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United Strands Passengers For Two Day In ANC  
User currently offlineANCsupercub From United States of America, joined May 2007, 139 posts, RR: 0
Posted (2 years 5 months 2 days 23 hours ago) and read 8867 times:

It seems as if United handled this situation really poorly.

http://www.adn.com/2012/03/20/238194...oken-toilets-strand-262-plane.html

[Edited 2012-03-20 23:06:08]

42 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineplanenutz From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 1, posted (2 years 5 months 2 days 21 hours ago) and read 8470 times:

Here;s another article from the San Francisco Chronicle. The flight originated at SFO enroute PVG.

http://www.adn.com/2012/03/20/238194...oken-toilets-strand-262-plane.html

It's been a bad couple of weeks for UA.


User currently offlineBCEaglesCO757 From United States of America, joined Mar 2011, 242 posts, RR: 2
Reply 2, posted (2 years 5 months 2 days 21 hours ago) and read 8453 times:

Seems they got the passsengers meal vouchers,hotels, and full REFUNDS per the link below.

http://news.yahoo.com/sf-shanghai-pa...stuck-2-days-alaska-042130305.html

The hotel wanting credit cards is out of UA's control.

If they handle it anymore poorly, they'll have to buy everyone a private jet.

I just cringe to see the story period. When I saw it, I somehow knew it was us.

Gordon Bethune where art thou ?


User currently offlineANCsupercub From United States of America, joined May 2007, 139 posts, RR: 0
Reply 3, posted (2 years 5 months 2 days 19 hours ago) and read 8272 times:

Quoting BCEaglesCO757 (Reply 2):

While in the end United did the right thing poor communication made a bad situation worse. I understand that UA was very understaffed, But from the experience that I read on another travel related site poor communication with the group lasted into the second day. I feel for the passengers in such a frustrating situation. No one is asking for a private jet, just the common curtiousy to stay informed. Given the situation (which was out of UAs control) it is the right thing to do.


User currently offlinenclmedic From United Kingdom, joined Oct 2009, 342 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (2 years 5 months 2 days 18 hours ago) and read 8123 times:

Sounds like a lot of bad luck - two planes going tech is not something most would anticipate. I think even the 'best' airlines might struggle to sort this one out at short notice.

I know with lots of lavs going out of service, the initial plane clearly needed to land soon, but was there no way they could have just returned to SFO? Bigger base, many passenger's hometown, better maintenance/staffing......


User currently offlinestasisLAX From United States of America, joined Jul 2007, 3280 posts, RR: 6
Reply 5, posted (2 years 5 months 2 days 7 hours ago) and read 7389 times:

This fiasco is now all over the national news here in the USA. CNN just had it as a top story. Very bad public relations for United/Continental. Passengers tweeted all about the airline's poor handling of the situation, including hotels that would not accept the passengers unless the passengers paid for the room with their own credit cards and food vouchers that would not be honored at ANC. Worse, there was no United personnel at the special services desks. Furthermore, the passengers (after having been held in ANC for two days) were not allowed access to their luggage for clean clothing, medications, or hygiene supplies. Not good, United!

Source; http://avherald.com/h?article=44cc5874&opt=0

CNN Video: http://www.cnn.com/video/?hpt=hp_t3#...21/tsr-oleary-nightmare-flight.cnn

[Edited 2012-03-21 15:44:30]

[Edited 2012-03-21 15:57:54]


"Those who would give up essential liberty to purchase temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety!" B.Franklin
User currently offline777fan From United States of America, joined Jan 2006, 2496 posts, RR: 2
Reply 6, posted (2 years 5 months 2 days 6 hours ago) and read 7237 times:

Quoting nclmedic (Reply 4):
I know with lots of lavs going out of service, the initial plane clearly needed to land soon, but was there no way they could have just returned to SFO? Bigger base, many passenger's hometown, better maintenance/staffing......

I was thinking the same thing although SEA was the first airport to come to mind. It's not their biggest station but sees a decent amount of metal, including 777s. Plus, from reading the article (the nearest airport was three hours away?), I'm guessing SEA might have been closer, unless of course they were west of ANC and approaching the Kamchakta Peninsula.

