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Hawaiian To JFK - New B6 Partnership  
User currently offlineSanti319 From Mexico, joined Dec 2005, 397 posts, RR: 0
Posted (2 years 7 months 4 weeks 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 10240 times:

As of right now it is a rumor, but it will be confirmed today, they will be parking at T-5, intersting B6 keeps having interline agreements instead of growing organically in JFK, while BOS sees most of B6 expansion to new destinations.

[Edited 2012-01-23 03:45:42]

63 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineOzarkD9S From United States of America, joined Oct 2001, 5111 posts, RR: 21
Reply 1, posted (2 years 7 months 4 weeks 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 10232 times:

Quoting Santi319 (Thread starter):


As of right now it is a rumor, but it will be confirmed today, they will be parking at T-5, intersting B6 keeps code-sharing instead of growing organically in JFK, while BOS sees most of B6 expansion to new destinations.


B6 doesn't codeshare with anyone at this time, they do have interline agreements in place with a few carriers to facilitate connections. And JFK is close to being maxed out for B6 in terms of commercially viable slots, a problem they don't face at BOS.



Next Up: STL-LGA-RIC-ATL-STL
User currently onlinejfk777 From United States of America, joined Aug 2006, 8375 posts, RR: 7
Reply 2, posted (2 years 7 months 4 weeks 1 day 5 hours ago) and read 10044 times:
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Is this the first A330 to park at Terminal 5 ? Terminal 5 seems very friendly to A320 but not big 777 size planes.

User currently offlinesimairlinenet From United States of America, joined Oct 2005, 917 posts, RR: 2
Reply 3, posted (2 years 7 months 4 weeks 1 day 4 hours ago) and read 9864 times:

Interesting, I would have expected Delta to be the logical candidate given the current relationship.

Quoting jfk777 (Reply 2):
Is this the first A330 to park at Terminal 5 ? Terminal 5 seems very friendly to A320 but not big 777 size planes.

This is a very good point. What is gate availability for 0655-1000, the scheduled turn time?


User currently offlinejfklganyc From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 3477 posts, RR: 5
Reply 4, posted (2 years 7 months 4 weeks 1 day 4 hours ago) and read 9815 times:

"This is a very good point. What is gate availability for 0655-1000, the scheduled turn time?"

Ironically, the one time of day when every gate is filled.

"intersting B6 keeps having interline agreements instead of growing organically in JFK"

They can not grow at JFK...they are slot restricted.

Now if AA pulls out/downsizes in BK, that is a different story


User currently onlineB6FA4ever From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 816 posts, RR: 11
Reply 5, posted (2 years 7 months 4 weeks 1 day 4 hours ago) and read 9814 times:

The only logical gate that could be used would be gate 27 IMO...but not sure if the wing span would also keep gate 26 vacant during the turn time. I believe its a 3hr ground time for the aircraft.

User currently offlinejetbluefan1 From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 2982 posts, RR: 14
Reply 6, posted (2 years 7 months 4 weeks 1 day 3 hours ago) and read 9564 times:

According to the AP, travelers can redeem frequent flier points on each other's flights. I'm pretty sure this is different from B6's other interline agreements except the one with AA.

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/JetBlu...rlines-ink-apf-3568915484.html?x=0



Most people on a.net hate JetBlue. Get used to it.
User currently onlinewerdywerd From United States of America, joined Aug 2005, 574 posts, RR: 1
Reply 7, posted (2 years 7 months 4 weeks 1 day 1 hour ago) and read 9221 times:

Here is my picture from today's event

http://img3.imageshack.us/img3/2572/b6has.jpg

Uploaded with ImageShack.us

It is confirmed that they will be using T5 at JFK.

We have 5 or 6 gates that their A330 will be able to use. In order to fit the aircraft, we will have to shutdown the neighboring gate and move the Jetway over.

Non-Stop service to/from JFK T5 starts in June

Very Excited!


