Sponsor Message:
Civil Aviation Forum
My Starred Topics | Profile | New Topic | Forum Index | Help | Search 
New Malev ... Loading  
User currently offlineju068 From Vanuatu, joined Aug 2009, 2643 posts, RR: 6
Posted (2 years 6 months 3 weeks 9 hours ago) and read 14964 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

Good afternoon,


As reported by various sources there are strong chances of Malev being re-born. One of the previous CEO's of Malev, Tamas Deri (1992-1994) is grouping investors in order to re-launch the airline.

Mihaly Vecsei, head of the Hungarian Association of Air Travel, told that his organization was in talks with Mr. Deri's group of investors. He stated that the owners of Hungary's Tensi travel group have also drown up plans for a new national carrier.

Daily Nepszava said Mr. Deri's consortium could announce their plans within days.


I know that there are a lot of haters out there who are going to oppose this idea, but still, I hope to see Malév back in the skies.

Link:
http://www.realdeal.hu/20120306/inve...ek-to-launch-new-national-carrier/

25 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineBritishB747 From United Kingdom, joined Jun 2010, 128 posts, RR: 0
Reply 1, posted (2 years 6 months 3 weeks 9 hours ago) and read 14898 times:

The problem I see is Deri trying to raise enough investment to start an airline of the scale required to become a "national carrier". Are there enough investors out there who would plough money into a new Malev when the result of the old Malev is still fresh in everyones memory. It would have to be a LCC to succeed I think. I hope they do succeed.

Regards



AB6 319 320 321 AR8 737/3/4/6/G/8 744 752 763 77W 788 D10 D38 DH4 E75 F70 M83
User currently offlineBA777 From United Kingdom, joined Jun 2001, 2179 posts, RR: 7
Reply 2, posted (2 years 6 months 3 weeks 9 hours ago) and read 14869 times:

I hope if their crews do, purely for example, BUD-LHR-BUD-MAD-BUD, they have to go through customs.

User currently offlineju068 From Vanuatu, joined Aug 2009, 2643 posts, RR: 6
Reply 3, posted (2 years 6 months 3 weeks 9 hours ago) and read 14869 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

Quoting BritishB747 (Reply 1):

From what I read on that site and some other ones is that they are trying to get ready for the summer season (which will be a bit difficult in my opinion). Working with travel agencies will provide them with additional cash from charter flights and so on... I guess that we will have to wait until the business plan is published and see what they have in mind.

I think that the Hungarian government needs this airline to succeede otherwise they will have to cash out €1.5 billion to BUD.


User currently offlinekl911 From Czech Republic, joined Jul 2003, 5142 posts, RR: 15
Reply 4, posted (2 years 6 months 3 weeks 9 hours ago) and read 14839 times:

Quoting ju068 (Thread starter):
I know that there are a lot of haters out there who are going to oppose this idea

I will only hate the idea if they will use the MALEV name and will employ the same people that ran it in the ground by creating the worst quality and almost always most expensive airline out of Budapest.

If they will start a new carrier from scratch, new name, new people I will fully support them.

For Hungary however it is not really needed. Most pax and revenue from the old Malev came from transfer pax. And with Ryanair and Wizz combines you have pretty much the whole of Europe covered regarding point to point Budapest flights.


User currently offlinedallasnewark From Estonia, joined Nov 2005, 495 posts, RR: 1
Reply 5, posted (2 years 6 months 3 weeks 9 hours ago) and read 14839 times:

That would be great!!! I took over 20 MALEV flights over the course of the last 3 years and I've had very positive experiences with them.

I don't know why there is so much hate towards MALEV here. I don't get the fascination with the CATTLE AIR, oh I'm sorry RYANAIR, that doesn't even come close to the services that MALEV offered.

Anyway, it would be great if they can get reborn and start flying the same route structure like they did before.


Quoting kl911 (Reply 4):
For Hungary however it is not really needed. Most pax and revenue from the old Malev came from transfer pax. And with Ryanair and Wizz combines you have pretty much the whole of Europe covered regarding point to point Budapest flights.


Can't agree with you here. Ryanair and Wizzair just dump you in the middle of the field and make you take buses or trains to your final destination, they are in no way a substitute for MALEV

[Edited 2012-03-06 08:54:07 by SA7700]


B732/3/4/5/6/7/8/9, B742/4, B752/3,B762/3/4, B772/3, A306, A318/9/20/21, A332/3, A343/6, MD80/83/88, L1011, TU104/134, F
User currently offlineju068 From Vanuatu, joined Aug 2009, 2643 posts, RR: 6
Reply 6, posted (2 years 6 months 3 weeks 9 hours ago) and read 14788 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

Quoting kl911 (Reply 4):

Apparently they are going to keep 1.500 people who worked for Malév, a lot of them being cabin crew and pilots. Interesting this is that one of the main people responsible for Malév's demise is the current CEO of Wizz Air, Jozsef Varadi.  

