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Hong Kong Airlines Orders 10 A380s  
User currently onlinescbriml From United Kingdom, joined Jul 2003, 12503 posts, RR: 46
Posted (2 years 7 months 3 weeks 6 days 20 hours ago) and read 26933 times:
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Bloomberg is reporting that Hong Kong Airlines just ordered 10 A380s. If true, I guess the "row" over ETS is nowhere near as bad as some would like it to be.

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2012-0...a380s-from-hong-kong-airlines.html

Quote:
Airbus, the world’s largest passenger-jet maker, won a contract from Hong Kong Airlines Ltd. (HKAIRZ) for 10 double decker A380s, valued at about $38 billion at list prices.



Time flies like an arrow, but fruit flies like a banana!
109 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineEPA001 From Netherlands, joined Sep 2006, 4723 posts, RR: 39
Reply 1, posted (2 years 7 months 3 weeks 6 days 20 hours ago) and read 26907 times:
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That would be great news since it is quite a large order from a new operator.  

Now we have to wait until the news is made official.


User currently offlinetravelavnut From Netherlands, joined May 2010, 1610 posts, RR: 7
Reply 2, posted (2 years 7 months 3 weeks 6 days 20 hours ago) and read 26868 times:

Yaay!! Congrats to Airbus and Hong Kong airlines!   


Live From Amsterdam!
User currently offlineIndianicWorld From Australia, joined Jun 2001, 2957 posts, RR: 0
Reply 3, posted (2 years 7 months 3 weeks 6 days 19 hours ago) and read 26592 times:

What routes would they look at deploying them on? That's a lot of capacity.

User currently offlineba319-131 From United Kingdom, joined Jan 2001, 8535 posts, RR: 54
Reply 4, posted (2 years 7 months 3 weeks 6 days 19 hours ago) and read 26562 times:
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Finally!!

First expected at the Paris Air Show back in 2011!



111,732,3,4,5,7,8,BBJ,741,742,743,744,752,762,763,764,772,77L,773,77W,L15,D10,30,40,AB3,AB6,A312.313,319,320,321,332,333
User currently offlineRuscoe From Australia, joined Aug 1999, 1561 posts, RR: 2
Reply 5, posted (2 years 7 months 3 weeks 6 days 19 hours ago) and read 26564 times:

Do you think the timing of the announcement could in any way be related to the A380 wing crack problem?

It is certainly nice to have a new order in the midst of this to maintain confidence.

Ruscoe


User currently offlineFocker From Netherlands, joined Jan 2011, 153 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (2 years 7 months 3 weeks 6 days 19 hours ago) and read 26517 times:

Quoting EPA001 (Reply 1):
Now we have to wait until the news is made official.

I guess this will be announced on the 17th - on Airbus' annual press conference.

In addition there is rumour on A380production.com saying Transasia (Taiwan) is planning to order 2 A380's. If that rumour holds truth the MOU might be announced on the 17th as well.


User currently offlinealoges From Germany, joined Jan 2006, 8705 posts, RR: 43
Reply 7, posted (2 years 7 months 3 weeks 6 days 19 hours ago) and read 26522 times:

Quoting scbriml (Thread starter):
Bloomberg is reporting that Hong Kong Airlines just ordered 10 A380s.

Fingers crossed!

Quoting scbriml (Thread starter):
If true, I guess the "row" over ETS is nowhere near as bad as some would like it to be.

Of course it isn't - nothing is eaten as hot as it is cooked.   However Hong Kong isn't China proper, which may have played a role.

[Edited 2012-01-06 05:34:23]


Walk together, talk together all ye peoples of the earth. Then, and only then, shall ye have peace.
User currently offlinemikey72 From United Kingdom, joined Oct 2009, 1780 posts, RR: 2
Reply 8, posted (2 years 7 months 3 weeks 6 days 19 hours ago) and read 26343 times:

Quoting IndianicWorld (Reply 3):
What routes would they look at deploying them on? That's a lot of capacity.

5 daily to LGW ?

