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Gol Applies For MIA-CCS-GRU With DOT  
User currently offlineMAH4546 From Sweden, joined Jan 2001, 32734 posts, RR: 72
Posted (2 years 5 months 2 weeks 6 days 6 hours ago) and read 5921 times:

Gol has applied with the Department of Transportation to operate daily service between Miami and Sao Paulo, via Caracas, effective 29 June 2012. No schedule has been provided to DOT.

http://airlineinfo.com/ost14/ost031212.html#gol31212 (subscription required)


a.
31 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineb757capt From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 1375 posts, RR: 0
Reply 1, posted (2 years 5 months 2 weeks 6 days 5 hours ago) and read 5882 times:

I think this is pretty smart. I am always glad to see GOL expanding.


The views written by this user are in no manner the views of my employer and should not be thought as such.
User currently offlineC010T3 From Brazil, joined Jul 2006, 3699 posts, RR: 19
Reply 2, posted (2 years 5 months 2 weeks 6 days 5 hours ago) and read 5809 times:

It's weird that they mention CCS as a technical stop.

User currently offlineCNForever From Brazil, joined Apr 2011, 91 posts, RR: 0
Reply 3, posted (2 years 5 months 2 weeks 6 days 4 hours ago) and read 5798 times:

Maybe Venezuela hasn´t granted the traffic rights yet.

User currently offlinePe@rson From United Kingdom, joined Jan 2001, 19212 posts, RR: 52
Reply 4, posted (2 years 5 months 2 weeks 6 days 4 hours ago) and read 5775 times:

I believe Venezuela is either the first or second most restricted country in South America.


"Everyone writing for the Telegraph knows that the way to grab eyeballs is with Ryanair and/or sex."
User currently offlinewedgetail737 From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 5901 posts, RR: 6
Reply 5, posted (2 years 5 months 2 weeks 5 days 20 hours ago) and read 5319 times:
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Quoting Pe@rson (Reply 4):
I believe Venezuela is either the first or second most restricted country in South America.

Venezuela never used to be like that until the Chavez Administration took over. During the early 1990's, EA (later AA), Viasa, Avensa, Servivensa and not too much later...the introduction of Aeropostal. There was plenty of service to Venezuela.

I think if Hugo Chavez wasn't so anti-American and would ease up on trade between us and them, we would see lots of service between the US and Venezuela. Venezuela has plenty of airlines that want to serve the US.


User currently offlineSuperCaravelle From Netherlands, joined Jan 2012, 233 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (2 years 5 months 2 weeks 5 days 17 hours ago) and read 5247 times:

That said, other foreign airlines already operate with full fifth freedom rights between CCS and MIA.

User currently offlineA388 From Netherlands Antilles, joined May 2001, 9780 posts, RR: 11
Reply 7, posted (2 years 5 months 2 weeks 5 days 13 hours ago) and read 5172 times:

Quoting SuperCaravelle (Reply 6):
That said, other foreign airlines already operate with full fifth freedom rights between CCS and MIA.

As far as I know only LAN flies the CCS-MIA route. Which other foreign airlines fly CCS-MIA?

A388


User currently offlineC010T3 From Brazil, joined Jul 2006, 3699 posts, RR: 19
Reply 8, posted (2 years 5 months 2 weeks 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 4655 times:

There is now a press release for the flight. Here's the proposed schedule:

G3 7XXX 737 1-345-7 GRU 0800 1130 CCS 1210 MIA 1610
G3 7XXX 737 1-345-7 MIA 1800 2100 CCS 2300* GRU 0615+1

*omitted, but I compared it to the current schedule at CCS.

http://www.mzweb.com.br/gol2009/web/arquivos/Release%20USA_eng.pdf

------------------------------------------------

I was thinking about this schedule and it doesn't make sense. They made a mistake. I presume the schedule will be the following:

G3 7XXX 737 1-345-7 GRU 0800 1230 CCS 1310 MIA 1710
G3 7XXX 737 1-345-7 MIA 1900 2200 CCS 2300 GRU 0615+1

[Edited 2012-03-13 19:50:56]

User currently offlineC010T3 From Brazil, joined Jul 2006, 3699 posts, RR: 19
Reply 9, posted (2 years 5 months 2 weeks 4 days 21 hours ago) and read 4562 times:

Gol's Investor Relations team really can't work with time changes:

The HOTRAN request has been just released. The schedule is the following:

G3 7700 738 1-345-7 GRU 0800 1230 CCS 1310 MIA 1710
G3 7701 738 1-345-7 MIA 1900 2200 CCS 2240 GRU 0615+1

http://www2.anac.gov.br/hotran/


User currently offlineSJOtoLIR From Costa Rica, joined Jul 2007, 4481 posts, RR: 4
Reply 10, posted (2 years 5 months 2 weeks 4 days 19 hours ago) and read 4531 times:

Quoting A388 (Reply 7):
LAN flies the CCS-MIA route

LA SCL-GYE-CCS-MIA; 1x weekly with 763.