I guess we will have to wait and see what they have come up with. I hope that they have learned from

their mistakes.

Quoting dallasnewark (Reply 5):
I don't know why there is so much hate towards MALEV here. I don't get the fascination with the CATTLE AIR, oh I'm sorry RYANAIR, that doesn't even come close to the services that MALEV offered.

I agree with you, to each his own. I personally enjoyed flying on Malév every time, they had decent service, comfortable aircraft and above all, fast connections.


User currently offlinekl911 From Czech Republic, joined Jul 2003, 5142 posts, RR: 15
Reply 7, posted (2 years 6 months 3 weeks 9 hours ago) and read 14788 times:

Quoting dallasnewark (Reply 5):
I don't know why there is so much hate towards MALEV here. I don't get the fascination with the CATTLE AIR, oh I'm sorry RYANAIR, that doesn't even come close to the services that MALEV offered.

Trust me, it did. At least Ryanair is never delayed, often even early, never overbook people, have pleasant and smiling staff,and costs just a fraction of what Malev charged. believe me, the last three years my Malev flights haave been pure horror.

But indeed, to each his own.

[Edited 2012-03-06 08:22:40]

User currently offlinePEET7G From Hungary, joined Jan 2007, 695 posts, RR: 0
Reply 8, posted (2 years 6 months 3 weeks 8 hours ago) and read 14306 times:

Quoting ju068 (Thread starter):

There are many many rumors and especially since in the last few days documents have been published, that when the former government re-nationalized MA and started the restructuring, they left complete plans on how MA should be restructured and bring it into a salable state. In fact if the money handed over to MA was used for achieving these plans, the whole "illegal funding" issue would have been pointless, because the EU allows governments to pump money in case that money is used to turn the company around and in the end brings it out of the blacks and the end result is a sustainable company....but sadly the current government did nothing to achieve those goals, they only pumped in more money without any real concept...

Unfortunately I think whatever happens a new airline will have a very hard time reentering the market once again. It was a crime letting the old MA pass without the new company starting on the very next day  
Quoting kl911 (Reply 4):
If they will start a new carrier from scratch, new name, new people I will fully support them.

I agree with you, that whatever they do, it has to be fundamentally different. However the MA brand is a very strong thing in this region, and it would be very big mistake to not build on the legacy it had!

Otherwise yes, it has to be a new thing. Different management thinking, much more efficient fleet and an even more efficient hub system. The market is there and the 2011 MA proved that it is achievable. If they can regain the same market, but with an efficient fleet and streamlined staff numbers, maybe even improving on areas like services then I see no reason why a new MA would not be successful.
A restructured MA without the huge debt burden they had, would be a very serious competitor and could have a great advantage to all the other carriers still facing huge losses and inefficient operations (in fact the funny part is that OK, RO, OU, OS all run with bigger operating losses than what the old MA had in 2011   )

Quoting kl911 (Reply 8):
But indeed, to each his own.

I think that is probably the first thing we will agree in this thread. I flew way over 30 segments with Malev every year for many years now, and believe me MA was nothing what you are trying to portray here on these forums. I think you had 1 or 2 unpleasant experience and that made you an MA hater...or what is worse (and that is what I am beginning to see through your continuous MA bashing and W6/FR praising) is that you work for W6 and your loyalty towards your company makes you spread BS about MA.

honestly mate, I had so much respect for you, and your comments on just about everything else, but you either have very little insight into Hungarian aviation, or you are very biased towards LCC airlines (especially W6 and FR)  



Peet7G
User currently offlinekl911 From Czech Republic, joined Jul 2003, 5142 posts, RR: 15
Reply 9, posted (2 years 6 months 3 weeks 7 hours ago) and read 14066 times:

Quoting PEET7G (Reply 8):
honestly mate, I had so much respect for you, and your comments on just about everything else, but you either have very little insight into Hungarian aviation, or you are very biased towards LCC airlines (especially W6 and FR)

Hi Peet,

I might be biased, but I dont work for an LCC, not even for any airline anymore. And I am a Flying Blue member and love flying Skyteam airlines if possible, affordable, believe it or not. I do however believe in cheap point to point LCC travel to leisure destinations and im not the kind of traveller who needs the additional services where LCCs charge for. So yes, getting me from A to B is all i want.

regarding Malev, I just dont see the market for it at the moment. O&D yields are always low out of Hungary, and transfer pax have choices enough.

