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Air Transat Fleet - Major All A330 Airline?  
User currently offlinedarkroast From Canada, joined Jan 2011, 41 posts, RR: 0
Posted (2 years 4 months 3 days 4 hours ago) and read 10990 times:

Any news on their fleet renewal plans? TS has to retire all of their A310's in the next year or two and their strategy appears to be to pick up A330s used (-200 and -300) ad-hoc. They'd have to install the 9-abreast economy seating that TS uses on most 330s also. Given how healthy the used A330 market is, is there really a financial advantage to this strategy? You'd also have to match engine types, etc..

Does TS plan to be an all A330 airline? and I mean a relatively major all A330 airline with a fleet around 20?

Air Transat just reported a Q4 loss and a poor 2011 as a whole - the Laurentian analyst's comments in the article are interesting.
http://ca.reuters.com/article/businessNews/idCATRE7BE0X420111215

25 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineskipness1E From United Kingdom, joined Aug 2007, 3073 posts, RR: 1
Reply 1, posted (2 years 4 months 3 days 4 hours ago) and read 10997 times:

Quoting darkroast (Thread starter):
TS has to retire all of their A310's in the next year or two

Why "has to"?


User currently offlinedarkroast From Canada, joined Jan 2011, 41 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (2 years 4 months 3 days 4 hours ago) and read 10939 times:

Quoting skipness1E (Reply 1):
Quoting darkroast (Thread starter):TS has to retire all of their A310's in the next year or two
Why "has to"?

Good point, should have said "plans to", or has stated plans to. I think that was in an interview by Jean-Marc Eustache in the recent past, will try to see if I can dig up that source.


User currently offlineskipness1E From United Kingdom, joined Aug 2007, 3073 posts, RR: 1
Reply 3, posted (2 years 4 months 3 days 4 hours ago) and read 10826 times:

I only ask as I haven't flown the A310 yet and I had them penciled them in for next year.....

User currently offlinesomething From United Kingdom, joined May 2011, 1633 posts, RR: 21
Reply 4, posted (2 years 4 months 3 days 3 hours ago) and read 10691 times:

I flew on an Air Transat A310 this summer and chatted with the pilots after arrival at YYZ. They told me TS initially targeted to have all A310s retired by the end of 2011 already, but is going to operate some of them for another year. They didn't know, or didn't wanna tell me the reason why.

It's a shame though. A310s are some of the nicest looking aircraft out there.



..sick of it. -K. Pilkington.
User currently offlineyyz717 From Canada, joined Sep 2001, 16228 posts, RR: 57
Reply 5, posted (2 years 4 months 3 days 2 hours ago) and read 10453 times:

TS operates 11 A330's and 11 A310's. A 12th 330 is due for delivery this week (not sure if it's a winter lease or a long term lease).

Given their thin profits and assuming a lack of capital, it will take some time to replace all 11 A310's whether with more 330's or adding a smaller type.

Their (likely) low margins suggest that the low-capital cost 313 should not be retired quickly.



Panam, TWA, Ansett, Eastern.......AC next? Might be good for Canada.
User currently offlinesomething From United Kingdom, joined May 2011, 1633 posts, RR: 21
Reply 6, posted (2 years 4 months 3 days 1 hour ago) and read 10213 times:

Quoting yyz717 (Reply 5):
Their (likely) low margins suggest that the low-capital cost 313 should not be retired quickly.

They run a strange airline though. I booked my TATL flight on a Wednesday night and left on a Thursday morning and I paid CA$400 for the round trip - in the peak season. I thought it was a desperate attempt to fill their empty plane, but much to my chargin there were hardly any vacant seats. I then kept an eye on the price development of other flights and literally nothing changed about the fare, as if they're fixed prices.

Opening a little ''yield management'' office should be able to help their cause.



