Sponsor Message:
Civil Aviation Forum
My Starred Topics | Profile | New Topic | Forum Index | Help | Search 
OAG Changes 4/27/2012: AM/DL/US/Y4  
User currently offlineenilria From Canada, joined Feb 2008, 7036 posts, RR: 13
Posted (2 years 3 months 2 days 2 hours ago) and read 6207 times:

INSTRUCTIONS

WHAT IS THIS REPORT?
This compares what is for sale THIS WEEK for the stated period versus what was for sale LAST WEEK...It does NOT compare to last year or now (UNLESS OTHERWISE STATED).

HOW DO I READ IT?
XXX-YYY DEC 4>5 JAN 4>5 ; means that the listed airline changed the frequency between the two airports to add from 4 to 5 roundtrips in December and January. No other months were changed. I only list one direction, although it is possible the listed change is only one way. It is too difficult to average the two directions. I assume the change is roundtrip and that is most often the case.

HOW ARE THE DAILY DEPARTURES CALCULATED?
This report uses total operations for the month listed, divided over the days in the month.

WHAT ARE THE FRACTIONAL FLIGHTS?
Non-daily operations create fractional weekly service. In most cases flights are rounded, but in the case of international service or markets with low frequency, fractions are shown. If a flight operated 5 days out of 7, it would show 0.8 flights.

WHY ARE THERE WEIRD FREQUENCIES IN FAR AWAY MONTHS FOR LCCs?
Most airlines publish schedules 11 months in advance. This report covers the next 9 months. That avoids seeing schedules as they are loaded. Several LCCs load their schedules less than 9 months into the future. Their schedules may also end mid-month. If B6 loads their schedule until Jan15, all flights in Janaury will show half frequency because of the way the report is created.

WHY IS A WHOLE AIRLINE'S SCHEDULE SHOWN AS CHANGING FOR A FUTURE MONTH?
Similarly to the previous question, some airlines load their schedule from nothing inside the 9 month window of this report. When their schedule is extended it will show as new service because there was no previous schedule to compare to. In some instances I will show a more valid comparison against another period.

THOSE FLIGHTS AREN'T DELTA, THEY ARE PINNACLE
This report only shows the marketing code. It is too complicated to show all the operators.

THE FREQUENCIES MAY HAVE CHANGED AS YOU SHOW, BUT THE SEATS DIDNT CHANGE BECAUSE OF EQUIPMENT SWAPS
That is a natural weakness of a frequency based report, but it provides something to discuss below.

THE FREQUENCY DOESN'T SHOW A CHANGE, E.G. 4>4
This happens as a result of rounding. There is a change in service that is large enough to be listed, but through rounding it does not appear.

I marked some of the ones I thought were interesting with an "*".


NOTE: There is a planned database outage next week, so if I do an update next week it will not occur until Sunday or so.

7I CLT-CUR MAY 0.3>0.1 JUN 0.3>0.2 JUL 0.3>0.1 AUG 0.3>0.1 SEP 0.3>0.2 OCT 0.3>0.1 NOV 0.3>0.1 DEC 0.3>0.2
7I SJU-CUR JUN 0>0.1 JUL 0>0.2

9K ACK-MVY JUL 1.7>3 AUG 1.7>3
9K AUG-BOS JUN 4>0
9K SJU-STX MAY 6>5 JUN 5>4 JUL 5>4 AUG 5>4 SEP 5>4 OCT 5>4 NOV 5>4
9K SJU-VQS JUN 7>8 JUL 7>8 AUG 7>8 SEP 7>8 OCT 7>8 NOV 7>8 DEC 8>9
*9K STT-EIS MAY 0>0.8 JUN 0>1.0 JUL 0>1.0 AUG 0>1.0 SEP 0>1.0 OCT 0>1.0 NOV 0>1.0 DEC 0>0.5
9K STX-SJU MAY 6>5 JUN 5>4 JUL 5>4 AUG 5>4 SEP 5>4 OCT 5>4 NOV 5>4 DEC 7>6

