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ANA's 787's - How Are They Performing?  
User currently offlinefpetrutiu From United States of America, joined Aug 2007, 880 posts, RR: 0
Posted (2 years 8 months 1 week 4 days 17 hours ago) and read 16336 times:

I know it is a bit early to open up this discussion, but the 787 has now been in regular scheduled commercial service with ANA for about a month. Does anyone have an idea on how they are performing for ANA in standard ops? I know that these frames are heavier and do not meet specs, but they still should be performing pretty well, especially on the domestic routes they are used for.

28 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlinenotaxonrotax From Netherlands, joined Mar 2011, 396 posts, RR: 0
Reply 1, posted (2 years 8 months 1 week 4 days 5 hours ago) and read 15135 times:

Good question!

But would the airline come out so soon with any hard figures?


No Tax On Rotax



Als vader voorlicht, kan je merken dat hij achter ligt.
User currently offlinefaro From Egypt, joined Aug 2007, 1534 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (2 years 8 months 1 week 4 days ago) and read 13822 times:

A small chance that ANA's 787 now hold the lowest CASM record in the industry, even better than the A380's? Or is that asking too much...

Faro



The chalice not my son
User currently offlinesomeone83 From Norway, joined Sep 2006, 3326 posts, RR: 3
Reply 3, posted (2 years 8 months 1 week 4 days ago) and read 13785 times:

Definately not for these over weight early build 787s

User currently offlinefpetrutiu From United States of America, joined Aug 2007, 880 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (2 years 8 months 1 week 3 days 22 hours ago) and read 12618 times:

Quoting notaxonrotax (Reply 1):
But would the airline come out so soon with any hard figures?

I was hoping for somebody, anyone on who works for ANA to give us some clues...  


User currently offlinePM From Germany, joined Feb 2005, 6870 posts, RR: 63
Reply 5, posted (2 years 8 months 1 week 3 days 22 hours ago) and read 12244 times:

I can't comment on its performance but I just got off JA802A (HND-HIJ) an hour ago and the flight was reassuringly uneventful. Most of the passengers around me seemed to have not the slightest idea that there was anything special about the plane or the flight.

And that, I suppose, is how it should be.

(Enjoyed playing with my tinted window...!)

And, I have to say, I've just done flights on an A380 and a 787 within three days - and both with RR!   


User currently offlineBD338 From United States of America, joined Jul 2010, 702 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (2 years 8 months 1 week 3 days 21 hours ago) and read 11140 times:

Quoting PM (Reply 5):
And, I have to say, I've just done flights on an A380 and a 787 within three days - and both with RR!  

Cool. Were you in Y and was it really any noticeably different in a 787 from say a 767 or 330?


User currently offlineBurkhard From Germany, joined Nov 2006, 4387 posts, RR: 2
Reply 7, posted (2 years 8 months 1 week 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 10810 times:

Quoting faro (Reply 2):
A small chance that ANA's 787 now hold the lowest CASM record in the industry, even better than the A380's?

By far not. The 789 is expected to have the same CASM as the 77W has currently, which would be a real achievement for such a smaller plane. Boeing promises the 789 to be better than the 788 by 10%, and the first 788 I expect to be 10% away from final 788 numbers, this adds up to a CASM 40% higher then the A380.

I always wonder how people expect wonders from a new plane that just is set up to get slightly better then the A332...


User currently offlineU2380 From United Kingdom, joined Dec 2010, 325 posts, RR: 0
Reply 8, posted (2 years 8 months 1 week 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 10634 times:

Quoting PM (Reply 5):
And, I have to say, I've just done flights on an A380 and a 787 within three days - and both with RR!   

I'm very jealous!
How did they compare in terms of cabin noise?

[Edited 2011-11-22 04:50:32]

User currently offlinePM From Germany, joined Feb 2005, 6870 posts, RR: 63
Reply 9, posted (2 years 8 months 1 week 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 10219 times:

Quoting BD338 (Reply 6):

Cool. Were you in Y and was it really any noticeably different in a 787 from say a 767 or 330?

Yes, in Y with a window seat above the wing and only just behind the engine. The first thing I noticed was that when the baggage bins are down they are low enough for me (@ 5ft 7") to brush my head on them. But when they are up, the impression is one of space. The multicolour LEDs were nice and the windows were noticeably big. It was pretty quiet and I think (!) I noticed the improved humidity in the cabin. (Although in a 75 minute flight, how much can you tell?) All very pleasant but almost anticlimatic.