User currently offlinecontrails15 From United States of America, joined Oct 2008, 1181 posts, RR: 0
Reply 8, posted (2 years 7 months 4 weeks 23 hours ago) and read 8987 times:

Gate 27 is approved my PANYNJ as a widebody gate. Whether or not you'll be able to use gate 26 at the same time, time will tell because demo is done next door so you can move the construction barrier and extend the jet bridge out more. I'm a little surprised we got this contract. With a service company being cheap and T4 set up for widebodies one would think they would be over there. The challenge will be sticking an A330 amount of pax up in the terminal. Its EXTREMELY cramped between 25-27. Eh, wouldn't be the first forced thing this airline has done here.


Giants football!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
User currently offlineKarlB737 From United States of America, joined Mar 2004, 3105 posts, RR: 10
Reply 9, posted (2 years 7 months 4 weeks 23 hours ago) and read 8936 times:

Quoting Santi319 (Thread starter):
As of right now it is a rumor, but it will be confirmed today

Courtesy: CNBC

Video Report:

JetBlue Teams Up With Hawaiian Airlines

http://video.cnbc.com/gallery/?video=3000068807


User currently offlineAv8tor From United States of America, joined Dec 2007, 142 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (2 years 7 months 4 weeks 22 hours ago) and read 8709 times:

Quoting werdywerd (Reply 7):
Very Excited!

Do you work for JetBlue? Are you Inflight? If so, you shouldn't be so excited, you are being outsourced. Another route that B6 will never fly on their own. Less motivation to buy an aircraft with the range to fly to Hawaii.


User currently offlineBMI727 From United States of America, joined Feb 2009, 15744 posts, RR: 27
Reply 11, posted (2 years 7 months 4 weeks 22 hours ago) and read 8636 times:

Quoting Av8tor (Reply 10):
Another route that B6 will never fly on their own.

They likely wouldn't have done that anytime soon. And I'm sure that everyone at JetBlue is completely disappointed with a new partnership that will help them fill their planes.



Why do Aerospace Engineering students have to turn things in on time?
User currently offlineairbazar From United States of America, joined Sep 2003, 8371 posts, RR: 10
Reply 12, posted (2 years 7 months 4 weeks 22 hours ago) and read 8604 times:

Quoting Av8tor (Reply 10):
Do you work for JetBlue? Are you Inflight? If so, you shouldn't be so excited, you are being outsourced. Another route that B6 will never fly on their own. Less motivation to buy an aircraft with the range to fly to Hawaii.

This is the stupidest comment I've heard in a while. Not only does it ignore the obvious and inherent benefits of cooperation between airlines which just about every airline in existence has, but why in the world would B6 want to a) fly to Hawaii, and b) want to buy a plane with that kind of range?


User currently offlinebrons2 From United States of America, joined Sep 2001, 3013 posts, RR: 4
Reply 13, posted (2 years 7 months 4 weeks 22 hours ago) and read 8570 times:

What equipment? A332 or A333? Clearly A332 can make it non-stop, but the A333 would have better economics on the route.

CO flew the 764 EWR-HNL at one time and there were occasional stops at SFO and such. Can newer A333 make it? GCMAP shows 4330nm, I know AC at one point used the A333 for some pretty long TATL somewhere over 4000NM.



Firings, if well done, are good for employee morale.
User currently onlinejfk777 From United States of America, joined Aug 2006, 8375 posts, RR: 7
Reply 14, posted (2 years 7 months 4 weeks 22 hours ago) and read 8465 times:
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Quoting brons2 (Reply 13):

What equipment? A332 or A333? Clearly A332 can make it non-stop, but the A333 would have better economics on the route.

CO flew the 764 EWR-HNL at one time and there were occasional stops at SFO and such. Can newer A333 make it? GCMAP shows 4330nm, I know AC at one point used the A333 for some pretty long TATL somewhere over 4000NM.

Hawiian has only A330-200 not the bigger -300. They are expanding eastward to JFK and westward to Haneda Airport in Tokyo and Seoul.


User currently offlineAv8tor From United States of America, joined Dec 2007, 142 posts, RR: 0
Reply 15, posted (2 years 7 months 4 weeks 21 hours ago) and read 7824 times:

Quoting airbazar (Reply 12):
This is the stupidest comment I've heard in a while. Not only does it ignore the obvious and inherent benefits of cooperation between airlines which just about every airline in existence has, but why in the world would B6 want to a) fly to Hawaii, and b) want to buy a plane with that kind of range?

