):
Do they still do JFK-LGW?

NO LGW from JFK.


User currently online727LOVER From United States of America, joined Oct 2001, 5955 posts, RR: 17
Reply 3, posted (2 years 6 months 1 week 2 days 8 hours ago) and read 17211 times:

When did that route stop? When JFK-LCY started?


Listen Betty, don't start up with your 'White Zone' s*** again.
User currently offlinedowntown273 From Spain, joined Aug 2005, 291 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (2 years 6 months 1 week 2 days 7 hours ago) and read 17086 times:

Quoting santos (Thread starter):
BA205 LHR1455 – 1920MIA 772 124
BA209 LHR1335 – 1745MIA 744 D
BA205 LHR1455 – 1920MIA 772 124
BA205 LHR1500 – 1925MIA 772 x124

BA208 MIA2035 – 0955+1LHR 744 1
BA208 MIA2040 – 1000+1LHR 744 x1
BA204 MIA2230 – 1200+1LHR 772 D

Maybe an A380 could merge BA209/205 and BA208/204 into 1 flight? The timings are quite similar.


User currently offlinejfklganyc From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 3176 posts, RR: 5
Reply 5, posted (2 years 6 months 1 week 2 days 7 hours ago) and read 16958 times:

"When did that route stop? When JFK-LCY started?"

Before that. It used to be a 767 I think


User currently offlineRichard28 From United Kingdom, joined Aug 2003, 1595 posts, RR: 6
Reply 6, posted (2 years 6 months 1 week 2 days 7 hours ago) and read 16856 times:

Quoting jfklganyc (Reply 5):
Before that. It used to be a 767 I think

IIRC it was a 777, as BA do not operate 767's from LGW.


User currently offline2travel2know2 From Panama, joined Apr 2010, 2428 posts, RR: 1
Reply 7, posted (2 years 6 months 1 week 2 days 5 hours ago) and read 16382 times:

Given the type of market MIA is, it may be seen odd BA chose to add a 3rd daily from LHR not a daily from LGW (and to FLL).
Surely BA-AA being on OneWorld has a lot to do with that.



I'm not on CM's payroll.
User currently offlineflymia From United States of America, joined Jun 2001, 7003 posts, RR: 9
Reply 8, posted (2 years 6 months 1 week 2 days 4 hours ago) and read 16122 times:

Quoting 2travel2know2 (Reply 7):
Given the type of market MIA is, it may be seen odd BA chose to add a 3rd daily from LHR not a daily from LGW (and to FLL).
Surely BA-AA being on OneWorld has a lot to do with that.

AA-BA probably has a lot to do with it. But why would they start a new station for one daily flight with no connections at all when they can fly to the airport which more people are likely to want to go to and one where they already have a station opened.
Great news for MIA. Will be nice seeing the BA 744 and 777 at the gate next to each other for a little bit too.
Anyone know if this is a seasonal change since AA did increase LHR to 2 daily in the winter from MIA with 3 MIA-LHR flights I think 3 days of the week during the winter.



"It was just four of us on the flight deck, trying to do our job" (Captain Al Haynes)
User currently offlineyellowtail From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 5885 posts, RR: 2
Reply 9, posted (2 years 6 months 1 week 2 days 4 hours ago) and read 16080 times:

So you will have BA 3Xdaily, AA 2Xdaily, VS 2Xdaily and don't forget DL.....

The way I see it is that this may be an attempt by AA/BA to trash the yields to the point that DL gets fed up. They may be seeing DL getting a foothold and figured is was now or never to defend the turf.



When in doubt, hold on to your altitude. No-one has ever collided with the sky.
User currently offlineheebeegb From Finland, joined Sep 2007, 424 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (2 years 6 months 1 week 2 days 4 hours ago) and read 15842 times:

Cant see BA merging any NYC flights, the route is big money earner and it is all about frequency for BA/AA.

BA operated LGW-JFK on a 763 then dropped it and re started on 772 but not for long


User currently offlineflymia From United States of America, joined Jun 2001, 7003 posts, RR: 9
Reply 11, posted (2 years 6 months 1 week 2 days 4 hours ago) and read 15825 times:

Quoting yellowtail (Reply 9):
So you will have BA 3Xdaily, AA 2Xdaily, VS 2Xdaily and don't forget DL.....

