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Australian Aviation Thread #57  
User currently offlineTN486 From Australia, joined Jul 2008, 941 posts, RR: 2
Posted (3 years 2 days 21 hours ago) and read 24153 times:

In Australian Aviation Thread #56 (by TN486 Nov 14 2011 in Civil Aviation) we discussed/announced the following:
- 787 tour SYD/MEL.
- Air Australia new website in op, and VC applies for 4 x weekly service to Vietnam.
- Tiger reports $20M loss.
- Air North announce new service TVL - DRW.
- QR announce PER as a new future destination.
- IASC determination re SAA/QF codeshare arrangements.
- QF Link announce BNE - GLT with 717's first quarter 2012.
- QF new configs for A380's.
- More about QF industrial dispute/grounding etc etc.
- MAS rumour re A380 service to MEL from Apr 2012.
- Polynesian Blue renamed Virgin Samoa.
- MI (Silk Air) to commence 4 x weekly SIN - DRW Mar 2002.
- NJS fined for underpaying pilots.

The festive season is about to descend on us all, let us all enjoy it safely, and happily, and may it be everything you wish it to be.
May discussions begin in our new thread, cheers.

remember the t shirt "I own an airline"on the front - "qantas" on the back
227 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
User currently offlineBoeing767-300 From Australia, joined Sep 2001, 664 posts, RR: 0
Reply 1, posted (3 years 2 days 18 hours ago) and read 23993 times:

Attached is a You tube link to ANZ 777 leaving for Auckland. I cannot recall an ANZ 777 in Perth before. Filmed from the new viewing area Saturday 17th of December.

ZK-OKC departing Perth NZ176 to Auckland

Thanks to Geoffrey Thomas and team for making the viewing area happen.

Apparently the 6th January is also scheduled 777 for ANZ175/6

User currently offlineBNE From Australia, joined Mar 2000, 3189 posts, RR: 12
Reply 2, posted (3 years 2 days 5 hours ago) and read 23737 times:

Being that it is airliners.net so a good place to add any rumours.

How long before Qantas return to the Gold Coast.

A friend was visiting the Gold Coast airport and there were a bunch of men/women in suits (around 6 people) holding clipboards and displaying their Qantas branded ASIC, as well as a Gold Coast Airport manager of some sorts.

Link to story with appropriate flame proof suit.

Why fly non stop when you can connect
User currently offlineqf002 From Australia, joined Jul 2011, 3020 posts, RR: 2
Reply 3, posted (3 years 2 days 4 hours ago) and read 23705 times:

Quoting BNE (Reply 2):
appropriate flame proof suit.

  We will see... I'm not particularly optimistic, but it would be great if they did jump back into OOL (and some other JQ-only routes/destinations). I can still think of plenty of alternative explanations to what he heard/saw, and would be surprised if they were being so open about their inspection, rather than being a bit more discreet if they are really returning to OOL. It just seems a bit fishy having that number of people travelling to OOL just to take gate measurements (I'm sure the airport already has these, and JQ would as well), look at the 737 stop line and inform the airport that they don't need rear stairs.

That's just the cynic in me... Would love to see it happen  

User currently offlinemariner From New Zealand, joined Nov 2001, 25692 posts, RR: 85
Reply 4, posted (3 years 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 23613 times:
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At last, there is a little industrial harmony at Qantas:


"Qantas and engineers 'hand in hand', says union

THE union leader who warned Australians not to fly with Qantas changed his tune today after licensed engineers confirmed they had reached an agreement with the airline.

The Australian Licenced Aircraft Engineers Association became the first of three warring Qantas unions to reach a settlement after the grounding of the airline led to compulsory arbitration by Fair Work Australia.

Union national secretary Steve Purvinas said the union and Qantas would go before Fair Work Australia "hand in hand" today, meaning there was no need for the tribunal to impose its own resolution."

One down - two to go. But at least Mr. Shorten seems to have played his part:

Mr Purvinas also said federal Workplace Relations Minister Bill Shorten had played an important part in encouraging the parties to broker a deal."


aeternum nauta
User currently offlinealangirvan From New Zealand, joined Nov 2000, 2106 posts, RR: 1
Reply 5, posted (3 years 2 days ago) and read 23453 times:

Do you think Qantas will return to the Gold Coast to support the Commonwealth Games (still a few years away), or will all the important people have to fly to the Gold Coast in Jetstar?

This would be a great opportunity for JB to organise Virgin Australia to be the official airline of the Gold Coast Commonwealth Games.

User currently offlineIndianicWorld From Australia, joined Jun 2001, 3028 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (3 years 2 days ago) and read 23421 times:

Quoting alangirvan (Reply 5):
Do you think Qantas will return to the Gold Coast to support the Commonwealth Games (still a few years away), or will all the important people have to fly to the Gold Coast in Jetstar?

I don't think the CWG will have much baring on it, as the market will dictate which way they choose to go. With a re-launched DJ/VA product being deployed, the competition has ramped up for QF though.

Quoting alangirvan (Reply 5):
This would be a great opportunity for JB to organise Virgin Australia to be the official airline of the Gold Coast Commonwealth Games.

After the AN games sponsorship in 2000 he may choose to save his cash  

User currently offlinesydscott From Australia, joined Oct 2003, 3189 posts, RR: 20
Reply 7, posted (3 years 1 day 23 hours ago) and read 23380 times:

Quoting alangirvan (Reply 5):
Do you think Qantas will return to the Gold Coast to support the Commonwealth Games (still a few years away), or will all the important people have to fly to the Gold Coast in Jetstar?

I would have thought Qantas would be watching to see what sort of Corporate Contracts DJ wins in the Gold Coast market and whether those losses are enough for it to put mainline back into OOL to stop the losses.

User currently offlinemariner From New Zealand, joined Nov 2001, 25692 posts, RR: 85
Reply 8, posted (3 years 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 23280 times:
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Travel Weekly is saying that Air Australia has confirmed will start both China and Vietnam next year:


"Air Australia will start three times weekly services to Shanghai and Ho Chi Minh from Melbourne and Brisbane in June 2012 pending regulatory approval, the carrier has confirmed."

