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CM And Widebodies?  
User currently offlineeinsteinboricua From Puerto Rico, joined Apr 2010, 3379 posts, RR: 8
Posted (2 years 10 months 1 hour ago) and read 2786 times:

It's clear to see that CM is a very successful airline, with its fleet consisting solely of 737s. However, I certainly don't think a 737 has the legs to fly PTY to Europe.

Considering that PTY's only European destinations are AMS with KL and MAD with IB, what are the chances that CM might add a couple of widebodies for TATL flights (not now, but perhaps before the end of the decade)? Madrid, London, and Paris would seem like the likely choices, perhaps even Barcelona.


"You haven't seen a tree until you've seen its shadow from the sky."
13 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlinejfk777 From United States of America, joined Aug 2006, 8513 posts, RR: 6
Reply 1, posted (2 years 10 months 1 hour ago) and read 2781 times:
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Copa probably has a future in 787's, they are small enough for 200 passengers yet capable enough to fly 8000 miles putting almost everything within nonstop reach.

User currently offlineRoseflyer From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 9827 posts, RR: 52
Reply 2, posted (2 years 10 months 1 hour ago) and read 2734 times:

Copa already pushes the 737 farther than any other airline in a typical configuration. PTY-EZE/MVD is a very long trip and I would assume that they'd benefit from a smaller widebody for those routes on top of routes to Europe or more extensive US routes.


If you have never designed an airplane part before, let the real designers do the work!
User currently offlineyellowtail From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 6358 posts, RR: 2
Reply 3, posted (2 years 10 months 1 hour ago) and read 2714 times:

The are many closer routes that could use some wide body capacity for CM so that that 738 capacity could be deployed elsewhere....SDQ, HAV, CCS come to mind


When in doubt, hold on to your altitude. No-one has ever collided with the sky.
User currently offlineViscount724 From Switzerland, joined Oct 2006, 26021 posts, RR: 22
Reply 4, posted (2 years 9 months 4 weeks 3 hours ago) and read 2244 times:

Quoting Roseflyer (Reply 2):
Copa already pushes the 737 farther than any other airline in a typical configuration.

Some other 737NG nonstops are almost as far. FJ's HNL-NAN 738 nonstop is also entirely over water with fewer potential diversion points.

PTY-MVD 2941 nm (73G)
PTY-EZE 2879 nm (738)
NBO-BKO 2802 nm (Kenya Airways 738)
HNL-NAN 2748 nm (Air Pacific 738)


User currently offlineAR385 From Mexico, joined Nov 2003, 6614 posts, RR: 35
Reply 5, posted (2 years 9 months 4 weeks 2 hours ago) and read 2200 times:
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At this point, I don´t think CM is interested in a very small fleet of a very different airliner to serve a few European destinations. Maybe in a few years, but not now. Besides, that small subfleet would require a total revamp of the services CM provides today, not so much in Y, maybe, but definitely in C. As for widebodies for MVD or EZE, I think their model is based on frequency, not on capacity.

A good analogy would for Southwest to get a few widebodies to fly to LHR or CDG. It´s just not their business model and probably won´t happen soon.


User currently offlinebpat777 From United States of America, joined Nov 1999, 447 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (2 years 9 months 4 weeks 2 hours ago) and read 2163 times:

I always felt CO/UA's 762's could be a good w/b for CM.

User currently offlineSJOtoLIR From Costa Rica, joined Jul 2007, 4620 posts, RR: 4
Reply 7, posted (2 years 9 months 4 weeks 1 hour ago) and read 2110 times:

Quoting einsteinboricua (Thread starter):
It's clear to see that CM is a very successful airline, with its fleet consisting solely of 737s.


False.
Both Copa Airlines and Copa Airlines Colombia also utilize a vast fleet of Embraer 190s.




.

Quoting einsteinboricua (Thread starter):
Considering that PTY's only European destinations are AMS with KL and MAD with IB


DE FRA-SDQ-PTY 1x weekly with 763 can also be considered as a regular operation linking Europe and Panama City.
It would be temporary upgraded from 1x to 2x weekly from June 25th till October 22nd.




.

