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ABC's 20/20: Chaos In The Skies, April 13th  
User currently offline727LOVER From United States of America, joined Oct 2001, 6422 posts, RR: 17
Posted (2 years 4 months 1 week 2 days 10 hours ago) and read 15208 times:

On tonight's 20/20, there will be a story on all the recent in-air incidents/meltdowns.

Watch & critique!


Listen Betty, don't start up with your 'White Zone' s*** again.
56 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineDLX737200 From United States of America, joined May 2001, 1904 posts, RR: 19
Reply 1, posted (2 years 4 months 1 week 2 days 8 hours ago) and read 14819 times:

Diggin it so far! I like how they're spotlighting flight crews and the hell they have to put up with but they need to show customer service agents, as well. Many customer service agents (gate/ticket counter) are just as overworked and underpaid and still have to deal with being abused on a daily basis. I can relate very well to this program.

I've been saying it for years, the traveling public is getting worse. More entitled, sassy and outspoken then ever before. Maybe the airlines have generated some of this behavior with changes in policies, fees, etc but people forget that the frontline employees don't set the policies and they are just people like everyone else.


User currently offlineDLX737200 From United States of America, joined May 2001, 1904 posts, RR: 19
Reply 2, posted (2 years 4 months 1 week 2 days 8 hours ago) and read 14724 times:

Oh boy... they just called a CRJ-700 a "Baby Jet." Ehhh.....

User currently offline727LOVER From United States of America, joined Oct 2001, 6422 posts, RR: 17
Reply 3, posted (2 years 4 months 1 week 2 days 8 hours ago) and read 14694 times:

Celebrity couple asks FA to tell pilot not to make announcements because of their sleeping baby???????!!!!!!

Wonder who that was.



Listen Betty, don't start up with your 'White Zone' s*** again.
User currently offlineBMI727 From United States of America, joined Feb 2009, 15729 posts, RR: 26
Reply 4, posted (2 years 4 months 1 week 2 days 6 hours ago) and read 14394 times:

Quoting 727LOVER (Reply 3):
Celebrity couple asks FA to tell pilot not to make announcements because of their sleeping baby???????!!!!!!

Wonder who that was.

I'd give you 2-1 odds on Tom Cruise.



Why do Aerospace Engineering students have to turn things in on time?
User currently offlineDashTrash From United States of America, joined exactly 8 years ago today! , 1522 posts, RR: 2
Reply 5, posted (2 years 4 months 1 week 2 days 5 hours ago) and read 14272 times:

Quoting 727LOVER (Reply 3):
Celebrity couple asks FA to tell pilot not to make announcements because of their sleeping baby???????!!!!!!

Wonder who that was.

Somebody who needs to buy a Netjets share....


User currently offlineboeingkid From United States of America, joined May 2009, 116 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (2 years 4 months 1 week 2 days 5 hours ago) and read 14242 times:

Here is a Link for anyone who wants to watch it

http://youtu.be/wd0Mn8kIqoY


User currently offlinegingersnap From United Kingdom, joined Aug 2010, 893 posts, RR: 5
Reply 7, posted (2 years 4 months 1 week 1 day 23 hours ago) and read 12973 times:

I chuckled at the footage from the UK Airline program 


Flown on: A306 A319/20/21 A332 B732/3/4/5/7/8 B742/4 B752 B762/3 B772/W C152 E195 F70/100 MD-82 Q400
User currently offlinedeltaguy767 From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 661 posts, RR: 2
Reply 8, posted (2 years 4 months 1 week 1 day 21 hours ago) and read 11703 times:

Quoting boeingkid (Reply 6):
Here is a Link for anyone who wants to watch it

Thanks for the link, good watch. Was that the full program?



A Good Landing is one you walk away from!
User currently offline727LOVER From United States of America, joined Oct 2001, 6422 posts, RR: 17
Reply 9, posted (2 years 4 months 1 week 1 day 20 hours ago) and read 11306 times:

Quoting deltaguy767 (Reply 8):

Absolutely not,.......omitting commercials, there was probably about 45 minutes worth.