There's som,e interesting stuff from Mr. James as to how they intend to approach (package) the market:

"While James claimed the airline now had outbound distribution “down pat”, he was daunted by the task of distribution in China, its first inbound market.

"It's one of the big risks - if we don't get distribution right in the Chinese market, it could all go pear-shaped," he said, adding that the airline would enlist government support to help them “do it right”.

And also a comment on the Honolulu service:

"Meanwhile, he claimed that load factors for the airline’s new services from Brisbane and Melbourne to Honolulu, which took to the skies last week, were averaging 92%."


aeternum nauta
User currently offlineBen175 From Australia, joined Jul 2008, 719 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (3 years 1 day 21 hours ago) and read 23234 times:

Quoting mariner (Reply 8):
"Meanwhile, he claimed that load factors for the airline’s new services from Brisbane and Melbourne to Honolulu, which took to the skies last week, were averaging 92%."

Fantastic news, as I'm planning to fly PER-MEL-HNL-BNE-PER on Air Australia and Qantas for the domestic legs in July next year in Business.

I wonder if Air Australia will ever try long haul from PER? NRT, PVG, PEK, SGN, ICN, TPE and MNL are all large ports without a direct service.
CZ is advertising their new CAN service hugely - I've come across cut out flight attendants with advertisements in the middle of the city!

User currently offlineAusA380 From Australia, joined Jan 2009, 310 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (3 years 1 day ago) and read 22777 times:

Interesting quote in my Crickey e-mail today (Fair use)

Running the sums on the Qantas fleet. Our aviation guru Ben Sandilands has often commented on the lack of 777 aircraft in the Qantas fleet. An anonymous Qantas 747 captain has lobbed in with some stats that reveal the answer:

"Last week I flew to LAX [Los Angeles] on a 747 and spoke to the Delta 777 behind me. For the same sector Sydney/LAX these are the comparable fuel figures: 747s burn off 136,400kg; 777s burn 95,500kg. Fuel flow in cruise: 747s do 11,800kg per hour; 777s do 7700kg per hour. Pax [passenger numbers] on board: 747s have 260; 777s have 232. I didnt get the actual payload carried by the 777 but on pax numbers they carried roughly 10% less paxs for 30% less fuel used. We are provided with a cost figure by Qantas for additional uplift of every 1000kgs in dollar terms. On that figure the extra 28 paxs cost $27,000. You don't need to be Einstein to know why we are in such trouble."

User currently offlinealangirvan From New Zealand, joined Nov 2000, 2106 posts, RR: 1
Reply 11, posted (3 years 1 day ago) and read 22768 times:

You may have seen in other threads that Etihad is taking a substantial shareholding in Air Berlin. Air Berlin will be providing a service between the new airport at Berlin and Abu Dhabi - this flight will give good connections onto EY flights to Australia.

Interesting thing is that Air Berlin is in the process of joining OneWorld (sponsored by BA). Etihad also has signed an agreement with Malaysia Airlines, which is also joining OneWorld (that is, if both AirBerlin and Malaysian continue to want to join OneWorld).

So, passengers might fly on a Virgin Australia operated flight to AUH, and connect onto an Air Berlin flight to Germany, both flights with EY codeshare.

Etihad does have codeshares with a lot of carriers, including Alitalia and Olympic. This could cause some confusion as to whether you can use certain combinations of carriers, if you were doing a trip between Australia and Germany or Italy.

User currently offlinemariner From New Zealand, joined Nov 2001, 25692 posts, RR: 85
Reply 12, posted (3 years 1 day ago) and read 22751 times:
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Quoting AusA380 (Reply 10):
Interesting quote in my Crickey e-mail today (Fair use)

Running the sums on the Qantas fleet. Our aviation guru Ben Sandilands has often commented on the lack of 777 aircraft in the Qantas fleet. An anonymous Qantas 747 captain has lobbed in with some stats that reveal the answer:

I wonder if Ben Sandilands will ever call a truce on his war with Qantas.


aeternum nauta
User currently offlinegemuser From Australia, joined Nov 2003, 5808 posts, RR: 6
Reply 13, posted (3 years 23 hours ago) and read 22716 times:

Quoting AusA380 (Reply 10):
747s have 260; 777s have 232.

I have sever doubts about these numbers. They would mean that QF have a load facyor of 55-60% and DL 90% or so. Some how I doubt that spread of load factors.


DC23468910;B72172273373G73873H74374475275376377L77W;A319 320321332333343;BAe146;C402;DHC6;F27;L188;MD80MD85
User currently offlinemaxter From Australia, joined May 2009, 225 posts, RR: 0
Reply 14, posted (3 years 23 hours ago) and read 22689 times:

I see that Perth Airport PER has officially opened the spotters area. I think I'll head over this weekend and check it out...



User currently offlineZkpilot From New Zealand, joined Mar 2006, 4865 posts, RR: 10
Reply 15, posted (3 years 20 hours ago) and read 22541 times:

Quoting AusA380 (Reply 10):
Interesting quote in my Crickey e-mail today (Fair use)

Running the sums on the Qantas fleet. Our aviation guru Ben Sandilands has often commented on the lack of 777 aircraft in the Qantas fleet. An anonymous Qantas 747 captain has lobbed in with some stats that reveal the answer:

"Last week I flew to LAX [Los Angeles] on a 747 and spoke to the Delta 777 behind me. For the same sector Sydney/LAX these are the comparable fuel figures: 747s burn off 136,400kg; 777s burn 95,500kg. Fuel flow in cruise: 747s do 11,800kg per hour; 777s do 7700kg per hour. Pax [passenger numbers] on board: 747s have 260; 777s have 232. I didnt get the actual payload carried by the 777 but on pax numbers they carried roughly 10% less paxs for 30% less fuel used. We are provided with a cost figure by Qantas for additional uplift of every 1000kgs in dollar terms. On that figure the extra 28 paxs cost $27,000. You don't need to be Einstein to know why we are in such trouble."