KL911


User currently offlineLJ From Netherlands, joined Nov 1999, 4430 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (2 years 6 months 3 weeks 7 hours ago) and read 13993 times:

Quoting ju068 (Thread starter):

I know that there are a lot of haters out there who are going to oppose this idea, but still, I hope to see Malév back in the skies.

Not going to oppose the deal, but we've seen this so many times before when an airline went out of business these stories emerge about a revival (usually not to come to any fruition). In the end, If you don't start within a month, the chances of survival are very slim. Or start a new airline.


User currently offlinekrisyyz From Canada, joined Nov 2004, 1593 posts, RR: 0
Reply 11, posted (2 years 6 months 3 weeks 7 hours ago) and read 13858 times:

Since everyone is ignoring the thread I started this morning, I will post my comments here..  

I know there are conflicting thoughts on whether a country the size of Hungary even needs a national airline, especially when you factor in the current economical situation. However, I do think there is a need to replace Malev, if for nothing else but to service the destinations that other carries like FR do not have permission to fly from BUD.

I know this news is just a plan and the funding and feasibility would have to be firmed before any solid steps are taken. I'm sure FR will put up a fight, but their influence on the Hungarian government and BAA doesn't seem to be as great as originally suggested given the news of FR having to cancel BUD flights due to customs requirements. But I'm optimistic that we will see a new Hungarian national airline.


KrisYYZ


User currently offlineFatmirJusufi From Albania, joined Jan 2009, 2441 posts, RR: 7
Reply 12, posted (2 years 6 months 3 weeks 4 hours ago) and read 13181 times:

Quoting ju068 (Thread starter):
New Malev ... Loading  

Are they trying to come up with a refurbished MALEV, or just another random airline from scratch?

Quoting kl911 (Reply 4):
If they will start a new carrier from scratch, new name, new people I will fully support them.

Just a guess — maybe something like Duna Airlines or Air Balaton?

Quoting ju068 (Reply 6):
I personally enjoyed flying on Malév every time, they had decent service, comfortable aircraft and above all, fast connections.

I enjoyed MA virtually, flying with them on Flight Simulator.




DO FLIGHTS. NOT FIGHTS.
User currently offlinetsnamm From United States of America, joined May 2005, 628 posts, RR: 0
Reply 13, posted (2 years 6 months 2 weeks 6 days 23 hours ago) and read 11314 times:

If there was a "new" Malev would they be part of Oneworld still? And if so might AA restart JFK/BUD to link up with the feed into BUD?...just jumping the gun a bit ! 

User currently offlinekrisyyz From Canada, joined Nov 2004, 1593 posts, RR: 0
Reply 14, posted (2 years 6 months 2 weeks 6 days 23 hours ago) and read 10851 times:

Quoting tsnamm (Reply 13):
If there was a "new" Malev would they be part of Oneworld still? And if so might AA restart JFK/BUD to link up with the feed into BUD?...just jumping the gun a bit !
Quoting FatmirJusufi (Reply 12):
Are they trying to come up with a refurbished MALEV, or just another random airline from scratch?

No details yet. Whether the Malev identity would be used is a big question. AFAIK, there are still court proceedings involving Malev, and the company still exists if only for liquidation and asset management purposes. The article seems to imply a "new" national carrier.

I also doubt that OneWorld would act unless the new carrier, if it actually materializes, is able to expand and provide OW with proper connections.

If this actually happens, I doubt they could just win back all of MA's pax from FR and the other low-cost carriers at BUD. I personally can't see any new Hungarian national airline be the size of MA for years to come. I would hope the lessons of MA and other European carriers would weigh heavily on the management of a future Hungarian airlines.

I know I'm putting the carriage before the horse, but I would guess a small fleet of regional or even 737s to start. As we know, MA's 736s have gone to the bone-yard, 3 73Gs have gone to Transaero and 1 or 2 738s are going to Transavia . So they would most likely look for "new" aircraft to be leased. But that is pure speculation.

KrisYYZ


User currently offlinePezySPU From Croatia, joined Dec 2011, 283 posts, RR: 0
Reply 15, posted (2 years 6 months 2 weeks 6 days 15 hours ago) and read 7427 times:

Quoting krisyyz (Reply 14):
Whether the Malev identity would be used is a big question.