  



Flying is like sex - I've never had all I wanted but occasionally I've had all I can stand.
User currently offlineHeavierthanair From Switzerland, joined Oct 2000, 795 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (2 years 7 months 3 weeks 6 days 19 hours ago) and read 26336 times:

G'day

So they can now remove that sticker clearly visible on that pic


View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Matteo Stella



The Bloomberg article states

quote:

10 double decker A380s, valued at about $38 billion at list prices.

unquote

those $38 billion could mean several things:

- the order is for 100 units - unless the try to copy Emirates not very likely   
- there has been a price increase - OK, the Euro is weak at the moment - but not that weak   
- the reporter at Bloomberg needs a new calculator - more likely   

I guess we now have to wait for them confirming the 747-8 order as well. Exciting times ahead   

Cheers

Peter



"Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the universe." (Albert Einstein, 1879
User currently offlineRara From Germany, joined Jan 2007, 2079 posts, RR: 2
Reply 10, posted (2 years 7 months 3 weeks 6 days 19 hours ago) and read 26293 times:

Finally, that's been in the works for a while.

So is this a hidden Hong Kong / Hainan Airlines joint order? Is it possible the A380s will eventually be operated under Hainan branding?



Samson was a biblical tough guy, but his dad Samsonite was even more of a hard case.
User currently offlineJack From United Kingdom, joined Jul 2003, 116 posts, RR: 0
Reply 11, posted (2 years 7 months 3 weeks 6 days 19 hours ago) and read 26190 times:

2011 order I assume?

User currently offlinePlymSpotter From Spain, joined Jun 2004, 11645 posts, RR: 60
Reply 12, posted (2 years 7 months 3 weeks 6 days 19 hours ago) and read 26059 times:

Quoting Heavierthanair (Reply 9):
- the reporter at Bloomberg needs a new calculator - more likely   

Or one with a working decimal point button perhaps?



...love is just a camouflage for what resembles rage again...
User currently offlineB738FlyUIA From Kazakhstan, joined Dec 2009, 557 posts, RR: 0
Reply 13, posted (2 years 7 months 3 weeks 6 days 19 hours ago) and read 26025 times:
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Quoting Heavierthanair (Reply 9):
So they can now remove that sticker clearly visible on that pic

That is really a good catch...   As the stickers are set in alphabetical order!!!!

Quoting Heavierthanair (Reply 9):
I guess we now have to wait for them confirming the 747-8 order as well. Exciting times ahead

little off topic but was my thoughts aswell !!!! Maybe there are ordered in the same amount!!!!

Quoting mikey72 (Reply 8):
5 daily to LGW ?

I wonder if LHR will have the capacity for all inkl. A380's from SQ, EK with all there flights...??!!


User currently offlinemickey90 From Sweden, joined Nov 2011, 65 posts, RR: 0
Reply 14, posted (2 years 7 months 3 weeks 6 days 19 hours ago) and read 25976 times:

Great news!

This will probably put some pressure on CX to order some a380s.



It's better to be in the air wishing you were on the ground than being on the ground wishing you were in the air
User currently offlineslinky09 From United Kingdom, joined Jun 2009, 830 posts, RR: 0
Reply 15, posted (2 years 7 months 3 weeks 6 days 18 hours ago) and read 25777 times:

Great news, x10 is a nice order and to a new airline.

Quoting Heavierthanair (Reply 9):
those $38 billion could mean several things:

- the order is for 100 units - unless the try to copy Emirates not very likely   

Very funny!

Quoting Heavierthanair (Reply 9):
So they can now remove that sticker clearly visible on that pic

I'm still amazed that Virgin Atlantic is on there!

Quoting B738FlyUIA (Reply 13):
I wonder if LHR will have the capacity for all inkl. A380's from SQ, EK with all there flights...??!!

They don't currently fly to LHR do they ... and are not in any alliance? So if they did likely T3 which means sharing gates with SQ, QF and EK ... sounds like T3 will need some more A380 gates ...


User currently offlineStanleyJ From Hong Kong, joined Apr 2010, 29 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (2 years 7 months 3 weeks 6 days 18 hours ago) and read 25571 times:

Quoting slinky09 (Reply 15):
They don't currently fly to LHR do they ... and are not in any alliance? So if they did likely T3 which means sharing gates with SQ, QF and EK ... sounds like T3 will need some more A380 gates ...

Ah! But HX will be flying HKG-LGW... so no LHR, as per here:

http://www.hongkongairlines.com/club/

Given it'll be the flagship route, makes sense to upgauge that one first. Where else HX will fly by 2015... well, that's for the rumour mill.  