"Goin' up to the spirit in the sky"
User currently offlineA388 From Netherlands Antilles, joined May 2001, 9780 posts, RR: 11
Reply 11, posted (2 years 5 months 2 weeks 4 days 13 hours ago) and read 4457 times:

Quoting SJOtoLIR (Reply 10):
LA SCL-GYE-CCS-MIA; 1x weekly with 763.

Thanks for the schedule SJOtoLIR. Why is LAN only flying the route once weekly? Seems very unattractive, can't they get more frequencies from the aviation authorities?

A388


User currently offlineMAH4546 From Sweden, joined Jan 2001, 32734 posts, RR: 72
Reply 12, posted (2 years 5 months 2 weeks 4 days 13 hours ago) and read 4442 times:

Quoting A388 (Reply 11):
Thanks for the schedule SJOtoLIR. Why is LAN only flying the route once weekly? Seems very unattractive, can't they get more frequencies from the aviation authorities?

MIACCS is 2x weekly. Once weekly it continues to GYE before SCL; once weekly it goes non-stop to SCL.

LA operates a daily daylight flight MIASCL that stops in either CCS, BOG, CUN or PUJ depending on the day.



a.
User currently offlineA388 From Netherlands Antilles, joined May 2001, 9780 posts, RR: 11
Reply 13, posted (2 years 5 months 2 weeks 4 days 13 hours ago) and read 4424 times:

Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 12):
MIACCS is 2x weekly. Once weekly it continues to GYE before SCL; once weekly it goes non-stop to SCL.

LA operates a daily daylight flight MIASCL that stops in either CCS, BOG, CUN or PUJ depending on the day.

So CCS-MIA is once weekly and MIA-CCS is twice weekly? Does this type of routing follow demand or why has LAN chosen such a routing? Can they add more frequencies on the CCS-MIA route?

A388


User currently offlineMAH4546 From Sweden, joined Jan 2001, 32734 posts, RR: 72
Reply 14, posted (2 years 5 months 2 weeks 4 days 13 hours ago) and read 4410 times:

Quoting A388 (Reply 13):
So CCS-MIA is once weekly and MIA-CCS is twice weekly? Does this type of routing follow demand or why has LAN chosen such a routing? Can they add more frequencies on the CCS-MIA route?

No, it's twice weekly in both directions.

I don't know if the government would allow it to add more flights, but CCS is simply a stop on the daylight MIASCL flight using a plane that would otherwise be parked on the Tarmac at MIA. It's all about utilization.



a.
User currently offlineA388 From Netherlands Antilles, joined May 2001, 9780 posts, RR: 11
Reply 15, posted (2 years 5 months 2 weeks 4 days 12 hours ago) and read 4402 times:

Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 14):
No, it's twice weekly in both directions.

I don't know if the government would allow it to add more flights, but CCS is simply a stop on the daylight MIASCL flight using a plane that would otherwise be parked on the Tarmac at MIA. It's all about utilization.

Okay thanks for the explanation. With GOL potentially starting a MIA route from CCS, let's see how LAN will react.

A388


User currently offline2travel2know2 From Panama, joined Apr 2010, 2607 posts, RR: 1
Reply 16, posted (2 years 5 months 2 weeks 4 days 9 hours ago) and read 4309 times:

Quoting C010T3 (Reply 9):
G3 7700 738 1-345-7 GRU 0800 1230 CCS 1310 MIA 1710
G3 7701 738 1-345-7 MIA 1900 2200 CCS 2240 GRU 0615+1

These days a 40 minutes stop in CCS seem to be too little time.
It took 30 minutes to get someone to move the jetway to the aircraft last time I arrived at CCS (and the plane had to wait 10 minutes before to move to the gate).
G3 shouldn't have chosen better days to operate that route. Most likely those are the days of the week when there's more demand between CCS and MIA. At least seems G3 is doing its CCS-MIA homework quite well.
Any news as when G3 plans to add the Tuesdays and Saturdays flights?



I'm not on CM's payroll.
User currently offlineC010T3 From Brazil, joined Jul 2006, 3699 posts, RR: 19
Reply 17, posted (2 years 5 months 2 weeks 4 days 9 hours ago) and read 4287 times:

Quoting 2travel2know2 (Reply 16):
These days a 40 minutes stop in CCS seem to be too little time.

40 minutes is standard for G3 at CCS.


User currently offlineLipeGIG From Brazil, joined May 2005, 11434 posts, RR: 58
Reply 18, posted (2 years 5 months 2 weeks 3 days 21 hours ago) and read 4101 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW
FORUM MODERATOR

Now waiting for the 2nd route. Their rights do not allow GIG, GRU and VCP as origin in Brazil for the 2nd flight.


