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UA757 - Deployment Plans  
User currently offlinejustloveplanes From United States of America, joined Jul 2004, 1034 posts, RR: 1
Posted (2 years 6 months 3 weeks 3 days 5 hours ago) and read 9767 times:

From another thread, an interesting comment on UA757's

"I saw that rumor too, someone had the idea that UA were converting the domestic 763s to International configuration to operate in Asia. The fact is those newly configured 763s are going to be replacing PMCO 762s to Latin America and Europe as well as replacing PMCO 757s on Trans-Atlantic routes from EWR. They are not going to be flying HKG-SIN etc.."

What is the future for PMCO ETOPS 757's? What about their other 757's? PMCO 757's all have BF upgrades....

Will any PMUA 757's be getting BF?

57 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlinemogandoCI From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 1, posted (2 years 6 months 3 weeks 3 days 5 hours ago) and read 9727 times:

Quoting justloveplanes (Thread starter):
What is the future for PMCO ETOPS 757's? What about their other 757's? PMCO 757's all have BF upgrades....

I have no insider info but my gut feeling is that they might attempt more IAD-Europe with them or take a stab at secondary destinations from EWR to ones like Lyon, Nice, Newcastle, Porto, Malaga....


User currently offlineTOMMY767 From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 6584 posts, RR: 11
Reply 2, posted (2 years 6 months 3 weeks 3 days 5 hours ago) and read 9697 times:

I saw this posting too..

My feeling is that the 2 class 763s will be strictly for transatlantic ops. Smisek said he was going to do this so I wouldn't expect for this to change at all.

However there are 41 TATL 757s and I think it's entirely possible that some could transfer out to NRT and GUM for Asia flying. They would definitely be better suited for some of the short/medium haul missions than the 737s.



"Folks that's the news and I'm outta here!" -- Dennis Miller
User currently offlinerdh3e From United States of America, joined Mar 2011, 1570 posts, RR: 2
Reply 3, posted (2 years 6 months 3 weeks 3 days 5 hours ago) and read 9646 times:

Quoting mogandoCI (Reply 1):
I have no insider info but my gut feeling is that they might attempt more IAD-Europe with them or take a stab at secondary destinations from EWR to ones like Lyon, Nice, Newcastle, Porto, Malaga....

There are still a few 763s in Hawaii service. Maybe there is a plan to provide better service in the islands? I'm shooting in the dark, but trying to think of where you would deploy and ETOPS bird with premium config that would be covering widebody flying.


User currently offlineSTT757 From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 16798 posts, RR: 51
Reply 4, posted (2 years 6 months 3 weeks 3 days 5 hours ago) and read 9620 times:

Quoting justloveplanes (Thread starter):
What is the future for PMCO ETOPS 757's?

Continue operation West Coast-Hawaii, as they are now.

Quoting justloveplanes (Thread starter):
What is the future for PMCO ETOPS 757's?

Continue operating how they are now.

Quoting justloveplanes (Thread starter):
Will any PMUA 757's be getting BF?

Besides the reconfiguration of the PS 757s with the new lay flat seats the PMUA 757s are being phased out by 737-900ERs.

Quoting rdh3e (Reply 3):
There are still a few 763s in Hawaii service. Maybe there is a plan to provide better service in the islands?

They haven't begun the reconfiguration yet, they are not going to stay in domestic (Hawaii) service.



Eastern Air lines flt # 701, EWR-MCO Boeing 757
User currently offlineflyhossd From United States of America, joined Nov 2009, 831 posts, RR: 2
Reply 5, posted (2 years 6 months 3 weeks 3 days 5 hours ago) and read 9622 times:

Given that UA/CO is parking 15 to 20 of the UA757s, I expect the CO757s that are replaced on transatlantic routes by UA763s, to do more domestic flying between hubs and major cities and on trans-cons (just my opinion).

Given the frequency of the diversions for fuel stops when westbound across the Atlantic, I don't expect many more transatlantic 757 flights out of IAD. I'm still surprised no one has developed an aux fuel tank STC for the 757s.

I like Tommy767's idea about using the CO757s out of NRT, though. CO had 757s based in GUM for a time (mid to late 90s, IIRC).



My statements do not represent my former employer or my current employer and are my opinions only.
User currently offlinemogandoCI From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 6, posted (2 years 6 months 3 weeks 3 days 5 hours ago) and read 9611 times:

Quoting rdh3e (Reply 3):
There are still a few 763s in Hawaii service. Maybe there is a plan to provide better service in the islands? I'm shooting in the dark, but trying to think of where you would deploy and ETOPS bird with premium config that would be covering widebody flying.

