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JJ Upgauges GRU-MIA To 77W  
User currently offlineC010T3 From Brazil, joined Jul 2006, 3652 posts, RR: 19
Posted (2 years 1 month 3 weeks 5 hours ago) and read 6210 times:

TAM has applied before the Brazilian ANAC for an amendment in its hours of transportation at GRU for the MIA flights. Most important modification is the equipment, which changes from a 332 to a 77W effective October 5, 2012.
TAM is taking delivery of 4 777-300ER this year and it was unclear until now which route would be upgauged. The strongest rumour was JFK, but it seems that MIA came first.

JJ8090 daily 77W GRU 2355 MIA 0715+1
JJ8091 daily 77W MIA 2005 GRU 0520+1

JJ8094 daily 77W GRU 1030 MIA 1805
JJ8095 daily 77W MIA 1120 GRU 1935

Source: http://www2.anac.gov.br/hotran/
Application date: 28.02.2012

27 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlinetonytifao From Brazil, joined Mar 2005, 1011 posts, RR: 0
Reply 1, posted (2 years 1 month 3 weeks 4 hours ago) and read 6229 times:

Finally a great aircraft on Brazil-US market for TAM! I would actually fly TAM now  

User currently offlinetcavanguard From Canada, joined Feb 2009, 5 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (2 years 1 month 3 weeks 3 hours ago) and read 6074 times:

Really? You would fly TAM now because of a 10 abreast 777 in Y and a 7 abreast J cabin? I'll pass, thanks!

User currently offlineOB1504 From United States of America, joined Jul 2004, 3236 posts, RR: 9
Reply 3, posted (2 years 1 month 3 weeks 3 hours ago) and read 6026 times:

Nevertheless, it's great news that the route is performing strongly enough to merit a larger aircraft.

User currently offlineleftyboarder From Turkey, joined Apr 2008, 693 posts, RR: 1
Reply 4, posted (2 years 1 month 3 weeks 2 hours ago) and read 5982 times:

Quoting C010T3 (Thread starter):
JJ8090 daily 77W GRU 2355 MIA 0715+1
JJ8091 daily 77W MIA 2005 GRU 0520+1

JJ8094 daily 77W GRU 1030 MIA 1805
JJ8095 daily 77W MIA 1120 GRU 1935

Great news for TAM and MIA.

Just a question, I understand that the aircraft that flies 8090 returns as JJ8095, and the one that does JJ8094 returns as JJ8091, right? What is the purpose of that? Why not number the flights so that same aircraft operates the same return flight?


User currently offlinejog From Netherlands, joined Jul 2005, 273 posts, RR: 7
Reply 5, posted (2 years 1 month 3 weeks 1 hour ago) and read 5922 times:

Quoting leftyboarder (Reply 4):
Just a question, I understand that the aircraft that flies 8090 returns as JJ8095, and the one that does JJ8094 returns as JJ8091, right? What is the purpose of that? Why not number the flights so that same aircraft operates the same return flight?

History: In the past JJ flew once daily and parked the aircraft all day at MIA. So, JJ8090/8091 were the night flights in the past. One day they decided it is worth doing daylight flight instead of parking the aircraft all day and added JJ8094/8095. Passengers booked on 8090/8091 remained booked on the night flights by keeping the old flight numbers for the night flights.


User currently offlineleftyboarder From Turkey, joined Apr 2008, 693 posts, RR: 1
Reply 6, posted (2 years 1 month 3 weeks 1 hour ago) and read 5892 times:

Quoting jog (Reply 5):
History: In the past JJ flew once daily and parked the aircraft all day at MIA. So, JJ8090/8091 were the night flights in the past. One day they decided it is worth doing daylight flight instead of parking the aircraft all day and added JJ8094/8095. Passengers booked on 8090/8091 remained booked on the night flights by keeping the old flight numbers for the night flights.

OK thanks, that makes sense  


User currently offlineC010T3 From Brazil, joined Jul 2006, 3652 posts, RR: 19
Reply 7, posted (2 years 1 month 2 weeks 6 days 22 hours ago) and read 5741 times:

Quoting leftyboarder (Reply 4):
Just a question, I understand that the aircraft that flies 8090 returns as JJ8095, and the one that does JJ8094 returns as JJ8091, right? What is the purpose of that? Why not number the flights so that same aircraft operates the same return flight?

It's that:

Quoting jog (Reply 5):
History

... and the fact that red-eye flights are generally preferred in Brazil. Passengers that are flying the red-eye will fly them on both directions.


User currently offlinejfk777 From United States of America, joined Aug 2006, 8091 posts, RR: 7
Reply 8, posted (2 years 1 month 2 weeks 6 days 19 hours ago) and read 5549 times:
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This is the first regularly scheduled 777-300ER from Miami. Air France was going to be first but kept the 744 on their CDG -MIA route. When will AA fly a 77W from MIA ?