AA 2X daily I think is only in the winter but I could be wrong with a 3rd flight on select days. VS is one daily and also DL daily to LHR.



"It was just four of us on the flight deck, trying to do our job" (Captain Al Haynes)
User currently offlineB6JFKH81 From United States of America, joined Mar 2006, 2848 posts, RR: 7
Reply 12, posted (2 years 6 months 1 week 2 days 4 hours ago) and read 15570 times:

Quoting santos (Thread starter):
London Heathrow – New York JFK Increases from 7 to 8 Daily
BA117 LHR0830 – 1100JFK 744 D
BA175 LHR1000 – 1240JFK 744 D
BA173 LHR1130 – 1400JFK 744 D
BA177 LHR1300 – 1540JFK 744 D
BA115 LHR1505 – 1740JFK 744 D
BA113 LHR1600 – 1840JFK 744 D
BA179 LHR1800 – 2050JFK 744 D
BA183 LHR2000 – 2235JFK 744 D

BA178 JFK0800 – 1940LHR 744 D
BA112 JFK1840 – 0635+1LHR 744 D
BA174 JFK1910 – 0655+1LHR 744 14
BA174 JFK1910 – 0700+1LHR 744 x14
BA176 JFK1930 – 0720+1LHR 744 D
BA116 JFK2040 – 0835+1LHR 744 D
BA172 JFK2125 – 0915+1LHR 744 D
BA114 JFK2155 – 0935+1LHR 744 D
BA182 JFK2235 – 1030+1LHR 744 D

So does this mean that BA is going back to an all B744 operation at JFK (except BA001 which is the A318)? Are they sending the B77W elsewhere?



"If you do not learn from history, you are doomed to repeat it"
User currently offlinemogandoCI From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 13, posted (2 years 6 months 1 week 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 15538 times:

Quoting B6JFKH81 (Reply 12):
So does this mean that BA is going back to an all B744 operation at JFK (except BA001 which is the A318)? Are they sending the B77W elsewhere?

is it true the newest BA First and Premium Econ are only on the 77W ? so BA is flying their flagship route with old product ?


User currently offlineYTZ From Canada, joined Jun 2009, 1832 posts, RR: 23
Reply 14, posted (2 years 6 months 1 week 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 15435 times:

Quoting yellowtail (Reply 9):
The way I see it is that this may be an attempt by AA/BA to trash the yields to the point that DL gets fed up. They may be seeing DL getting a foothold and figured is was now or never to defend the turf.

Whoever puts up a few A380s is gonna win this game....


User currently offlinelightsaber From United States of America, joined Jan 2005, 12420 posts, RR: 100
Reply 15, posted (2 years 6 months 1 week 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 15288 times:
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Quoting santos (Thread starter):
London Heathrow – New York JFK Increases from 7 to 8 Daily
BA117 LHR0830 – 1100JFK 744 D
BA175 LHR1000 – 1240JFK 744 D
BA173 LHR1130 – 1400JFK 744 D
BA177 LHR1300 – 1540JFK 744 D
BA115 LHR1505 – 1740JFK 744 D
BA113 LHR1600 – 1840JFK 744 D
BA179 LHR1800 – 2050JFK 744 D
BA183 LHR2000 – 2235JFK 744 D

That tells me LHR-JFK is both about frequency and seats. I see an A388 at the most popular times and possible 787 shrinks at less popular times... But only if BA/AA is able to meet the seat demand.    Otherwise, it will be continued gauge increases.

Quoting downtown273 (Reply 4):
Maybe an A380 could merge BA209/205 and BA208/204 into 1 flight? The timings are quite similar.

Possible... The profit per day would go up.    I do not see the added MIA flight being for frequency. As you noted, the timings are similar. This is for seats at the premium time slot. Thus a gauge increase would make sense.

Quoting 2travel2know2 (Reply 7):
Surely BA-AA being on OneWorld has a lot to do with that.

Agreed.

Quoting heebeegb (Reply 10):
Cant see BA merging any NYC flights, the route is big money earner and it is all about frequency for BA/AA.

Frequency is for premium passengers. Hence why I think any non-high demand slots will drop to the 787 (no smaller). But... only after enough A388s are put on the route to meet seat demand at the most popular times.

