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What Forms EK Market From SFO And LAX?  
User currently offlineleftyboarder From Turkey, joined Apr 2008, 693 posts, RR: 1
Posted (2 years 12 months 3 days ago) and read 4556 times:

I was checking GCM distances from SFO, SEA and LAX to India (BOM and DEL) via DXB and ICN, and realized that for the most part, a routing via Seoul is actually shorter than via Dubai. Now I know that EK offers many more destinations in South Asia than one can reach via Seoul (or Shanghai or Beijing or Narita for that matter), but for the major points like BOM and DEL, it kinda makes more sense to go westbound from US Pacific.

So, I am wondering, how does EK get the feed for its twice dailies to LAX, SFO and their new flight to SEA? From MidEast and Iran alone? Africa? Or do they steal pax away from Eastern Asian carriers by lower prices?

17 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlinechepos From Puerto Rico, joined Dec 2000, 6229 posts, RR: 11
Reply 1, posted (2 years 12 months 2 days 23 hours ago) and read 4481 times:

Since EK offers a plethora of destinations from it's DXB hub the flights to both LA and SFO cater to a wide array of passengers. Alot of people flying on EK out of SFO are headed to Pakistan, Iran, and of course India (among others) and being that DXB offers a wide aray of cities in the subcontinent it might be more conveneint than ICN, NRT, PEK or HKG. No matter whcih way you slice or dice it going from Cali to India/Pakistan is a long trip.

Regards,

Chepos



Fly the Flag!!!!
User currently offlinetayser From Australia, joined Mar 2008, 1134 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (2 years 12 months 2 days 23 hours ago) and read 4464 times:

The 2nd largest metro area in the US and the largest tech-heavy industry city in the US perhaps?

jus' saying.  


User currently offlineleftyboarder From Turkey, joined Apr 2008, 693 posts, RR: 1
Reply 3, posted (2 years 12 months 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 4220 times:

Quoting tayser (Reply 2):
The 2nd largest metro area in the US and the largest tech-heavy industry city in the US perhaps?

jus' saying.

You're right about that one, maybe I wasn't clear. I know there is a big market from SFO / LAX to India and Pakistan. But it seems it is actually shorter to go through East Asian alternatives than DXB unless there is a price initiative. So you could take this question either way; why don't passengers choose these alternatives, or why don't airlines from this region like KE, OZ, CZ, NH target these passengers?

Quoting chepos (Reply 1):
Since EK offers a plethora of destinations from it's DXB hub

I guess this has to be the answer. Maybe if KE opened up a few more stations in India, it could grab a market share. Or maybe the yields are too low to be worth it?


User currently offlineTomassjc From United States of America, joined Jan 2010, 894 posts, RR: 2
Reply 4, posted (2 years 12 months 2 days 16 hours ago) and read 4020 times:
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Quoting chepos (Reply 1):
No matter whcih way you slice or dice it going from Cali to India/Pakistan is a long trip


I didn't realize people flew from Colombia to India/Pakistan that frequently.

Sorry....Pet peeve calling California "Cali" .

Tom SJC



When once you have tasted flight, you will forever walk the Earth with your eyes turned skyward -Leonardo DaVinci
User currently offlinelightsaber From United States of America, joined Jan 2005, 13440 posts, RR: 100
Reply 5, posted (2 years 12 months 2 days 14 hours ago) and read 3844 times:
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Quoting leftyboarder (Thread starter):
I was checking GCM distances from SFO, SEA and LAX to India (BOM and DEL) via DXB and ICN, and realized that for the most part, a routing via Seoul is actually shorter than via Dubai.

What if one is flying to anywhere other than BOM or DEL.

Quoting leftyboarder (Reply 3):
Maybe if KE opened up a few more stations in India, it could grab a market share.

That would require India to open the bilateral. There are currently rights for two flights. One is used to BOM and one to DEL. Last I looked the India side rights were not being used. India is notoriously difficult to amend bilaterals.

The priority for KE is MAA (due to Korean auto industry in that city). If Korea and India signed an open skies, the connections would be impressive. The same would be true of Hong Kong.

Lightsaber



Societies that achieve a critical mass of ideas achieve self sustaining growth; others stagnate.
User currently offlineAeroWesty From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 20785 posts, RR: 62
Reply 6, posted (2 years 12 months 2 days 13 hours ago) and read 3757 times:

Quoting lightsaber (Reply 5):
If Korea and India signed an open skies, the connections would be impressive. The same would be true of Hong Kong

Oddly though, India and the US have had open skies since 2005, which has resulted in what, a half-dozen flights so far?



International Homo of Mystery
User currently offlinepnd100 From Canada, joined Mar 2009, 343 posts, RR: 0
Reply 7, posted (2 years 12 months 2 days 10 hours ago) and read 3605 times:

Quoting lightsaber (Reply 5):
What if one is flying to anywhere other than BOM or DEL.