Not to mention the extra space available in the hold for revenue earning freight on a 777.

56 types. 38 countries. 24 airlines.
User currently offlinejetfuel From Australia, joined Jan 2005, 2252 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (2 years 12 months 4 days 19 hours ago) and read 22230 times:

Qf is still hurting badly with forward bookings. The Fin review of today has an article about QF monitoring the Euro finance crisis and its ongoing impact. Talk of cancelling FRA route and even returning leased a/c early to survive

Where's the passion gone out of the airline industry? The smell of jetfuel and the romance of taking a flight....
User currently offlineBoeing767-300 From Australia, joined Sep 2001, 664 posts, RR: 0
Reply 17, posted (2 years 12 months 4 days 18 hours ago) and read 22163 times:

Shame about forward bookings and I won't be negative but as soon as you mention Jetstar or Alan Joyce EK A380 or NZ 77W across the tasman is severely testing my loyalty despite my platinum status.

Nice that one of the Unions has settled but Joyce is kidding himself. The problems at Perth regarding weather on 6th December was more about Joyce than anything else. The festering wounds with the other two unions need to be sorted. Was not coincidence that Virgin operated practically normal schedule on the same day......

User currently offlineJQflightie From Australia, joined Mar 2009, 1010 posts, RR: 1
Reply 18, posted (2 years 12 months 4 days 18 hours ago) and read 22115 times:

Quoting Boeing767-300 (Reply 17):

Im sorry but i was one of the crew stuck on one of those jets out on the tarmac! I can tell you now it was the overflow of aircraft, and nothing to do with QF, there were no-where to park aircraft, it was more PER Airport to blame due to being to small to support a Hub. Also, further to DJ still operating that night, along with other carriers such as Alliance, you will find that they are actually under 'investigation' now by for not having procedures set in place for their staff not to be out on a tarmac in an electrical storm! QF follows a strict saftey culture, as you will know safety is our number one priority, and thats not just for pax, it also goes for staff, i really dont think its fair that people blame QF for that storm, and for actually protecting thier employee's by not sending them out on a tarmac in an eletrical storm!

User currently offlineQF175 From Portugal, joined Mar 2007, 701 posts, RR: 2
Reply 19, posted (2 years 12 months 4 days ago) and read 21850 times:

* Malaysia Airlines is suspending its Perth - Kota Kinabalu service with effect 30JAN12

* Air Australia plans to commence thrice weekly services from Brisbane and Melbourne to Shanghai and Ho Chi Minh City from June 2012. Services to Bali, Phuket and Honolulu will be increased in March 2012

* Air New Zealand has been awarded the Norfolk Island air services contract and will begin flying exclusively to Brisbane and Sydney from Norfolk Island in March 2012 (both 2x weekly and commence 02MAR12)

* Canberra-based Brindabella Airlines will simplify its range of fare products from 17JAN12, reducing from 4 to 3 fare categories. on 21NOV11 the Airline introduced an additional Monday Brisbane to Tamworth service, bringing total weekly services to 14 weekly. Additionally, Canberra - Tamworth is now a permanent service and runs 2x weekly

* A new start-up Airline, Calibre Airways is expected to commence FIFO Fokker 50 operations ex-Brisbane in 2012 and are currently looking to recruite type rated tech crew

* Virgin Australia has opened its newest lounge in Mackay, with a seating capacity of 70 guests. The lounge experience is modelled on that of its new Brisbane and Melbourne lounges. Virgin Australia will also introduce additional Mackay to Brisbane flights in March 2012, bring weekly services to 78, the highest frequency of any airline on the route

* Emirates will introduce the A380 on its Dubai - Melbourne - Auckland service in October 2012, replacing the existing 777-300ER. MEL will be the second port in Australia to see Emirates A380s

Merry Christmas


[Edited 2011-12-21 22:59:49]

User currently offlineBen175 From Australia, joined Jul 2008, 719 posts, RR: 0
Reply 20, posted (2 years 12 months 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 21697 times:

Quoting QF175 (Reply 19):
* Malaysia Airlines is suspending its Perth - Kota Kinabalu service with effect 30JAN12

What a shame! I believe this was the last chip to kill off BI's PER-BWN service which ceased in October. I know this flight didn't sell but it was cool to see an MH 738 down under.

User currently offlinegardermoen From Australia, joined Jul 1999, 1523 posts, RR: 1
Reply 21, posted (2 years 12 months 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 21678 times:

Ben175, I feel the same way too. BI would have stood a chance with a reduced 320/319 service if MH had withdrawn early on.
From some 6 odd weekly flights between PER and east Malaysia/Brunei, there will soon be zero.

User currently offlineJQflightie From Australia, joined Mar 2009, 1010 posts, RR: 1
Reply 22, posted (2 years 12 months 3 days 19 hours ago) and read 21620 times:

Quoting Ben175 (Reply 20):
Quoting gardermoen (Reply 21):

I flew on this service in June, BKI-PER on the B738 BSI  unfortunately only 2 of us in J-Class and 59 in Y-Class
Its sad to see it go, if only people knew how beautiful Sabah really is, they would want to go, but i guess that comes down to advertising, which i only really saw in PER and no other capital.  

User currently offlineBen175 From Australia, joined Jul 2008, 719 posts, RR: 0
Reply 23, posted (2 years 12 months 3 days 18 hours ago) and read 21552 times:

I know it's probably overly-optimistic thinking, but any chance we could see AK commence BKI-PER service? AirAsia know how to market down under and they've established a huge presence in WA - with 1-2 daily KUL flights and up to 5 DPS flights a day. With the advertising, I really do think this route is viable - even at say 3 x weekly.

I'll always remember when MH used to fly in a 330 from Kuching every Tuesday and Saturday. Things have really changed.

