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UAL New Fleet Purchase  
User currently offlineMarcouscg From United States of America, joined Aug 2010, 11 posts, RR: 0
Posted (2 years 8 months 3 weeks 2 days 5 hours ago) and read 19350 times:
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There is a new article that came out with an announcement of United Airlines has decided to purchase 150 new Aircraft between $150 Million to $300 Million Dollars. Though the official details about which aircraft has not been made? Does anyone have more Information on which Aircraft and how many precise are planned?

In June 2009, United asked manufacturers Boeing and Airbus to submit proposals to sell the airline up to 150 jets in a winner-take-all competition. United is taking advantage of declining sales at both plane makers to reap steep price reductions; the large size of this prospective order will also influence pricing.[74] The Wall Street Journal cited the average ages of four types of jets in United's fleet as follows:

Boeing 747 – 13 years
Boeing 777 – 10 years
Boeing 767 – 14 years
Boeing 757 – 17 years

77 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineStitch From United States of America, joined Jul 2005, 30855 posts, RR: 86
Reply 1, posted (2 years 8 months 3 weeks 2 days 5 hours ago) and read 19307 times:
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Reuters states it is a narrowbody order: up to 130 next generation (A320neo/737MAX) and up to 50 current generation (A320/737NG).

User currently offlinedavescj From United States of America, joined Jun 2007, 2305 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (2 years 8 months 3 weeks 2 days 4 hours ago) and read 19145 times:

This will be interesting as PMUA was mostly Airbus narrow bodies and PMCO was all Boeing. Here's for a hope for a return to a Boeing fleet!

Dave



Can I have a mojito on this flight?
User currently offlineual777 From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 1550 posts, RR: 5
Reply 3, posted (2 years 8 months 3 weeks 2 days 2 hours ago) and read 18590 times:

Quoting davescj (Reply 2):
This will be interesting as PMUA was mostly Airbus narrow bodies and PMCO was all Boeing. Here's for a hope for a return to a Boeing fleet!

I hope not! The A320 is the better aircraft. Its roomier, quieter, and more modern. The overhead panel on the 73 is straight out of the 1960s.



It is always darkest before the sun comes up.
User currently offlineBMIFlyer From UK - England, joined Feb 2004, 8810 posts, RR: 58
Reply 4, posted (2 years 8 months 3 weeks 2 days 2 hours ago) and read 18495 times:

I could see them doing a mixed order similar to what AA did, seeing as the 2 types (737 family and A320 family) have their own advantages, are good for some routes but not others (performance) and also fit into certain markets but not others (capacity).

This is just my opinion.


Lee



Sometimes You Can't Make It On Your Own
User currently offlineAdam T. From United States of America, joined Jun 2000, 957 posts, RR: 6
Reply 5, posted (2 years 8 months 3 weeks 2 days 2 hours ago) and read 18474 times:

I have to agree with ual777 - from a passenger perspective I much prefer the A320 family as opposed to the 737s for the reasons that it is roomier - on my recent trips my Air Canada A320 flight was much more comfortable than my Continental 737 flight to give an example. Just my opinion though.

User currently offlineUnited787 From United States of America, joined May 2005, 2698 posts, RR: 1
Reply 6, posted (2 years 8 months 3 weeks 2 days 2 hours ago) and read 18295 times:

I see them adding more 739ER to start retiring some of the older PMUA 752s, it wouldn't make sense to add the A321 at this point since they aren't currently in the fleet and the range will be getting better on them. I don't see any current generation A320s being ordered since the newest one is already 9 years old.

As for the next generation, I think it is a toss up. I am pissed Boeing isn't taking this opportunity to produce an all new narrowbody given that this could be an opportunity to leap frog Airbus. Airbus is too busy on the A350 to start another all new aircraft but Boeing is just finishing up the 788 and 748...the 749 is just a stretch so...