Quoting Viscount724 (Reply 4):
PTY-MVD 2941 nm (73G)


Probably the longest commercial route for a 737 nowadays.




.

Quoting einsteinboricua (Thread starter):
what are the chances that CM might add a couple of widebodies for TATL flights (not now, but perhaps before the end of the decade)? Madrid, London, and Paris would seem like the likely choices, perhaps even Barcelona.


Copa studied in 2007 the chance to launch flights to Europe but the idea hasn't been materialized.
Related link available in Spanish language:

http://mensual.prensa.com/mensual/co...007/01/21/hoy/negocios/866405.html

CM has firmly ordered a huge fleet consisting in 32 brand new 737s to be gradually delivered between 2015 and 2018.
However, the long-haul equipments haven't been mentioned yet.

Regards.



"Goin' up to the spirit in the sky"
User currently offlinekiwiandrew From New Zealand, joined Jun 2005, 8632 posts, RR: 13
Reply 8, posted (2 years 9 months 3 weeks 6 days ago) and read 1863 times:
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I recall reading an interview with the CEO of CM last year ( pretty sure it was in Flight International magazine) where he said that they currently have no intention of investing in widebodies and would rather attempt to persuade some of their future *A partners to commence longhaul services to PTY ( which, presumably, they would codeshare on) . I will try to find a link.


Moderation in all things ... including moderation ;-)
User currently offlineJQflightie From Australia, joined Mar 2009, 1010 posts, RR: 1
Reply 9, posted (2 years 9 months 3 weeks 5 days 19 hours ago) and read 1720 times:

Quoting Viscount724 (Reply 4):

add to the list:
DJ PER-HKT 2991mi
DJ SYD-DPS 2871mi



Next Trip: PER-DPS-KUL-BKK-HKT-CNX-BKK-SIN-PER
User currently offlinePe@rson From United Kingdom, joined Jan 2001, 19259 posts, RR: 52
Reply 10, posted (2 years 9 months 3 weeks 5 days 19 hours ago) and read 1707 times:

For those interested, here are CM's net profit (loss) and net margin between 2007 and 2011 in USD and millions:


Net profit (loss):

2011: 310.40m

2010: 212.10m

2009: 240.36m

2008: 118.66m

2007 160.41m

Net margin

2011: 16.96 %

2010: 15.03 %

2009: 19.18 %

2008: 9.2 %

2007: 15.61 %

Source: Air Transport Intelligence (ATI).

Needless to say, these are, for airlines, highly impressive results.



"Everyone writing for the Telegraph knows that the way to grab eyeballs is with Ryanair and/or sex."
User currently offlineSJOtoLIR From Costa Rica, joined Jul 2007, 4620 posts, RR: 4
Reply 11, posted (2 years 9 months 3 weeks 5 days 6 hours ago) and read 1434 times:

Quoting kiwiandrew (Reply 8):
they currently have no intention of investing in widebodies and would rather attempt to persuade some of their future *A partners to commence longhaul services to PTY


I agree.
We have previously commented into the Central American aviation thread about the possibility of LH FRA-PTY in the near future.

Regards.



"Goin' up to the spirit in the sky"
User currently offlinenethkt From Thailand, joined Apr 2001, 1093 posts, RR: 3
Reply 12, posted (2 years 9 months 3 weeks 4 days 19 hours ago) and read 1257 times:

LH FRA-PTY with high-density A340-300?
I'd say the 8 First class seats on 333 and lower density 343 are a waste on FRA-PTY?
Would love to see a STAR long-haul, trans-con. connection from PTY!



Let's just blame it on yields.
User currently offlineRWA380 From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 3461 posts, RR: 5
Reply 13, posted (2 years 9 months 3 weeks 4 days 16 hours ago) and read 1175 times:

Quoting nethkt (Reply 12):
LH FRA-PTY with high-density A340-300?
I'd say the 8 First class seats on 333 and lower density 343 are a waste on FRA-PTY?
Would love to see a STAR long-haul, trans-con. connection from PTY!

I would think, a tag to PTY instead of a non-stop, or even a circle trip with another neighboring city they serve, or can, or else an en-route, not too far off the circle mapper for a stop. For any airline trying trans-atlantic to PTY, not just LH.



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