User currently offlineN62NA From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 4256 posts, RR: 6
Reply 9, posted (2 years 1 month 2 weeks 6 days 18 hours ago) and read 5500 times:

Quoting jfk777 (Reply 8):
This is the first regularly scheduled 777-300ER from Miami. Air France was going to be first but kept the 744 on their CDG -MIA route.

Yes, it will be - very excited to see it here in MIA.

Quoting jfk777 (Reply 8):
When will AA fly a 77W from MIA ?

Or, will AA fly the 77W from MIA?


User currently offlinejfk777 From United States of America, joined Aug 2006, 8091 posts, RR: 7
Reply 10, posted (2 years 1 month 2 weeks 6 days 18 hours ago) and read 5480 times:
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Quoting N62NA (Reply 9):
Quoting jfk777 (Reply 8):When will AA fly a 77W from MIA ?
Or, will AA fly the 77W from MIA?

Since AA flies to many 777 cities from MIA its almost a "certainty" AA will fly the 77W from MIA. The 77W could "consolidate" current 777 flights from MIA to GRU and EZE during the slow season.


User currently offlinetonytifao From Brazil, joined Mar 2005, 1011 posts, RR: 0
Reply 11, posted (2 years 1 month 2 weeks 6 days 18 hours ago) and read 5417 times:

Quoting tcavanguard (Reply 2):
Really? You would fly TAM now because of a 10 abreast 777 in Y and a 7 abreast J cabin? I'll pass, thanks!

Didn't know it was 10 abreast in Y. Is the 77W a bit wider than the 772? All my 777 flights were on on AA772 or UA772 and once RG777. If not, it must be really cramped  


User currently offlinesomething From United Kingdom, joined May 2011, 1633 posts, RR: 21
Reply 12, posted (2 years 1 month 2 weeks 6 days 18 hours ago) and read 5405 times:

Quoting tcavanguard (Reply 2):
Really? You would fly TAM now because of a 10 abreast 777 in Y and a 7 abreast J cabin? I'll pass, thanks!

My thoughts exactly, especially when the alternative would have been a nice A330. Besides, the 777 is the dullest looking airplane to ever be built. Imagine what a TAM 748 or an A380 in their colors would look like.   



..sick of it. -K. Pilkington.
User currently offlineC010T3 From Brazil, joined Jul 2006, 3652 posts, RR: 19
Reply 13, posted (2 years 1 month 2 weeks 6 days 17 hours ago) and read 5381 times:

Quoting tonytifao (Reply 11):
Is the 77W a bit wider than the 772?

No, just longer.


User currently offlinetonytifao From Brazil, joined Mar 2005, 1011 posts, RR: 0
Reply 14, posted (2 years 1 month 2 weeks 6 days 16 hours ago) and read 5268 times:

On the 10 abreast vs 9 abreast (TAM vs AA for example), how thinner are the seats? Do they make the aisle thinner or the seats? Or combination?

User currently offlineOB1504 From United States of America, joined Jul 2004, 3236 posts, RR: 9
Reply 15, posted (2 years 1 month 2 weeks 6 days 13 hours ago) and read 5082 times:

Quoting jfk777 (Reply 8):
This is the first regularly scheduled 777-300ER from Miami. Air France was going to be first but kept the 744 on their CDG -MIA route. When will AA fly a 77W from MIA ?

Didn't AF get around to flying the 77W a few times on the route? And the equipment change has to happen eventually, considering that the 744s will be leaving the fleet.


User currently offlinerotating14 From United States of America, joined Jan 2012, 542 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (2 years 1 month 2 weeks 6 days 12 hours ago) and read 4617 times:

Quoting N62NA (Reply 9):

One would have to assume that they would fly out of MIA. Id be safe to bet they would send at least 2 777-300ER's to MIA to do the GRU or the NRT route,as they have applied for more frequencies, GRU that is.


User currently offlineTdan From United States of America, joined Nov 2011, 394 posts, RR: 3
Reply 17, posted (2 years 1 month 2 weeks 6 days 11 hours ago) and read 4360 times:

Just mind boggling how much capacity is increasing between the US and Brazil. Scary part is that it all appears to be sticking! I was trying to book IAH-GIG for this summer and it was $1,800RT! I wonder what is going to happen with open skies


We will ride this thunderbird, silver shadows on the earth, a thousand leagues away our land of birth... -Captain Bruce
User currently offlinePacificClipper From United States of America, joined Aug 2009, 312 posts, RR: 0
Reply 18, posted (2 years 1 month 2 weeks 6 days 7 hours ago) and read 3253 times:

Quoting tonytifao (Reply 14):
On the 10 abreast vs 9 abreast (TAM vs AA for example), how thinner are the seats? Do they make the aisle thinner or the seats? Or combination?

