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Avianca Wants To Buy 50 New Airpanes For AV Brazil  
User currently offlinegabo787 From United Kingdom, joined Sep 2006, 158 posts, RR: 0
Posted (2 years 9 months 13 hours ago) and read 7685 times:

http://www.foxbusiness.com/news/2012...lion-on-airplanes-for-brazil-unit/

They will spend close to $4 Billion in the next 2 to 5 years, no manufacturer has been selected yet.

Is AV Brazil doing that well?

15 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlinesomething From United Kingdom, joined May 2011, 1633 posts, RR: 21
Reply 1, posted (2 years 9 months 12 hours ago) and read 7479 times:

If they know 50 airplanes will cost $4bn. but that a manufacturer has not yet been chosen, then it can only be a decision between A320 and 737. So congratulations to Airbus to selling a bunch of OEOs, congratulations to Avianca for their rapid growth and apparent success in Brazil.


..sick of it. -K. Pilkington.
User currently offlineAvianca From Venezuela, joined Jan 2005, 5934 posts, RR: 40
Reply 2, posted (2 years 9 months 12 hours ago) and read 7479 times:

Quoting gabo787 (Thread starter):
Is AV Brazil doing that well?

well they have no other choice in order to increase their market share, also this would be very welcomed by * alliance!

cheers
Avianca



Colombia es el Mundo Y el Mundo es Colombia
User currently offlinekiwiandrew From New Zealand, joined Jun 2005, 8631 posts, RR: 13
Reply 3, posted (2 years 9 months 12 hours ago) and read 7407 times:
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Where are they planning to operate them to. Aren't GRU and GIG pretty much out of available slots?


Moderation in all things ... including moderation ;-)
User currently offlinebennett123 From United Kingdom, joined Aug 2004, 7815 posts, RR: 3
Reply 4, posted (2 years 9 months 12 hours ago) and read 7351 times:

Could they be looking at Embraer or C Series?.

User currently offlinesomething From United Kingdom, joined May 2011, 1633 posts, RR: 21
Reply 5, posted (2 years 9 months 11 hours ago) and read 7309 times:

Quoting kiwiandrew (Reply 3):
Aren't GRU and GIG pretty much out of available slots?

There are other airports in that region too and surprisingly, Brazilians in other parts of the country as well. SP has 20m., Rio 12m. people - that's less than 1/6 of the countries population.



..sick of it. -K. Pilkington.
User currently offlinerotating14 From United States of America, joined Jan 2012, 731 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (2 years 9 months 11 hours ago) and read 7309 times:

Quoting something (Reply 1):

Assuming they in fact were buying Airbus, I wonder what delivery slots they could get versus buying a 737MAX, C-Series or Embraer NB??


User currently offlinesomething From United Kingdom, joined May 2011, 1633 posts, RR: 21
Reply 7, posted (2 years 9 months 9 hours ago) and read 7055 times:

Quoting rotating14 (Reply 6):
Assuming they in fact were buying Airbus, I wonder what delivery slots they could get versus buying a 737MAX, C-Series or Embraer NB??

Their lines seem to have a lot of slack in the mentioned time frame (2-5 years), which are the last years of the OEO production before the NEO is launched. Airbus will sell these pre-NEO slots for a very good price I assume and I would not hate seeing an Avianca do Brasil A321 with sharklets take to the skies.



..sick of it. -K. Pilkington.
User currently offlinesteve6666 From United Kingdom, joined Sep 2003, 429 posts, RR: 0
Reply 8, posted (2 years 9 months 9 hours ago) and read 6992 times:

Quoting something (Reply 5):
Quoting kiwiandrew (Reply 3):
Aren't GRU and GIG pretty much out of available slots?

There are other airports in that region too and surprisingly, Brazilians in other parts of the country as well. SP has 20m., Rio 12m. people - that's less than 1/6 of the countries population.

Yes but the southeast region has the bulk of the wealth. I would be more interested in CGH and SDU than GRU and GIG in terms of slots. Avianca's current schedule is a bit pathetic - if you are on GOL or TAM, you know (pretty much) if you turn up for the ponte aerea and you are early they will put you on the early one, or if it has all gone wrong then there will be alternatives. Avianca just doesn't have the frequency to make them a serious option over TAM or GOL at the moment for me.

Anyway, more competition can only be good - get the (extortionate) fares down...



eu nasci ha dez mil anos atras, e nao tem nada nesse mundo que eu nao saiba demais
User currently offlineC010T3 From Brazil, joined Jul 2006, 3736 posts, RR: 19
Reply 9, posted (2 years 9 months 8 hours ago) and read 6793 times:

Quoting kiwiandrew (Reply 3):
Aren't GRU and GIG pretty much out of available slots?

