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BA Begin Codesharing BD Flights  
User currently offlinenicktt From UK - England, joined Jan 2012, 14 posts, RR: 0
Posted (2 years 4 months 1 week 6 days 11 hours ago) and read 4130 times:

http://www.britishairways.com/travel...lightops/public/en_gb?p_faqid=4406

I've just noticed this on the BA website. BA are now selling tickets for BD operated flights to the following destinations:

• Yerevan (Armenia)
• Baku (Azerbaijan)
• Addis Ababa (Ethiopia)
• Tbilisi (Georgia)
• Almaty (Kazakhstan)
• Beirut (Lebanon)
• Freetown (Sierra Leone)

These don't seem very obvious choices, I was hoping BA were possibly going to use their new slots to expand into the Asian market. Will these routes really be that profitable for BA when the merger is complete?

Apologies if this topic has already been discussed, the announcement has been on the BA website for a number of days now.

14 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineFlyCaledonian From United Kingdom, joined Dec 2003, 2081 posts, RR: 3
Reply 1, posted (2 years 4 months 1 week 6 days 11 hours ago) and read 4056 times:

BA has said it will operate the BD Summer schedule. I'd imagine that codesharing on these flights is a way of posibbly trying to reduce losses by opening the flights up to BA's and oneworld's customer base.


Let's Go British Caledonian!
User currently offlineAIR MALTA From Malta, joined Sep 2001, 2498 posts, RR: 1
Reply 2, posted (2 years 4 months 1 week 6 days 11 hours ago) and read 4024 times:

Don't expect BA to start 10 longhaul destinations at once. Some othe ex BD destinations will remain for sure.


Next flights : BRU-ZRH-CAI (LX)/ BRU-FCO-TLV (AZ)
User currently offlineBAStar1 From UK - England, joined Dec 2011, 16 posts, RR: 0
Reply 3, posted (2 years 4 months 1 week 6 days 9 hours ago) and read 3770 times:

No decisions have been made yet on which routes will stay and which will go. No formal announcements will be made until after the sale completes. Some BD routes are profitable and will, most likely, stay.

User currently offlineOA260 From Ireland, joined Nov 2006, 26912 posts, RR: 58
Reply 4, posted (2 years 4 months 1 week 6 days 6 hours ago) and read 3533 times:

As others say some will stay some will go. I would be surprised if BA axed BEY. BA has the network to get the American/Canadian Lebanese communities and South America.

User currently offline757ops From United Kingdom, joined Feb 2006, 318 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (2 years 4 months 1 week 6 days 6 hours ago) and read 3487 times:

I can't believe the rumour machine hasn't started on the route cuts!

I would expect to see ADD go its a long way for a narrow body tag on flight and not enough demand for 767 direct IMHO


User currently offlineGSTBA From UK - England, joined Apr 2010, 465 posts, RR: 1
Reply 6, posted (2 years 4 months 1 week 5 days 8 hours ago) and read 3106 times:

Quoting 757ops (Reply 5):
I can't believe the rumour machine hasn't started on the route cuts!

I think BA will probably cut BD's flights to BGO, DME, DUB, HAJ, JED, RUH, SVG, TIP & VIE

Flights to ABZ, CAI, EDI, MAN & NCE will all see there overall daily frequency reduced. For example EDI is served up to 17 x Daily (6 x Daily by BD and 11 x Daily by BA) during S12. The new combined schedule will probably see BA operate 14 x Daily freeing up 3 pairs of slots.

DMM will probably remain with BA operating it as a continuation of there current JED service. JED will likely increase to daily.

Quoting AIR MALTA (Reply 2):
Don't expect BA to start 10 longhaul destinations at once. Some othe ex BD destinations will remain for sure.

I agree. I think initially BA will probably use freed up slots to increase frequency on some existing routes and will might add just 1 or 2 new routes during W12/13.

BA have already increased frequency on the following routes for W12/13

BER - Will increase from 5 to 6 x Daily
DUS - Will increase from 6 to 7 x Daily


User currently offline757ops From United Kingdom, joined Feb 2006, 318 posts, RR: 0
Reply 7, posted (2 years 4 months 1 week 5 days 7 hours ago) and read 2989 times:

That's great but what about the oddball destinations? Long and thin routes? KRT/ADD/FNA/GYD/ALA??

User currently offlineGSTBA From UK - England, joined Apr 2010, 465 posts, RR: 1
Reply 8, posted (2 years 4 months 1 week 5 days 5 hours ago) and read 2897 times:

Quoting 757ops (Reply 7):
That's great but what about the oddball destinations? Long and thin routes? KRT/ADD/FNA/GYD/ALA??

These are nearly if not all ex BMED routes so BA have a idea of how they have historically performed. It will be interesting to see what BD do with there medium haul routes. Here is a list of the medium haul routes and what I think could happen to them.

Addis Ababa (ADD) - (BD op a A321 3 x Weekly via BEY) BA will probably drop ADD altogether or they could decide to operate the flight via JED on a 767 with a reduced 2 x weekly frequency.

Almaty (ALA) - (BD op a A332 3 x Weekly) BA will likely continue to operate ALA 3 x weekly but not as a direct service, they may instead decide to operate the flight via GYD

Amman (AMM) - (BD op a A321 Daily) BA and RJ will very likely continue to operate a daily service each with RJ codesharing on BA's service. BA already codeshare on RJ's service from LHR to AMM

Amristar (ATQ) - (BD op a A332 3 x Weekly via ALA) Have no idea with this one as I am unsure how this route has been performing since it's launch. Anyone have any idea of pax numbers/load factor on this route

Baku (GYD) - (BD op a A321 Daily) I think will likely remain unchanged

Beiruit (BEY) - (BD op a A321 Daily and a A320 3 x Weekly) - Will probably decide to operate the route daily with a A321 or 767

Bishkek (FRU) - (BD op a A321 3 x Weekly via GYD) - I think will likely remain unchanged

Damman (DMM) - (BD op a A332 3 x Weekly via RUH) I said in my earlier post

Quoting GSTBA (Reply 6):
DMM will probably remain with BA operating it as a continuation of there current JED service. JED will likely increase to daily.