Listen Betty, don't start up with your 'White Zone' s*** again.
User currently offlineLOWS From Austria, joined Oct 2011, 1136 posts, RR: 1
Reply 10, posted (2 years 4 months 1 week 1 day 20 hours ago) and read 11279 times:

Quoting boeingkid (Reply 6):
http://youtu.be/wd0Mn8kIqoY

I'm absolutely sick of this „flying used to be soooo much better“ nonsense.

Without rehashing things everyone has said here 1000000 times. I'm going to leave it at that.


User currently offlinejuantrippe82 From Bahamas, joined Sep 2011, 26 posts, RR: 0
Reply 11, posted (2 years 4 months 1 week 1 day 19 hours ago) and read 10888 times:

Quoting LOWS (Reply 10):
I'm absolutely sick of this „flying used to be soooo much better“ nonsense.

But its true, flying was better before they let the great unwashed fly circa 1978! Just kidding!   

I couldn't imagine working customer service, I couldn't take the dumb questions and demands from people. I can't stand my boss coming down on me, imagine a passenger! I have alot of respect for airline employees.



Don't worry, I'm never wrong.
User currently offlineB727FA From United States of America, joined Jun 2011, 756 posts, RR: 0
Reply 12, posted (2 years 4 months 1 week 1 day 19 hours ago) and read 10563 times:

Quoting BMI727 (Reply 4):
Quoting 727LOVER (Reply 3):
Celebrity couple asks FA to tell pilot not to make announcements because of their sleeping baby???????!!!!!!

Wonder who that was.

I'd give you 2-1 odds on Tom Cruise.

Nah, he'd just jump on the FC seat and say, "I LOVE this flight!"



My comments/opinions are my own and are not to be construed as the opinion(s) of my employer.
User currently offlinedeltaguy767 From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 661 posts, RR: 2
Reply 13, posted (2 years 4 months 1 week 1 day 18 hours ago) and read 10084 times:

ABC has the full program on it's site:

http://abc.go.com/watch/2020/166626



A Good Landing is one you walk away from!
User currently offlineABQopsHP From United States of America, joined May 2006, 848 posts, RR: 3
Reply 14, posted (2 years 4 months 1 week 1 day 18 hours ago) and read 9823 times:

Quoting juantrippe82 (Reply 11):
I couldn't imagine working customer service, I couldn't take the dumb questions and demands from people. I can't stand my boss coming down on me, imagine a passenger! I have alot of respect for airline employees.

Recently, during the spring break rush, I had a few customers come to me from watching at a distance to say.........They could not do what I do, dealing with customers. Stunned, how self absorbed others were, as if they were the only ones on the plane that were going to misconnect at IAH. And one overheard a customer ask me to remove someone from a flight out of IAH just so they could get on, since there were no seats left on the later flight. I just chuckle and keep on processing. Its a drastic change from when I started in the early 80's. The good thing is, I love what I do, which helps dampen the insanity that goes on, almost every day.

Keep in mind, that what we see in the media, will always be a flair for the dramatic. Just to sell the story. Although, the recent melt downs of these crew members, have even stunned us in the industry. Making me believe that American society has wound itself up too tight, and has become way too aggressive, when things dont go the way they think it ought too.

JD CRP Expressjet



A line is evidence that other people exist.
User currently offlinecomair25 From United States of America, joined Sep 2006, 216 posts, RR: 0
Reply 15, posted (2 years 4 months 1 week 1 day 17 hours ago) and read 9624 times:

Can't seem to get a VPN blocker working anyone have a link for overseas?

User currently offlinekann123air From United States of America, joined Jun 2009, 929 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (2 years 4 months 1 week 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 8666 times:

Quoting LOWS (Reply 10):
I'm absolutely sick of this „flying used to be soooo much better“ nonsense.

Right! That's so ridiculous. I think flying is at its best now with new planes like the A380 and 787.



Moving forward with the New American
User currently offlinetraindoc From United States of America, joined Mar 2008, 352 posts, RR: 0
Reply 17, posted (2 years 4 months 1 week 1 day 15 hours ago) and read 8370 times:

I fly a lot and totally agree the public is getting worse, but every where and not just at the airport. The frontline employees really do have to put up with a lot. When I fly, I try especially hard to treat them well because of this.