User currently offlineJQflightie From Australia, joined Mar 2009, 1010 posts, RR: 1
Reply 24, posted (2 years 12 months 3 days 18 hours ago) and read 21521 times:

Quoting Ben175 (Reply 24):

I heard DJ wanted to start PER-BKI-PER

Or dare i say it... even if JQ start the route .... sigh

and the biggest long shot.... but with our tie-up with MH, maybe QF could start. ALOT of 738's overnight in PER everynight, BKI is actually a good connecting point in Asia, you have, if you time the flight right;
KUL x 9 MH
HKG x 2 MH and KA
HND x 1 MH
KCH x 1 MH
TPE x 1 MH

25 Post contains images Ben175 : BKI would tie in nicely with DJ, they already fly to DPS and HKT. JQ another (but smaller) possibility. QF commencing a NEW international route from
26 Post contains links JQflightie : Hahaha completely agree! but one could wish! On another note.... Oh dear, and how did we all miss this one? DJ to start SYD-DRW to connect with the M
27 6thfreedom : DJ possibly with a B738, to diversify their flying. at 5:35 block time, AK wouldn't do it with a narrowbody and it would be a stretch for JQ too.
28 Post contains links jetfuel : Huge dramas with Air Australia and one of the largest travel insurers. This has been going on for weeks but is at the point of creating major havoc ht
29 Post contains images qf002 : We didn't It was in the last thread, and raised in the dedicated MI SIN-DRW thread...
30 kiwiandrew : To be honest it is news to me that any travel insurer still offers insolvency cover. I remember that most insurers in NZ/Australia used to, but after
31 Post contains images JQflightie : haha awesome, ive spent a couple months away from here..... sorry everyone.. and in my defense i live in WA so im behind
32 fiscal : See JQFlightie below - this is pretty accurate and confirmed by an QF engineer... That some storm - I dont know that I have seen such an extended len
33 Zkpilot : Which really is one of the biggest things that actually does need to be insured for! Its a low risk but if it happens then there goes your trip and m
34 kiwiandrew : I have heard of that in some countries, specifically the UK, but I was not aware that it was the practice in this part of the world ( having said tha
35 Post contains images SCL767 : QF 017 recently diverted to SCL. QF's Boeing 747-400ERs are seemingly becoming a regular feature at SCL. Next March, QF will luckily become a permanen
36 JQflightie : it looks like as of 15FEB12 MH124 and MH126 PER-KUL goes from B772 to A333 Also couldnt find this in Thread 56 (yes i had a good look this time) QR ha
37 gemuser : No, it's 620 nm shorter (great circle) than QFs own AKL-LAX A332 service. I belive there are longer A332 routes, it came up in another thread a week
38 JQflightie : ok thanks. i didnt realise out AKL-LAX was that long... thats what happens when you sleep for most of it!
39 FlyboyOz : It means that MH has a new interior cabin and seats inside A333 and also new livery as well. I don't think that i would like to fly on that A332 on t
40 Sethor : From 27 Oct 2012 QR900/QR901 will operate daily with Boeing 777-200LR.
41 VH-BZF : A mate of mine down in Melbourne said he saw an AtlasJet A330-200 in on a couple of days last week. Anybody have any more info? Maybe a charter or wet
42 JQflightie : I Believe that is Air Australia ....... wet lease
43 CXfirst : Does anybody know why the QR website won't allow me to book certain routes. I was trying to book PER-DOH-OSL. I know that it didn't allow me to do thi
44 VH-BZF : Thanks BZF
45 RyanairGuru : If the website doesn't offer it then Flight Centre is your friend... Whenever my mother (loyal SQ flyer) goes to the UK (on business) she ends up goi
46 CXfirst : The thing is that i'm just after a quote, as there are many other options. I don't really want to go through the hassle of flight centre (partly as i
47 jetfuel : Just noticed Strategic VH-SSA A330 operating for Air Pacific tonight flight FJI930 MEL-NAN tonight
48 eaglefarm4 : Yes it did BNE-NAN as well yesterday FJ9091 mayby a positioning flight.Currently doing FJ 923 NAN-BNE.
49 eaglefarm4 : Brisbane Growth. Virgin will add a extra 5 services a day Mon-Fri plus some weekend services in January with more flights to be added in Feb and March
50 thegeek : With 20/day BNE-SYD on DJ you'd think they'd upgauge to a bigger plane, 739ER at least. Or will that (and SYD-MEL) go to A330 eventually?
51 ZuluAlpha : The second runway at BNE can't come soon enough by the sounds of things. Also, with this many movements, we might see a few more wide bodies with QF
52 tayser : Funny thing about movements...... the lack of any real large regional operation out of MEL puts it quite close to BNE's movement numbers (MEL 205k, BN
53 vhebb : Speaking of BNE I see you mention the B717 base and the proposed services to MKY, ROK, and GLT. Does anyone know more? No official announcement has be
54 Post contains links eaglefarm4 : BNE currently is 196,000 movements OCT11-SEP 12 and the current past 2 monthly movements have now surpassed MEL.Around 199,000 movements expected in 2
55 thegeek : Thought it was indefinitely deferred? Start charging the airlines per movement, especially at peak times and see how quickly they upgauge their fligh
56 ZuluAlpha : Honestly, I don't know. Though I should correct myself, there is already the short second cross runway at BNE where the turboprops use most often (an
57 Post contains links TN486 : Is this the info you refer to? Re para 2 of press release. http://www.qantas.com.au/regions/dyn.../details?ArticleID=2011/sep11/5186
58 eaglefarm4 : Sorry what i meant was no info on the routes for the 717 except GLT .No details on routes except GLT or schedules have been advised.On other forums th
59 BNE : The dirt from the new cross river tunnels in Brisbane had to go somewhere and it will form part of the ground for the new 2nd runway and taxiways. So
60 Post contains images JQflightie : ive been 'lucky' enough to land on the short runway in BNE on a A320, had to offload pax and luggage on TSV tho... as the main run way was closed for
61 VH-BZF : The second runway in Brisbane is a major engineering project and even after they clear the land and prepare the sand base, I understand the sand base
62 thegeek : All that assumes that the rapid growth of aviation will continue unchecked. It is possible that peak oil will increase the cost of flying significantl