And, lest anyone accuse me of bias, I felt exactly the same about my first two A380 flights last week: NRT-FRA-NRT.

Quoting U2380 (Reply 8):
I'm very jealous!
How did they compare in terms of cabin noise?

For the LH flights I was upstairs in business. Both legs were comfortable and a lot quiter than a 777-300ER. But gob-smackingly quiet? Not really.

So, after testing both the A380 and 787 in just over a week, nice, fun, but - from a passenger's point of view - just incremental improvements on what went before.


User currently offlinecol From Malaysia, joined Nov 2003, 2093 posts, RR: 22
Reply 10, posted (2 years 8 months 1 week 3 days 19 hours ago) and read 9867 times:

Quoting PM (Reply 9):
For the LH flights I was upstairs in business. Both legs were comfortable and a lot quiter than a 777-300ER. But gob-smackingly quiet? Not really.

I think a lot depends on what you just got off or on. I have only flown SQ 380's about 11 flights now, and where I have connected onto something else or vv, the 380 is much quieter. Of course the 77W is the worse for PAX noise and terrible when you have just got off a 380, but the best for Airline profits.

Is the 787 on board noise similar to the 380, 330 or anything else with Rollers of course.


User currently offline2175301 From United States of America, joined May 2007, 1036 posts, RR: 0
Reply 11, posted (2 years 8 months 1 week 3 days 18 hours ago) and read 8538 times:

Of course the 77W is the worse for PAX noise...

Sounds like you have never flown the DC-9's - especially in the last row  

I have to admit that I will miss the DC 9's as they are being phased out in my area.


Have a great day,


User currently offlineaeropiggot From United States of America, joined May 2005, 283 posts, RR: 0
Reply 12, posted (2 years 8 months 1 week 3 days 16 hours ago) and read 6571 times:

Quoting col (Reply 10):
I think a lot depends on what you just got off or on. I have only flown SQ 380's about 11 flights now, and where I have connected onto something else or vv, the 380 is much quieter. Of course the 77W is the worse for PAX noise and terrible when you have just got off a 380, but the best for Airline profits.

I don't know about you guys, but I love to hear and feel the power of those GE90s, at full throttle during a take off roll. I imagine that must be how the astronauts feel at lift off, you know that you are going somewhere.



A scientist discovers that which exists, an engineer creates that which never was.
User currently offlinefrancoflier From France, joined Oct 2001, 3738 posts, RR: 11
Reply 13, posted (2 years 8 months 1 week 3 days 15 hours ago) and read 6292 times:

Quoting fpetrutiu (Thread starter):
Does anyone have an idea on how they are performing for ANA in standard ops?

I think the figures will be well kept for some time, but the lack of any 'noise' is reassuring.

If the A380 is anything to go by, any minor technical issue with the plane would cause massive media overreaction worldwide...
Then again the landing gear issue they had recently went relatively unnoticed.



Looks like I picked the wrong week to quit posting...
User currently offlinemham001 From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 3573 posts, RR: 3
Reply 14, posted (2 years 8 months 1 week 3 days 14 hours ago) and read 6117 times:

What about the dispatch rate?

User currently offlineWarpSpeed From United States of America, joined Feb 2010, 581 posts, RR: 3
Reply 15, posted (2 years 8 months 1 week 3 days 14 hours ago) and read 6080 times:

Quoting francoflier (Reply 13):
Then again the landing gear issue they had recently went relatively unnoticed.

The 787 landing gear glitch? I can confirm that it was reported on-line in the Wall Street Journal, Chicago Tribune and even made it to the news summary on the home page for Yahoo! (at least the one I see). Given this, I'd say it was noticeable given the breadth of circulation of those media outlets. As you rightly suggest, overreaction. Heaven help us if that fancy toilet on the ANA 787 doesn't work .

[Edited 2011-11-22 10:35:03]


DaHjaj jaj QaQ Daghajjaj !!!!
User currently offlineStitch From United States of America, joined Jul 2005, 30613 posts, RR: 84
Reply 16, posted (2 years 8 months 1 week 3 days 14 hours ago) and read 5980 times:
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Quoting mham001 (Reply 14):
What about the dispatch rate?

Nobody is reporting missed or delayed flights, so I assume that means it's high.