Well if you don't work for JetBlue, you probably wouldn't understand. If we as employees keep getting outsourced by the numerous "agreements" JetBlue keeps signing, we will never grow into larger aircraft. I don't like being outsourced, I want B6 to fly these routes.

Quoting BMI727 (Reply 11):
They likely wouldn't have done that anytime soon. And I'm sure that everyone at JetBlue is completely disappointed with a new partnership that will help them fill their planes.

They certainly won't do routes like this anytime soon because they don't have to. They'll just sign another agreement like this when they want to fly somewhere new.


User currently offlinecontrails15 From United States of America, joined Oct 2008, 1181 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (2 years 7 months 4 weeks 20 hours ago) and read 7494 times:

Quoting Av8tor (Reply 10):
Do you work for JetBlue? Are you Inflight? If so, you shouldn't be so excited, you are being outsourced. Another route that B6 will never fly on their own. Less motivation to buy an aircraft with the range to fly to Hawaii.

Okay, I'm not gonna call your comment stupid but your misguided here. I say this because speaking on a forum such as this, I don't know what your background is concerning aviation business. First off I do work for B6 which has nothing to do with the fact this is a matter of B6 making itself stronger in an area in which we don't compete in. Don't know how long you've been with the company but we've been making agreements like this for years now. Its how airlines survive in modern times without having to start up a route. Especially an airline like ours where we don't have the equipment to do such a route and doesn't merit getting it. If your looking for Jetblue to aquire widebody aircraft, well don't hold your breath. Its not in their business model and to be honest makes zero sense. What department that you work for that you say we "keep on being outsourced"/ Because from someone that works for ground ops, your using that word a little to loosely for my taste. This is very good news whether you chose to believe that or not.



Giants football!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
User currently offlineAv8tor From United States of America, joined Dec 2007, 142 posts, RR: 0
Reply 17, posted (2 years 7 months 4 weeks 20 hours ago) and read 7400 times:

Quoting contrails15 (Reply 16):
This is very good news whether you chose to believe that or not.

It is great news if you work for ground ops. You are actually going to benefit from this agreement. If you work above the wings, it's not so great. Just my opinion of course. And I certainly don't see the need to call people names.  


User currently offlinewashingtonian From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 18, posted (2 years 7 months 4 weeks 20 hours ago) and read 7320 times:

Quoting werdywerd (Reply 7):
We have 5 or 6 gates that their A330 will be able to use. In order to fit the aircraft, we will have to shutdown the neighboring gate and move the Jetway over.

How are they possibly going to do this for 3 hours in the morning peak then?

I'm surprised they can't just use that gate near the empty T6 ramp space (27)? Would that also require the use of Gate 26? If so, seems like poor (recent) planning by B6...The terminal is only 3 years old.


User currently offlinecontrails15 From United States of America, joined Oct 2008, 1181 posts, RR: 0
Reply 19, posted (2 years 7 months 4 weeks 20 hours ago) and read 7294 times:

Quoting Av8tor (Reply 17):
It is great news if you work for ground ops. You are actually going to benefit from this agreement. If you work above the wings, it's not so great. Just my opinion of course. And I certainly don't see the need to call people names.  

But who are you worried about this affecting??? No jobs are lost to this nor will jobs be in jeopardy in the future because of it. I'm not following how you figure on crew members having to worry about being outsourced through transactions such as this.



Giants football!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
User currently offlinechuchoteur From France, joined Sep 2006, 764 posts, RR: 0
Reply 20, posted (2 years 7 months 4 weeks 20 hours ago) and read 7263 times:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/jetblue/6750151915/

Nice photos of the event


User currently offlineunited75x From United States of America, joined Feb 2007, 27 posts, RR: 0
Reply 21, posted (2 years 7 months 4 weeks 20 hours ago) and read 7240 times:
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Quoting OzarkD9S (Reply 1):
B6 doesn't codeshare with anyone at this time, they do have interline agreements in place with a few carriers to facilitate connections.