9 abreast 777s (in whatever variant -200 or -300) use an 18 inch wide seat. 10 abreast Y configurations on a 777 use a 17 inch wide seat (which is also the standard seat width in Y on all 737, 747, 757 models) and a narrower aisle.



Fly Beautiful :: 747
User currently offlineFSDan From United States of America, joined Jan 2011, 729 posts, RR: 2
Reply 19, posted (2 years 1 month 2 weeks 6 days 7 hours ago) and read 3196 times:

Quoting N62NA (Reply 9):
Or, will AA fly the 77W from MIA?

Rumor has it MIA-NRT will be an early AA 77W route.

On a separate note, what is the mix of business/leisure traffic on the MIA-GRU route? I don't have any solid facts but I would imagine Miami has one of the largest populations Brazilians in the US, and I know it's also the economic "gateway" to Latin America from the US.



SEA SFO SJC LAX ONT SAN DEN IAH DFW OMA FSD MSP MSN MKE ORD DTW CVG MEM JAN BHM RSW ATL CLT BWI PHL LGA JFK MEX LIM KEF
User currently offlinejr From United States of America, joined May 1999, 966 posts, RR: 6
Reply 20, posted (2 years 1 month 2 weeks 5 days 17 hours ago) and read 2665 times:

Quoting PacificClipper (Reply 18):
9 abreast 777s (in whatever variant -200 or -300) use an 18 inch wide seat. 10 abreast Y configurations on a 777 use a 17 inch wide seat (which is also the standard seat width in Y on all 737, 747, 757 models) and a narrower aisle.

Aren't the arm rests packed a bit tighter in the 10 abreast configuration, making the available seat space less then just the 1 inch loss of seat width? I have flown on both the EK and AF 10 abreast configs, and both felt a lot worse than a 747 or 757 seat. Certainly wouldn't be my first pick. Especially on an ULH flight. Hope Delta and UA don't follow!



I've flown on 9V-SPK.
User currently offlinelaca773 From United States of America, joined Nov 2004, 3945 posts, RR: 2
Reply 21, posted (2 years 1 month 2 weeks 5 days 17 hours ago) and read 2640 times:
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Quoting FSDan (Reply 19):
Rumor has it MIA-NRT will be an early AA 77W route.

This seems like too much a/c to start. They'd be better off having JL start the service with a 787-8 and see how it does, then upgauge to a 77W if the demand is there.

This is great news for all those traveling to and from MIA-GRU. There's a lot of demand in this market. I bet we'll see AA upgauge one of the MIA-GRU flights to a 77W at some point.


User currently offlinesunrisevalley From Canada, joined Jul 2004, 4614 posts, RR: 5
Reply 22, posted (2 years 1 month 2 weeks 5 days 17 hours ago) and read 2612 times:

Quoting OB1504 (Reply 3):
Nevertheless, it's great news that the route is performing strongly enough to merit a larger aircraft.

I suspect that the 77W 's significantly larger cargo capacity may have quite a lot to do with it.


User currently offlinetff From Portugal, joined May 2011, 65 posts, RR: 2
Reply 23, posted (2 years 1 month 2 weeks 5 days 16 hours ago) and read 2608 times:

Quoting jfk777 (Reply 8):
This is the first regularly scheduled 777-300ER from Miami. Air France was going to be first but kept the 744 on their CDG -MIA route.

AF will fly the B77W daily to MIA from June 4th onwards.



Remove before flight
User currently offlineVC10er From United States of America, joined Feb 2007, 2793 posts, RR: 10
Reply 24, posted (2 years 1 month 2 weeks 4 days 19 hours ago) and read 2302 times:
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I have flown TAM many times from Brazil to Europe and the USA. While TAM has one of the single worst liveries and interior color scheme, at least it is off-set by how beautiful the 777 is and the 777-300 makes the most of the bad livery. But if it's a 777 or A330, it's still an angled lie flat in business. First Class is much better for sure, but bright red, olive green and tan is such an eye sore with a bad floral pattern on the seats to make it even more old fashioned! What ever happened to their new interior design? They had contracted a great UK industrial design agency.

As for economy, the VLA ac they have - I think economy is equally as tight as the Ponte Area. So tight it feels like an evacuation would be unsafe. I like TAM, admittedly I preferred the old days of VARIG, but is the seat pitch the same on the 777 or A330 as it is on an A320?

Still, there is a good vibe on board.



The world is missing love, let's use our flights to spread it!
25 MAH4546 : The problem is more that the 788 is too low density - the 77W being too big is less of a problem - there is so much traffic between Tokyo and Brazil/
26 laca773 : Thanks for the information, Mark. This makes sense.
27 LipeGIG : Thanks for sharing and that's confirms TAM focus in the USA during 2012. Expected to see GRU-JFK also upgauged to 77W by November or December, GIG-JF
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