User currently offlineEPA001 From Netherlands, joined Sep 2006, 4705 posts, RR: 38
Reply 17, posted (2 years 8 months 1 week 3 days 12 hours ago) and read 5590 times:
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Is the second B787 already delivered and in operation at ANA? Otherwise the question in the title of this thread should be: How is it performing?  .

But the question by itself comes too early imho. After 10 deliveries you can start to make up the first-impressions balance sheet. And nothing more than that.


User currently onlinewjcandee From United States of America, joined Jun 2000, 5119 posts, RR: 22
Reply 18, posted (2 years 8 months 1 week 3 days 12 hours ago) and read 5397 times:

Quoting WarpSpeed (Reply 15):
fancy toilet

Does ANA put the "washlet" or equivalent on its 787s? On its other aircraft?

A very common feature in Japanese homes and businesses.


User currently offlineFoxBravo From United States of America, joined Nov 2003, 2993 posts, RR: 4
Reply 19, posted (2 years 8 months 1 week 3 days 11 hours ago) and read 5244 times:

Quoting wjcandee (Reply 18):
Does ANA put the "washlet" or equivalent on its 787s? On its other aircraft?

Yes, I believe they do. They already had them on their 777-300ERs in first and business class--not sure about any other types.



Common sense is not so common. -Voltaire
User currently offlineStitch From United States of America, joined Jul 2005, 30613 posts, RR: 84
Reply 20, posted (2 years 8 months 1 week 3 days 11 hours ago) and read 5178 times:
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Quoting EPA001 (Reply 17):
Is the second B787 already delivered and in operation at ANA?

It has been delivered and believe it is operational.


User currently offlineikramerica From United States of America, joined May 2005, 21474 posts, RR: 60
Reply 21, posted (2 years 8 months 1 week 3 days 11 hours ago) and read 5151 times:

Quoting Stitch (Reply 16):
Nobody is reporting missed or delayed flights, so I assume that means it's high.

It was subbed for with a 767 when the gear had an issue deploying. Was put back into service later in the day, but it did miss 1 dispatch (and if you count the return flight it also missed, that would be 2). But since it didn't force the cancelation of flights and later was used in place of a 767 from what I gather, it may not have even missed any planned cycles. Just flew a different set of flight numbers that day.

Someone else might know more.



Of all the things to worry about... the Wookie has no pants.
User currently offlinea380900 From France, joined Dec 2003, 1106 posts, RR: 1
Reply 22, posted (2 years 8 months 1 week 3 days 11 hours ago) and read 5095 times:

Yes. There is a big difference between the A380 and the 787. If a 787 cannot be dispatched, it can be replaced by something else. Not as easy for the A380...

User currently offlineba319-131 From United Kingdom, joined Jan 2001, 8506 posts, RR: 55
Reply 23, posted (2 years 8 months 1 week 3 days 10 hours ago) and read 4875 times:
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Looks like they are being treated with kid gloves, the 2 frames don't seem to see all that much flying looking at

Quoting Stitch (Reply 20):
Quoting EPA001 (Reply 17):
Is the second B787 already delivered and in operation at ANA?

It has been delivered and believe it is operational.

- Correct, JA801A & JA802A are operational on 2 domestic routes, typically undertaking 2 returns flights per day from HND.



111,732,3,4,5,7,8,BBJ,741,742,743,744,752,762,763,764,772,77L,773,77W,L15,D10,30,40,AB3,AB6,A312.313,319,320,321,332,333
User currently offlinePM From Germany, joined Feb 2005, 6870 posts, RR: 63
Reply 24, posted (2 years 8 months 1 week 3 days 9 hours ago) and read 4591 times:

Quoting EPA001 (Reply 17):
Is the second B787 already delivered and in operation at ANA?
Quoting PM (Reply 5):
I just got off JA802A (HND-HIJ) an hour ago

JA802A is the second delivered.


25 ikramerica : QF replaced it with 744ERs for days and weeks when it couldn't be dispatched.
26 lightsaber : Thank you for your impressions. However, at the cost of a significant drop in last minute seats that should have been kept open for premium passenger
27 Post contains images ebbuk : My goodness. what a trip report! Killjoy
28 fpetrutiu : Not sure I agree with you. Let's look at orders since 2004 (launch of the 787) vs A332 what you are quoting here. A332's = 241 planes B788 = 555 plan
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