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Ryanair - Now Just One Toilet On-board?  
User currently offlineplanesmith From United Kingdom, joined Jun 2009, 139 posts, RR: 0
Posted (3 years 2 months 1 week 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 14537 times:

I came across this in todays' news - you'd think that if they were to remove two toilets then at least they'd give passengers some room to cross their legs!
Seems the day of 195 seat 738 is about to come...

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...-provide-extra-seats.html?ITO=1490

40 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlinemandala499 From Indonesia, joined Aug 2001, 6965 posts, RR: 76
Reply 1, posted (3 years 2 months 1 week 4 days ago) and read 14415 times:

195 seats on the 738? I'm sure that would require additional exits... Otherwise, if true, they're just doing it to save more weight (only to be replaced by storage for onboard sales items perhaps?    )... and puts a controversial spin into it as per the usual with O'Leary... HOWEVER, this could simply just be another PR stunt by him! (news has been slow regarding Ryanair lately it seems!)


When losing situational awareness, pray Cumulus Granitus isn't nearby !
User currently offlineGT4EZY From United Kingdom, joined Dec 2007, 1804 posts, RR: 3
Reply 2, posted (3 years 2 months 1 week 4 days ago) and read 14306 times:

PR stunt. Aircraft toilets, like most things, can't be relied upon 100% of the time and to have just one would cause all kinds of headaches should it break.


Proud to fly from Manchester!
User currently offlineBA777 From United Kingdom, joined Jun 2001, 2181 posts, RR: 7
Reply 3, posted (3 years 2 months 1 week 4 days ago) and read 14242 times:

Like the article says, there is no legal requirement to provide a toilet. That being said, It would not be nice if it did become u/s and dispatch was permitted.

User currently offlineapodino From United States of America, joined Apr 2005, 4317 posts, RR: 6
Reply 4, posted (3 years 2 months 1 week 4 days ago) and read 14159 times:

Quoting BA777 (Reply 3):
Like the article says, there is no legal requirement to provide a toilet. That being said, It would not be nice if it did become u/s and dispatch was permitted.

I don't know what the law is in the UK, but in the US you can MEL the lavatory and fly revenue. It happens a lot at the regional carriers since the regional Jets only have one Lav on board in many cases.

This does reek of another publicity stunt by MOL. If you removed the lav and instead installed more seats, I am guessing the weight of the PAX is more than the removed lav, which is going to increase things like fuel burn. Not to mention when nature calls and there are no facilities to use.


User currently offlinekaitak From Ireland, joined Aug 1999, 12594 posts, RR: 34
Reply 5, posted (3 years 2 months 1 week 4 days ago) and read 14100 times:

There may not be a regulatory requirement for a toilet (which surprises me!); however, there is a certified maximum number of pax that a 738 can carry and that's 189, which the FR 738s already carry, so taking away toilets is just a PR stunt.

User currently offlineyxd172 From Canada, joined Feb 2008, 451 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (3 years 2 months 1 week 4 days ago) and read 14038 times:

Quoting O'Leary

Quote:
'We're trying to push Boeing to re-certify the aircraft for six more seats, particularly for short-haul flights,'

What does the intended use of the aircraft have to do with the max seating? Isn't it all for evacuation. I agree this is probably all PR, would the benefits of re-certification really outweigh the costs for Boeing?



Radial engines don't leak oil, they are just marking their territory!
User currently offlinealoha73g From United States of America, joined Jul 2003, 2372 posts, RR: 4
Reply 7, posted (3 years 2 months 1 week 4 days ago) and read 14038 times:

HA only has 1 toilet on its 717s. AQ only had 1 toilet on its 732s. It never happened to me, but I did hear from HA F/As that at times they did fly entire days with the toilet inoperable back in the DC9 days. You really only need one on 20 minute flights. Very few passengers used them....they're used mostly by the crew.

-Aloha!



Aloha Airlines - The Spirit Moves Us. Gone but NEVER Forgotten. Aloha, A Hui Hou!
User currently offlineamccann From United States of America, joined Mar 2008, 175 posts, RR: 0
Reply 8, posted (3 years 2 months 1 week 3 days 22 hours ago) and read 13701 times:

Quoting aloha73g (Reply 7):
HA only has 1 toilet on its 717s. AQ only had 1 toilet on its 732s.

Huh, learn something new everyday. However, you brought up a good point, HA flights in the islands are at a maximum of approximately 215 sm, FR flights can reach a maximum of approximately 2000 sm (example, EDI - LPA).



What one person receives without working for, another person must work for without receiving. - Ronald Reagan
User currently offlineAAMDanny From United Kingdom, joined Apr 2008, 376 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (3 years 2 months 1 week 3 days 22 hours ago) and read 13585 times:

I once operated a flight on a B757 config'ed with all Y 225 seats. With the old 'bucket' style Lav's.