63 joelyboy911 : I just thought I would stop by to say I was a little surprised to see (for the first time, I know I'm slow here) the V Australia 777 re-titled with th
64 747m8te : Indeed! looks better in the V Australia colours...if they repaint it its gonna be one big boring white 77W...
65 ZuluAlpha : Agreed. look how long the dirt has been dug up at the Moreton Bay end of the BNE dom terminal for the satellite extension, that has been going on for
66 Ben175 : I just realised something - QR's new PER-DOH service departs at 22:30 - the exact same time as EK's overnight service to DXB! Not even 5 minutes diffe
67 BAeRJ100 : And arrives at (almost) the same time too - talk about competing head-to-head.
68 CXfirst : Eventually it will be the same aircraft type as well! But, really, it's to be expected. The best connection times to Europe from the gulf are the mor
69 Ben175 : I love how QR is taking on EK and going the whole mile! It's going to begreat to see which aircraft makes it out on the runway first when you're out
70 JQflightie : This is PER airport remember.... they probably dont even realise they have QR flying to the 'Airport' (lack of) or even going at the same time as the
71 Ben175 : PER management is a mess, they don't even issue press releases on the website when new airlines announce services like they used to. Also, I didn't re
72 FlyboyOz : I would love to see QR in all the Australia cities so that we can have a choice which airlines is the best to fly to europe and other cities. I hope t
73 Flyingsottsman : Yeah give it time like EY and EK you will find before to long QR will serve all the major capital citys.
74 9MMPD : When will SYD, MEL, BNE, PER and ADL see 787 operations and who will be the first carrier to send their 787s to these ports? I assume JQ will be the f
75 EK413 : It's certainly going to be interesting... Wondering if the EK pilots will apply the 'go slow' approach while taxing out for departure and vice versa
76 Flyingsottsman : Dont bank on that we have been hearing for a long long time AI is comming to MEL, my wife's uncle who works at MEL even he says he will belive it whe
77 BAeRJ100 : Not sure about WAC themselves, but the contractors at the international terminal are certainly aware it's going to have the same times as EK. Will be
78 eaglefarm4 : Latest plans by AI is to combine SYD and MEL and if they commence then 25 march is the date.Yes 787.
79 EK413 : & pigs might fly by the time AI commence services to OZ in general... The airline has announced it's plans to serve Australia in 2005! EK413
80 alangirvan : This is a what could have been. A few years ago, Indian Airlines (IC) announced they would operate A330-200s DEL-SIN-MEL. SIN would have been a hub,
81 eaglefarm4 : Hey i agree pigs may fly but i am privy to this info and this was amended a few weeks ago to be both SYD,MEL .Originally it was to be only MEL.Whether
82 6thfreedom : not sure why this is such a big deal... most airlines that fly between similar regions have vary similar arrival and departure times. look at asian c
83 CXfirst : For PER, my money was on QR, however, QR are upgauging PER to the 77L before the 787 comes in. I think this will be successful, so I don't see QR red
84 sydscott : My money was on NZ or QF for AKL-PER or SIN-PER.
85 Ben175 : There's talk of NZ continuing AKL-PER to either JNB or BOM with the 787.
86 thegeek : Wouldn't that require CASA approval, which would be unlikely?
87 sydscott : It would require the 787 to have the appropriate ETOPS approvals for it to be commercial and it would also probably need a change in the Australia/So
88 Post contains links thegeek : From CASA, unless I'm mistaken. Great other points why the JNB idea isn't happening. Not sure why DJ need to be involved except for domestic feed. Si
89 kiwiandrew : Open skies between New Zealand and Australia wouldn't mean a thing unless the Indian authorities also gave their approval.
90 gemuser : If operated within ETOPS 180 I don't believe any seperate CASA ETOPS approval would be required as ETOPS180 is an ICAO agreeded standard. CASA would
91 JQflightie : IF there are JQ 787's based in Australia (looks like they will be based in SIN) one of the first routes i think you will see is a EAST-WEST 787 servi
92 Post contains links JQflightie : Very interesting times for NTL Airport, internatioanl flights on the 'radar' for 2012/2013 and domestic expansion also in reaction from the business m
93 Post contains images 747m8te : Now that would be interesting, actually probably would be viable once daily. Bring it on!
94 gemuser : Does this mean there is movement on an EU/Australia Open Skies agreement? Gemuser
95 CXfirst : I would put my money on NZ now, but the reason it was on QR, was simply because they get the 787 earlier. But now that PER will be 77L, I think it wi
96 JQflightie : No its more the China-EU open skies agreement.
97 JQflightie : Just wondering if anyone can help me here; I know NZ is taking over the BNE/SYD-NLK route as of 01MAR12 but there is no mention about flights to MEL/N
98 sydscott : Good luck with that. I think we'll see a treaty change at the same time Air India starts services to Australia........ Gemuser - there is no movement
99 gemuser : And this would benfit QF/JQ how? Thanks Sydscott JQ QF currently serves the UK & F.R.G and doesn't serve France, under old Australia/county bilat
100 Post contains links JQflightie : there was a article out a few months back, with Alan Joyce saying that QF is looking at new options, and flying to CDG via PVG is one of them, but wa
101 ZuluAlpha : I have also heard that China (and also the U.A.E) have given us us unlimited rights into Europe, but it is the European countries that are not allowin
102 Post contains images JQflightie : well QF need to negotiate well then, because Italy and France have both said a big hell no to LCC .... and i think its just been proven with Air Asia
103 jetfuel : Do you have a source? I hear this is incorrect Could you please elaborate/explain?
104 JQflightie : JQ are slowly reducing schedual.,... have you not seen it?
105 jetfuel : No sorry I must have missed that. Just wonder why then the KIX and NRT services seem to have survived? Do you think it is because they are an actual