Lightsaber



I've posted how many times?!?
User currently offlinelhr380 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 16, posted (2 years 6 months 1 week 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 15221 times:

Quoting mogandoCI (Reply 13):
is it true the newest BA First and Premium Econ are only on the 77W

The new First is on a lot of 747s now (See TheBAsource for info)
New W/Y is only so far on the new 77Ws


User currently offlinemysterzip From United States of America, joined Jul 2008, 162 posts, RR: 0
Reply 17, posted (2 years 6 months 1 week 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 15185 times:

Quoting mogandoCI (Reply 13):
is it true the newest BA First and Premium Econ are only on the 77W ? so BA is flying their flagship route with old product ?

The new BA First is available on all flights to JFK, except in rare circumstance when there is an equipment substitution. The newer Club is pretty much indistinguishable from the older one. The only difference is the IFE. BA did update their World Traveller and World Traveller Plus cabins with newer seats, new IFE, etc. BA flies all 747s now into JFK, except for the last flight out, which is the 77W.


User currently offlineN62NA From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 4254 posts, RR: 6
Reply 18, posted (2 years 6 months 1 week 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 14974 times:

Quoting heebeegb (Reply 10):
Cant see BA merging any NYC flights, the route is big money earner and it is all about frequency for BA/AA.

Frequency and a HUGE amount of seats based on an all 744 schedule. Plus the AA seats. This seems unsustainable.

Quoting flymia (Reply 8):
Great news for MIA. Will be nice seeing the BA 744 and 777 at the gate next to each other for a little bit too.

Too bad we're not getting that 8AM MIA flight. 


User currently offlineAirbusA6 From United Kingdom, joined Apr 2005, 2004 posts, RR: 0
Reply 19, posted (2 years 6 months 1 week 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 14895 times:

It's extraordinary how BA can operate such a high frequency on the LHR JFK route, at a time when the financial sector is struggling, not with smaller twin jets, but with the 744! If they can fill all the C seats at a decent price, they'll be making a fortune.


it's the bus to stansted (now renamed national express a4 to ruin my username)
User currently offlineskipness1E From United Kingdom, joined Aug 2007, 3074 posts, RR: 1
Reply 20, posted (2 years 6 months 1 week 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 14860 times:

Quoting N62NA (Reply 19):
HUGE amount of seats based on an all 744 schedule

BA B744s are hardly high capacity remember, lots of nicely spaced F and J in there, as well as Premium Economy.


User currently offlineN62NA From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 4254 posts, RR: 6
Reply 21, posted (2 years 6 months 1 week 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 14728 times:

Quoting skipness1E (Reply 21):
BA B744s are hardly high capacity remember, lots of nicely spaced F and J in there, as well as Premium Economy.

Well, I'm sure BA can better decide what equipment to use than any of us, but from the outside looking in, it just seems like their 777s could offer almost the same amount of F and J seats without hauling around what is likely to be a bunch of empty Y class seats.

Though maybe LHR-JFK shouldn't suffer the "indignity" of being served by 777s in BA's view. (Though 777 and 767 equipment seems to be just fine for BA's EWR service).


User currently offlineskipness1E From United Kingdom, joined Aug 2007, 3074 posts, RR: 1
Reply 22, posted (2 years 6 months 1 week 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 14613 times:

Quoting N62NA (Reply 22):
without hauling around what is likely to be a bunch of empty Y class seats.

What makes you say this? LHR-JFK isn't empty often as the amount sitting down the front allows good fares down the back which fills the B744. The best offering is undeniably on the B77W but they're only got a small subfleet.


User currently offlineBthebest From United Kingdom, joined Jan 2008, 493 posts, RR: 0
Reply 23, posted (2 years 6 months 1 week 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 14464 times:

Remember there is the Olympics so if they've got the A380s by then they might be using those on other high-density 'olympic' routes, freeing up the 744s for an extra service?