We got to TFS from LGW, and the TFS cleaners were on strike and therefore we had no way of emptying the tank, the 1 toilet at Door L1 was already full, and one of the 3 Lav's down at the 3 doors was full too. We was already delayed and if we waited around to try and get it sorted we would had ended up going out of hours, so to get us, the aircraft and the pax home we ended up going with 2/4 toilet's out of action.

Needless too say 2 hours into the flight the remaining 2 toilets filled up.... cringe.

What can you do tho?


User currently offlinePHLBOS From United States of America, joined Mar 2004, 7558 posts, RR: 23
Reply 10, posted (3 years 2 months 1 week 3 days 21 hours ago) and read 13448 times:

Quoting aloha73g (Reply 7):
HA only has 1 toilet on its 717s

Wow, never knew that about HA's 717s. Especially since FL's 717s had 3 and YX's had 2. Didn't some of those birds (3 (?)) go to another carrier (FL perhaps) but then came back for a period? I guess Lavs can be indeed be added and taken away.

Quoting amccann (Reply 8):
Huh, learn something new everyday. However, you brought up a good point, HA flights in the islands are at a maximum of approximately 215 sm

  

Quoting GT4EZY (Reply 2):
PR stunt.

Sounds similar to the Lav Fee (aka Pee Fee) PR stunt MOL layed out some time back.



"TransEastern! You'll feel like you've never left the ground because we treat you like dirt!" SNL Parady ad circa 1981
User currently offlineBabybus From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 11, posted (3 years 2 months 1 week 3 days 21 hours ago) and read 13420 times:

Quoting kaitak (Reply 5):
There may not be a regulatory requirement for a toilet (which surprises me!)

I may be wrong but someone could resort to public health laws. I think there is a law that states that any premises offering drinks and foods has to provide toilet facilities (so many toilets per head seated). Hence a cafe in a department store doesn't need one as one is provided in the store but a high street cafe does have to provide one.

Airports and airlines like to pretend they are outside normal laws of the kingdom but they are not.

The trick is to put the toilets at the front of the cabin as ladies prefer not to use it and men take less time in there.

I presume for Ryanair's 738 aircraft the minimum number of toilets is two.


User currently offlineFoxRomeo From United Kingdom, joined Sep 2011, 16 posts, RR: 0
Reply 12, posted (3 years 2 months 1 week 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 13171 times:

Slow news day. MOL used this PR stunt at least 3 years ago. Although there's always those who believe it  

User currently offlineLGWflyer From United Kingdom, joined Mar 2011, 2348 posts, RR: 1
Reply 13, posted (3 years 2 months 1 week 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 13025 times:

Doesn't matter if there is 1 or 2 toilets... still got to pay for it.  


3 words... I Love Aviation!!!
User currently offlineeicvd From Ireland, joined Mar 2008, 2188 posts, RR: 5
Reply 14, posted (3 years 2 months 1 week 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 13002 times:

Quoting LGWflyer (Reply 13):
Doesn't matter if there is 1 or 2 toilets... still got to pay for it.

Eh, since when did they actually bring in this "pay to use the toilet" idea?  
Quoting FoxRomeo (Reply 12):
Slow news day. MOL used this PR stunt at least 3 years ago. Although there's always those who believe it

  
Its done the job though, been a while since we've had a FR thread here, now we've got 2 on the same subject!


User currently offlineAlgoz66 From UK - England, joined Oct 2010, 77 posts, RR: 0
Reply 15, posted (3 years 2 months 1 week 3 days 19 hours ago) and read 12927 times:

Yet again this company demonstrates contempt for its customers because it knows that millions of people that patronise them just have more interest in spending less than a penny.

User currently offlinemax999 From United States of America, joined Dec 2005, 1086 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (3 years 2 months 1 week 3 days 19 hours ago) and read 12886 times:

Even if Ryanair does not get regulatory approval to increase the number of seats on the 738, they can save $$$ on having to maintain only one toilet on each aircraft. It's cheaper keeping one toilet around than having three.


All the things I really like to do are either immoral, illegal, or fattening.
User currently offlineamccann From United States of America, joined Mar 2008, 175 posts, RR: 0
Reply 17, posted (3 years 2 months 1 week 3 days 18 hours ago) and read 11741 times:

Quoting max999 (Reply 16):
Even if Ryanair does not get regulatory approval to increase the number of seats on the 738, they can save $$$ on having to maintain only one toilet on each aircraft. It's cheaper keeping one toilet around than having three.

On top of that, if the seat increase does not get approved, it is cheaper to remove the toilet reducing aircraft weight... A relatively small amount of weight, but at say ~3 cycles a day that small amount of weight could add up to a large amount of savings.



What one person receives without working for, another person must work for without receiving. - Ronald Reagan
User currently offlinebennett123 From United Kingdom, joined Aug 2004, 7809 posts, RR: 3
Reply 18, posted (3 years 2 months 1 week 3 days 18 hours ago) and read 11652 times:

It would mean that you could even increase the pitch.