106 eaglefarm4 : No Norfolk Air lost the contract to all Australian cities and Air New Zealand only decided to fly to BNE and SYD. 24 December 2011 The Norfolk Island
107 Post contains links sydscott : Not to nitpick, but he hasn't said anything in relation to CDG via PVG. The problem with flights into France is that until a new treaty is worked out
108 thegeek : Great link. Seems that the capacity into Chile falls just short of a 3pw 4 class 744ER (307 seats) @ 881 seats/week. Are they going to block out a fe
109 6thfreedom : Rumour is Vietnam operations will also get the chop.
110 vheca : How will this impact on Military movements? There has always been an issue (as far as I can recall, and may have changed) that this was firstly a Mil
111 sydscott : That is the register of "available" capacity which means that it only outlines capacity that is currently not allocated to a carrier. QF has a holdin
112 thegeek : Ah right. Tks for clearing that up. So they can go to 5pw on the current treaty, but not daily.
113 sydscott : Correct. However I think Santiago is a prime 787 route so it'll be interesting to see if QF tries to increase frequency when it has a smaller aircraf
114 thegeek : Even if ETOPS/EDTO considerations didn't apply, I'd be surprised if that route became daily on a smaller aircraft. By the time the 787 comes on board,
115 Post contains links and images JQflightie : SIN is more of a transit port, i dont see budget concious travellers stopping in SIN for a holiday, its more to connect to say another 3K flight. NRT
116 vheca : If there has been an announcement to increase this, surely the ADF would have to have some input/issues with it. I was wondering if there has been an
117 JQflightie : they get priority to the runway anyway, there used to be days where we would sit at the end of the runway between 40-90mins waiting to take off becau
118 Post contains links gemuser : They certainly do! See: http://www.gcmap.com/mapui?P=syd-scl&MS=wls&DU=nm&E=180 There is NO way CASA will agree to this on a twin. This r
119 Bluebird191 : Hallelujah!!! QF wants to add a European destination other than LHR and FRA. But personally, I dont really see what is so good or attractive about Pa
120 Post contains images mariner : Foreign language? Well - duh. That tends to happen in Europe. I'd go to Paris before I'd go to any other city in Europe. mariner
121 Post contains links eaglefarm4 : http://www.airservicesaustralia.com/.../movements-at-australian-airports/ October and November 2011 movements now added to airservices web site. BNE a
122 Post contains images 747m8te : Actually part of the whole reason i'd visit Paris would be to see a place that is different from what we get here, foreign language comes with part o
123 Post contains images mariner : I think that is true of most countries - I don't just visit London if I fly into LHR and about the last place I want to spend time in Germany is FRA.
124 JQflightie : In the article AJ is talking about Shanghai, as we already fly there daily... and then onward to CDG (EU) which i think would be a nice alternative t
125 qf002 : QF has said 275 in their birds, which should mean zero blocking required. It's worth noting that Alan Joyce's comments predate the chopping of HKG-LH
126 gemuser : Does not matter to SCL, CASA is not going to approve ETDO >180 this decade nor probably the next, for twins. Gemuser
127 sydscott : Entirely agreed. I loved my time and Paris and can't wait to get back there! QF have been codesharing with AF out of SIN and HKG, along with BA via L
128 Post contains links thegeek : This link shows SYD-SCL if you don't overfly PPT & IPC, and if you have ETOPS-240: http://www.gcmap.com/mapui?P=syd-ppt...+131w-scl&MS=wls&am
129 alangirvan : There already is a MEL-SIN-LHR service and a JQ MEL-SIN, so how about PER-SIN-CDG? Qantas have already done that one, as a three times weekly. Then t
130 sydscott : I'd suggest that if QF were to obtain rights for a daily service that they would open the route in conjunction with Air France and deepend the relati
131 Ben175 : Wouldn't it actually make more sense to have this flight originating in PER? PER-SIN is over 2 hours shorter than SYD/MEL/BNE-SIN which would increas
132 alangirvan : Going back to the late 70s, when Qantas was purely an International carrier, they put in a suggestion that if they were allowed to operate 747s on SYD
133 ZuluAlpha : Another possible port that could / maybe open up is a second port in Germany. I'm pretty sure QF has traffic rights into other ports into Germany. Wit
134 6thfreedom : Interesting move. Obviously JQ has full rights between MNL and NRT, and fares do appear relatively high ex-MNL. what is MNL like to transit through?
135 Post contains links sydscott : I could imagine a JQ 787 going to Berlin to link up with Air Berlin, but the problem with Berlin is that even though it's the centre of Government it
136 6thfreedom : Can't recall in which thread I saw reports that MH would be reducing KUL_SYD from double daily to daily... BUT I have started to see news that Air Asi
137 Post contains links eaglefarm4 : Yes D7 222 and 223 are the flight numbers. Story here. http://biz.thestar.com.my/news/story...?file=/2012/1/12/business/10238500
138 IndianicWorld : Interesting to see that MH may pull one daily flight to accomodate D7. I would have thought 3 flights a day would have been attempted (2XMH and 1 X D7
139 Post contains links JQflightie : QF has already thought about BER as a dstination aswel as MAD because of the new pax tax in UK/EU http://atwonline.com/eco-aviation/ar...ope-after-uk
140 alangirvan : If MH is going well they should operate frequencies independent of what Air Asia X do. MH will have the attraction of operating the A380 into SYD, so
141 kiwiandrew : To me MAD makes very little sense. Yes, it is a OW hub, but thanks to geography you have to overfly even more of Europe and double back further for c
142 Post contains images IndianicWorld : I had heard the other day from a friend that CI is seriously considering a MEL flight. He is usually a reliable source but I am not sure where he had
143 Post contains images JQflightie : So AirAsiaX have just canx ORY, LGW, reduced DEL You cannot book past March 31 for these routes. Also i believe there is another thread on the matter
