Sponsor Message:
Civil Aviation Forum
My Starred Topics | Profile | New Topic | Forum Index | Help | Search 
DL Dropping MIA-LHR  
User currently offlinebastew From Australia, joined Sep 2006, 1023 posts, RR: 2
Posted (2 years 1 month 3 weeks 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 11968 times:

Not long after starting the route Delta is dropping MIA-LHR due to high costs and fuel prices.

It gained slots to operate the route when BA/AA had to relinquish a slot on the LHR-MIA route in order to gain Anti Trust immunity.

These changes are on the back of Deltas' announcement that it will also cease LGW-ATL completely withdrawing service from that airport and increasing frequency on LHR-ATL.

46 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlinedtwpilot225 From United States of America, joined Dec 2011, 100 posts, RR: 0
Reply 1, posted (2 years 1 month 3 weeks 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 11975 times:

Delta had also set up a mini operation for Pinnacle out of MIA to connect these london flights. Pinnacle is and or was doing MIA-TPA, MIA-MCO, MIA JAX, and MIA RDU. I think all of those are going away as well.

User currently offlineLondonCity From United Kingdom, joined Nov 2008, 1448 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (2 years 1 month 3 weeks 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 11953 times:

Confirmed. Route ceases on April 16

http://www.businesstraveller.com/news/delta-drops-heathrow-miami-route


User currently offlinepeanuts From Netherlands, joined Dec 2009, 1411 posts, RR: 4
Reply 3, posted (2 years 1 month 3 weeks 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 11879 times:

Something smells. DL needs way more time for a route to develop. Why wouldn't they stick it out? Stick it out at least for the period that the slot deal would have required...

so:

-Numbers really look terrible, no reason to hang in there...DL may be predicting oil prices to soar even more soon.
-Something in the works with VS
-DL wants to make a gutsy move with a very uncertain outcome (AA assets)

If it's none of the above I would consider this a major "strategic MIA and/or LHR adjustment".

[Edited 2012-02-24 05:42:33]


Question Conventional Wisdom. While not all commonly held beliefs are wrong…all should be questioned.
User currently offlineLAXdude1023 From India, joined Sep 2006, 7320 posts, RR: 24
Reply 4, posted (2 years 1 month 3 weeks 2 days 19 hours ago) and read 11823 times:

Quoting peanuts (Reply 3):
-Numbers really look terrible, no reason to hang in there...
-Something in the works with VS

Its one of these two. Personally, I think it may be both.



Stewed...Lewd...Crude...Irreverent...Belligerent
User currently offlinebastew From Australia, joined Sep 2006, 1023 posts, RR: 2
Reply 5, posted (2 years 1 month 3 weeks 2 days 19 hours ago) and read 11739 times:

I agree. Maybe they jumped in a bit too quick without doing the proper sums as they slot that had to be relinquished by BA/AA was open to all bidders. With BA starting a 3rd daily flight end of march the competition would have been ramped up ever more as well which would have put even more pressure on DL's yield.

User currently offlineskymiler From United States of America, joined Aug 2007, 511 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (2 years 1 month 3 weeks 2 days 19 hours ago) and read 11628 times:

such a shame -- I did a R/T MIA LHR in December and it was great, and convenient, and was planning another in May.

I understood that the equipment would change to a 763 from the 764, but with the lie flats, in J etc.




I love to fly, and it shows!
User currently offlineA388 From Netherlands Antilles, joined May 2001, 9564 posts, RR: 11
Reply 7, posted (2 years 1 month 3 weeks 2 days 19 hours ago) and read 11542 times:

I never expected the DL MIA-LHR flight to be succesful looking at the major presence of BA and the AA hub for OneWorld Alliance connectivity.

A388


User currently offlinedavescj From United States of America, joined Jun 2007, 2292 posts, RR: 0
Reply 8, posted (2 years 1 month 3 weeks 2 days 19 hours ago) and read 11542 times:

LHR- MIA has heavy competion from BA/AA. Remember, connections to South America on AA go out of MIA, so there are good connections both there and into the US.

DL had no real support for the routes that are not leisure routes (TPA, MCO, etc.) RDU already has a London route (AA), BA has TPA and MCO. So where was the need for DL's MIA- LHR? DL doesn't heave a massive MIA route.

What would make more sense is for DL to begin a route to LHR where they can have more contracts and higher fare pax (LAX for example? maybe BOS or SLC?).

MIA- CDG/AMS would have made more sense as part of a JV I would think.