AC DEN-YUL MAY 1.0>0.8

AM LAS-MTY JUL 0.6>0.4 AUG 0.6>0.5
AM LAX-GDL AUG 3>2
AM MCO-MEX AUG 1.8>3
*AM MIA-CUN MAY 0>0.3 JUN 0>0.3 JUL 0>0.5 AUG 0>0.6
AM ONT-GDL AUG 0.8>1.0
AM ORD-MEX JUL 2>1.6
AM ORD-MTY AUG 0.4>0.5
AM SAT-MTY JUL 0.6>0.9 AUG 0.6>0.8
AM SMF-GDL AUG 0.8>1.0

AZ JFK-FCO AUG 1.8>2 SEP 1.9>2
AZ JFK-MXP AUG 0.7>1.0 SEP 0.7>1.0

BR GUM-TPE JUN 0.3>0.4 JUL 0.3>0.8 AUG 0.3>0.7 SEP 0.3>0.5 OCT 0.3>0.4

CA LAX-PEK JUN 2>1.8 NOV 2>1.6 DEC 2>1.6

DL ATL-BMI SEP 4>3 OCT 4>3 NOV 4>3 DEC 4>3
DL ATL-BTR SEP 9>8 OCT 9>8 NOV 9>8
DL ATL-CAE SEP 9>8 OCT 9>8 NOV 9>8
DL ATL-ILM SEP 7>6 OCT 7>6 NOV 7>6
DL ATL-JAN SEP 8>7 OCT 8>7 NOV 8>7
DL ATL-LIT SEP 8>7 OCT 8>7 NOV 8>7
DL ATL-SDF AUG 10>9 SEP 9>8 OCT 9>8 NOV 8>7
Think F9 will try this? LOL
*DL COS-MSP AUG 1.0>0.4 SEP 1.0>0 OCT 1.0>0 NOV 1.0>0 DEC 1.0>0
DL CVG-SAN AUG 0.9>0.4
DL DTW-AVL AUG 1.9>1.4
DL DTW-CMH SEP 7>8 OCT 7>8 NOV 7>8
DL DTW-MBS OCT 7>6 NOV 7>6 DEC 6>5
DL DTW-OKC SEP 3>1.8 OCT 3>1.9 NOV 3>1.9
DL JFK-BOS JUL 6>5 AUG 6>5
Wow, a lot more freq than last Winter
*DL LAX-SFO SEP 11>12 OCT 11>12 NOV 11>12 DEC 7>8
DL LGA-CHS JUL 3>4 SEP 3>4 OCT 3>4 NOV 3>4 DEC 3>4
DL LGA-JAX JUL 4>3 AUG 4>3 SEP 4>3 OCT 4>3 NOV 4>3 DEC 4>3
DL MBS-MSP AUG 1.6>1.0
Finally, glad to see this back.
*DL MEM-JFK SEP 0>0.9 OCT 0>1.0 NOV 0>1.0 DEC 0>1.0
DL MEM-MSP SEP 3>4 OCT 3>4 NOV 3>4 DEC 3>4
*DL MEM-PNS AUG 1.0>0.4 SEP 1.0>0 OCT 1.0>0 NOV 0.9>0 DEC 1.0>0
DL MEM-SEA AUG 0.9>0.4
DL MEM-SHV SEP 3>1.9 OCT 3>2 NOV 3>1.9 DEC 2>1.2
*DL MSP-SYR SEP 0>0.9 OCT 0>1.0 NOV 0>1.0 DEC 0>1.0
DL MSP-YWG SEP 6>5 OCT 6>5 NOV 6>5
DL SLC-FAR AUG 1.9>1.4
DL SLC-OAK SEP 5>4 OCT 5>4 NOV 5>4

EC EWR-ORY NOV 2>1.8 DEC 2>1.7

Last week they deleted HOU
*F9 DEN-IAH JUL 0>1.3 AUG 0>1.9 SEP 0>1.7 OCT 0>1.9 NOV 0>0.9