144 EK413 : Ummm, wasn't impressed and couldn't wait to get out of the MNL... EK413
145 Post contains images tayser : a little birdie told me to expect a LOT from the upcoming T4 and then T3 redevelopment plans at MEL Tiger, Virgin, Air Australia and Rex will have a n
146 QantasA333 : Anyone got news for ADL in 2012? All I can think of is the opening of the new ATC tower, and the new front plaza development. SQ have also upped their
147 tayser : CX are de-linking ADL and MEL gradually, I wouldn't be surprised if ADL is a full blown daily HKG service on CX this year or early next year (and MEL
148 JQflightie : Rumour floating around is that QF doing ADL-HKG
149 tayser : would be very interesting if it came to fruition! 3x weekly SIN and 3-4x weekly HKG?
150 qf002 : That is very true... IMO it's irrelevant where the flight starts. The flight is really a PER-SIN flight and a (Aus-)SIN-CDG flight, and I don't see a
151 6thfreedom : I don't see this happening. it would dilute yields, and there has been no history of EK operating domestic tags in Australia. my view is they may go
152 kiwiandrew : I believe this would require either a change to the current air service agreement or dropping one of their existing Tasman sectors as they are curren
153 6thfreedom : I think this may be the case if the wanted PER-AKL, but not from ADL. ADL is outside the big four airports negotiated in air services agreements. as
154 IndianicWorld : Im not too sure about that, as it would also e up to the NZ authorities to give approval too I would suspect. I can see ADL service at some point to
155 kiwiandrew : From my understanding the NZ authorities don't place any restrictions. I am open to correction, but my belief is that the current restriction of four
156 TN486 : Notice MEL is announcing, on website at least, arrivals and departurers of "Strategic", as apart from "Air Australia" still!!
157 QantasA333 : Where did you hear this from?
158 Post contains links cwalt2 : AirAsia X has today signalled plans to launch the long rumoured services to Sydney, with their Facebook and Twitter accounts indicating they'll be mak
159 JQflightie : its the talk around the bases and the back galley.... why?
160 Post contains images 747m8te : yeah I have been hearing rumours from QF crew I know and QF staff in BNE, ADL-HKG 3xWeekly, also been hearing BNE-HKG to go daily soon....so who know
161 ZuluAlpha : About 12 months ago, I had a conversation with someone within the sales and marketing department based in BNE and what they advised is they wanted to
162 747m8te : Indeed....QF15/16 are always quite full, so they have no trouble filling the 747 6 days a week, surely going daily they could prove it viable. I have
163 Post contains images JQflightie : QF7/8 has been constantly full from the get go, i think once you see our full fleet of 'new' 744's QF15/16 may go daily. Afterall this was were the r
164 ZuluAlpha : And on the subject of the re-configured 744, it appears that management have decided that the one out of the two reconfigured 744's is going to go to
165 vhebb : Guys, The only reason QF15/16 BNE-LAX-BNE is 6x weekly instead of daily is because it takes exactly 2x B744s to operate the service 6x weekly, to oper
166 JQflightie : or get rid of one of the PER-SIN-PER flights, change it to B744 and then a spare A333 is freed up ....... because i dont know the last time one of th
167 eaglefarm4 : Yep hearing BNE-HKG to go daily as well with a combination of QF 97,QF 297 schedules. Also VA commenced BNE-EMD today with ATR VH-FVH operating the in
168 vhebb : What flight schedule is QF297? Thanks
169 ZuluAlpha : Very silly me .. I am kicking, myself for not realising this sooner. QF51/52 BNE / SIN / BNE is going to a daily 744 from Sunday 25 March. Which will
170 eaglefarm4 : QF 297 is usually a supplementary flight used during Chinese new year period BNE-HKG. I think you will find that say 4 flights a week may go out aroun
171 vhebb : No it doesn't... MEL-HKG-MEL changes from B744 to A333 on the same date. And by the looks of the new QF29/30 A333 HKG schedule it will take 2x A333s
172 vhebb : I doubt it. As of March 2012 the QF97/98 revert back to a daylight service along with the PER-HKG-PER services. The daylight departures ex BNE and PE
173 ZuluAlpha : According to qantas.com in availability from 25 March it is a 744. I guess they have it wrong, oh well.
174 Post contains images QF175 : ZuluAlpha, I am inclined to think that vh-ebb was alluding to that there won't be a spare A330 once BNE-SIN goes 744 in March as the freed A330-300 wi
175 6thfreedom : Qantas codeshare flights are also in the 200s, including codeshare on QF. is Jetstar operating their 330 on those days perhaps?
176 vhebb : Yep sorry guys should have phrased it better. BNE-SIN-BNE switches from A333 to B744 and MEL-HKG-MEL switches from B744 to A333. So in the end no addi
177 sydscott : If QF were to adopt an AA style "cornerstone" strategy then I would advocate BNE & PER - HKG being upgraded to daily, increasing ADL-SIN to daily
178 vhebb : Agreed. I remember one of the recommendations of the Intl review was for QF to increase frequencies from Australia to "key" Asian destinations.... So
179 6thfreedom : just reread this.. what i meant was that QF codeshare on JQ services is in the 200s, while codeshares on other international airlines is flight numbe
180 ZK-NBT : Both of these routes can be done daily with 2 744s for each. The 7th day is usually for maintenance which isn't required every week but the aircraft
181 ZuluAlpha : Fair call, Soon you will see a codeshare relationship start between QF / BA via HKG. However the codeshare relationship does not allow stopovers, onl
182 Post contains images JQflightie : ADL-SIN is crewed by Domestic Crew, aswel as alot of the A333 flying. Also this 'new contract' vs 'old contract' has pre-dated the Cost-Cutting Strat
183 sydscott : I know. But what I found interesting was that none of the "old contract" people are being trained on the A380. It's only "new" contract people which
184 qf002 : Yet you cannot book a HKG stopover on either the QF or BA websites... I had to do it through Expedia because neither website would show any flights u
185 6thfreedom : could possibly be that the aircraft will be used on other retimed sectors.. ie, aircraft rotating PER/ADL - HKG - MEL, while other aircraft operates