..sick of it. -K. Pilkington.
User currently offlineYVRLTN From Canada, joined Oct 2006, 2347 posts, RR: 0
Reply 7, posted (2 years 4 months 2 days 17 hours ago) and read 8644 times:

Quoting skipness1E (Reply 3):
I only ask as I haven't flown the A310 yet and I had them penciled them in for next year.....

Be prepared    I did the same to tick off the A310 on my log. Never again...

Just flew a 9-abreast 332, and it didnt feel too bad compared to the 310 somehow, forget a nights sleep on an overnight though. One thing I have to say is the crew were great. And having paid less roundtrip (YVR-LGW) for both of us than a single fare with AC, one would expect no frills whatsoever, but plenty of complimentary beverage service, complimentary wine with the dinner, extra wet wipes & candies. I guess the RASM on those 332's must be pretty awesome, 343 seats in those babies, compared to 278 in an AC 333! Sure feels like it baggage reclaim too.....

I note one A310 was scrapped this week, but not heard of any others. They have just taken on a couple of former MX and KA 330's recently, plus some of the TCX birds will transition over to operate 100% of the Canadian Affair (UK) flights and three have come back from Hajj lease to GA, so quite an increase in capacity. Unless they are doing more flying, some more 310's must be parked, maybe to be used as back up aircraft.



Follow me on twitter for YVR movements @vernonYVR
User currently offlineairportugal310 From United States of America, joined Apr 2004, 3447 posts, RR: 2
Reply 8, posted (2 years 4 months 2 days 17 hours ago) and read 8419 times:

Quoting something (Reply 4):
It's a shame though. A310s are some of the nicest looking aircraft out there.

Agreed! That airplane will always hold a special place in my heart  



hit it and quit it
User currently onlinecslusarc From Canada, joined May 2005, 829 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (2 years 4 months 2 days 13 hours ago) and read 7279 times:

are any TS A333s still in a 8-seat abreast configuration?


--cslusarc from YWG
User currently offlinetribird1011 From Canada, joined Mar 2005, 207 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (2 years 4 months 2 days 10 hours ago) and read 6537 times:

Quoting cslusarc (Reply 9):
are any TS A333s still in a 8-seat abreast configuration?


yes, all A330-300's (CTS, KTS, TSD and TSO) are 8-seat across
the A330-200's are all 9-seat across, although they all have slightly different configurations, depending on where they came from.

the reason for the 8-abreast A333's and 9-abreast A332's is that by doing so they all have the same seat count (342 seats)

the 310's clock in at 249 seats - all 3-3-3!


User currently onlinecslusarc From Canada, joined May 2005, 829 posts, RR: 0
Reply 11, posted (2 years 4 months 2 days 10 hours ago) and read 6488 times:

Quoting tribird1011 (Reply 10):
the reason for the 8-abreast A333's and 9-abreast A332's is that by doing so they all have the same seat count (342 seats)

That's stupid because as a customer I'd always want to fly on a A333 as it offers a 1-2 inch wider seat, giving more enjoyment to your pax.



--cslusarc from YWG
User currently offlineclydenairways From Ireland, joined Jan 2007, 1196 posts, RR: 0
Reply 12, posted (2 years 4 months 2 days 9 hours ago) and read 5956 times:

Quoting tribird1011 (Reply 10):
the reason for the 8-abreast A333's and 9-abreast A332's is that by doing so they all have the same seat count (342 seats)

I can't really see the logic in that, what's the point then in having the larger aircraft then?


User currently offlinetribird1011 From Canada, joined Mar 2005, 207 posts, RR: 0
Reply 13, posted (2 years 4 months 2 days 8 hours ago) and read 5653 times:

Quoting clydenairways (Reply 12):
I can't really see the logic in that, what's the point then in having the larger aircraft then?



I'm sure they have their reasons (although i'm not sure what they are; the -200s do have more range than the 300s), but it does give them the ability to swap out airplanes if one goes mechanical without having to worry about leaving anybody behind...