Those ETOPS 752 are flat-bed BusinessFirst ... a bit overkill for the west coast to Hawaii market that is bombarded with HA and AS ?


User currently offlineSTT757 From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 16798 posts, RR: 51
Reply 7, posted (2 years 6 months 3 weeks 3 days 5 hours ago) and read 9612 times:

Quoting TOMMY767 (Reply 2):
However there are 41 TATL 757s and I think it's entirely possible that some could transfer out to NRT and GUM for Asia flying. They would definitely be better suited for some of the short/medium haul missions than the 737s.

CO used to have 757s operating from GUM, I doubt they will put them back. The 737s are already there.



Eastern Air lines flt # 701, EWR-MCO Boeing 757
User currently offlineflyhossd From United States of America, joined Nov 2009, 831 posts, RR: 2
Reply 8, posted (2 years 6 months 3 weeks 3 days 5 hours ago) and read 9610 times:

Quoting STT757 (Reply 4):
Quoting justloveplanes (Thread starter):
What is the future for PMCO ETOPS 757's?

Continue operation West Coast-Hawaii, as they are now.

I thought the CO757s to Hawaii had been replaced by 737s...



My statements do not represent my former employer or my current employer and are my opinions only.
User currently offlinedrerx7 From United States of America, joined Jun 2000, 5146 posts, RR: 8
Reply 9, posted (2 years 6 months 3 weeks 3 days 5 hours ago) and read 9593 times:

With the upcoming spring schedules showing a greater degree of PMCO/PMUA crossfleeting - will we see the 757s out of IAH and EWR? Right now they are dummied for 319s on the routes that I see.


Third Coast born, means I'm Texas raised
User currently offlineSTT757 From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 16798 posts, RR: 51
Reply 10, posted (2 years 6 months 3 weeks 3 days 5 hours ago) and read 9578 times:

Quoting flyhossd (Reply 8):
I thought the CO757s to Hawaii had been replaced by 737s...

I meant the ETOPS PMUA 757s.



Eastern Air lines flt # 701, EWR-MCO Boeing 757
User currently offlineTOMMY767 From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 6584 posts, RR: 11
Reply 11, posted (2 years 6 months 3 weeks 3 days 4 hours ago) and read 9499 times:

Quoting mogandoCI (Reply 1):
IAD-Europe with them or take a stab at secondary destinations from EWR to ones like Lyon, Nice, Newcastle, Porto, Malaga....

Yeah what the 757s SHOULD be doing instead of IAD-AMS/CDG. I doubt you'll see IAD-AMS/CDG back for next year as there has been more diversions then I can even count at this point. Although IAD-DUB/MAN should do just fine.

Quoting flyhossd (Reply 5):
Given that UA/CO is parking 15 to 20 of the UA757s

Over time possibly, definitely not within the next year. Only a grand total of 3 will be withdrawn by the end of the year leaving 93 active PMUA 757s.

Quoting drerx7 (Reply 9):
Right now they are dummied for 319s on the routes that I see.

If I had to guess from what has already been announced:

UA 757 routes:
EWR-LAS/MCO/MIA/SEA/IAH and PHX/LAX-EWR (only one way bookable.)
IAH-BOS/LGA
CLE-LAX/SFO

UA 319/320 routes:
EWR-SAT
CLE-LAX/SFO/MCO
IAH-PHL

Ugh, I'd speculate futher but I need to see a list of what's changing.



"Folks that's the news and I'm outta here!" -- Dennis Miller
User currently offlinedrerx7 From United States of America, joined Jun 2000, 5146 posts, RR: 8
Reply 12, posted (2 years 6 months 3 weeks 3 days 4 hours ago) and read 9473 times:

Well from IAH I see:
SEA, PHX, LAS, LAX, EWR, BOS, DCA, PHL, DTW, LGA, EWR, and SAN. EWR and LAX intrigue me as I could see those being widebody positioning flights. Any of those could be UA757s - CO has used the 75 into nearly all of those in the past...except for DCA, BOS, and PHL; not sure about LGA before though.



Third Coast born, means I'm Texas raised
User currently offlineTOMMY767 From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 6584 posts, RR: 11
Reply 13, posted (2 years 6 months 3 weeks 3 days 4 hours ago) and read 9426 times:

Quoting drerx7 (Reply 12):
SEA, PHX, LAS, LAX, EWR, BOS, DCA, PHL, DTW, LGA, EWR, and SAN. EWR and LAX intrigue me as I could see those being widebody positioning flights. Any of those could be UA757s - CO has used the 75 into nearly all of those in the past...except for DCA, BOS, and PHL; not sure about LGA before though.

dimes to dollars that IAH-BOS/LGA/DCA will be 757.