Exactly. This is the market that EK has cornerned with it's service of secondary cities. People may not know that the metropolitan areas of CCU, MAA, AMD, BLR & HYD have over 5 million residents EACH. The business market in these cities is growing at the same rate or higher as India. As Delhi & Mumbai become saturated, companies & people turn to these cities. EK flies direct to all the cities mentioned nonstop from DXB. This is a big plus for many people in the India-California market. If you are flying to DAC, CMB, KHI, LHE or ISB the same advantages are there. Not to mention the fares are usually cheaper or more flexible than flying westbound.

Quoting lightsaber (Reply 5):
India is notoriously difficult to amend bilaterals.

Well said.


User currently offlineflySFO From United States of America, joined Apr 2011, 112 posts, RR: 0
Reply 8, posted (2 years 12 months 2 days 10 hours ago) and read 3557 times:

It might help that Los Angeles has the second largest population of Persians outside of Iran... and that they have the money to fly halfway around the world to visit family.

User currently offlinesomething From United Kingdom, joined May 2011, 1633 posts, RR: 21
Reply 9, posted (2 years 12 months 2 days 9 hours ago) and read 3466 times:

Quoting flySFO (Reply 8):
It might help that Los Angeles has the second largest population of Persians outside of Iran... and that they have the money to fly halfway around the world to visit family.

TK made it very clear that the ''Arabic/Persian'' market ex LAX is what they're after and it appears to work for them.



..sick of it. -K. Pilkington.
User currently offlineemirates202 From United States of America, joined exactly 3 years ago today! , 237 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (2 years 12 months 2 days 7 hours ago) and read 3329 times:

Also, EK has a much better product in all 3 cabins,than most airlines! Fly Emirates!


Fly Emirates, Hello Tomorrow
User currently offlinecmf From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 11, posted (2 years 12 months 2 days 7 hours ago) and read 3293 times:

Quoting leftyboarder (Thread starter):
but for the major points like BOM and DEL, it kinda makes more sense to go westbound from US Pacific.

I will do almost anything to avoid crossing the dateline. I have no issue with jet lag except when I cross the dateline. Don't think there are too many who care about it but I know a few who are like me.

Then there are the normal reason of finding good deals and better connection to the end point as already mentioned.


User currently offlineairbusfanyyz From Canada, joined Oct 2002, 1436 posts, RR: 25
Reply 12, posted (2 years 12 months 1 day 19 hours ago) and read 3031 times:

In addition to the obvious South Asian markets, a significant portion of LAX market is heading to IKA.


t.dot photography
User currently offlineUAL747 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 13, posted (2 years 12 months 1 day 18 hours ago) and read 2982 times:

Since when does EK need a market to fly a route? 

User currently offlineleftyboarder From Turkey, joined Apr 2008, 693 posts, RR: 1
Reply 14, posted (2 years 12 months 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 2868 times:

Quoting UAL747 (Reply 13):
Since when does EK need a market to fly a route?

I wonder the same sometimes, especially after seeing a TR of an almost empty DXB-ZRH flight. How do they make money? 


User currently offlineViscount724 From Switzerland, joined Oct 2006, 25871 posts, RR: 22
Reply 15, posted (2 years 12 months 1 day 14 hours ago) and read 2748 times:

Quoting emirates202 (Reply 10):
Also, EK has a much better product in all 3 cabins,than most airlines

10-abreast in Y class on 777s is not "better" than most 777 operators which are 9-abreast.
7-abreast (2-3-2) in J class on A330s and A340-300s is not better than virtually all other A330/340 operators that are never more than 6-abreast in J (2-2-2). EK must be virtually the only operator of those types with 7-abreast in business class.


User currently offlineTravelsUK From United Kingdom, joined Dec 2007, 134 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (2 years 12 months 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 2587 times:

Quoting emirates202 (Reply 10):
Also, EK has a much better product in all 3 cabins,than most airlines! Fly Emirates!

I'm sorry but how is 10 abreast in Y is a better product?!! Dam uncomforatble on an ultra long haul IMHO.


User currently offlineDTWLAX From United States of America, joined Aug 2009, 812 posts, RR: 0
Reply 17, posted (2 years 12 months 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 2442 times:

Quoting leftyboarder (Thread starter):
Now I know that EK offers many more destinations in South Asia than one can reach via Seoul (or Shanghai or Beijing or Narita for that matter), but for the major points like BOM and DEL, it kinda makes more sense to go westbound from US Pacific.

Please note that even for destination slike BOM, KE does not offer daily flights but just 3 a week. EK offers about 4-5 daily flights to BOM & DEL.
ALso to note that apart from KE, there is no good 1-stop connection to BOM from California via ICN, HKG, or NRT. Most of them have layovers in excess of 7 hours.


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