True story from the ER, just to make the point about the self absorbed public! It is the day before Thanksgiving 2011 (always busy) and I have one empty bed left. A 20 year old woman comes in because of mild nausea, and shortly after her a 78 year old man with a life threatening infection who needs immediate treatment. When the 78 year old gets the last bed, the 20 something starts screaming that she was there first! Our explanation that the sickest patents get treated first did not matter. She then left AMA (against medical advice) and she signed out of the ER acknowledging that she was leaving because we gave the last bed to the sickest patient. At least, if she complains (which they frequently do) we have documented the facts of the matter.

This illustrates an important medical finding-the "Equine Paradox" there are more horses a****s than horses!   

Traindoc


User currently offlineTbone354 From United States of America, joined Sep 2010, 76 posts, RR: 0
Reply 18, posted (2 years 4 months 1 week 1 day 14 hours ago) and read 7612 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

Guess I should come to the forum more often! This show was ancient history by the time I got around to reading about it just a scant few minutes ago. ABC is not likely to rerun it I fear. Sigh...

User currently offline727LOVER From United States of America, joined Oct 2001, 6422 posts, RR: 17
Reply 19, posted (2 years 4 months 1 week 1 day 13 hours ago) and read 6880 times:

Quoting Tbone354 (Reply 18):

You realize its 2012, right?

See reply #13



Listen Betty, don't start up with your 'White Zone' s*** again.
User currently offlineAWACSooner From United States of America, joined Jan 2008, 1900 posts, RR: 1
Reply 20, posted (2 years 4 months 1 week 1 day 13 hours ago) and read 6854 times:

Quoting BMI727 (Reply 4):
I'd give you 2-1 odds on Tom Cruise.

No, he'd just complain about being trapped in the closet!


User currently offlineAirCalSNA From United States of America, joined Mar 2010, 333 posts, RR: 0
Reply 21, posted (2 years 4 months 1 week 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 5407 times:

Quoting traindoc (Reply 17):
Right! That's so ridiculous. I think flying is at its best now with new planes like the A380 and 787.

Another major improvement is that planes don't crash as often as they used to.


User currently offlineZChannel From United States of America, joined Jan 2006, 188 posts, RR: 0
Reply 22, posted (2 years 4 months 1 week 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 5371 times:

Am I the only one that thinks the gal in the Delta Airlines Safety video is absolutely gorgeous?


ZChannel: Member FDIC
User currently offlineSkyCub From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 23, posted (2 years 4 months 1 week 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 5334 times:

You know what I am sick of? I am sick of crew members and the media portraying flight attendants at US carriers as overworked and underpaid people. I really am.

I will be the first to admit that YES.... crew members at US regional airlines are paid very poorly.

I will also be the first to admit that YES.... crew members at MAJOR US airlines have taken pay cuts over the past decade.

And yes, I will be the first to admit that the pilots and flight attendants at US regional airlines are paid pathetically and their work rules are horrible.

HOWEVER, as a flight attendant for a major US airline, I will say that we are actually paid VERY well for what we do. We are. Maybe that is not the popular opinion to take when the AFA and the APFA are yelling about poor wages and bad working rules....but we are.

I, personally, enjoy my job. And as a result, I like to work. I like to work A LOT. I don't go to work seeing the passenger as the enemy. I don't go to work hating the company I work for. I don't go to work seeing myself as a police officer or a doctor or a waiter/waitress. I go to work as someone who has ALWAYS loved aviation and still thinks it is amazing that my "office" is flying 40,000 feet above the earth. And since I like to work... I work a lot. Yeah, I am an aviation enthusiast... I love to land at LAX or JFK and see all of the different planes from around the world. I still walk through an airport I have never been to in amazement at the architecture..... I love my job and I fly A LOT.... more than I am required to.......

That's why when I watched this 20/20 segment which included the jetBlue flight attendant who went crazy and popped a slide with a few beers... not only was I shocked my his lack of desire to be a flight attendant any longer, but I was also appalled by his comment (which was seemingly reenforced by ABC News) that we are all underpaid and overworked.