[Edited 2012-01-06 06:45:03]

User currently onlinescbriml From United Kingdom, joined Jul 2003, 12503 posts, RR: 46
Reply 17, posted (2 years 7 months 3 weeks 6 days 17 hours ago) and read 25074 times:
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Quoting Ruscoe (Reply 5):
Do you think the timing of the announcement could in any way be related to the A380 wing crack problem?

It is certainly nice to have a new order in the midst of this to maintain confidence.

You really are a half-empty guy when it comes to Airbus, aren't you?   

Given that neither Airbus nor the airline have made an announcement, do you believe this is some sort of a conspiracy?

Quoting aloges (Reply 7):
However Hong Kong isn't China proper

No, but Hong Kong Airlines is part-owned by Hainan Airlines, which is.



Time flies like an arrow, but fruit flies like a banana!
User currently offlineLGWflyer From United Kingdom, joined Mar 2011, 2348 posts, RR: 1
Reply 18, posted (2 years 7 months 3 weeks 6 days 17 hours ago) and read 25044 times:

Quoting mikey72 (Reply 8):

5 daily to LGW ?

Haha I very much hope so!  



3 words... I Love Aviation!!!
User currently offlineastuteman From United Kingdom, joined Jan 2005, 10008 posts, RR: 96
Reply 19, posted (2 years 7 months 3 weeks 6 days 17 hours ago) and read 24976 times:
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Quoting scbriml (Thread starter):
Bloomberg is reporting that Hong Kong Airlines just ordered 10 A380s. If true, I guess the "row" over ETS is nowhere near as bad as some would like it to be.

Which would make 29 gross and 19 net for the year I guess...

Quoting scbriml (Reply 17):
You really are a half-empty guy when it comes to Airbus, aren't you?

Half empty? There's optimism for you  

Rgds


User currently offlineCXB77L From Australia, joined Feb 2009, 2609 posts, RR: 5
Reply 20, posted (2 years 7 months 3 weeks 6 days 17 hours ago) and read 24816 times:
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Quoting Heavierthanair (Reply 9):
10 double decker A380s, valued at about $38 billion at list prices.

It says $3.8 billion now, so the article must've been edited since you read it.



Boeing 777 fanboy
User currently offlineNOTAXONROTAX From Netherlands, joined Mar 2011, 398 posts, RR: 0
Reply 21, posted (2 years 7 months 3 weeks 6 days 16 hours ago) and read 24548 times:

Quoting Ruscoe (Reply 5):
Do you think the timing of the announcement could in any way be related to the A380 wing crack problem?

I do not........do you?

Shame A380 has so many enemies on this site. I for one am pleased with this announcement, we just have to see if it is true.

Come on CX / KL, what are you waiting for?
Those slots had your name on them.............

No Tax On Rotax



Als vader voorlicht, kan je merken dat hij achter ligt.
User currently offlinena From Germany, joined Dec 1999, 10707 posts, RR: 9
Reply 22, posted (2 years 7 months 3 weeks 6 days 16 hours ago) and read 24546 times:

Nice beginning of the supposedly slowed down order race of 2012.

Quoting mickey90 (Reply 14):
This will probably put some pressure on CX to order some a380s.

Sure. And a kick for Air China, too. I wouldnt wonder if by year´s end we´ll look back at ca. 15 A380 (or 748I) orders from CX and 10 from Air China. I would wonder if not. Both need new top-of-the-line aircraft by 2015.


User currently offlineCXB77L From Australia, joined Feb 2009, 2609 posts, RR: 5
Reply 23, posted (2 years 7 months 3 weeks 6 days 16 hours ago) and read 24465 times:
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CHAT OPERATOR

Quoting mickey90 (Reply 14):
This will probably put some pressure on CX to order some a380s.

Why would it? CX and HX are different airlines run by different people with different plans for the airline. It has never been good business practice to order an aircraft just because a competitor has one. Any aircraft order should only be made when there is a need for that particular aircraft in that airline's fleet. The fact that HX has ordered 10 A380s has absolutely nothing to do with whether CX will also order them.