We do have a codeshare with LH. They do put there flight numbers on alot of our flights.


User currently offlinecontrails15 From United States of America, joined Oct 2008, 1181 posts, RR: 0
Reply 22, posted (2 years 7 months 4 weeks 20 hours ago) and read 7189 times:

Quoting washingtonian (Reply 18):

Quoting werdywerd (Reply 7):
We have 5 or 6 gates that their A330 will be able to use. In order to fit the aircraft, we will have to shutdown the neighboring gate and move the Jetway over.

How are they possibly going to do this for 3 hours in the morning peak then?

I'm surprised they can't just use that gate near the empty T6 ramp space (27)? Would that also require the use of Gate 26? If so, seems like poor (recent) planning by B6...The terminal is only 3 years old.

Like I stated above, 27 is a widebody gate and will be used. However, the problem isn't on the ground with gate space and ground time. We can work with that. My question is having all those pax in a terminal area not designed to house that amount of people. Now, if we're not gonna use 26 which isn't needed from a ground point of view, its gonna get very crowed and uncomfortable in that gate area. Those that are familiar with the area between 25-27 upstairs know what I'm talking about.



Giants football!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
User currently offlineAv8tor From United States of America, joined Dec 2007, 142 posts, RR: 0
Reply 23, posted (2 years 7 months 4 weeks 20 hours ago) and read 7189 times:

Quoting contrails15 (Reply 19):
But who are you worried about this affecting??? No jobs are lost to this nor will jobs be in jeopardy in the future because of it. I'm not following how you figure on crew members having to worry about being outsourced through transactions such as this.

The basic problem is this: JetBlue can add hundreds of these agreements with as many airlines as they want and the employees have ZERO say in it. What prevents JetBlue from adding flights to say STL or OMA or BNA etc.. with XYZ airline? If you work for JetBlue, you should want JetBlue to grow "organically". Isn't that the term Dave always throws around? All of these agreements are not "organic" growth, they are outsourcing..... Just my opinion of course.


User currently offlinewashingtonian From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 24, posted (2 years 7 months 4 weeks 19 hours ago) and read 7031 times:

Quoting contrails15 (Reply 22):
Like I stated above, 27 is a widebody gate and will be used.

Thanks for the info. I'm sure that by June they will push the gate back such that 26 can be used at the same time as the A-330 is at 27. Right?

Quoting contrails15 (Reply 22):
My question is having all those pax in a terminal area not designed to house that amount of people

I'm sure they'll be spread out, and that many will be in the dining area and walking around until boarding. It will get crowded though.