New York + Rio de Janeiro = One of the best combinations !
User currently offlineC010T3 From Brazil, joined Jul 2006, 3699 posts, RR: 19
Reply 19, posted (2 years 5 months 2 weeks 3 days 21 hours ago) and read 4084 times:

Quoting LipeGIG (Reply 18):
Their rights do not allow GIG, GRU and VCP as origin in Brazil for the 2nd flight.

Where did you access that information?


User currently offline797 From Venezuela, joined Aug 2005, 1894 posts, RR: 27
Reply 20, posted (2 years 5 months 2 weeks 3 days 16 hours ago) and read 4033 times:

Interesting.

I am assuming the Venezuelan Authority INAC has pre-approved this route, right?

If they are formally applying with the DOT, it means they would have some sort of certainty that there's the permission for the technical stop in CCS...

If the stop is only technical, and no PAX can be picked up and carried onwards, then no 5th Freedom rights would be needed...

797



Flying isn't dangerous. Crashing is what's dangerous!
User currently offlineC010T3 From Brazil, joined Jul 2006, 3699 posts, RR: 19
Reply 21, posted (2 years 5 months 2 weeks 3 days 10 hours ago) and read 3949 times:

Quoting C010T3 (Reply 2):
It's weird that they mention CCS as a technical stop.

Gol has amended their application including a revenue stop:

http://www.regulations.gov/#!documentDetail;D=DOT-OST-2012-0039-0002

The original application is now publicly available under:

http://www.regulations.gov/#!documentDetail;D=DOT-OST-2012-0039-0001


User currently offlineLipeGIG From Brazil, joined May 2005, 11434 posts, RR: 58
Reply 22, posted (2 years 5 months 2 weeks 3 days 5 hours ago) and read 3835 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW
FORUM MODERATOR

Quoting C010T3 (Reply 19):
Where did you access that information?

The letter dd Feb 17 from ANAC to DOT clarifies which type of frequencies they got.
The ones departing from Sao Paulo are among the 105 original frequencies, which now TAM owns 62 and GOL, 7.

They got 7 frequencies from Section 2, paragraph 1 (b), which are restricted to any place other than Rio and Sao Paulo area airports.

They could took 14 from the unrestricted ones, but it seems they do not have plans for a Sao Paulo (or Rio) flight on the second flight. That's why i heard about the CNF-BEL-MIA flight.



New York + Rio de Janeiro = One of the best combinations !
User currently offlineC010T3 From Brazil, joined Jul 2006, 3699 posts, RR: 19
Reply 23, posted (2 years 5 months 2 weeks 3 days 3 hours ago) and read 3773 times:

Quoting LipeGIG (Reply 22):

The letter dd Feb 17 from ANAC to DOT clarifies which type of frequencies they got.
The ones departing from Sao Paulo are among the 105 original frequencies, which now TAM owns 62 and GOL, 7.

They got 7 frequencies from Section 2, paragraph 1 (b), which are restricted to any place other than Rio and Sao Paulo area airports.

They could took 14 from the unrestricted ones, but it seems they do not have plans for a Sao Paulo (or Rio) flight on the second flight. That's why i heard about the CNF-BEL-MIA flight.

I forgot about reading the letter on the application. It makes sense now.


User currently offlineMAH4546 From Sweden, joined Jan 2001, 32734 posts, RR: 72
Reply 24, posted (2 years 5 months 2 weeks 2 days 17 hours ago) and read 3632 times:

Quoting LipeGIG (Reply 22):
They could took 14 from the unrestricted ones, but it seems they do not have plans for a Sao Paulo (or Rio) flight on the second flight. That's why i heard about the CNF-BEL-MIA flight.

I heard FOR-BEL-MIA.



a.
25 incitatus : Do these GOL people have any idea about what they are doing? If they are going to fly GRU-CCS-MIA, the way to the jackpot is to make sure GRU-MIA is
26 cybergus : Believe me they do. They are targeting the CCS-MIA sector which is highly underserved. They are probably applying the same technique as LAN, which is
27 SJOtoLIR : A very similar route like the extinct JJ FOR-BEL-MAO-MIA with 320 which operated before the dedicated JJ MIA-MAO with 763; both on a daily basis. Reg
28 Avianca : well have to say in general the fares out of CCS are these days crazy high....cheapest international route i can think of is CCS-POS for 500 USD roun
29 cybergus : Hey Andreas! Fares out of CCS are epic...but MIA has been exaggeratedly expensive. We are talking a route that went from 400$ to 900$ in the snap of a
30 LipeGIG : FOR-BEL sounds even better as there's competition. However, CNF-BEL represents a potential strong domestic route due to the mining ties among both ma
31 797 : My opinion is, until we don't see anything official posted from the Venezuelan INAC, then we shouldn't get our hopes up. These people are relentless.
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