Boeing 777 fanboy
User currently offlineStitch From United States of America, joined Jul 2005, 30910 posts, RR: 87
Reply 24, posted (2 years 7 months 3 weeks 6 days 16 hours ago) and read 24352 times:
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Quoting na (Reply 22):
Nice beginning of the supposedly slowed down order race of 2012.

Is this a 2012 order? The Bloomberg article seemed to imply it would go on 2011's books.


25 ER757 : The 748 order was to be for 15 units IIRC Good news for the A380 - always great to see a new operator for a four-holer!
26 virgin747 : Thats what I was thinking of too. Besides CX is committing themselves to the 773/A330 for their long term fleet plans. They seem to order more every
27 mham001 : That depends on whether or not Airbus finds it more convenient to extend the calender year to fit their PR needs.
28 Stitch : Airbus has always announced the previous year's orders in January. Not to mention they have so handily won the 2011 orders race, 10 additional orders
29 na : Ok, it seems like 2011 in the books, but as it is announced in 2012 for me its a nice beginning of 2012!
30 kbdude : so does this mean that the 15x747-8i order will not happen? That would be a lot of VLA.
31 Post contains links PezySPU : Yes, but back then China blocked this order in protest against the ETS. http://www.centreforaviation.com/new...doubt-due-to-eu-ets-dispute-108738 Nah
32 mickey90 : I have to disagree with you. A lot o travellers chooses the a380 over other alternatives. Just look at LH, they mark every a380 flight on their websi
33 Stitch : Assuming HX is the customer, they've put money down (as Boeing has stated a "commitment" requires a deposit), so that implies a serious intent to acq
34 something : It is a little more complex than that. The 77W can haul significantly more cargo than the A380 and an A380 only has a lower CASM when all seats are s
35 Post contains images astuteman : As a historical footnote, it also takes net orders to 253, thus achieving the originally quoted break-even just 11 years after launch, with 3 of thos
36 Post contains images CHRISBA777ER : And this is before the second generation of A388 and the new A389 are even formally launched, within four years of EIS. Nice
37 dfambro : I really disagree, as someone who buys a good deal of international tickets to a variety of destinations. I get very frustrated with the lack of sche
38 ER757 : Exactly - too many people fail to take the long view. Yeah, it was (and still is to some extent) a drain on EADS' finances, but over the life of the
39 cosmofly : Is it possible that Hong Kong Airlines is betting to use A388 as a WOW factor to take market share from CX, leveraging the fact that CX has not yet or
40 ebbUK : No let's leave the PR games to the experts across the Atlantic pond. Also I'm not sure that the sales teams who have bonus related pay would sacrific
41 gemuser : Would you please stop saying that!!! Is not true!!! Yes the A380 must have a certain load factor to have a lower CASK than the B77W and it is more pa
42 alangirvan : If they do go through with both orders, it will be interesting to see if they use the two types for different types of routes or interchangeably. A38
43 ikramerica : Quite a large order from an airline with a few narrowbodies and a few A330s. 10 A388s and 15 748s? What a load of hooey. Now fantastically failing to
44 Post contains images lightsaber : Dang, Leary is good! Huh? Casm on the A380 is about 14% lower than the 77W. Thus, it is cheaper to fly each person on an A380 with 70+ empty seats ve
45 ikramerica : That's a good point, so far. So is the 764ER though. And the 77L. It will likely be the case for the 748i. Doesn't mean any of those have/will sell i
46 something : Yes, that was a very poor choice of words on my part. Sorry about that. My point was that yes, an A380 does have a lower CASM than the 77W, with the
47 zeke : CX have not made such a statement. They 77W has more cargo volume, however it does not lift as much payload as an A380. CASK/CASM is the same regardl
48 PanAm_DC10 : Good to see this order finalised, they needed to get this signed given the carrier had already announced the first delivery dates starting in 2013 for
49 ikramerica : The article from bloomberg says 2015.
50 something : LH hauls 50% of their cargo on passenger planes, despite maintaining a dedicated freighter fleet. Incidentally, they don't own a single 77W, but do f
51 Post contains images glideslope : Not at all. Far too early to know anything. It's 5 early build frames so far. Most likely just from them being Shoe Horned together creating unantici