Dave



Can I have a mojito on this flight?
User currently offlinestaralliance85 From United States of America, joined Jul 2011, 201 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (2 years 1 month 3 weeks 2 days 19 hours ago) and read 11373 times:

The only strong routes that DL has from London are to JFK, ATL and maybe DTW. Any other routes are Not worth it for DL. They probably got killed by AA/BA on the MIA route because MIA is Not even a DL focus city and a strong OW hub. DL just needs to focus on JFK and ATL as their international gateways. What DL needs the most is VS. ST can use a new good member. It doesn't seem like *A members like LH (BMI deal to BA) and UA (Not picking up CO's relationship with VS) are so eager to have a relationship with VS. VS is certainly Not going to OW so they need ST.

However, SQ owning 49% of VS could be in a conflict of interest if they allow them to join ST. DL/AF/KL should strike a deal to SQ and Sir RB and make it happen. Dl will Not have to add more flights to LHR but codeshare with VS and would be a win win situation for both parties. DL would have code shares with VS to JFK, EWR, IAD, MIA, ORD, LAS, LAX and SFO. VS has a healthy prescence at JFK so it would be perfect in having a relationship with DL. Maybe even do a slot swap with *A members who want to be at EWR, close to UA.


As for LGW, it was Yesterdays News and it was inevitable that they were going to cut that route.



brad Fitzpatrick
User currently offlineflymia From United States of America, joined Jun 2001, 6995 posts, RR: 9
Reply 10, posted (2 years 1 month 3 weeks 2 days 18 hours ago) and read 11188 times:

There is no way in their short time in the route they could establish the route well enough to get some of the higher fares which of course due to MIA's AA hub AA/BA get most of. The planes were full but just full with low fares. They were competing with the monster of AA/BA which BA is going to start a 3rd daily flight from MIA soon. AA has its daily flight and on some days two-three flights to LHR from MIA and of course VS daily MIA-LHR. That is a lot of competition but also a very large market. But they just did not A) establish themselves long enough and B) Have that little bit of extra feed that could make the route work a bit better.

Quoting davescj (Reply 8):
What would make more sense is for DL to begin a route to LHR where they can have more contracts and higher fare pax (LAX for example? maybe BOS or SLC?).

They do fly BOS-LHR they started both BOS-LHR and MIA-LHR because they were given the slots once BA/AA got their ATI. But the slots can only be used for MIA-LHR and BOS-LHR.



"It was just four of us on the flight deck, trying to do our job" (Captain Al Haynes)
User currently offlineMAV88 From United States of America, joined May 2011, 183 posts, RR: 0
Reply 11, posted (2 years 1 month 3 weeks 2 days 18 hours ago) and read 11172 times:

Does AA/BA connect a decent amount of people through MIA going to/from Europe to Latin America?

I know millions of people connect from domestic destinations through MIA to Latin America, but am curious how many go international to international.


User currently offlineincitatus From Brazil, joined Feb 2005, 3964 posts, RR: 13
Reply 12, posted (2 years 1 month 3 weeks 2 days 18 hours ago) and read 11127 times:

Quoting flymia (Reply 10):
There is no way in their short time in the route they could establish the route well enough to get some of the higher fares which of course due to MIA's AA hub AA/BA get most of.

That is not what we read here at the time. We read that DL has a huge FF base in South Florida's huge market and making the flight viable would be easy. Many folks stated that MIA-LHR had a far better chance than BOS-LHR. Even though BOS isn't really anybody's hub.

Overall I say kudos to DL. If they can hold on to BOS-LHR, it is a significant win for them.


User currently offlinefxramper From United States of America, joined Dec 2005, 7127 posts, RR: 87
Reply 13, posted (2 years 1 month 3 weeks 2 days 18 hours ago) and read 11104 times:

Where in the announcement does it say that AA was kicking their butt and they are axing the route? Comical they thought they could compete out of MIA. Delta dartboard strikes again.

User currently offlineplanesailing From United Kingdom, joined Jul 2005, 815 posts, RR: 0
Reply 14, posted (2 years 1 month 3 weeks 2 days 18 hours ago) and read 11073 times:

Quoting flymia (Reply 10):
They do fly BOS-LHR they started both BOS-LHR and MIA-LHR because they were given the slots once BA/AA got their ATI. But the slots can only be used for MIA-LHR and BOS-LHR.

It is worth noting that the BOS route has been cut from twice daily down to one flight, so it is not performing either.

The slots are being returned for reallocation.


User currently offlinedelta2ual From United States of America, joined Dec 2007, 606 posts, RR: 1
Reply 15, posted (2 years 1 month 3 weeks 2 days 18 hours ago) and read 10998 times:

Quoting fxramper (Reply 13):
Delta dartboard strikes again.