No, only GRU is. GIG has available slots at any given time throughout the day.


User currently offlinekiwiandrew From New Zealand, joined Jun 2005, 8631 posts, RR: 13
Reply 10, posted (2 years 9 months 7 hours ago) and read 6700 times:
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Quoting C010T3 (Reply 9):
No, only GRU is. GIG has available slots at any given time throughout the day.

Thanks, I didn't realise that.



Moderation in all things ... including moderation ;-)
User currently offlineRCS763AV From Colombia, joined Jun 2004, 4396 posts, RR: 12
Reply 11, posted (2 years 8 months 4 weeks 1 day 20 hours ago) and read 6291 times:

Well that is great news. It was clear that if they wanted to grow in Brazil they would need a lot more aircraft than those currently ordered, which would only cover growth in BOG, LIM and central america. This is also good news for Star Alliance.

User currently offlinejfk777 From United States of America, joined Aug 2006, 8513 posts, RR: 6
Reply 12, posted (2 years 8 months 4 weeks 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 4466 times:
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Buy Azul, they have planes, an established operation, from which Avianca could expand its domestic and regional operation in Brazil. Buying GOL would be a great goal to achieve but the cost may be prohibitve and impossible since they are closely held.

User currently offlineSJOtoLIR From Costa Rica, joined Jul 2007, 4618 posts, RR: 4
Reply 13, posted (2 years 8 months 4 weeks 1 day 15 hours ago) and read 4238 times:

Quoting bennett123 (Reply 4):
Could they be looking at Embraer or C Series?.


As far as I know, TA by itself is not entirely happy for their 11 E90s due to cargo constraints.
The airline has not ordered more planes, even though the memorandum of understanding signed in 2008 between Embraer and TACA stated about the possibility of more planes in the future.




.

Quoting rotating14 (Reply 6):
Assuming they in fact were buying Airbus, I wonder what delivery slots they could get versus buying a 737MAX, C-Series or Embraer NB??


I'm not clear about why might AV consider the 737s when AV-TA is pursuing the commonality of the 320 family on Avianca, Taca, Aerogal and Avianca Brasil for the (120-160)-seater planes.

Regards.



"Goin' up to the spirit in the sky"
User currently offlineVC10er From United States of America, joined Feb 2007, 2989 posts, RR: 13
Reply 14, posted (2 years 8 months 4 weeks 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 3408 times:
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What ever Avianca buys, even if they are behind TAM and GOL, all they would need to do is either add 2 or 3 inches of legroom nose to tail, or put in 10 rows of something like UA's E+ with 5 inches of legroom and they would have a huge advantage over Gol or TAM - who have the tightest economy seats ever sat in, ever!


The world is missing love, let's use our flights to spread it!
User currently offlinesomething From United Kingdom, joined May 2011, 1633 posts, RR: 21
Reply 15, posted (2 years 8 months 4 weeks 21 hours ago) and read 3154 times:

Quoting VC10er (Reply 14):
What ever Avianca buys, even if they are behind TAM and GOL, all they would need to do is either add 2 or 3 inches of legroom nose to tail, or put in 10 rows of something like UA's E+ with 5 inches of legroom and they would have a huge advantage over Gol or TAM - who have the tightest economy seats ever sat in, ever!

People who want a bit more comfort and are willing to pay for it too, would usually elect Azul as their carrier of choice. They claim they're $17 cheaper on average, but my real world experience is inconsistent with this claim.

If Avianca were to install a more generous cabin layout, they would have to have either lower operating costs or higher fares. The question is would the market bear these higher fares or, would this more comfortable layout attract enough customers for the higher load factors to make more money than a denser configuration at what could potentially be a lower load factor?

All we know is that they want to spend $4bn. on 50 aircraft; that leaves only the A320 and 737 of which the latter can be ruled out as a possibility. What we don't know however is what strategy Avianca Brasil is pursueing. Will they fly domestically or internationally? Will they create a hub and spoke system or focus on direct links? If the former, couldn't they use some A330s? If the latter, wouldn't smaller aircraft (E195s and ATR72) make more sense, to go after smaller markets or higher frequencies? How important will the long haul Star Alliance feed be for them? If it's crucial to their operation, they will have no other choice but to focus on flying 'spokes' out of GIG and GRU to exactly the same markets JJ is already serving. How important is cargo to them?

There are so many variables that without knowing what they're on about, the order could consist of everything from 50x A320 to a mix of A330s down to ATRs. But so far, the all A320OEO order at favorable conditions seems the likeliest.



..sick of it. -K. Pilkington.
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