User currently offlineStitch From United States of America, joined Jul 2005, 30855 posts, RR: 86
Reply 7, posted (2 years 8 months 3 weeks 2 days 2 hours ago) and read 18258 times:
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Quoting BMIFlyer (Reply 4):
I could see them doing a mixed order similar to what AA did...

Agreed, both for delivery position availability and because they have a large enough pool of both to leverage new additions of each.

[Edited 2011-11-30 20:04:39]

User currently offlineqfa787380 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 8, posted (2 years 8 months 3 weeks 2 days 1 hour ago) and read 18205 times:

Quoting ual777 (Reply 3):
I hope not! The A320 is the better aircraft. Its roomier, quieter, and more modern. The overhead panel on the 73 is straight out of the 1960s.

Well you haven't flown on a 737NG with the new Sky interior then!


User currently offlinecruiseshipcrew From United States of America, joined Aug 2008, 205 posts, RR: 1
Reply 9, posted (2 years 8 months 3 weeks 2 days ago) and read 17944 times:

Quoting qfa787380 (Reply 8):
Well you haven't flown on a 737NG with the new Sky interior then!

You beat me to it! The new 737 sky interiors are the most modern, updated interior of any narrow body aircraft on the market.



facebook sn jetboy787
User currently offlineN62NA From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 4447 posts, RR: 6
Reply 10, posted (2 years 8 months 3 weeks 2 days ago) and read 17930 times:

Quoting Marcouscg (Thread starter):
United Airlines has decided to purchase 150 new Aircraft between $150 Million to $300 Million Dollars.

Wow, that would be quite a deal. Each aircraft costing $1 million to $2 million.  


User currently onlineatct From United States of America, joined Mar 2001, 2283 posts, RR: 38
Reply 11, posted (2 years 8 months 3 weeks 2 days ago) and read 17911 times:

Ive flown the new 737-900ER with the Sky interior...nothing better than the current Airbus or old 737 in my opinion. The overhead didnt like my rollaboard very much and the coach seat is still a coach seat. That being said it was SEA-IAH in 1A and the lighting was cool...though I slept through most of the flight.

Personally I hope to see a 737 order.

ATCT



"The way to get started is to quit talking and begin doing." - Walt Disney
User currently offlinelaca773 From United States of America, joined Nov 2004, 4005 posts, RR: 2
Reply 12, posted (2 years 8 months 3 weeks 1 day 18 hours ago) and read 16648 times:
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Quoting qfa787380 (Reply 8):

Well you haven't flown on a 737NG with the new Sky interior then!

Boeing really did do a great job updating and modernizing the 737NGs with the Sky Interiors. It's quite a job to do and is only available on new build a/c. 737NG already in service can't be modified.

I think we will see UA go with a sizable order of 739ERs since PMCO seems happy with them and they have worked well on routes that used to be flown mainly with 757s. The 739ERs (is the coding for it 73J?) will never be a full or an equal replacement for the 757 nor will the A321, which I feel many people think these two a/c are just enlarged and do not have strengthened wings, heavier, fuselage, modified landing gears and etc...

I do think it's going to be interesting to see what UA goes with in the 125 seat a/c thinking about the 73G & the A319. The 73G & A319 have good performance for airports where they have field performance challenges, (think MEX, BOG, the majority of Central America as well as the likes of SNA, BUR etc.) where the A320/73Hs have performance and payload restrictions. We all know how happy CO is with their 73H fleet. I guess it will come down to who offers the better deal.


User currently offlineBurkhard From Germany, joined Nov 2006, 4395 posts, RR: 2
Reply 13, posted (2 years 8 months 3 weeks 1 day 18 hours ago) and read 16528 times:

Quoting Marcouscg (Thread starter):
United is taking advantage of declining sales at both plane makers to reap steep price reductions

On which planat does the writer of such a nonsense live? A and B have record sales, and are mostly booked out for a decade - they can take record prices for delveries before 2020.


User currently offlineual777uk From United Kingdom, joined Nov 2005, 3356 posts, RR: 1
Reply 14, posted (2 years 8 months 3 weeks 1 day 18 hours ago) and read 16273 times:

Quoting Burkhard (Reply 13):
On which planat does the writer of such a nonsense live? A and B have record sales, and are mostly booked out for a decade - they can take record prices for delveries before 2020.