186 thegeek : Of course. But I thought the plan (pre-Joyce) was for MEL-HKG-LHR and SYD-BKK-LHR to go A380 anyway, so I don't see how this point explains Joyce's m
187 Post contains links MilesDependent : Air Asia X official announcement: http://www.smh.com.au/travel/travel-...sydney-flights-20120117-1q41y.html Sydney now listed on their site as a desti
188 eaglefarm4 : Alliance Airlines and Virgin planning Article in today's Australian. Meanwhile, Virgin is also believed to be in advanced negotiations with fly-in, fl
189 747m8te : Unless they are planning on making better connections onto BA? QF also codeshare with flights on AY to Europe, plus higher demand for codeshare fligh
190 JQflightie : there are alot of 'old contract' crew on the A380 ofcourse, the only short haul pilot QF have are 737 guys and gals. Cabin crew are different to Tech
191 Post contains links JQflightie : Virgin Australia has set a date for the start of MEL-PER and MEL-SYD-MEL EFF. 14MAY12 PER-MEL DJ680 0830-1345 MEL-PER DJ685 1300-1515 PER-MEL DJ694 17
192 thegeek : Really? Do they have to agree to the terms of the 'new contract' to get on the aircraft? I thought that was completely against the plan.
193 sydscott : I was under the impression that the "old contract" crew weren't even being trained on the A380.
194 airnewzealand : They have ALWAYS been on the A380. Most of teh CSM are "old contract" crew. I will give you the correct disignation codes. QAL= Qantas Australia Airl
195 thegeek : +UK. +New contract international Oz based - I can't see that in your list QCCD/MAM = Short haul new contract, is that what you are saying? Sounds lik
196 Post contains images JQflightie : I dont need to, you did it for me airnewzealand included the new oz domestic contract, QCCD.
197 ZuluAlpha : I found some information about QF and it's Wunala Dreaming lively from the Travel Daily . It will be interesting what will be in the new indigenous co
198 QF744 : A Singapore Airlines A333 9V-STC operated SIN-SYD-SIN today.. It's currently on route to SIN. First visit of a SQ A333 to SYD??
199 EK413 : SQ have deployed the A333's on the SYD route in December 2011... EK413
200 tayser : I wonder how many more VA MEL-SYD-MEL frequencies will be flown by a 330 in future. 4 aircraft could operate a significant amount of the 25-28 (depen
201 Post contains links pugsley : This is my addition to airnewzealand's info earlier. QAL - Qantas Airlines - Refers to mainline crew that operate in either the International Division
202 EK413 : I've heard JL will cease flying to SYD from June 2012... Could someone please confirm? EK413
203 xiaotung : NH flying here will be great!
204 Zkpilot : If it was going on a 744 then they would have simply renewed it on the current aircraft do that just leaves the A330 or A380. My bet is that the fina
205 Post contains links and images eta unknown : FYI the parted out 146 at BNE was removed off airport yesterday for scrapping: View Large View MediumPhoto © Craig Murray
206 BAeRJ100 : Aside from the former VH-JJT, which is being used for fire training at PER, are there any ex-Ansett aircraft remaining in Australia in any form now?
207 qf002 : Final A380 isn't due till next year... If it's going to be an A380 this year then it will either be a repaint, or it will be Nancy Bird. My bet is on
208 eaglefarm4 : There was a newly painted 333 outside the Qantas hangars in BNE earlier last week.Did not see the reg as too far away.
209 Post contains links BAeRJ100 : Virgin Blue 737-700 VH-VBY "Virginia Blue", the airline's 50th aircraft and painted in a special blue livery, is now being repainted in the white Virg
210 Post contains links JQflightie : NSW is to challenge VIC for the Air India route. To me, in the full article that was in The Financial Review, Monday 23rd Jan 2012, Pg.8, it sounds li
211 qf002 : Nice. She must be the first then -- can you remember which day/the time of day (so I can try and figure out which frames were in BNE at the time)??
212 EK413 : About time the A333 fleet received the NEW Roo! Any idea which aircraft...? EK413
213 qf002 : I'm starting to think perhaps eaglefarm4 might be mistaken? None of the fleet have been out of service over the past 8 weeks, and there haven't been
214 Post contains links BNE : Some good numbers from Brisbane airport. 18/01/2012 Brisbane Airport has recorded steady passenger growth for 2011 with a record of almost 20.6 millio
215 Ben175 : Anyone have an idea on what is going on with QF71/72 today? SIN-PER took off 8 minutes late but will arrive into PER 4 hours late - possibly a diversi
216 EK413 : Any of the A332's operate to BNE? I was under the impression the A332 fleet ops. SYD-PER, MEL-PER routes...? EK413
217 Auchmithie : QF650/QF597 PER-BNE-PER is 332 daily.[Edited 2012-01-24 03:06:53]
218 JQflightie : And where a A330 operates a route and can be a mix of A333/A332
219 EK413 : Thank-you for confirming... Was under the impression BNE-PER was a B763 but that clears it up... EK413
220 eaglefarm4 : qf002 You could be correct and i could be wrong.It may have been a 332 as i have been trying to track it down as well without luck. Apologies if i am
221 eaglefarm4 : Virgin E-170 VH-ZHF departed BNE for HIR on delivery to the US earlier today.
222 Aussie_ : Virgin released fares for sale today for Alliance Airlines wetlease ops from BNE, starting 13 Feb using 2 dedicated F100s. Routes impacted are BNE-NTL
223 AusA380 : Just got the following note from a travel agent.
224 Post contains images allrite : What happens to the Alliance Airlines wetlease ops for QantasLink? I did a mock booking on the Qantas website for BNE-ROK for 8 March and QF2356 is l
225 VH-BZF : Down at Tullamarine airport, there is an old Ansett F28-4000 jet that sits over near the Bulla - Melbourne Airport Road. Not sure of the rego, but it
226 Post contains links and images JQflightie : QF has officially launched the trial of their new "Q Streaming" product onboard one of the 763's VH-OGH Here is a demo: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v
227 Post contains links wilco737 : Part #58 is available here: Australian Aviation Thread # 58 (by QF175 Jan 24 2012 in Civil Aviation) Please continue discussion there. Many thanks.
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