777fan



DC-8 61/63/71 DC-9-30/50 MD-80/82/83 DC-10-10/30 MD-11 717 721/2 732/3/4/5/G/8/9 741/2/4 752 762/3 777 A306/319/20/33 AT
User currently offlinePHX787 From Japan, joined Mar 2012, 7394 posts, RR: 17
Reply 7, posted (2 years 5 months 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 6866 times:

How could 2 T7s have the same electrical problem?! Something is quite not right with UA's mechanics -_-

Anyway it seems like whenever there's an incident with a flight that's carrying a number of passengers, chaos ensues. Airlines need to get this right.



次は、渋谷、渋谷。出口は、右側です。電車とホームの間は広く開いておりますので、足元に注意下さい。
User currently offlineplanenut767 From United States of America, joined Jun 2009, 66 posts, RR: 0
Reply 8, posted (2 years 5 months 1 day 15 hours ago) and read 4533 times:

Quoting PHX787 (Reply 7):
How could 2 T7s have the same electrical problem?! Something is quite not right with UA's mechanics -_-

Anyway it seems like whenever there's an incident with a flight that's carrying a number of passengers, chaos ensues. Airlines need to get this right.

If you read the article the first 777 had problems with the lavs, which in my experience tells me there may have been clog some where in the system and since you have 2 to 3 toilets on the same tank with 3 tanks total (at least on ours) that would take out all of the lav toilets on that particular system. As for the second one I have no idea since they don't tell you much in the article(or much of the first problem), other than people were upset their flight was diverted (which is understandable why they would be).


User currently offlinejreuschl From United States of America, joined Jul 2009, 545 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (2 years 5 months 1 day 13 hours ago) and read 4340 times:

Maybe the passengers should have all carried 3.4 oz of Drano on flight?

  

The toilet problem doesn't sound impossible to fix.. you think UA could have sent a mechanic along with the 2nd flight to check up on that? I assume at least the first aircraft will be ferried back to SFO.

[Edited 2012-03-22 09:01:24]

User currently offlineSW733 From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 6311 posts, RR: 9
Reply 10, posted (2 years 5 months 1 day 13 hours ago) and read 4308 times:

Quoting ANCsupercub (Reply 3):
While in the end United did the right thing poor communication made a bad situation worse. I understand that UA was very understaffed, But from the experience that I read on another travel related site poor communication with the group lasted into the second day.

Here is my thought about airports like ANC who probably have a higher-than-average chance of seeing diversions of large planes, simply due to their location along long distance US/Canada to Asia route: They should be trained differently than employees at, say, Kansas City or Phoenix or Nashville. I'm not saying things can always go smoothly, but they should be trained and have more contingencies in place for this type of event. If they do already...they clearly need to be better. And that is for all airlines, not just United.


User currently offlineDL WIDGET HEAD From United States of America, joined Apr 2000, 2088 posts, RR: 5
Reply 11, posted (2 years 5 months 1 day 13 hours ago) and read 4264 times:

Quoting jreuschl (Reply 9):
you think UA could have sent a mechanic along with the 2nd flight to check up on that?

No doubt UA had contract MTC in ANC check out the first a/c for a quick fix but determined that the problem could not be rectified expeditiosly; hence the rescue flight with a 2nd a/c. Unfortunately for UA and those passengers, Murphy's law reared its ugly head and the 2nd a/c went tech as well. This happens to all airlines at some point or another. Seems to me UA tried very hard to manage this situation as best they could with the resources at hand.


User currently offlinefrmrCapCadet From United States of America, joined May 2008, 1713 posts, RR: 1
Reply 12, posted (2 years 5 months 1 day 13 hours ago) and read 4215 times:

That things go wrong when you are flying is understandable. Complicated planes have mechanical problems, volcanos, weather, politics, even a system can break down because of these, not just your flight. What passengers have a right to expect is good information and competence in resolving the situation.

A statistic not gathered currently: Blizzard, volcano, fog at London Heathrow? How long does it take to recover. How effectively do airlines reduce the hassle factor? I am willing to pay more when these sort of breakdowns happen (hint hint, sell reasonably priced insurance for this, income opportunity), but I want timely information and better than average resolution. I resent that at LHR you can be stranded for hours with a minor fog, and get no good information. (Never again BA). WN makes a point to add staffing when something happens. Many airlines don't.