Another possibility is to op DMM via RUH as BD currently do with flight op on a 777.

Freetown (FNA) - (BD op a A332 3 x Weekly) - I think the service could continue to be operated direct using a 767.

Khartoum (KRT) - (BD op 2 x A321 & 1 x A320 Weekly via BEY) BA will probably cease to serve KRT themselves. They could instead offer a connection and enter a codeshare agreement with RJ who op to KRT via AMM

Tbilisi (TBS) - (BD op 4 x A321 Weekly via GYD) I think will likely remain unchanged

Tehran (IKT) - (BD op a A321 Daily via EVN) I think will likely remain unchanged

Yerevan (EVN) - (BD op direct A321) I think will likely remain unchanged

BD Frequency and Routing info based on info taken from BD's Winter 2011/2012 Schedule

[Edited 2012-04-12 17:38:02]

User currently offlinejumpjets From United Kingdom, joined Apr 2012, 805 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (2 years 4 months 1 week 4 days 17 hours ago) and read 2727 times:

Quoting GSTBA (Reply 8):
Amman (AMM) - (BD op a A321 Daily) BA and RJ will very likely continue to operate a daily service each with RJ codesharing on BA's service

An interesting analysis there GSTBA.

One thing I dont think will happen is the services to AMM that you suggest. The EU ruling requires BA to stop its codeshare with RJ if it starts its own flights. I imagine that BA will continue the code share and as you suggest codeshare with RJ down to Khartoum. The BMI flights to AMM will likely stop to free up slots.

Here are a couple of off the wall dieas:

ADD - ET have been running 757's non stop to LHR - though I see they have upgraded to 763s - I think BA have some 757's in storage so BA could refurbish a couple of 757s for that route - and if they felt so inclined extend to Khartoum or even more off the wall to Juba in the newly created Southern Sudan - would be great to see BA taking the lead in serving somewhere new.

Freetown - maintain the service but reintroduce a stop in Dakar, Senegal. BA could then consider codesharing with the new Air Senegal on routes to cities in French West Africa - Oneworld needs more african pentration and Dakar would be a good jumping off point for connections from Europe and the Americas. Anyone else think this has any merit?


User currently offlineyellowtail From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 6092 posts, RR: 2
Reply 10, posted (2 years 4 months 1 week 4 days 15 hours ago) and read 2634 times:

There has been British service to FNA for as long as I can remember on various British Airlines ...I flew on a BOAC VC10 there when I was a child......so clearly there must be traffic. BA just needs to get the frequency and gauge right.


When in doubt, hold on to your altitude. No-one has ever collided with the sky.
User currently offline757ops From United Kingdom, joined Feb 2006, 318 posts, RR: 0
Reply 11, posted (2 years 4 months 1 week 4 days 15 hours ago) and read 2593 times:

Quoting jumpjets (Reply 9):

ET operate 763 to ADD but the traffic to ADD is minimal it's more a feed to their large African network, wouldn't stand a terminator service from LHR


User currently offlineTristarsteve From Sweden, joined Nov 2005, 3999 posts, RR: 34
Reply 12, posted (2 years 4 months 1 week 4 days 14 hours ago) and read 2555 times:

Quoting GSTBA (Reply 8):
. It will be interesting to see what BD do with there medium haul routes.

BA.com has been updated with a lot of info.
Early days yet, but as of today, for flights in November
Following BD flights will continue to operate with BA flight numbers
ADD ALA GYD BEY FRU FNA TBS EVN

Following are dropped
ATQ DMM KRT IKT
and AMM is a daily RJ codeshare.


User currently offlineCrosswind From United Kingdom, joined Nov 2000, 2598 posts, RR: 58
Reply 13, posted (2 years 4 months 1 week 4 days 11 hours ago) and read 2418 times:
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Quoting Tristarsteve (Reply 12):
BA.com has been updated with a lot of info.
Early days yet, but as of today, for flights in November
Following BD flights will continue to operate with BA flight numbers
ADD ALA GYD BEY FRU FNA TBS EVN

Following are dropped
ATQ DMM KRT IKT
and AMM is a daily RJ codeshare.

Much of that may be down to billateral agreements though, some of which are more restrictive and harder to change than others. Where agreements with certain countries restrict who can operate on some of these routes, especially ones that only permit one UK carrier and actually name bmi as the "UK" operating carrier, then until the agreement is amended BA cannot put their code on it. I suspect the ones that have already shown up as BA codeshares already permit BA to serve the routes, or have been able to be changed since the takeover was announced.

That being said, maybe not all these routes will prove viable for BA with their cost structure, but then it's debatable whether they were all viable for bmi... They must have been making a loss somewhere and I doubt it was the contract flying for Lufthansa/Swiss/Austrian partners.

Regards
CROSSWIND


User currently offlineyegbey01 From United States of America, joined Nov 2003, 1724 posts, RR: 3
Reply 14, posted (2 years 4 months 1 week 3 days 13 hours ago) and read 2083 times:

I think BEY could see the 767 deployed for sure. BD wanted double dailies, but they were restricted by the bilateral agreements and ended up only going 10 per week.


BA should be able to funnel more passengers through to BEY than BD, so I can definitely see BEY seeing an overall increase in seats.


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