I really don't see any potential for the proposed new airline to succeed if it doesn't use Malev's name. It seems that Hungarians are very emotionally connected with the brand, so finding customers shouldn't be a problem if the new carrier takes the brand.
A new name is a new brand, no matter how hard you try to label it as "new Malev", people will have a hard time believing you.
And it absolutely shouldn't be an LCC, especially if it carries Malev's name. With FR and W6 in BUD, there is no room for another one. Some sort of a hybrid could be the best option, with low cost base and legacy feel.


User currently offlineju068 From Vanuatu, joined Aug 2009, 2643 posts, RR: 6
Reply 16, posted (2 years 6 months 2 weeks 6 days 14 hours ago) and read 6934 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

Quoting FatmirJusufi (Reply 12):
Just a guess — maybe something like Duna Airlines or Air Balaton?

I hope they do not get the name Air Balaton, as the word Balaton comes from the Slavic word for mud. I still think that it will be a new airline named Malev, but it will be rebranded in the same way Olympic was.

Quoting tsnamm (Reply 13):
If there was a "new" Malev would they be part of Oneworld still? And if so might AA restart JFK/BUD to link up with the feed into BUD?...just jumping the gun a bit !

Don't forget Hainan Airlines  


User currently offlinekl911 From Czech Republic, joined Jul 2003, 5142 posts, RR: 15
Reply 17, posted (2 years 6 months 2 weeks 6 days 14 hours ago) and read 6802 times:

Quoting PezySPU (Reply 15):
Hungarians are very emotionally connected with the brand, so finding customers shouldn't be a problem if the new carrier takes the brand.

Yes, but it is the Hungarian pax who are generally lower yielding. So their feeling isnt that important here. Real money was being made from mostly foreign business people flying to BUD or transferring through it.

Quoting PezySPU (Reply 15):
Some sort of a hybrid could be the best option, with low cost base and legacy feel.

Thats what I think as well, a kind of Aer Lingus model. But without membership and feed from an alliance I still dont see it work though.


User currently offlineSKAirbus From Norway, joined Oct 2007, 1738 posts, RR: 1
Reply 18, posted (2 years 6 months 2 weeks 6 days 13 hours ago) and read 6325 times:

Malev is an iconic name... and I think that will help the new airline succeed. When Alitalia was on the verge of demise, there was no question that a new airline would be call the same. In Greece too, Olympic kept the same name as the old airline.

Keep the Malev name but change everything behind it... I want to see blue tails at BUD again. I just isn't the same without them.



Next Flights: LHR-OSL (319-BA), OSL-LHR (319-BA), LHR-CPH (320-BA), VXO-BMA (S20-TF), ARN-CPH (738-SK), CPH-LHR (320-BA)
User currently offlineckfred From United States of America, joined Apr 2001, 5242 posts, RR: 1
Reply 19, posted (2 years 6 months 2 weeks 6 days 9 hours ago) and read 3756 times:

What would the status of the new Malev (or whatever name it adopts) in terms of Oneworld membership? Would it have to reapply, or could it pick up where the old Malev left off?

User currently offlinekrisyyz From Canada, joined Nov 2004, 1593 posts, RR: 0
Reply 20, posted (2 years 6 months 2 weeks 6 days 3 hours ago) and read 3382 times:

Just came across this article, the wording would suggest that a completely new airline is being planned.. While the Malev brand is well known in Europe, I think there is too many legal and political barriers in the way for MA to be reborn.

http://www.bbj.hu/economy/associatio...er-initiates-talks-with-govt_62839


KrisYYZ


User currently offlinekrisyyz From Canada, joined Nov 2004, 1593 posts, RR: 0
Reply 21, posted (2 years 6 months 2 weeks 3 days 11 hours ago) and read 2727 times:

Bluenose air? What do you think of that name for a new Hungarian Airline?

It seems that the efforts to revive some sort of national carrier is not fizzling away. Although a prime ingredient, money is still lacking...

""Three different groups are working on establishing a new national airline, but there are no investors in the wings, news website Origo reports. Magyar Nemzet writes that the government is also studying the prospects for launching a successor to Malév, which stopped operating a month ago."

(check out the picture)

http://www.xpatloop.com/news/proposa...rt_new_national_airline_in_hungary

KrisYYZ


User currently offlinePezySPU From Croatia, joined Dec 2011, 283 posts, RR: 0
Reply 22, posted (2 years 6 months 2 weeks 3 days 9 hours ago) and read 2579 times:

Quoting krisyyz (Reply 21):

Wow, that name would certainly carry some of MA's heritage. Too bad they didn't reveal any more details, I'm eager to see what they came up with.