User currently offlinekl692 From Canada, joined Feb 2006, 675 posts, RR: 0
Reply 14, posted (2 years 4 months 2 days 5 hours ago) and read 4830 times:

This explains why i kept on seeing A330 at TS hanger in YYZ by landmark. some of them even had the tail painted with different airline logo. I guess they are were in for make over. I happy to see TS moving up into bigger A/C.


A310, A330,A346,B73H, B747,B772,B77W,CRJ
User currently offlinetribird1011 From Canada, joined Mar 2005, 207 posts, RR: 0
Reply 15, posted (2 years 4 months 2 days 4 hours ago) and read 4356 times:

Quoting kl692 (Reply 14):
some of them even had the tail painted with different airline logo

If you saw it within the last week, that was not a new aircraft. That was 1 of the 4 returning from the Hajj (GPTS) . It had the Garuda Indonesia paint job (decals, not paint) - it is back to full Transat livery.


User currently offlinedarkroast From Canada, joined Jan 2011, 41 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (2 years 4 months 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 4200 times:

Quoting something (Reply 6):
They run a strange airline though. I booked my TATL flight on a Wednesday night and left on a Thursday morning and I paid CA$400 for the round trip - in the peak season. I thought it was a desperate attempt to fill their empty plane, but much to my chargin there were hardly any vacant seats. I then kept an eye on the price development of other flights and literally nothing changed about the fare, as if they're fixed prices.

Opening a little ''yield management'' office should be able to help their cause.

I would guess that yield management software costs money and their current platform would need to support it. Could a systems problem be the reason for their fare structure?

Charging $400 return for a TATL walk-up fare is incredible..


User currently offlineViscount724 From Switzerland, joined Oct 2006, 24061 posts, RR: 23
Reply 17, posted (2 years 4 months 1 day 21 hours ago) and read 3961 times:

Quoting tribird1011 (Reply 13):
Quoting clydenairways (Reply 12):
I can't really see the logic in that, what's the point then in having the larger aircraft then?



I'm sure they have their reasons (although i'm not sure what they are; the -200s do have more range than the 300s), but it does give them the ability to swap out airplanes if one goes mechanical without having to worry about leaving anybody behind...

Leases may also be cheaper on the -300s since they're significantly older on average than the -200s. Two of the four -300s are 16 years old.


User currently onlinecedarjet From United Kingdom, joined May 1999, 7925 posts, RR: 54
Reply 18, posted (2 years 4 months 1 day 21 hours ago) and read 3923 times:

Quoting skipness1E (Reply 3):

I only ask as I haven't flown the A310 yet and I had them penciled them in for next year.....

Do it - Air Transat is definitely the easiest airline to fly an A310. Other options are airlines like PIA and Biman Bangladesh which have visa and political problems (Pakistan) or at least, not particularly desirable or touristic destinations (both - although I am in Bangladesh as I type this, and everyone's very nice, just not a lot of things to do as a tourist). Whereas Canadian cities are wealthy and safe and walkable and there's tonnes to do. A weekend in Toronto or Montreal in spring with a transatlantic crossing by A310, how much more perfect can life be?

Re Air Transat, I have flown with them across the pond dozens of times and they're not too bad, I'm not a fattie so I don't have a problem with the seat width - although you do notice it, expect to have some physical contact with your neighbour. Food is OK, crew generally very nice and friendly, timekeeping has always been good in my experience although there are some horror stories out there. I would recommend heartily, the type is now nearly as rare as a DC-10 or 727 and you'll save a hundred bucks or more over a mainstream airline such as BA or AC which you can spend at the destination, maybe on a nice meal where you can get together with another a.netter and discuss how wonderful the A310 is!