Buffet: the airline business...has eaten up capital...like..no other (business)
User currently offlineyyz717 From Canada, joined Sep 2001, 16248 posts, RR: 56
Reply 13, posted (2 years 5 months 1 day 13 hours ago) and read 4216 times:

You know, putting this in perspective, it's kinda hard to have too much sympathy (or indeed, any) for travellers wealthy enough to fly from the US to China, a flight which, evne in this day & age, would represent a life-long epic journey for so many Americans.

And to be "stuck' in Anchorage, a safe, pleasant American city with beautiful vistas, that few people visit, for 2 short days.

Isn't life about the odd unplanned detour now and then?



Panam, TWA, Ansett, Eastern.......AC next? Might be good for Canada.
User currently offlineANCsupercub From United States of America, joined May 2007, 139 posts, RR: 0
Reply 14, posted (2 years 5 months 1 day 13 hours ago) and read 4153 times:

Quoting SW733 (Reply 10):
Here is my thought about airports like ANC who probably have a higher-than-average chance of seeing diversions of large planes, simply due to their location along long distance US/Canada to Asia route: They should be trained differently than employees at, say, Kansas City or Phoenix or Nashville. I'm not saying things can always go smoothly, but they should be trained and have more contingencies in place for this type of event. If they do already...they clearly need to be better. And that is for all airlines, not just United.

They should have a plan in place, but I think you are overestimating the size of the staff at ANC. In the winter United only flies two flights per day (a 757 and 737) to Anchorage. It is a small station to say the least. Also, how many times does United divert to Anchorage per year? When United diverts it is even less likely that passengers will have to spend the night ( I would guess the majority of diversion are for medical reasons but thats a guess). I guess my two points are that with the small station there is only so much they can do and with the very limited number of diversions per year (and less that spend the night) would costly training be justified? That being said, this situation could've been handled better. At least they could've had a plan for this type of event in place and if they had a plan it could've been executed better (communication is the key IMO).

[Edited 2012-03-22 09:45:24]

[Edited 2012-03-22 09:48:11]

User currently offlineDL WIDGET HEAD From United States of America, joined Apr 2000, 2088 posts, RR: 5
Reply 15, posted (2 years 5 months 1 day 12 hours ago) and read 4138 times:

Quoting frmrCapCadet (Reply 12):
What passengers have a right to expect is good information and competence in resolving the situation.
Quoting frmrCapCadet (Reply 12):
but I want timely information and better than average resolution.

I have no idea what was communicated to these passengers and how timely the information was or was not provided. I do know that during mechanical issues, the airline does not always immediately know what the exact problem is, how long it will take to correct, and when passengers will be on their way again. Sometimes, these evaluations can take hours upon hours depending on how complex the problem is. Then, having to move maintenance techs and parts into place to correct the fault. There's crew duty times to work out and airport curfews, etc, etc. The airline and its agents have no reason to keep solid information from their passengers once the airline itself knows how and when the a/c will be returned to service. Anchorage is not a UA hub so they probably have a minimal number of agents on duty or on call at any time. Probably no UA mechanics stationed there nor many a/c parts. I'll bet those folks at ANC did the best they could, as fast as they could as they were waiting on information from maintenance and HQ.


User currently offlineIADLHR From Italy, joined Apr 2005, 735 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (2 years 5 months 1 day 12 hours ago) and read 4088 times:

Quoting yyz717 (Reply 13):
You know, putting this in perspective, it's kinda hard to have too much sympathy (or indeed, any) for travellers wealthy enough to fly from the US to China, a flight which, evne in this day & age, would represent a life-long epic journey for so many Americans.

I am sure there were people on that flight that were going to China on business and appointmets had to be rescheduled etc. Many of the pax were going to a semiconductor convention in China.

There could have been some wealthy Americans on the flight too that were looking forward to a trip to China and not Alaska at this time of year. They have probably already been to Alaska.

There could have been some Chinese Americans trying to get back to China for a family illnessz or death, who knows. The reality is that everyone on the flight bought a ticket to China and not Alaska.

Regardless of why they were traveling to China, they all deserved better communication, from United , and better customer service.

Too many cos. have cut back on customer service training.When something, out of the ordianry happens, it requires some outside the box thinking. Consequently, the lack of training for outside the box events cant be handled properly.