UA A319/A320:
IAH-PHL/DTW/SAN

UA 757:
IAH-SEA/LAS/EWR/LAX

Also EWR-SFO is going up to 3-4x UA metal next summer so I'd expect a UA 777 on this route come 2012



"Folks that's the news and I'm outta here!" -- Dennis Miller
User currently offlineflyhossd From United States of America, joined Nov 2009, 831 posts, RR: 2
Reply 14, posted (2 years 6 months 3 weeks 3 days 2 hours ago) and read 9118 times:

Quoting TOMMY767 (Reply 11):


Quoting flyhossd (Reply 5):
Given that UA/CO is parking 15 to 20 of the UA757s

Over time possibly, definitely not within the next year. Only a grand total of 3 will be withdrawn by the end of the year leaving 93 active PMUA 757s.

My UA source for parking 15-20 UA 757s claims that more than 3 have already been parked (returned to the leasing companies), but I haven't checked; he claimed that at least 15 were being parked soon (before summer). Does anyone have a link to a recent fleet plan?



My statements do not represent my former employer or my current employer and are my opinions only.
User currently offlinemogandoCI From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 15, posted (2 years 6 months 3 weeks 3 days 2 hours ago) and read 9058 times:

Quoting flyhossd (Reply 14):
My UA source for parking 15-20 UA 757s claims that more than 3 have already been parked (returned to the leasing companies), but I haven't checked; he claimed that at least 15 were being parked soon (before summer). Does anyone have a link to a recent fleet plan?

That's entirely fine. Other than missions that require the 752 (TATL or Hawaii), most of the other routes are best served with 738 and 737-900ER that are arriving gradually.

What UA/CO needs is rapid expansion internationally so solidify its leader position (only airline flying to all 4 BRIC countries nonstop from US) - meaning, all the 787 and 350 and 748 they could get their hands on. The 359 is not a proper replacement for 744 (even the 350-1000 is marginal).


User currently offlinerdh3e From United States of America, joined Mar 2011, 1570 posts, RR: 2
Reply 16, posted (2 years 6 months 3 weeks 3 days 2 hours ago) and read 9048 times:

Quoting mogandoCI (Reply 6):
Those ETOPS 752 are flat-bed BusinessFirst ... a bit overkill for the west coast to Hawaii market that is bombarded with HA and AS ?

That is less overkill than putting them on domestic markets as others here are suggesting. If they do replace a fair amount of the EWR birds with widebodies, where do you put those 757's? Easiest choice would be to put them right where you got the 763's. Hawaii would be one of those places. I'm not saying it's the best choice, but it is a choice. They could also use them for intra-asia service on the HKG-SIN/SGN, NRT-HKG, NRT-ICN, etc... That way your premium pax get to keep their premium experience instead of being on a domestic 739.


User currently offlinemogandoCI From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 17, posted (2 years 6 months 3 weeks 3 days 1 hour ago) and read 8991 times:

Quoting rdh3e (Reply 16):
That is less overkill than putting them on domestic markets as others here are suggesting.

Aren't they planning to put BF seats into p.s. planes and switch to 2 class ? Why not just return/park the PMUA 752 p.s. planes, take these from PMCO, add a few more BF seats, and put them on JFK-SFO/LAX ?

The problem with the intra-Asian routes is that they all arrive and depart as a bank, so utilization is very low if there's a dedicated fleet. The 738 works because they rotate with CO Micronesia routes ? A 2-class 763 on HKG-NRT would be good balance since that plane could go onward to a smaller destination like SEA (with NH picking up the slack via 788)

Isn't GUM-HNL flown with 764? Maybe a creative routing like SIN-HKG-GUM-HNL for that plane.


User currently offlinerdh3e From United States of America, joined Mar 2011, 1570 posts, RR: 2
Reply 18, posted (2 years 6 months 3 weeks 3 days 1 hour ago) and read 8943 times:

Quoting mogandoCI (Reply 17):
Aren't they planning to put BF seats into p.s. planes and switch to 2 class ? Why not just return/park the PMUA 752 p.s. planes, take these from PMCO, add a few more BF seats, and put them on JFK-SFO/LAX ?

Because they can't just return that many aircraft willy nilly. You're talking about a significant number of aircraft that will likely find homes in several different niches until retirement.