I was shocked to read 12 whole posts before somebody said this. I think DL should just never start a new route again; if a route is successful, nobody cares; if it isn't, somebody brings up the dartboard. That's the best part of A-Net; total predictability for every topic discussed.



From the world's largest airline-to the world's largest airline. Delta2ual
User currently offlinemikey72 From United Kingdom, joined Oct 2009, 1780 posts, RR: 2
Reply 16, posted (2 years 1 month 3 weeks 2 days 17 hours ago) and read 10818 times:

Do the slots now go back to BA/AA or will another airline have a go at LHR-MIA ?


Flying is like sex - I've never had all I wanted but occasionally I've had all I can stand.
User currently offlineLDVAviation From United States of America, joined Dec 2008, 975 posts, RR: 5
Reply 17, posted (2 years 1 month 3 weeks 2 days 17 hours ago) and read 10769 times:

Quoting mikey72 (Reply 16):
Do the slots now go back to BA/AA or will another airline have a go at LHR-MIA ?

If no one applies for the slots, BA can make use of them until the next allocation period. After 10 years, the slots revert permanently back to BA. (They are BA's, not AA's slots.)


User currently offlinemikey72 From United Kingdom, joined Oct 2009, 1780 posts, RR: 2
Reply 18, posted (2 years 1 month 3 weeks 2 days 17 hours ago) and read 10481 times:

Quoting LDVAviation (Reply 17):
If no one applies for the slots,

Ooh, maybe I'll have a crack at it ! Lol

Wonder if i'd get some sort of enterprise grant ?

All I'd need is a couple of 748i's, handful of pilots and maybe what 50,60 crew ?

Game on !!



Flying is like sex - I've never had all I wanted but occasionally I've had all I can stand.
User currently offlineTeamInTheSky From United States of America, joined Apr 2011, 531 posts, RR: 0
Reply 19, posted (2 years 1 month 3 weeks 2 days 16 hours ago) and read 10365 times:

I had friends come in from BHM to LHR and they were routed to ATL to MIA then to LHR. So if the planes were full, it was because people were taking very cheap fares to be routed through a couple of places.

I tend to think that VS and DL are very close to forming a codesharing relationship. This has been in the works, but from what I understand, VS's asking price was too high for DL. With BA consolidating power, VS has to find a strong partner in the USA, especially with the agreement with CO ending. For DL, it makes sense since they will have relationships with both VS and DJ.

However, as staralliance aptly points out, I don't think DL will be adding VS to SkyTeam or even a JV because of SQ's ownership.



Since 2010: DL, KL, AF, WX, IG, FR , FL, U2, AK, BA, OK, UX, VS, VN, K6
User currently offlineskipness1E From United Kingdom, joined Aug 2007, 3073 posts, RR: 1
Reply 20, posted (2 years 1 month 3 weeks 2 days 16 hours ago) and read 10096 times:

Delta are also strong on MSP-LHR as well, built up over many years by NWA, initially from LGW.

User currently offlinejfklganyc From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 3171 posts, RR: 5
Reply 21, posted (2 years 1 month 3 weeks 2 days 15 hours ago) and read 9090 times:

Amazing that a bunch of aviation novices such as myself here on a.net knew this route would never work. Yet Delta is paying someone a very nice salary in ATL to make these decisions and they didn't see it.

Really makes you wonder how firm that ground you walk on really is. Likely lost millions if not tens of millions with this stupid experiment.


User currently offlineLONGisland89 From United States of America, joined Jan 2006, 708 posts, RR: 0
Reply 22, posted (2 years 1 month 3 weeks 2 days 14 hours ago) and read 8912 times:

Quoting delta2ual (Reply 15):
I was shocked to read 12 whole posts before somebody said this. I think DL should just never start a new route again; if a route is successful, nobody cares; if it isn't, somebody brings up the dartboard. That's the best part of A-Net; total predictability for every topic discussed.

The dartboard exists. I've past several offices in HQ that have wall maps with little holes in it (evidence of dart throwing).


User currently offlinefxramper From United States of America, joined Dec 2005, 7127 posts, RR: 87
Reply 23, posted (2 years 1 month 3 weeks 2 days 14 hours ago) and read 8762 times:

Quoting jfklganyc (Reply 21):
Amazing that a bunch of aviation novices such as myself here on a.net knew this route would never work. Yet Delta is paying someone a very nice salary in ATL to make these decisions and they didn't see it.

The DL koolaid drinkers continue to argue this opinion but I agree with you. I have no allegiance to any airline including the one I work for. I use common sense when I talk about DL and their dartboard.