This might have cost UA more than if the staff had been trained, properly, for unusual events.

[Edited 2012-03-22 10:10:59]

User currently offlineDL WIDGET HEAD From United States of America, joined Apr 2000, 2088 posts, RR: 5
Reply 17, posted (2 years 5 months 1 day 12 hours ago) and read 4066 times:

Quoting IADLHR (Reply 16):
When something, out of the ordianry happens, it requires some outside the box thinking. Consequently, the lack of training for outside the box events cant be handled properly.

This might have cost UA more than if the staff had been trained, properly, for unusual events.

Just curious, what do you think they could have done differently at a small station with few International airline options?


User currently offlineikramerica From United States of America, joined May 2005, 21501 posts, RR: 60
Reply 18, posted (2 years 5 months 1 day 12 hours ago) and read 4054 times:

Quoting BCEaglesCO757 (Reply 2):
The hotel wanting credit cards is out of UA's control.

It's for incidentals. All hotels ask for this on prepaid stays, or you have to deposit cash with them to hold.



Of all the things to worry about... the Wookie has no pants.
User currently offlinejreuschl From United States of America, joined Jul 2009, 545 posts, RR: 0
Reply 19, posted (2 years 5 months 1 day 12 hours ago) and read 3957 times:

Quoting ikramerica (Reply 18):
It's for incidentals. All hotels ask for this on prepaid stays, or you have to deposit cash with them to hold.

I was just in a convention in New Orleans for a well-known computer-related company, and the hotel actually did a pre-authorization for the entire hotel stay even though that well-known company was picking up the cost of the hotel. Doesn't matter who is paying for it.


User currently offlinepanova98 From United States of America, joined Apr 2008, 304 posts, RR: 0
Reply 20, posted (2 years 5 months 1 day 12 hours ago) and read 3957 times:

How often is plumbing a problem with UA?

Wednesday, March 7, I took the UA 1106p red-eye from SFO to IAD, flight 380, an A320. Almost immediately after we had taken off, the pilot said they noticed a problem with water pressure--no running water in the sinks, and nothing to flush the toilets. He said that despite this, we were heading on, specifically saying we were not returning to base.

No one seemed to complain, and my bladder was on empty so no big deal, I guess. But, if this were a restaurant, wouldn't health officials have ordered the place shut down, right then and there?

Of course, one such issue does not a trend (re:UA and aircraft plumbing) make. Well, the aircraft landing at ANC was another incident. Why, I don't know.

But, in the SFO-IAD flight I took, shouldn't the crew have been aware of the water pressure problem before we left SFO? Maybe they were. If so, should we have taken off before getting the problem fixed? Maybe the crew discovered the problem only after takeoff. What is standard procedure is such cases? Is what I experience the norm?


User currently offlineBCEaglesCO757 From United States of America, joined Mar 2011, 242 posts, RR: 2
Reply 21, posted (2 years 5 months 1 day 11 hours ago) and read 3909 times:

Very bad publicity for us to say the least.

I'm going to wait to see how everyone misses the meal vouchers,hotels and full reunds though.........

Quoting ikramerica (Reply 18):
It's for incidentals. All hotels ask for this on prepaid stays, or you have to deposit cash with them to hold.

Oh I get that....A few passengers said they didn't have credit cards or enough cash. I think a few were a bit upset with UA when asked for them by the hotels.

I can understand being caught off guard,or being upset about that.

My only point was that the incidentals was something out of UA control. Perhaps like rental cars and the hold they put on your card the hotel could have waived it,or worked something out.

But alas, I don't know how their business works. Much the way I can say they should have worked something out without knowing how protocols with them may work. I guess I wouldn't want them to tell UA how to work something out regarding operational issuses.

Either way.......... quite tired of being in the news and late night TV for not so pleasant things.


User currently offlinefrmrCapCadet From United States of America, joined May 2008, 1713 posts, RR: 1
Reply 22, posted (2 years 5 months 1 day 11 hours ago) and read 3892 times:

Timely information does not mean that the airline can say immediately what is wrong and when it will be fixed. It means frequent updates regarding uncertainties, and should even unwelcome possibilities like crews timing out. Free wi-fi at most airports now, and e-mail or a special website could easily do the trick. And airlines which regularly operate at an airport should have some trained contract persons available to assist when things go wrong. If an airline policy is, "tough sh**, deal with it", fine, I will not use them. It is their business, they can do it however they want; it is my money, I will fly with whoever I want.