The jetBlue dude said (and I am sure ABC News loved this soundbit) that he made a whole $9,700 in his last year of flying.

I can tell you that I have been a flight attendant for over a decade and even at a low-paying regional airline pre-9/11 my annual income was almost twice that amount. Furthermore, as a flight attendant who now works for a major US carrier who flies A LOT (and I am not even half-way up our pay scale) my income last year was over $60,000. If I continue to work at the rate I do, my income will top $100,000 in a few years when I top out.

I am not bragging. That is not my intention. My intention is to say that I get sick of flight attendants complaining about being underpaid and overworked.

Yes, flight attendants have taken pay cuts over the past decade. Yes, people can say that we are paid very well for what we do considering that many of us have never been to college. I don't or won't deny any of that (which will probably make me very unpopular among other flight attendants.) But it IS the truth. In addition, WHO in the United States has NOT taken a pay cut in the past decade? I get paid in excess of $40/hr to, as a co-worker once said, "hand out peanuts, pick up trash and hope we don't crash."

I watched this 20/20 segment and I just had to shake my head. I don't care if your top out pay at a major US carrier is $35/hr or $65/hr..... I don't care. We all accepted jobs in this position for one reason or another..... mine was because of a love of the airline industry and you could pay me pennies to do this job as long as I can be around planes and airports and if someone told me I had to take a paycut..... I would STILL do this job because of my desire to be around planes and airports.

However, for a former flight attendant to complain that in his last year of flying he made a mere $9,700 is simply untrue and an insult to all flight attendants. 15 years ago as a commuter airline flight attendant I made twice that amount. His statements did nothing...NOTHING.... but make us look like minimum-wage waitresses.


User currently offlineCapEd388 From United States of America, joined Feb 2011, 233 posts, RR: 0
Reply 24, posted (2 years 4 months 1 week 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 5181 times:

Quoting SkyCub (Reply 23):

Thank you so much for saying what a lot of us are thinking. I think we need more flight attendants like you and I think your attitude is one that we all need to apply to our jobs whether your a flight attendant, doctor, lawyer etc. You need to be passionate about your job. When you're passionate about your job, it shows, you make the experience a lot better for yourself, colleagues and customers.

My opinion has always been, if you dont like it, dont do it. I see a bunch of people (from all industries) complain about how much they hate their jobs or the companies they work for and I always say "Then why did you choose that job? Why are you at that company?" Keep in mind that you went to work for them, they didn't come to you.

I agree with you that even though flight crews have taken their share of cuts, they still get paid rather handsomely. Why didnt 20/20 interview flight members like you who love their job and love their company and the industry as a whole? Because they want to make the airlines look bad, its the industry that people love to hate.

I remember seeing a CNN interview with "Deltalina" and she was saying that she loved her job. I remember interviews with Sully, and he also loved his job, I don't think I ever heard him say anything negative about US or the industry as a whole.

Im just sick and tired of people trying to demonize airlines. I know that airlines have their flaws, but I think people are over doing it. I think its a slap in the face to loyal hard working employees like yourself, who love their job, to say that flight attendants (along with other airline employees) provide poor service and that flying sucks or that you are somehow slaves to the airlines.

Yes, flying isnt what it used to be, but at the end of the day, I know that there are a lot of good flight crews and ground staff who give it their best and try to make the flying experience as best as possible.

If people hate flying so much then they can drive. If people hate working at airlines, then they can find another job.

P.S. I love how the B6 FA is the one that acted out did the whole slide thing yet, B6 is the bad guy.