I had to laugh at this as well, what complte nonsense.

I personally think it will be a split sale between A & B, but can we completely write of the C Series?


User currently offlinelaca773 From United States of America, joined Nov 2004, 4005 posts, RR: 2
Reply 15, posted (2 years 8 months 3 weeks 1 day 17 hours ago) and read 15963 times:
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Quoting ual777uk (Reply 14):
I had to laugh at this as well, what complte nonsense.

I personally think it will be a split sale between A & B, but can we completely write of the C Series?

Doesn't UA need a 100 seat a/c way sooner than when the C Series will be available to start scheduled passenger service?
I think we'll see UA go with the E90 if they finally decide they need to purchase a 100 seat a/c to join their fleet.


User currently offlineVC10er From United States of America, joined Feb 2007, 2884 posts, RR: 10
Reply 16, posted (2 years 8 months 3 weeks 1 day 17 hours ago) and read 15734 times:
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I happen to like both very much. A "new" 737 is quite nice on the inside and a vast improvement. But the A320 has been a better airplane for the pax from the day it rolled off the line. So either would be ok with me. My primary issue is a silly one: I think an A320+21 is a much nicer looking airplane from the "outside"- she is a much more beautiful aircraft IMHO! I often prefer a Boeing plane's aesthetics like a 777 over an A330 and the 787 rocks, I even love the look of a 757. Whenever I look at a 737 she just looks old. Even a new one. I see a 707 or 727 (planes I love) but a friend of mine said yesterday at the airport (a friend who is a great designer but knows nothing about airplanes) said that a 737 looks like a "fat sparrow" and now I will never see anything else but a fat sparrow. I think that part of the A320 is her looks. Boeing should redesign the nose to look more like the 787 or a E190. I can't imagine they will mess with a nose cone and flight deck windows that seem to be perfect aerodynamically. There have been 7000 with that profile. But she does look like a fat sparrow!

I know nothing but if they go with all 737's won't that make their current A320's seem like a small subfleet in the giant fleet? If they go all A320 it gives them a nice mix. But, what do I know?



The world is missing love, let's use our flights to spread it!
User currently offlinedelta2ual From United States of America, joined Dec 2007, 620 posts, RR: 1
Reply 17, posted (2 years 8 months 3 weeks 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 14979 times:

Quoting atct (Reply 11):
The overhead didnt like my rollaboard very much

What do you mean? Either your carry-on fits or it doesn't. If it doesn't-then it's not a carry-on and should be checked.



From the world's largest airline-to the world's largest airline. Delta2ual
User currently offlineflash330 From United Kingdom, joined Nov 2010, 36 posts, RR: 0
Reply 18, posted (2 years 8 months 3 weeks 1 day 15 hours ago) and read 14376 times:

How much does the decision to refurbish all of the current a320 aircraft factor into this? Can't see them refurbishing 150 odd aircraft unless they knew they were going to be an important part of the narrowbody fleet going forward

User currently offlinehannahpa From United States of America, joined Mar 2010, 128 posts, RR: 0
Reply 19, posted (2 years 8 months 3 weeks 1 day 15 hours ago) and read 14182 times:
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Quoting Marcouscg (Thread starter):
Boeing 747 – 13 years
Boeing 777 – 10 years
Boeing 767 – 14 years
Boeing 757 – 17 years

According to Airfleets.net:

747 avg age: 16.5 years
777 avg age: 12.4 years
767 avg age: 15.2 years
757 avg age: 17.7 years

Let's get the right info here......


User currently offlineKLASM83 From United States of America, joined Aug 2005, 628 posts, RR: 0
Reply 20, posted (2 years 8 months 3 weeks 1 day 15 hours ago) and read 14158 times:

Quoting laca773 (Reply 12):
737NG already in service can't be modified.