User currently offlineYULWinterSkies From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 2169 posts, RR: 5
Reply 24, posted (2 years 6 months 1 week 2 days 2 hours ago) and read 14469 times:

Quoting santos (Thread starter):
London Heathrow – Miami Increases from 2 to 3 Daily
BA207 LHR1105 – 1515MIA 744 D
BA209 LHR1335 – 1745MIA 744 D
BA205 LHR1455 – 1920MIA 772 124
BA205 LHR1500 – 1925MIA 772 x124

BA206 MIA1720 – 0640+1LHR 744 D
BA208 MIA2035 – 0955+1LHR 744 1
BA208 MIA2040 – 1000+1LHR 744 x1
BA204 MIA2230 – 1200+1LHR 772 D

Funny 5 min shifts among days on some flights. It's not like either LHR and JFK are never prone to delays, and also flying times depend a lot on atmospheric conditions. What's the reason behind this?

Quoting downtown273 (Reply 4):
Maybe an A380 could merge BA209/205 and BA208/204 into 1 flight? The timings are quite similar.

No doubt the A380 will eventually fly some of the JFK flights. I can see 2 of them daily, while time blocks with lesser pax demand can be downsized to 777 or 787.

Quoting 2travel2know2 (Reply 7):
Given the type of market MIA is, it may be seen odd BA chose to add a 3rd daily from LHR not a daily from LGW (and to FLL).
Surely BA-AA being on OneWorld has a lot to do with that.

No, MIA is not MCO or FLL, the business market there is sizable, and it it AA's mega-hub to SE US, Caribbean, Central and South America.