388 346 77W 787
25 zippyjet : I call them "Barbie Jets." Your average Joe gets confused at the different models and companies of aircraft. Thank You! I've been a CSA/Gate Agent at
26 macsog6 : I wish I knew who you were and who you fly for; I'd go buy a ticket tonight. I LOVE aviation, my father was an air-framer and a Second World War bomb
27 Post contains links pilotfox : They ended up using one of my youtube videos on this show. ABC had been in touch with me the last month getting my permission to air it. The video cli
28 spacecadet : The first rule of business is that every company in every industry attracts exactly the sort of customers it deserves. If the airlines want better fl
29 LOWS : So which airline should be the first to raise prices? US consumers appear to only be focused on price. Maybe it's time for a true Y+ that restores so
30 Post contains links milesrich : I agree, very funny, very glib, very much on point. . This flight attendant needs to go back to school and learn math or something. I was married to
31 CapEd388 : Wow! So because of that statement I made, I am now a union hating, fox news watching right wing republican? There is not need to insult me. I dont mi
32 WNCrew : It's VERY doable, depending on which carrier you work for. At WN, for instance, the minimum credit for a 3-day trip is 19.5, with the highest 3-day p
33 milesrich : I am not aware of Southwest's rules. It's impossible at Delta. The minimum three day trip is 14.5. Other than international trips, there are few thre
34 EWRCabincrew : I saw the show and enjoyed it, but got tired of the much used overworked, underpaid, stressed out, exhausted, abused, blah blah balh. I have been doin
35 WNCrew : So, while apparently not possible at DL, a FA can in-fact make that kind of money and be legal elsewhere.
36 EWRCabincrew : That is one thing this job offers.....flexiblity. Flexibility to work as much or as little as you want..or to make as much or as little as you want.
37 Post contains images SkyCub : Thank you for the compliment. I really do appreciate that. And perhaps, my friend, someone else should go to etiquette school so they can learn it is
38 ASFlyer : A Southwest FA can make that kind of money. At any other carrier, it's EXTREMELY difficult - you would have to fly just about every day of the week a
39 SkyCub : ASFlyer, First of all, please let me say that I have always read and respected your posts. I have. I think you have a great insight into the airline b
40 B727FA : I've been SO lucky to "live/work" my hobby for the last 19 years. And in MANY ways, ALL of the people who've said what they have are "right." But in m
41 SkyCub : And that is how I feel about my job. I did this job working for a regional where I was furloughed during a strike by another work group. I did it for
42 futureualpilot : I appreciate the FAs that continue to strive to deliver a good product to our paying customers. We need more attitudes like this. Flying is stressful
43 SkyCub : futureualpilot, You do make very valid points. And I will admit, that when I said I would do this job for a fraction of what I make now, I meant that
44 B727FA : I can share many of the above sentiments. However, I would caution anyone from interpreting my comments as being willing to work for free or not offer
45 Post contains images 727LOVER : Some airport ops people as well !
46 SkyCub : Oh please.... it doesn't just stop with passengers and ground ops personnel! I recently worked a flight with a fellow flight attendant who had just n
47 Post contains images yowza : I'm pretty sure it's a guy, not a woman. Way to not pigeon hole the job. As others have shown it is possible if not common. The reality is that if th
48 futureualpilot : SkyCub, thanks for a well thou out and rational response. I respect your points of views and I do understand your point. It seems your views are more
49 B727FA : As we say in the South, "O, law-Chile, NO!" I volunteer for a cause; I work for a living! Thank you for your continued conversation and explaining yo
50 SkyCub : Thank you, futureualpilot, I do appreciate that. I do. Let me give you additional insight.... Yes, I did work in the late 90s/early 2000s as a flight
51 ASFlyer : Very well spoken. I've read SkyCub and B727FA's responses, so I'm a little late to the game, but I really appreciate what you've written here. I love
52 SuperCaravelle : Let me weigh in shortly as a non-US expert, but I'm sure the same problems exist on this side of the point (or will start to) in some way or another.
53 Post contains images ASFlyer : SkyCub, with all due respect, I'm not attacking you. I just disagree with some of what you say. Not all of what you say. I think we are both on the sa
54 COalways : Was on a Continental flight and was chatting it up with a Flight Att about the show the other day and she said yes she had to deal with alot on the ai
55 zippyjet : Caught the show at home online. Liked the female flight attendant. At least the show ended on an upnote with the romantic angle. I wish a show like 20
56 ASFlyer : Unless she's amongst the most senior FA's, she's actually at work for probably 350+ hours a month in order to get that 150 hours of flying in. That 1
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