Indeed. But, as usual, Heath Techna can supply a retrofit kit that pretty closely emulates the Sky Interior. It seems that every time Boeing releases a new cabin interior, HT is right behind them on a retrofit kit for a similar-looking one.

I am sure UA would probably not spring to make all their eligible Boeing NB fleet have this interior, but it would be interesting to see if they did.



Don't you want to hang out and waste your life with us?
User currently offlinerdh3e From United States of America, joined Mar 2011, 1639 posts, RR: 3
Reply 21, posted (2 years 8 months 3 weeks 1 day 15 hours ago) and read 13991 times:

Quoting hannahpa (Reply 19):
Let's get the right info here......

He prefaced by saying that that was quoted in the article. Not to mention that those differences aren't really relevant to the discussion.

Quoting ual777 (Reply 3):
I hope not! The A320 is the better aircraft. Its roomier, quieter, and more modern. The overhead panel on the 73 is straight out of the 1960s.
Quoting qfa787380 (Reply 8):
Well you haven't flown on a 737NG with the new Sky interior then!

I haven't flow on the new Sky Interior, but the s-UA Airbus fleet is more comfortable in almost all aspects than the s-CO Boeing 73's.


User currently onlineboilerla From United States of America, joined Jul 2010, 360 posts, RR: 0
Reply 22, posted (2 years 8 months 3 weeks 1 day 14 hours ago) and read 13079 times:

Article here:
http://news.airwise.com/story/view/1322001384.html

doesn't mention the C-Series. Also says that the order will be for at least 50 of the existing generation of products, and up to 130 next generation narrowbody. That small of an order doesn't necessarily have to be split, especially since the 50 existing would be available for delivery next year.

This is obviously not for growth given Smisek's comments on the US domestic route network, so I imagine the bulk of this order will be to replace the non-TATL 757 fleet. Combined UA flies over 130 752s, right around the size of this order. The obvious replacements are the 739ER and A321, but doesn't fly the A321, and PMCO had 86 NGs on order. Leads me to believe this will be an order of 40-50 more 739ERs for immediate delivery with the rest being a MAX order. Wild guesses are fun  

Would like to see a C-Series order to replace the 20 or so 735s plus replace some RJ flying, but I can't find anything online that mentions anybody but Boeing & Airbus being in the running. I'd love to be wrong though. They have already begun parking the 735s without a successor lined up so those routes will have to be upguaged to a 73G or 319.


User currently offlinejoeljack From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 936 posts, RR: 0
Reply 23, posted (2 years 8 months 3 weeks 1 day 14 hours ago) and read 12901 times:

Quoting boilerla (Reply 22):
The obvious replacements are the 739ER and A321, but doesn't fly the A321, and PMCO had 86 NGs on order. Leads me to believe this will be an order of 40-50 more 739ERs for immediate delivery with the rest being a MAX order. Wild guesses are fun

This just makes my stomach turn as a UA elite. I absolutely love the 757 and avoid the 738 and 739 like the plague. I hate those things. I'll even book a CR7 or E170 over those 737's if possible. It's not a comparable aircraft in my book at all. The mid-cabin entrance with first left and coach right makes it the best narrowbody aircraft ever made. Many many additional reasons too...just not time to go into right now. This just sucks.

on a side note, I don't know anything about the A321, does that have a mid-cabin door? I do like the airbus' too even with a front door...I should probably reserve comment on the 321 until I've been in one.


User currently offlinekgaiflyer From United States of America, joined Jul 2008, 4262 posts, RR: 1
Reply 24, posted (2 years 8 months 3 weeks 1 day 13 hours ago) and read 12350 times:
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Quoting joeljack (Reply 23):
This just makes my stomach turn as a UA elite. I absolutely love the 757 and avoid the 738 and 739 like the plague. I hate those things. I'll even book a CR7 or E170 over those 737's if possible. It's not a comparable aircraft in my book at all. The mid-cabin entrance with first left and coach right makes it the best narrowbody aircraft ever made. Many many additional reasons too...just not time to go into right now. This just sucks.