K5 BNA-MKL SEP 0>1.7 OCT 0>1.7 NOV 0>1.7 DEC 0>1.7
K5 DAL-ELD SEP 0>1.7 OCT 0>1.7 NOV 0>1.7 DEC 0>1.7
K5 DAL-HOT SEP 0>0.8 OCT 0>0.9 NOV 0>0.9 DEC 0>0.8
K5 EAT-YKM SEP 0>3 OCT 0>3 NOV 0>3 DEC 0>3
K5 ELD-HOT SEP 0>0.8 OCT 0>0.9 NOV 0>0.9 DEC 0>0.8
K5 ELD-MEM SEP 0>0.8 OCT 0>0.9 NOV 0>0.9 DEC 0>0.8
K5 HOT-MEM SEP 0>0.8 OCT 0>0.9 NOV 0>0.9 DEC 0>0.8
K5 HRO-MCI SEP 0>1.7 OCT 0>1.7 NOV 0>1.7 DEC 0>1.7
K5 HRO-MEM SEP 0>1.7 OCT 0>1.7 NOV 0>1.7 DEC 0>1.7
K5 MCI-SLN SEP 0>3 OCT 0>3 NOV 0>3 DEC 0>3
K5 MEM-MKL SEP 0>1.7 OCT 0>1.7 NOV 0>1.7 DEC 0>1.7
K5 OTH-PDX SEP 1.6>3 OCT 0.0>4 NOV 0>4 DEC 0>3
K5 PDT-PDX SEP 0>3 OCT 0>4 NOV 0>4 DEC 0>4
K5 PDX-YKM SEP 0>3 OCT 0>3 NOV 0>3 DEC 0>3

KS BHB-BOS JUN 2>3 JUL 2>4 AUG 2>4 SEP 2>4 OCT 2>0.9 NOV 2>0 DEC 2>0
KS BOS-PBG JUN 0>1.4 JUL 0>1.7 AUG 0>1.7 SEP 0>1.7 OCT 0>3 NOV 0>3 DEC 0>3

KS BOS-PQI JUN 0>1.5 JUL 0>3 AUG 0>3 SEP 0>3 OCT 0>3 NOV 0>3 DEC 0>3

LA SFO-LIM NOV 0.9>0.7

NH HNL-HND OCT 0.8>1.0 NOV 0>1.0 DEC 0>1.0

*NK DFW-PDX JUL 0>1.0 AUG 0>1.0 SEP 0>1.0 OCT 0>1.0
NK FLL-PTY JUN 0.7>0.8
NK IAG-MYR JUN 0.3>0.1

SU MIA-SVO NOV 0>0.4 DEC 0>0.4

TA ORD-SAL JUN 0.3>0.2 JUL 0.3>0 AUG 0.3>0 SEP 0.3>0 OCT 0.3>0 NOV 0.3>0 DEC 0.3>0

*TJ ACK-HPN MAY 0.9>0 JUN 0.9>0 JUL 1.1>0 AUG 0.9>0 SEP 1.0>0 OCT 1.0>0 NOV 0.9>0 DEC 1.1>0
*TJ ACK-TEB MAY 0.8>0 JUN 0.8>0 JUL 1.0>0 AUG 0.8>0 SEP 0.9>0 OCT 0.9>0 NOV 0.8>0 DEC 1.0>0
TJ SJU-SBH MAY 5>3 JUN 1.7>1.4 OCT 0>1.6 NOV 0>3 DEC 0>3
TJ STT-SBH MAY 0.1>0