(Barely worth mentioning but, no, TS don't have any PTVs. The reason it's hardly worth mentioning is, as a child I learned to read, so I relish the time aloft to enjoy a book or some magazines. If you really need to watch TV to make the experience of flying pleasurable, maybe try another airline, or, better still, another planet.)



fly Saha Air 707s daily from Tehran's downtown Mehrabad to Mashhad, Kish Island and Ahwaz
User currently offlinetribird1011 From Canada, joined Mar 2005, 207 posts, RR: 0
Reply 19, posted (2 years 4 months 1 day 19 hours ago) and read 3802 times:

Quoting cedarjet (Reply 18):
Barely worth mentioning but, no, TS don't have any PTVs

Almost correct... 2 A330-200's DO have PTVs, the 2 acquired from Mexicana (GTSR and GTSZ)... There are talks about a major cabin refurbishment fleet wide -- early next spring --(330's anyway) and it seems that the installation of PTV's is on the "menu" so to speak...


User currently offlineYULWinterSkies From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 2169 posts, RR: 5
Reply 20, posted (2 years 4 months 1 day 18 hours ago) and read 3761 times:

Quoting cslusarc (Reply 11):
That's stupid because as a customer I'd always want to fly on a A333 as it offers a 1-2 inch wider seat, giving more enjoyment to your pax.

No, most customers get a cheap flight, they could not care less how many seats there are per row, nor do they know which airplane they are flying on, nor will they even notice the difference if they get a -300 one way and a -200 the other way.
If you specifically book a flight which is run by a -300, don't put too much money on it as TS has a tendency to swap equipment often!

Quoting cedarjet (Reply 18):
Food is OK, crew generally very nice and friendly, timekeeping has always been good in my experience although there are some horror stories out there.

I'm not so sure I agree with the "food". But well, true also that horror stories are everywhere, not just at TS, and most of the time, based on a bad one-time experience or very biased or non-experienced customers.



When I doubt... go running!
User currently offlineFly2yyz From Canada, joined Jan 2006, 1029 posts, RR: 2
Reply 21, posted (2 years 4 months 1 day 17 hours ago) and read 3705 times:

Quoting tribird1011 (Reply 19):
Almost correct... 2 A330-200's DO have PTVs, the 2 acquired from Mexicana (GTSR and GTSZ)... There are talks about a major cabin refurbishment fleet wide -- early next spring --(330's anyway) and it seems that the installation of PTV's is on the "menu" so to speak...

3 now...another 330-200 arrives and I believe has already started operating.. (GTSJ), this aircraft is from Thomas Cook and has the new livery...


User currently offlinekl692 From Canada, joined Feb 2006, 675 posts, RR: 0
Reply 22, posted (2 years 4 months 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 3656 times:

Quoting tribird1011 (Reply 15):

not recently but it was at then of the summer. I beelive it was close to October if anything and yes it was Garuda that was painted (decal) on tail.



A310, A330,A346,B73H, B747,B772,B77W,CRJ
User currently offlineyyz717 From Canada, joined Sep 2001, 16228 posts, RR: 57
Reply 23, posted (2 years 4 months 1 day 14 hours ago) and read 3554 times:

Quoting cedarjet (Reply 18):
Do it - Air Transat is definitely the easiest airline to fly an A310.

In the summer months, TS sells seats on 2-3x weekly YYZ-YUL flights which are probably just positioning flights between TATL flights anyway. This would be the cheapest way to try the A310 (if you're already in YYZ or YUL).



Panam, TWA, Ansett, Eastern.......AC next? Might be good for Canada.
User currently offlinebennett123 From United Kingdom, joined Aug 2004, 7199 posts, RR: 3
Reply 24, posted (2 years 3 months 4 weeks 1 day 21 hours ago) and read 3057 times:

YVRLTN.

I seem to recall 1 A310 being about to be scrapped, has this now happened.

iirc it was MSN 413.


User currently offlineBY738 From Tonga, joined Sep 2000, 2173 posts, RR: 1
Reply 25, posted (2 years 3 months 4 weeks 1 day 21 hours ago) and read 3043 times:

Just of out of interest, what is the definition of a "Major" airline, and does TS fulfill the criteria ?

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