In a year, I fly UA and CO equally (try getting to ELP on UA or GEG on CO). So it amuses me when I hear "If it isn't Boeing, I'm not going" or "Airbus means no fuss."

It's a bloody airplane, people -- it's not a girlfriend.   

Incidently, I've flown 738s with lousy seat pitch (WS for instance) and 320s with lousy seat pitch (AF for instance) . The lack of legroom and comfort is the fault of the airline and not the airplane.   

[Edited 2011-12-01 08:34:57]

25 ual777 : I have, but I am also speaking from a pilot perspective as well. The Sky interior is nice, but the CO seats are uncomfortable. They need to switch to
26 joeljack : 100% agree! Those CO seats are terrible in both first and coach. The reason my dad starting flying UA to begin with 20 years ago was the seats and it
27 Revelation : You say that like it's a bad thing! Signed, Superfly
28 LOWS : No, the A321s at LH and OS use the main (first) door. Of course, we have a different standard for Business on Domestic and IntraEuropean flights than
29 gigneil : What crap. Some aircraft have awful bins, and some do not. My carryon fits lovely along the outside of a 767 but barely at all along the inside, and
30 OURBOEING : The only airbus fleet that they have is the old A319-20s and everything else is Boeing. Won't it be cost effective for them to stick to one manufactur
31 Post contains images MauriceB : They have A320s aswell, the combined airbus fleet is like 150+ frames, + 25 A350's on order... that is more than the total combined fleet of most ran
32 gigneil : No. The commonality of a fleet of that size can be driven down by maintaining aggressive negotiations between the two manufacturers. Plus, with the u
33 bobnwa : I don't see how sticking with one manufacturer would result in being cost effective. I would think just the opposite
34 Stitch : Of the top of my head I can see savings being realized in things like a single crew pool, a single maintenance and spars pool and the ability to work
35 windy95 : You have never done a heavy check on a 737 have you? There is nothing next generation about the NG or the MAX. Same tired old airframe. Pretty interi
36 rdh3e : I think part of the problem for Boeing is they needed to keep so much the same to convince the FAA to keep the same type rating in order to sell cust
37 thebry : Exactly! I had the benefit of flying on one of AAs new 738s with the new Boeing Sky Interior just last week (DFW - SFO). The new bins make the cabin
38 captainstefan : The A320 is approximately 5" wider on the inside than the 737 - legroom isn't necessarily the issue, width of the seats is.
39 Post contains images TWA772LR : Love the UA A320s. Flew on from ORD-IAH in August and it just killed CO's 737s in comfort. However, if CO could change the seats from the current ones
40 Post contains links boilerla : The 739ER has an option for a rear door but no airline chooses to order it. It's only needed if you have more than 186 seats, which AFAIK is why the 7
41 kgaiflyer : CO and UA don't manufacture seats. Are you speaking of the B/E Aerospace seats, the Koito seats, the Thompson-Aero seats, the Weber seats, or somethin
42 Post contains images kgaiflyer : Oh no? Unless (as on WS ) someone reclines their seat requiring you to splay your legs.
43 cubastar : Let's see.......5 more inches of cabin width, spread across 6 coach seats. Believe that comes to about .833 of an inch more for each of the 6 rears t
44 Post contains images captainstefan : Sorry, I was mentioning the post i replied to - seat pitch is much more controllable by individual operators than the width is. Every little bit coun
45 OURBOEING : Very well summarized! Southwest is the biggest example of that model.
46 liftsifter : If United chooses to go with the 73MAX then they reall will have to go with the sky interior. Which is verryy costly.
47 TOMMY767 : The CO 737s will be getting E+ so that will help in the long run. Otherwise I completely agree with you. The CO 737s are terribly uncomfortable in Y.
48 YTZ : I think UA will go with Boeing for 130 739ERs to be delivered over the next few years. They already have tons of orders for the 737NG which they can s
49 YTZ : Any thoughts on the A350 order? I know they're meant to replace the 747s. But does that order still make sense for the merged company? I would think U