52 zeke : One would need to see where they freight is actually being carried. If it is anything like where I work, more short/medium haul freight is under the
53 Post contains links PanAm_DC10 : Agree that is what it said but I was going from a previous report In 2013, it will receive 18 more aircraft - eight A330s, eight A320s and two A380s.
54 dfambro : Well yes, I'm essentially always flying schedule over price. Just because there aren't all that many people like me for every route doesn't mean "the
55 Stitch : With things like curfews, slot restrictions, departure/arrival banks and such, even if there is demand for a certain departure/arrival time (and with
56 Daysleeper : So when will you consider it a success then? The ramp up is finally going smoothly with 3 convoys planned per month for 2012, its met all its perform
57 Post contains images 747400sp : This is great news! The more airlines order A380s, the larger the chance of seeing an A389. I am a fan of both A380s and 747s. I believe that if you a
58 Post contains images Stitch : I don't believe they were loans, so there is nothing to repay. Washington State's "contribution" was in the form of reduced tax rates for various thi
59 dfambro : I don't think my wishes raise curfew or slot restriction issues, rather is seems to be the arrival/departure banks. This is clearly important for a w
60 747400sp : HAVE YOU LOST YOUR MIND! Leave transpacific to the widebodies! It bad enough that 767s fly transpacific.
61 Post contains images lightsaber : I'll agree that the A388, 764, 77L, A345, and a few other aircraft had poor ROI. My point is 'too late.' The development costs on the A380 have been
62 Post contains images CXB77L : Is there any evidence to suggest that on routes where their competitors are using A380s (DXB, SIN, ICN for example), CX are losing market share? And
63 PM : It was rumoured last summer that they had selected RR engines. Would be nice... Then all three new customers in 2011 would have chosen RR.
64 mariner : Surely not, it has nothing to do with revenue. CASM (or CASK) is a cost metric. RASM (or RASK) is the revenue metric. mariner
65 gemuser : Not totally true! The B77W can can more cargo VOLUME than the A380, the A380 can carry more cargo weight than the B77W. Gemuser
66 Post contains images mikey72 : There is no doubt the A380 is a game changer and a technologically awe inspiring aircraft. (Not sure about aesthetically but as the saying goes 'look
67 PM : A 77L is the 777-200LR. A 77W is the 777-300ER. A 773 is (or should be) the non-ER 777-300. Then there's the 77E which is the 777-200ER. It all gets
68 mikey72 : Gracias !
69 mickey90 : What do you mean with revenue cargo? You can fill the a380 with more revenue cargo on HKG-JFK since the 77W is weight restricted. The a380 has more f
70 na : One of the key factors for success is to have the best plane. And that is currently the A380, not the 77W. CX will have to react, as the 77W will not
71 art : Regarding the pipedream/lie as you put it, Airbus did not allow for the CATIA disaster in their business case. Had that not happened (adding $ billio
72 Post contains images par13del : Well, one could always ask how China got to be where they are today, wonder what actions they took or were they actually forced. China is big on acti
73 CX Flyboy : Depends on your definition of "best". For CX it is not about prestige, looks, size etc...It is about profits, and for CX the A380-800 is probably not
74 something : I believe CX assumed Airbus would let the A389 follow sooner than they will. If CX were to order, say, 20 A380s today, when would these frames be del
75 Stitch : Sales figures would contradict that claim - and the A380-800 has been on offer at least as long as the 777-300ER has. The A380-800 is a magnificent a
76 Post contains images CXB77L : So is the A388 on JFK-HKG. A quick check of Airliners.net photo database doesn't appear to support your conclusion. Even if that were true, how is th
77 JerseyFlyer : It was also rumoured that they would take some early slots vacated by QF deferrals, which is consistent with the suggested 2013 first delivery, in wh
78 be77 : Here Here - I so agree! Sadly, when one companies sunk costs get written off, all of a sudden the other companies in the industry are non-competitive
79 A380Heavy : I don't think Hong Kong Airlines will be using an A388 into LGW, I seem to remember that with the tail being 13ft taller than that of a B744 they can
80 ba319-131 : I don't think Hong Kong Airlines will be using an A388 into LGW, I seem to remember that with the tail being 13ft taller than that of a B744 they can'
81 something : Prestige very often translates into profit though. Or do you think a pair of Gucci pants lasts 100 times longer than a Levis?