User currently offlineGT4EZY From United Kingdom, joined Dec 2007, 1804 posts, RR: 3
Reply 19, posted (3 years 2 months 1 week 3 days 18 hours ago) and read 11528 times:

For goodness sake guys. We get some wild idea from FR Towers and we run and run with it each and everytime. Does it usually happen? NO.


Proud to fly from Manchester!
User currently offlinekdhurst380 From United Kingdom, joined Jun 2010, 219 posts, RR: 0
Reply 20, posted (3 years 2 months 1 week 3 days 17 hours ago) and read 10934 times:

Reading the typical 'shocked and appalled' Daily Mail readers' comments never fail to make me laugh.

User currently offlineltbewr From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 13199 posts, RR: 15
Reply 21, posted (3 years 2 months 1 week 3 days 16 hours ago) and read 10655 times:

I wish MOL would quit giving other airlines more ideas that are against the customers.   

I doubt he could ever gain seating capacity by removal of the loos as would most likely Boeing wouldn't do it. Maybe he could get away with this if he were to get Airbus aircraft so as part of a deal they might do a cert deal as to expanding the number of seats. Perhaps this is part of a plan to put Boeing vs. Airbus in any future a/c purchases.


User currently offlineRussianJet From Belgium, joined Jul 2007, 7719 posts, RR: 21
Reply 22, posted (3 years 2 months 1 week 3 days 15 hours ago) and read 9992 times:

Absolute rubbish from a useless source. Won't happen.


✈ Every strike of the hammer is a blow against the enemy. ✈
User currently offlineseabosdca From United States of America, joined Sep 2007, 5841 posts, RR: 6
Reply 23, posted (3 years 2 months 1 week 3 days 15 hours ago) and read 9985 times:

Quoting mandala499 (Reply 1):
195 seats on the 738? I'm sure that would require additional exits...

  

At least under US rules, 189 is the maximum possible with a single-aisle with the 738's exit configuration. The original 739 would have had room for 195 easily, but was not certified for such.

Just another way for MOL to get his and his airline's names in the paper.


User currently offlinestratosphere From United States of America, joined Sep 2007, 1653 posts, RR: 5
Reply 24, posted (3 years 2 months 1 week 3 days 15 hours ago) and read 9855 times:

Quoting BA777 (Reply 3):
Like the article says, there is no legal requirement to provide a toilet.

Really? Might be legal but try dispatching any passenger airplane in the US with all the lavs inop..Not going to happen.. Even in the cargo world (except one notable cargo carrier) If you inop the only lav fight is limited to 1 and 1/2 hrs and only with special circumstances can it be extended.

[Edited 2011-10-12 19:21:54]

[Edited 2011-10-12 19:22:11]


NWA THE TRUE EVIL EMPIRE
25 spr773 : Reading this one wonders then why have toilets at all. Few more seats can be crammed in that empty space. Also cut costs on having F/As. Once everyone
26 kdhurst380 : The misconceptions of Ryanair, from people who have clearly never flown with them does nothing short of amaze me. O'Leary says a lot of things. Ryanai
27 Post contains images SKAirbus : The only time you will ever find me flying Ryanair is if I am dead in a box in the hold. At least the legroom is ample down there... Doubt there are m
28 Babybus : Believe it or not but if your body is being flown to Knock in Ireland your body travels free! I think it's something to do with it being a Holy site.
29 Byrdluvs747 : You can bet there will be once a legislator finds himself on a flight with no toilet, and nature is calling. And once they legislate you can be sure
30 PanHAM : The Dutch railways found a good solution for their "no toilet trains". The Gerard Depardieu bag. Will be available shortly on FR for a fiver, Pound or
31 kdhurst380 : The legroom already is ample, 30" to be exact. That's about the same as what BA offer in economy, and better than most charter airlines. I outlined t
32 Post contains links signol : They should get in touch with Nederlandse Spoorwegen... Dutch Rail Plan To Introduce "pee-bags" On Trains (by YokoTsuno Oct 8 2011 in Non Aviation) si
33 CoachClass : The focus of course is on passengers. But the working crew needs toilets too.
34 Post contains images Mir : To be fair, if you have that many people desperate to go to the bathroom, that's some extra motivation to get out of the airplane, so the evacuation
35 BA777 : This is very true!
36 seabosdca : There is some disagreement whether the pitch is 29" or 30" (I've never measured). Either way, it's not "ample," it's less than the 31"-32" that most
37 apodino : That is not true. I dispatch planes all the time in the US with the LAV inop. The MEL doesn't say anything about a limitation on stage length. From a
38 Post contains links lapper : Not unless you want to go to Knock... http://www.ryanair.com/en/questions/does-ryanair-carry-human-remains
39 hal9213 : If I were O Leary and removing the lavs, I would only increase pitch in the 3-4 foremost rows and sell them as "extra legroom premium seats". Thats p
40 kdhurst380 : That's a matter of opinion. I've flown both, even BA long haul economy is only 31".
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