User currently offlineBOACCunard From United States of America, joined Dec 2009, 864 posts, RR: 1
Reply 23, posted (2 years 6 months 2 weeks 3 days 8 hours ago) and read 2403 times:

Quoting krisyyz (Reply 21):
Bluenose air? What do you think of that name for a new Hungarian Airline?

Sounds like it's from Nova Scotia, not Hungary.



Getting There is Half the Fun!
User currently offlineAR385 From Mexico, joined Nov 2003, 6218 posts, RR: 31
Reply 24, posted (2 years 6 months 2 weeks 3 days 8 hours ago) and read 2335 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

I understand the emotional attachment some people feel for their National carrier. I just don´t get the obsession with restarting them once they go bust. They went bust because the market had no place for them.

If a group of investors decides to put money into them, that´s great. If they want to loose their shirt in adventurous endeavors, there are more fun ways to do that, but as has been said before, to each his own.

What I am against, essentially, is when these schemes receive financial aid from the state, wether in subsidies or in actual investment. And while I do not really know the EU regulations on governments helping businesses restart after they´ve died, I´m sure there are many ways to circumvent these regulations or disguise the cash infusions. Specially in times like these. There are better ways to use state funding and people´s tax money.

In my neck of the woods, this happened with MX. Sure, I was sad, I mean, brand recognition? Most everybody I know has taken multiple flights with MX throughout their lives and the airline was a pioneer in many ways. For many years it was also an example of how to run a private business in a country that was basically a state-ran-economy.

But, it was not able to adapt, change, or whatever. It went bust. The market spoke and that´s it. I´m glad this government has publicly stated and maintained its position that not a single cent from their coffers is coming MX´s (or whatever is left of it) way. We have better uses and needs for that money.

In the end, an airline is just another business. We may not see it that way here on a.net, but that´s the reality. Nostalgia is nice, but there´s no place for it when making the hard decisions. How many airlines have been restarted after gone the way of the Dodo, just to go bust a few months later, having needed to be bought out or disappearing (again) altogether?


User currently offlinePezySPU From Croatia, joined Dec 2011, 283 posts, RR: 0
Reply 25, posted (2 years 6 months 2 weeks 3 days 7 hours ago) and read 2290 times:

Quoting AR385 (Reply 24):
I understand the emotional attachment some people feel for their National carrier. I just don´t get the obsession with restarting them once they go bust. They went bust because the market had no place for them.

Uh-oh, don't start it again. It's not that their business model was at fault (it seems they started making money), this bankruptcy was the result of past mismanagement. Market did in fact have place for them, they were serving upper/business segment of the market and they were important for BUD as they created a very nice hub there. The low-fare segment was in the hands of W6.

Quoting AR385 (Reply 24):
If a group of investors decides to put money into them, that´s great. If they want to loose their shirt in adventurous endeavors, there are more fun ways to do that, but as has been said before, to each his own.

Really, no need to write-off the whole project before any details surface. Sure, whatever they do, it's gonna be a tight fit, but I'd rather wait for more details.

Quoting AR385 (Reply 24):
Nostalgia is nice

Nah, even nostalgia isn't what it used to be...   


Top Of Page
Forum Index

This topic is archived and can not be replied to any more.

Printer friendly format

Similar topics:More similar topics...
Malev's First New 767-300ER posted Sun Mar 18 2007 16:18:54 by TommyBP251b
Lila Design New Website. Malev Study... posted Tue Mar 28 2006 01:04:15 by Boeing777/747
New Route: Dublin To Athens Direct With Malev posted Tue Apr 5 2005 12:58:56 by Murtagh1108
New Route: Malev To Cork. posted Fri Feb 18 2005 09:26:04 by Murtagh1108
Malev's New Fleet posted Thu Jan 6 2005 15:57:01 by Krisyyz
Malev Gets New 737NG posted Thu Dec 13 2001 06:53:22 by Jiml1126
New DTW - Saab 340 Loading Bridges! posted Tue Feb 27 2001 21:09:45 by Nwa747-400
A New Way Of Loading Passengers Faster! posted Tue Jan 2 2001 07:12:55 by Boeing747-400
A New Hungarian National Carrier? posted Tue Mar 6 2012 06:36:24 by krisyyz
New Airplanes With Old Liveries posted Mon Mar 5 2012 20:42:01 by BOACCunard