50 rdh3e : Have you read any of the threads about the pilot negotiations? That is NOT going to happen.
51 polot : They already have 737s with the sky interior in the fleet.
52 YTZ : Sorry. Haven't kept up. What is ruling this out now? Not just moving to regionals. But why not enough concessions to make a CS100 a sound proposition
53 DualQual : The RR PMCO 752s and 753s aren't going anywhere for a long while. And even only the oldest PMUA 752s are really the only targets for replacement.
54 Africawings : How come on one is mentioning the A321 as a 757 Replacement? As a frequent UA traveller I love the 757. I recently flew on a US Airways A321 from Char
55 TOMMY767 : Range issues. The A321 isn't nearly as capable as a 757. And the 739ERs are probably more efficient than the A321s in the long run.
56 GALLEYSTEW : 737 NG.....it is still a 737 with a fusalage width that has been around since the 707. As much as I hate to admit it, AIRBUS has the better product in
57 rdh3e : At this point we'll probably see what kind of scope relaxing AA ends up with, then see if maybe UA offers for the same scope but with better pay or s
58 YTZ : On the widebody side, I'm still wondering if new UA will cancel the A350 order. I don't see the point of this order now. Heck, I don't see the point o
59 AADC10 : UA has said that they would be willing to increase frequencies as the 744s and 772s fade away. They do not expect the A359 to be a direct replacement
60 kgaiflyer : Not really -- the newest models of each are just about equal to one another. Either an A321 or a B739ER would be nice to have.
61 boilerla : Mainly because UA already has almost 100 739s in the fleet or on order and NO A321s, so it doesn't make much sense (IMHO) to introduce a new type int
62 globetrekker64 : What are you talking about the 737 in all of its forms (Classic, NG, and MAX ) is the most popular civil aviation transport history in terms of numbe
63 Blueman87 : maybe a mix order half Airbus hal Boeing max and others
64 flyhossd : "...in this economy..." IIRC, UA/CO had over a billion dollar operating profit last quarter (before special items, etc.). In other words, what's so b
65 YTZ : Billion dollar profit which could evaporate quickly if the economy goes south. It's good that they are making profits. But the economy is very fragil
66 delta2ual : I hate to say it, but I agree with GALLEYSTEW. I personally am a Boeing fan, but paxs seem to prefer the Airbus narrowbodies. The aisle on the 737's
67 flyhossd : Really? What was the context of your earlier comments? Here are your comments in reply 52... So the context was clearly about mainline pilots making
68 globetrekker64 : Interior seat pitch and the way the seats are configured are up to the respective airlines. Its not the fault of the 737 or the 320 but how they are
69 Post contains links rdh3e : Easiest example I could think of. http://www.aanegotiations.com/docume...roposal_ExecutiveSummaries_000.pdf The document won't let you copy and paste
70 DogsOfWar : This will be interesting as PMUA was mostly Airbus narrow bodies and PMCO was all Boeing. Here's for a hope for a return to a Boeing fleet! i agree e
71 gigneil : Lol which is it? Return to a Boeing fleet, just keep the A320? That's the only Airbus plane they got, boss. NS
72 Antoniemey : Plus the A350s on order (though SOME will claim those will never be delivered, I think they will).
73 gigneil : No rational person thinks they'll never be delivered. Only the children. They have a contract to purchase the plane. What will they fly in its stead a
74 boilerla : Although I agree with you that the A350s will indeed be delivered, United stated when they firmed up the order that they have "high amounts" of flexi
75 gigneil : I'm thinking he likes the costs of the back of the 744 on some routes and realizes that for his super VFR routes, that might be the way to go. NS
76 rjm777ual : The 744 is slowly being retired, as one was just sent to Marana today from SFO . The 757 however, shows no sign of being retired with any US airline e
77 YTZ : There was a time when even 70 seaters were mainline. Now airplanes like the E-170/175 are steady regional birds and the CSeries and E-190/195 are bei
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