UA DEN-BIL SEP 5>6 OCT 5>6
UA DEN-BZN SEP 4>5
UA DEN-DFW SEP 6>5 OCT 6>5
UA DEN-ELP SEP 3>4 OCT 3>4
UA DEN-EUG SEP 2>3
UA DEN-FLL AUG 0.9>0.4
UA DEN-FSD SEP 5>4
UA DEN-HDN SEP 2>3
UA DEN-MSO SEP 4>5
UA DEN-RAP SEP 7>8
UA DEN-SBA SEP 2>3
UA DEN-SJD OCT 0.1>0.3
UA DEN-TUS SEP 5>3
UA EWR-ALB OCT 4>5
UA EWR-AUA OCT 1.0>1.1
UA EWR-AVL OCT 1.8>1.0
UA EWR-BTV OCT 3>4
UA EWR-BUF OCT 6>7
UA EWR-CHS OCT 3>4
UA EWR-CVG OCT 4>6
UA EWR-DAY OCT 3>4
UA EWR-GRR OCT 1.7>3
UA EWR-GSP OCT 1.9>3
UA EWR-IND OCT 6>7
UA EWR-SEA OCT 5>3 NOV 5>3 DEC 5>4
UA FLL-FPO MAY 4>5 JUN 4>5 JUL 4>5 AUG 4>5 SEP 4>5 OCT 4>5 NOV 4>5 DEC 4>5
*UA FLL-TPA JUN 1.0>0 JUL 1.0>0 AUG 1.0>0 SEP 1.0>0 OCT 1.0>0 NOV 1.0>0 DEC 1.0>0
UA IAH-DGO OCT 0.1>0.3
UA IAH-GCM OCT 0.1>0.3
UA IAH-SJD OCT 1.7>2.0
UA LAX-OKC OCT 1.8>1.0 NOV 1.9>1.0 DEC 1.8>1.0
Another gift to VX
*UA LAX-PHL OCT 0.9>0.0 NOV 1.0>0.1 DEC 1.0>0.4
UA ORD-BZN SEP 1.0>2
UA ORD-FSD SEP 5>4
UA ORD-SJD OCT 0>0.1
UA TLH-TPA MAY 4>3

UP MIA-NAS OCT 4>3 NOV 4>3 DEC 4>3

US CLT-MBJ AUG 4>3
US PHX-CUN SEP 0.7>0.8

*V2 GPT-PIE JUN 0>0.7 JUL 0>0.7 AUG 0>0.7 SEP 0>0.7 OCT 0>0.7 NOV 0>0.7 DEC 0>0.7

VX SAN-SFO DEC 4>5
VX SFO-PVR SEP 0.6>0.5 OCT 0.5>0.4

Y4 LAS-GDL JUL 1.0>1.6 AUG 1.0>1.1 SEP 1.0>1.1 OCT 1.0>1.2 NOV 1.0>1.1 DEC 1.0>1.1
Y4 LAS-MEX JUL 1.1>2 AUG 1.2>2 SEP 1.1>2 OCT 1.1>2 NOV 1.2>2 DEC 1.1>2
Y4 LAX-GDL JUL 2>3 AUG 2>3 SEP 2>3 OCT 2>3 NOV 2>3 DEC 2>3
Y4 LAX-MEX JUL 0.4>1.0 AUG 0.5>1.0 SEP 0.4>1.0 OCT 0.4>1.0 NOV 0.5>1.0 DEC 0.4>1.0
Y4 LAX-ZCL JUL 0.5>0.6 AUG 0.4>0.5 SEP 0.4>0.6 OCT 0.4>0.6 NOV 0.4>0.6 DEC 0.5>0.6
Y4 MDW-MEX JUL 0.5>1.0 AUG 0.6>1.0 SEP 0.6>1.0 OCT 0.5>1.0 NOV 0.6>1.0 DEC 0.6>1.0
Y4 MDW-MLM JUL 0.4>0.7 AUG 0.5>0.7 SEP 0.4>0.7 OCT 0.4>0.7 NOV 0.5>0.7 DEC 0.4>0.7
Y4 MDW-ZCL JUL 0.1>0.3 AUG 0.1>0.3 SEP 0.2>0.3 OCT 0.1>0.3 NOV 0.1>0.3 DEC 0.2>0.3
Y4 OAK-GDL JUL 1.0>1.4 AUG 1.0>1.6 SEP 1.0>1.5 OCT 1.0>1.6 NOV 1.0>1.6 DEC 1.0>1.5
*Y4 OAK-MEX JUL 0>0.5 AUG 0>0.5 SEP 0>0.6 OCT 0>0.5 NOV 0>0.6 DEC 0>0.6
Y4 SAN-GDL JUN 0.3>0.2 JUL 0.3>0.5 AUG 0.3>0.6 SEP 0.3>0.6 OCT 0.3>0.5 NOV 0.3>0.6 DEC 0.3>0.6
Y4 SAN-MEX JUL 0.4>1.0 AUG 0.4>1.0 SEP 0.4>1.0 OCT 0.4>1.0 NOV 0.4>1.0 DEC 0.5>1.0
Y4 SJC-GDL JUL 1.0>1.3 AUG 1.0>1.3 SEP 1.0>1.3 OCT 1.0>1.3 NOV 1.0>1.3 DEC 1.0>1.3