User currently offlinemogandoCI From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 19, posted (2 years 6 months 3 weeks 3 days 1 hour ago) and read 8898 times:

Quoting rdh3e (Reply 18):
Because they can't just return that many aircraft willy nilly. You're talking about a significant number of aircraft that will likely find homes in several different niches until retirement.

How big is the p.s. fleet ? 13 planes ? That's reasonably small.


User currently offlinenycdave From United States of America, joined Aug 2010, 546 posts, RR: 1
Reply 20, posted (2 years 6 months 3 weeks 3 days 1 hour ago) and read 8822 times:

So glad someone posted this -- I've really been wondering about it, since the combined UA will have such a huge 757 fleet, with a pretty wide range of past usage. PMCO is almost all ETOPS, winglets, BF, updated interiors, and had been used extensively on TATL operations. PMUA had far fewer ETOPS 752's, with most getting used domestically in several configs, many with aging, outdated interiors (not to mention some old Battleship liveries that look just about ready to peel off).

Wasn't sure whether there was any chance (or purpose) to upgrading some of the PMUA 757's to ETOPS, fitting them with winglets, etc... or whether most of the fleet was just waiting to be pushed off the roster for 321s and 739s.

Quoting flyhossd (Reply 5):
Given that UA/CO is parking 15 to 20 of the UA757s, I expect the CO757s that are replaced on transatlantic routes by UA763s, to do more domestic flying between hubs and major cities and on trans-cons (just my opinion).

Wouldn't that be kind of a waste of the PMCO 752's capabilities? I'd imagine they'd sooner use those to expand frequency and open new routes TATL.

Quoting mogandoCI (Reply 17):
Why not just return/park the PMUA 752 p.s. planes, take these from PMCO, add a few more BF seats, and put them on JFK-SFO/LAX ?

the p.s. planes, IIRC, are in good condition with relatively few cycles on them for their age... I'd imagine there's quite a lot of PMUA 752's that are much better candidates for retirement. Plus, there's no need for ETOPS on the p.s. services, so why waste one on it?


User currently offlinerdh3e From United States of America, joined Mar 2011, 1570 posts, RR: 2
Reply 21, posted (2 years 6 months 3 weeks 3 days 1 hour ago) and read 8795 times:

Quoting mogandoCI (Reply 19):
How big is the p.s. fleet ? 13 planes ? That's reasonably small.

I'm thinking more of the 41 units that CO brought to the table.


User currently offlinedrerx7 From United States of America, joined Jun 2000, 5146 posts, RR: 8
Reply 22, posted (2 years 6 months 3 weeks 3 days 1 hour ago) and read 8795 times:

Quoting nycdave (Reply 20):
(not to mention some old Battleship liveries that look just about ready to peel off).

Battleship gray is just about finished though according to the UA/CO repaint thread.

Quoting nycdave (Reply 20):
I'd imagine they'd sooner use those to expand frequency and open new routes TATL.

I'd think that there would not be too many more opportunities there...some really should head to IAH to investigate South America - and head west coast to Hawaii runs to remedy the payload restricted 737s.



Third Coast born, means I'm Texas raised
User currently offlinemogandoCI From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 23, posted (2 years 6 months 3 weeks 3 days 1 hour ago) and read 8784 times:

Quoting nycdave (Reply 20):
the p.s. planes, IIRC, are in good condition with relatively few cycles on them for their age... I'd imagine there's quite a lot of PMUA 752's that are much better candidates for retirement. Plus, there's no need for ETOPS on the p.s. services, so why waste one on it?

Even without the ETOPS requirement, the winglets alone shave 2-3% SFC ? Wouldn't that help on a longer cruise like p.s. transcon, and save the PMUA fleet for shorter hops.

ps : if a plane flies over-water but reasonably close to land along the entire way (HKG-SIN, MIA-LGA etc), does that count as ETOPS? i'm guessing no ?


User currently offlinetimberwolf24 From United States of America, joined Jun 2001, 575 posts, RR: 1
Reply 24, posted (2 years 6 months 3 weeks 3 days 1 hour ago) and read 8749 times:

It would be nice to see UA/CO 757s be used to start ORD-MAN/GLA/BHX or BFS.