25 Viscount724 : AC currently uses the A333 YVR-LHR (4104 nm).
26 Post contains images OzarkD9S : It appears to be one-sided however. No problem booking FRA-JFK-BUF on the LH website, but I could not book BUF-JFK-FRA on the B6 website. I guess we'
27 lhr380 : So your saying no airline should co-op like B6 and Hawaiian are? Your asking for the entire aviation industry to change the way it works. Also saying
28 tharanga : This seems like a very valid concern. The problem with your argument is that you assume jetblue could fly to Hawaii, Ireland, South Africa and wherev
29 Post contains images lightsaber : I would be too! HA is a great partner that will enhance JetBlue's reputation. That I can understand. But B6 is not in the financial position to buy t
30 JAAlbert : For us armchair experts, such as myself, what is the difference between a codeshare agreement and interline agreement? Did Continental end its non-st
31 b757jetjockey : JetBlue management has been coercing B6 employees to sign addendums to their individual employment contracts with wording to the effect that B6's poss
32 Trucker : Looking at an area SSE of T5 on Google Maps it appears to be an area with hardstands. Given that it looks like this plane is going to tie up 2 gates f
33 JAAlbert : Lightsaber, what E190 experience did JetBlue have? Is there a thread on this topic? Why would JetBlue even require such an addendum? What is in the J
34 BMI727 : They aren't going to be flying those routes anytime soon regardless. Didn't Alaska codeshare on a bunch of flights to Hawaii before they started flyi
35 b757jetjockey : The individual contracts that B6 has its pilots sign when first employed is a sort of Independent Contractor contract. This was done in an effort to
36 jetbluefan1 : I understand your point of view, especially since there is a sense of loyalty. However, you need to consider that a.) JetBlue never offered you the o
37 HAL : It can easily take 2+ hours to turn a widebody after an 11 hour flight (cleaning, catering, servicing, unloading & reloading the baggage, boardin
38 Post contains links HALFA : Here is a slide show of todays events from Terminal 5 at JFK, including my flying partners at HA donning uniforms from the past. http://www.flickr.com
39 jayhup : So what are the empty promises? How are they being misled? How are the last ten years at JetBlue and different than any other start-up business in an
40 jetbluefan1 : I know you meant to quote the b757jetjockey and not me, but I agree with you. I would allude to the fact that JetBlue pilots have spawned unionizatio
41 richierich : I didn't want to jump in here but I think there is something very wrong with your 'logic'. B6 does not have and is not buying aircraft capable of fly
42 jayhup : Apologies...I hit the wrong @#$%^& button. I think JetBlue have taken some chances in the destinations that they are flying to and I think that s
43 delta2ual : I may be naive, but doesn't it work both ways? If HA flies JFK-HNL (and B6 doesn't) and B6 flies up and down the east coast (and HA doesn't) isn't it
44 B6JFKH81 : You would have to look back to the 2006 time frame for the threads. The E190 had very bad "teething issues", so bad that ExpressJet was contracted ou
45 BMI727 : Very much so, which is why the whole argument is ridiculous. And using the word "outsourcing" is very much misleading, since there is zero chance tha
46 Trucker : I was thinking more like park the plane at the remote stand the entire time it's there and bus the passengers to and from T5. I see T4 also has remot
47 Cargolex : I guess I don't understand this perspective. I fly AS most of the time and not B6, owing to my location and the fact that I really like AS. When I do
48 contrails15 : T4 hardstand are used for uploading and offloading of rev. flights. Buses are used and pax are taken to the commuter terminal where Independence used
49 atrude777 : However, WN Pilots and SWAPA have forbidden code-sharing for the specific purpose because it is "outsourcing" SWAPA wants Southwest to do the flying
50 aloha73g : Codesharing does not = outsourcing. If B6 was hiring HA to fly an A330, 767 or 717 from JFK to BOS, LAX or FLL that would be outsourcing. Codesharing
51 Viscount724 : And there's not even any need to codeshare to do that. Many thousands of interline tickets are sold every day all over the world where there's no cod
52 contrails15 : Okay so I've heard that the gate that will be used will be either 14 or 12. Not 27. 14 will either be pushed back or 12 pulled out. Non the less a gat
53 werdywerd : 14 and 12 are just 2 of the 5 gates being considered. And Yes (As of the last meeting I had) the adjoining gate will need to be shutdown while the A3
54 contrails15 : That's a main concern Why would I think you were???
55 werdywerd : Sorry I was responding to b757jetjockey who had asked me
56 Av8tor : Ding...ding...ding... we have a winner! SWAPA gets it! JetBlue employees on the other hand don't have representation, so they get outsourcing shoved
57 lhr380 : I'm trying to understand his? Your airline has no aircraft to operate the route, and won't for a good number of years, and you don't want your airlin
58 jfklganyc : What outsourcing? Do they have 50 and 70 seaters flying 50 percent of their routes like the ALPA big guys do? As for HNL, if you're a pilot you know t
59 tharanga : Wait, what? If that's the case, please please tell me that they'll make it so it can be easily expanded in the future, as needed.
60 lightsaber : As already noted: B6 is a high utilization airline whom is discovering the costs of owning the 'fleet leader.' B6, with the E190 purchase, also bet o
61 contrails15 : Three gates three hardstands. Arrivals Only!!!! Looks like we'll be dealing with the same crap we deal with now over at the IAT, just under our roof.
62 Bluewave 707 : This looks like a win-win for HA & B6. Not only will B6 feed HA at common airports, but it will allow HA to do the same where B6 flies. Plus with
63 gigneil : You're never going to grow into larger aircraft, and as an employee you should know that. NS
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