User currently offlinehiflyer From United States of America, joined Nov 2004, 2153 posts, RR: 3
Reply 24, posted (2 years 1 month 3 weeks 2 days 14 hours ago) and read 8716 times:

I smell a deal out there....to give it up before high summer season there has got to be some incentive beside keeping the aircraft......England is good money during the summer no matter what.

25 simairlinenet : You mean the wall maps on which Delta employees plan future vacations? Because I have one of those...
26 EricR : It may appear that way, but we really do not know what the rationale was behind launching and subsequently discontinuing the route. There could have
27 ebbuk : Nobody can make a new route work with 767s. Not with fuel prices as they are and the rate at which that planes burns it. Was never going to work on th
28 Post contains images airbazar : I suppose that's why the 767 outnumbers any other aircraft on TATL routes
29 ks5114 : What jet did they use on this route? 763 or 772?
30 klkla : Where did DL get the additional slots for ATL-LHR that are being added at around the same time that this route is being discontinued?
31 dlramp4life : DL is cutting back in Europe, that is one of the things that is going on for the 2012 year, grow in south america and asia, cut back in europe because
32 OOer : This is just such a stupid move. If the route was losing money, why wasn't it axed in November? No...instead they're going to kill it right before the
33 planesailing : 764. The MIA route is being returned as per the conditions of the lease and is already posted for tender again, with a closing date in March. There i
34 skipness1E : This is complete nonsense, you have a better platform to launch a new route? No, of course not, it's not the aircraft it's the prevailing market domi
35 PHX Flyer : What a surprise ... NOT! Why US airlines ever agreed to the current LHR slot policy is beyond me. Of course, the reason for the route cancellation is
36 burnsie28 : According to network it is "LGW station closure and route moves to LHR" take it for what its worth.
37 ChrisNH : Well, if they don't want to be laughed at endlessly they'll stick it out. No airline has started and then ceased more routes out of Boston than Delta
38 Post contains images AAIL86 : Just goes to show how hard it is these days to venture outside the hub. Everyone knows that AA or UA not could compete on DTW-AMS (AMS is not LHR, I
39 jporterfi : I'm not surprised that Delta wasn't profitable on a route outside its hub. AA and BA probably had that route covered; for Delta, it was probably a lon
40 slcdeltarumd11 : It is not a 757 possible route. Between AA and BAs FF bases in BOTH cities it seemed like a crazy dartboard route anyway. Much like PHL-LAX you are f
41 jmc1975 : This is not a surprise...it was the perhaps the biggest herpderp that DL has done in recent years.
42 BobLoblaw : I thought Delta never planned on operating it for too long. I think the rules between UK and USA gave another carrier the ability to fly MIA-LHR nonst
43 burnsie28 : It's out of range, but in reality the LHR routes were big on promoting the lie flats that the 764 offered.
44 IrishAyes : Yes, but product offering alone isn't going to steal market share away when there are other very important variables that give AA and BA a leg up ove
45 Post contains images skipness1E : Worth mentioning that some Heathrow flight numbers were changed at the start of Feb. DL6 / 5 DTW renumbered DL18 / 19 DL148 / 149 renumbered DL1 / 6 S
46 doulasc : This doesn't surprise me. American and British Airways has that route with plenty of flights. When Delta took over the Atlantic routes from Pan Am in
Top Of Page
Forum Index

This topic is archived and can not be replied to any more.

Printer friendly format

Similar topics:More similar topics...
AA Changes On MIA-LHR posted Sun Oct 3 2010 19:40:28 by N62NA
AA Flight 56 MIA-LHR posted Mon Feb 16 2009 16:09:00 by N62NA
DL Kiosks In LHR Terminal 4? posted Tue Nov 4 2008 06:25:18 by Josh32121
AA Possibly Starting MIA-LHR Daylight Flight posted Tue Jul 24 2007 22:41:07 by N62NA
DL Dropping BGM In September posted Fri Jul 13 2007 18:02:45 by BatonOps
Virgin 6 MIA-LHR Diverted To BOS! posted Sun Dec 17 2006 05:51:09 by HighFlyer9790
DL JFK-MIA Mainline posted Sat Sep 2 2006 04:00:49 by Flyguy1
Daytime Flight MIA-LHR posted Mon Feb 20 2006 05:12:25 by N62NA
DL Started MIA-SLC Today posted Sun Dec 18 2005 04:46:03 by MAH4546
Is DL Dropping New Haven? posted Fri Oct 28 2005 07:15:20 by F27XXX