Living in LA, ORD/MDW will always be home!
25 drerx7 : Not really - however, the birds have to be overwater equipped, rafts etc. I believe that ICAO has minimum 90minutes without needing ETOPS180 certific
26 EIRules : Which routes that are currently PMCO 752 routes are likely to be replaced with 2 class 763s? EWR-LHR seems like a prime candidate along with IAD-AMS &
27 mogandoCI : EWR to any of the SkyTeam or oneworld hubs, sans LHR. That one needs 3-class planes, even if only 8F.
28 nycdave : You're forgetting just how far most of the urban centers of SA are. GIG is out of range for a 752 flying from IAH, and everything below that follows.
29 Viscount724 : There have been 2 UA fuel stops on westbound 757 flights to IAD in the past 10 days. Following from Transport Canada daily incident summaries. Decemb
30 CALPSAFltSkeds : This may make sense for a few units as the 752 can expand GUM to markets longer than the 73NG can operate. GUM-SYD/MEL/DPS/JKT. However, these aircra
31 flyhossd : Thanks for the information. Does this include the aircraft that were flight planned to have a fuel stop as it was clear at the beginning that a non-s
32 Viscount724 : I think the Transport Canada occurrence reports only cover unplanned events.
33 SonomaFlyer : True. My crystal ball: The PMCO 752's aren't going to do transcon unless they are phased into p.s. service though I'm pretty certain the 739ER will b
34 gigneil : CO barely fills 73Gs on IAH-DCA. Nonrev dream. NS
35 laca773 : I could see some LAX-HNL/OGG going with the 753s (if they are going to become ETOPs capable. They do have blended winglets, so this would be a great
36 drerx7 : Really? Its been full every time I've flown it and once on a 738...maybe it had a lot of non revs though. I'd expect that to be a good 319 route.
37 TOMMY767 : Why would it be overkill? There are only 16 BF seats -- not like there's 26-30 of the BF lie flats on the 757. UA regularly flies the PMCO 757s on EW
38 SonomaFlyer : I think people are confusing the economic reality with the aircraft enthusiast when it comes to domestic flying.... In the new reality of the airline
39 mogandoCI : Since the legacies are having trouble competing on price with LCCs, the only way to differentiate themselves is being more premium. p.s.-level servic
40 rdh3e : Which is not the primary territory of the UA 757's. There is a small fleet that flies that type of mission. What about ORD-DEN? Or anything that is n
41 TOMMY767 : ORD-DEN is regularly flown with a 3-class UA 777. I don't understand why a PMCO 757 wouldn't be appropriate for a route such as this one. A waste of
42 mogandoCI : p.s. is an extension of the Pacific flights for PMUA. Now they need to do the same at EWR to be an extension of Atlantic flights (keeping existing JF
43 rdh3e : Dude, you're confusing repositioning flights with ideal routings.
44 TOMMY767 : expect EWR-SFO to not be operated by PS, but by widebodies -- 777s and 763s likely. But they operate the flight -- meaning while it's technically 're
45 mogandoCI : That's good too. That would simultaneously fulfill p.s. role while allowing international flights on both ends to be fed properly.
46 TOMMY767 : Yup. And honestly, EWR has a lot of premium demand, but not enough to justify PS services.
47 kgaiflyer : ???? Last time I did IAH-DCA (December 10th) CO was flying "sky interior" 738s and not 73NGs. And my experience has been that first and last flights
48 rdh3e : Today IAH-DCA is booked at 63% (5 flights) for the day and DCA-IAH is booked even at 100% for the day (4 flights)
49 AmricanShamrok : Seasonal ORD-SNN? They could always replace the second daily EWR-SNN flight...
50 Post contains images kgaiflyer : Evening rush hour began here just before noon. I guess all the congressional staffers are fleeing the joint. Yet on Sunday afternoon and evening, the
51 justloveplanes : I think Smisek publicly said they will offer Transcon lie flats. Makes a lot of sense for a red-eye going east to west.
52 CALPSAFltSkeds : Sorry, Tommy to disagree a bit. Enough to cover the swap of 753 for 763ER(going International) then PMUA752 for 753(covering for 763ER) - about 14 739
53 TOMMY767 : Completely disagree. Why wouldn't EWR-SFO be a good 763 or 777 routing? It's hub to hub, they will need to reposition the birds anyway, so why not? U
54 sldispatcher : I personally would like to see them updated (PMUA) if need be and deployed to South American routes such as UIO, etc. as well as the transcon usefulne
55 CALPSAFltSkeds : OK, I'll agree with you on the "slots" and because EWR and SFO are the two largest coastal hubs even though connections at either SFO and EWR aren't
56 ual777uk : NCL I think would be a great route for those 757, even if it was initially just 3 or 4 times a week to get their foot in the door. EWR would be ideal
57 nycdave : Does anyone have the breakdown regarding ETOPS/non-ETOPS PMUA 752's, and age (cycles ideally, but where on earth are any of us gonna get that?) Agreed
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