82 ebbUK : Be careful quoting or responding to that you are likely to have it deleted as I did with this note from the mods "This is a personal message from the
83 Post contains links and images Heavierthanair : G'day For whatever it's worth, it has hit the BBC news http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-16452171 Cheers Peter
84 Post contains images be77 : Bridges shouldn't be any harder to go through than buildings or RJ's?
85 Stitch : Even with it happening, I've always been of the opinion that it's far too early to write the epitaph for the business case of the A380-800. In roughl
86 NCFC99 : If crew rest is on the main deck, that means less passangers, less bags, more room for cargo. To me the above paragraph is a contardiction. Whilst ca
87 sunrisevalley : The "standard" for belly cargo for passenger aircraft is considered to be around 180kg/m^3. FWIW this is the value that EK uses. On this basis the 77
88 Post contains links Daysleeper : To quote this article. Boeing received direct government subsidies on the 787 aircraft from the state of Washington ($3.2 billion equates to $3.2 mil
89 Stitch : That article is using the projected benefits of House Bill 2294 over 20 years at the time that bill was passed in 2003. And those projections assumed
90 par13del : Still does not explain what Boeing's issues have to do with the A380, the order just placed, how much money Airbus put into the a/c and how many fram
91 Post contains links N14AZ : Finally a confirmation from Hong Kong Airlines. Source: http://www.flightglobal.com/news/art...onfirms-order-for-10-a380s-366646/ So the sales numbers
92 scouseflyer : As you say, a good year with the backlog shrinking slightly but still being very healthy. My only disapointment is that the VN order now looks to be
93 Post contains images N14AZ : Yes, this would be a nice start for 2012, similiar to 2011 when they confirmed two new operators at the beginning of the year (ASIANA and SKYMARK). I
94 india1 : @ Scouseflyer "As you say, a good year with the backlog shrinking slightly but still being very healthy. My only disapointment is that the VN order no
95 Burkhard : So he was the inventor of yield management systems. He would understand the daily changes of FR ticket prices immediately. He is right, price is a fu
96 Post contains images N14AZ : That's what I think. So John Leahy should send his salesmen *) to the Sheik wife's tea partys to present the adavantages of having a VVIP A 380. *) a
97 AustrianZRH : With the difference that the VS and IT orders are firm, deposits paid, while VN only signed a letter of intent.
98 scouseflyer : Airbus originally had 5 test aircraft: MSN001 - always to remain with Airbus and is currently doing XWB tests (I think!0 MSN002 - VVIP plane MSN004 -
99 Post contains images OzGlobal : What value is 'higher frenquency" when we're talking about very long and ultra long haul??? If I leave LHR on QF10 at 21:30 in the evening bound for
100 Post contains images dfambro : Why yes, quite some time ago and I my wife tells me regularly But seriously, upstairs on the 744 is a narrowbody experience - low ceiling, one aisle,
101 Stitch : While I was not actually the poster (the website does not properly reflect deleted posts), I will say that I probably would prefer a non-stop A319LR
102 Post contains images 747400sp : Well I have a feeling, that my future wife where ever she is, could easily say the same about me. "Now, there a different between the up stairs on a
103 OzGlobal : So would I over a short Transatlantic hop for instance: e.g. CDG-JFK rather than CDG-LHR-JFK. But we are talking transpacific or Kangaroo route. LHR-
104 dfambro : I do respect this view - comfort definitely matters. But my priorities here seem to be a bit different. The specific thing that really bugs me is tha
105 ikramerica : NRT curfew. Curfews are a main driving force behind size over frequency, not just distance. SYD, LHR, NRT, FRA all have curfews that force airlines t
106 OzGlobal : Right. Just look at the flotillas of QF A388s and B744s departing within minutes from LHR and LAX for Oz on any evening....
107 ikramerica : The thing is, QF has tried the flight that arrives SYD before curfew, and it was an underperformer. It can't leave late enough in the afternoon to ge
108 dfambro : This is the reason - no connecting opportunities. I would think there's enough traffic that wants a later arrival to support a 788 from ORD or JFK, s
109 Post contains images AngMoh : Maybe your own Gulfstream G650 (or even better, a private 77L or 345) can do what you want, but the fare is definitely not the same.... And the plane
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