When I doubt... go running!
25 N62NA : Is the Y cabin somewhat full on all those BA 744's on LHR-JFK-LHR? I don't honestly know - we would need someone from BA to confirm this. I suspect t
26 qqflyboy : Wow! Eight daily on BA is interesting, especially since we were told AA will be going five daily next summer (up from four now). 13 JFK-LHR flights d
27 Tristarsteve : Slot timings. The timetable that is published must reflect the ATC slots.
28 steve6666 : Last time I looked, they were all High J 744s, so "only" 177 or 185 seats down the back to fill. If you've filled 70 Club seats and 14 F seats, do yo
29 bonusonus : Have BA and AA synced up their schedules yet to better take advantage of this shuttle plan?
30 skipness1E : The timetable is available at AA, BA and LHR websites.
31 BA0197 : I wonder if all these extra frequencies are coming from the BD slots. I rather thought that they would open new destinations with them: KUL, CLT, PIT.
32 jfklganyc : "Frequency and a HUGE amount of seats based on an all 744 schedule. Plus the AA seats. This seems unsustainable." They have been doing this high frequ
33 Babybus : Just thinking about the environmental issues here (like BA themselves pretend to do) but isn't that rather a lot of seats? Surely if it a profitable r
34 skipness1E : Oh dear me the business acumen on here is woeful sometimes. London to New York is one of the highest yielding routes, part of the reason is market dom
35 blueflyer : BA delayed and extended delivery compared to the initial schedule. First A380 should arrive in 2013, the last in 2017. They do pretty good in the bac
36 N62NA : Is JFK-LHR profitable for BA? (Actual facts please. I honestly don't know, though I keep reading here that it is.) Also... no comments on the MIA exp
37 bonusonus : BA178 JFK0800 – 1940LHR 744 D AA142 JFK0935 - 2130LHR 772 AA100 JFK1820 - 0620+1LHR 772 BA112 JFK1840 – 0635+1LHR 744 D BA174 JFK1910 – 0655+1LH
38 flymia : I doubt a route that gets 8 daily flights is not making a lot of money. Why else would they fly it?
39 MAH4546 : You missed one - AA's last JFKLHR departure, which is around 11pm.
40 N62NA : Yes, I would presume that too, but.... I've never actually seen any FACTS here about whether LHR-JFK-LHR is actually profitable or not for BA (and no
41 HKG212 : This is hardly an experimental route. BA has been in this market forever with huge capacity, and their lead is such that they don't need to add more
42 flylku : Only in a market that is price versus frequency sensitive.
43 flymia : I never seen any airlines give out financial facts about any route they fly. They make money on the route this is not a question.
44 Post contains images astuteman : For BA? In what I understand will become their "standard" 744 configuration 14 x 8 = 288 1st class seats 52 x 8 = 416 Club world seats 36 x 8 = 288 W
45 UAL777UK : I tend to agree but the flip side is dont put all your eggs in one basket. If as it seems we could go into a double dip recession I would have though
46 skipness1E : Yes except the only markets BA make substantial profits in a deregulated environment is the North Atlantic. The other basket is called "Madrid", IAG
47 UAL777UK : And some!...I guess VS is "holding their own" on this route?, UA/CO serve EWR and with the capapcity they have there at present that probably looks a
48 B747-4U3 : If there is a double dip then BA could quite easily reduce the frequencies again, use smaller aircraft or use tactical cancellations as they have don
49 Babybus : Not trying to challenge your comments at all, they are all as valid as anyone else's, but I think we need to point out that no one here on A.net know
50 Richard28 : I cant find the source, but remember reading how a lot of BA's corporate clients request the 744 on the JFK route... the 777 layout on BA in club is
51 Jacobin777 : I recently spoke to one of BA's senior management (in fact, pretty much up the top of the IAG Group ladder). It was discussion on a few topics (such
52 VV701 : They synchronised their schedules at the start of the current summer season creating what in effect is almost, on the east to west routing, an on-the
53 washingtonian : Like others have said, BA has been running multiple daily 747s for years, if not decades. I'm sure they know what they are doing. Again, like others s
54 LHRFlyer : Might be to meet MCT for certain connections on arrival. Put another way, the 1505 LHR departure may at that time rather than at 1500 in order for in
55 N62NA : Well, some people here have claimed in the past that - for example - AA's #1 profitable route is XXX-YYY and the like. Ah, here we have an example of
56 skipness1E : I work with BA every day, they are a partner of ours. The people I know at BA consistently say this makes money, and good money at that. N62NA do you
57 N62NA : I'm not just playing devil's advocate. It's just a simple question of are these assertions based on fact or conjecture? Too many times I've seen post
58 flymia : I see where your coming from and I sometimes think about this also. But when airlines add frequency to flights like JFK-LHR at 8 daily! Why in the wo
59 AirbusA6 : At what point do AA drop their flights, and let BA do all the flying? BA operate 8 744s between LHR and JFK, when AA only use 3 772s, would it be bett
60 MAH4546 : AA has four daily flights and at no point does it give drop all it's flights. There is value to having the brand, plus loyal AA customers would be fu
61 david_itl : You mean like the BA1500 that arrives MAN at 07:45 from Chicago
62 N62NA : So what you're saying is that AAdvantage members don't get treated the same - with regards to upgrade chances - as BA Executive Club members on BA fl
63 MAH4546 : AA Elites can't use their systemwide upgrades on BA. All AAdvantage members can upgrade on BA using AAdvantage miles.[Edited 2011-10-13 17:08:19]
64 crAAzy : True and very good points. However, let's face it. AA's product is inferior in every way to BA's product on these routes and most paying customers kn
65 commavia : Ah - except for one very important aspect of "product" in which AA is most definitely not inferior to BA: frequent flyer program. AAdvantage is gener
66 RayChuang : That many flights between JFK and LHR on BA is probably good reason why BA bought the A380-800. That way, BA could cut the number of flights between J
67 MAH4546 : True, for now. But AA has begun upgrading the soft product and all signs indicate will introduce an all new product next year, starting with the 77W
68 Post contains images astuteman : All of BA's behaviours tell us that this is a lucrative route. If it wasn't, they would be doing something different. And whilst anecdotal evidence m
69 Post contains images N62NA : Quite "astute" of you. BUT... it would be nice to know for sure.
70 Post contains links VV701 : In discussing the types of aircraft used or not used on the LHR-JFK route it is pertinent to remember the cabin configurations of the aircraft. BA pri
71 sam1987 : Indeed. I think there are some other valid points to be made when it comes to choosing a particular aircraft for a route. Take fuel burn, for example
72 VV701 : What is more the capital cost of operating the older, less fuel efficient aircraft is much lower. There are two reasons for this. First the cost of B
73 boysteve : Probably becasue the aircraft is then used in BA's 22:00 long haul departure wave
74 lhr380 : Never will happen. Frequency is key, not capacity. Every flight gets inbound customers from all over the world, be it from JNB CPT LOS ABV and Euro a
75 david_itl : Ray was saying dropping by 2 per day not going to 2 a day....bit of a difference!
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