Buffet: the airline business...has eaten up capital...like..no other (business)
User currently offlineIADLHR From Italy, joined Apr 2005, 735 posts, RR: 0
Reply 23, posted (2 years 5 months 1 day 11 hours ago) and read 3877 times:

[

Quoting panova98 (Reply 20):
Wednesday, March 7, I took the UA 1106p red-eye from SFO to IAD, flight 380, an A320. Almost immediately after we had taken off, the pilot said they noticed a problem with water pressure--no running water in the sinks, and nothing to flush the toilets. He said that despite this, we were heading on, specifically saying we were not returning to base.

All these stories of the toilet issues seedm to have SFO, within days of one another, as a common denominator. That is really interesting. Is it coincidence or is, possibly, something more involved.

It wasnt a mechanical but the issue with the Mayor of Houston and the check was also at SFO during the same time span. Is anybody noticing a possible trend?


User currently offlineikramerica From United States of America, joined May 2005, 21501 posts, RR: 60
Reply 24, posted (2 years 5 months 1 day 11 hours ago) and read 3854 times:

Quoting BCEaglesCO757 (Reply 21):
Oh I get that....A few passengers said they didn't have credit cards or enough cash. I think a few were a bit upset with UA when asked for them by the hotels.

Nobody, absolutely nobody, should travel internationally without sufficient funds or credit to handle a contingency such as this. There are many situations where you might need to stay in a hotel you didn't plan on during such a trip. It's irresponsible of the traveler, and not the fault of the airline or the hotel.



Of all the things to worry about... the Wookie has no pants.
25 DL WIDGET HEAD : Seems like the a/c was only on the ground for a few hours before the decision was made to put the passengers up in hotels and issue meal vouchers. Tha
26 PHX787 : If this becomes a repeated thing (especially with SFO-based aircraft) then maybe an investigation into the SFO base is an order.
27 Viscount724 : Not if you had to cancel/postpone important business meetings, or had non-refundable hotel bookings. And ANC isn't very pleasant in March. Current te
28 gigneil : I don't know that there's more failures than are normal. The pressurized water system has lots of moving parts, and I've been aboard more than one fl
29 ANCsupercub : To defend my town, todays low temperature didn't even hit 7F (it was close). Right now it is a balmy 17F with an expected high of 25F (-4C), which is
30 panova98 : Interesting. Hmmm! The mayor of Sacremento and his wife were onboard the troubled SFO-IAD A320 red-eye I was on.
31 Post contains links PHX787 : http://www.cnn.com/2012/03/21/travel...engers-stranded/index.html?npt=NP1 just saw this on my Facebook earlier. Sort-of pathetic, if you ask me. Airli
32 DC8FanJet : And I'm certain you have the answers for how to do it. Obviously, no one at United wanted this to happen, but airplanes are machines, and machines br
33 ContnlEliteCMH : What about the tools the mechanic would need to disassemble the pertinent sections of the aircraft? What if those sections are too large to handled b
34 ikramerica : And it's not a matter of being unfeeling. It's a matter of personal responsibility. If you don't have a credit card or enough money for a simply cont
35 usdcaguy : I completely agree with this as an American as it concerns other Americans. However, many people in other countries simply do not have credit cards,
36 frmrCapCadet : How judgmental - if you don't have a credit card don't travel. I wouldn't, and you wouldn't, but this does not arise to the level of one of Kant's mor
37 ikramerica : That's why I said "or enough money" because if you don't have credit cards, then you travel with cash, travelers checks or bank card, no? You must ha
38 glbltrvlr : That's not what was posted. The actual quote was
39 kfitz : No you don't. You're displaing a strikingly western bias point of view that is simply not applicable to many others. I don't know why you beieve you'
40 Post contains images PHX787 : More analysis: I never said I personally had the answers to it, but my solution would be training mechanics and technicians better to foresee problems
41 Mir : Not the one I stayed in recently. Handed over my DL voucher at check-in, and that was that. No credit card required. -Mir
42 frmrCapCadet : Actually you are right. In fact you are doubly right. The airline was not prepared and we need to cover not only ourselves but unprepared airlines. L
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