31 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineBoeingGuy From United States of America, joined Dec 2010, 2983 posts, RR: 7
Reply 1, posted (2 years 3 months 2 days 2 hours ago) and read 6073 times:

Quoting enilria (Thread starter):
DL MEM-SEA AUG 0.9>0.4

I thought DL canned MEM-SEA. Is it coming back for the Summer season, less than daily?

On another note, I think DL is down to one-daily each SJC-ATL and SJC-MSP. I remember when NW had two daily A320s SJC-MSP and DL had three-daily SJC-ATL fligths.


User currently offlineLAXdude1023 From India, joined Sep 2006, 7497 posts, RR: 24
Reply 2, posted (2 years 3 months 2 days 2 hours ago) and read 6059 times:

Is TA leaving ORD? Looks like it for at least the season.


Stewed...Lewd...Crude...Irreverent...Belligerent
User currently offlinePSU.DTW.SCE From United States of America, joined Jan 2002, 7521 posts, RR: 28
Reply 3, posted (2 years 3 months 2 days 2 hours ago) and read 6035 times:

Quoting enilria (Thread starter):
DL LGA-JAX JUL 4>3 AUG 4>3 SEP 4>3 OCT 4>3 NOV 4>3 DEC 4>3

DL is upgaging this route in July to all-mainline.

Currently LGA-JAX is a mix of CR7 & E70 equipment. June is goes to 2x 319, 1x E70, Then in July onward it goes 3x 319.

DL is starting to upgage certain LGA flights now they they are gaining some traction post-merger. PWM, BUF, and RDU all see at least 1 A319 flight per day starting this summer. Granted BOS-LGA is switching from A319 to E75.

Quoting enilria (Thread starter):
*DL MEM-JFK SEP 0>0.9 OCT 0>1.0 NOV 0>1.0 DEC 0>1.0

This coincides with the suspension of the MEM-AMS flight to open up the JFK TATL flights to MEM connections as a replacement to the AMS connections. Of course there is still plenty of connections over DTW & ATL.

Quoting enilria (Thread starter):
DL MEM-MSP SEP 3>4 OCT 3>4 NOV 3>4 DEC 3>4

I think the comment was made a few weeks ago that it was shocking to see MEM-MSP drop to 3x per day, granted that looks like that could've been a mistake or oversite at the time.


User currently offlinenkops From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 2660 posts, RR: 6
Reply 4, posted (2 years 3 months 2 days 2 hours ago) and read 6032 times:

Quoting enilria (Thread starter):
*TJ

Who is TJ again??

Quoting enilria (Thread starter):
NK IAG-MYR JUN 0.3>0.1

I believe this is from the runway closure in IAG first half of June.



I have no association with Spirit Airlines
User currently offlinelegacyins From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 2054 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (2 years 3 months 2 days 1 hour ago) and read 5995 times:

LA SFO-LIM NOV 0.9>0.7


Just to understand, is LA going to be offering 6 flights per week in November?



John@SFO
User currently offlinePSU.DTW.SCE From United States of America, joined Jan 2002, 7521 posts, RR: 28
Reply 6, posted (2 years 3 months 2 days 1 hour ago) and read 5986 times:

Quoting BoeingGuy (Reply 1):

I thought DL canned MEM-SEA. Is it coming back for the Summer season, less than daily?

On another note, I think DL is down to one-daily each SJC-ATL and SJC-MSP. I remember when NW had two daily A320s SJC-MSP and DL had three-daily SJC-ATL fligths.

MEM-SEA comes back daily for the summer season, operating as a red-eye 6/7 - 8/15. They just adjusted up the termination to be mid-August now.

SJC-ATL is 1x daily 757
SJC-MSP is 2x daily MD-90, I think it was reduced to 1x for the winter though.


User currently offlineenilria From Canada, joined Feb 2008, 7036 posts, RR: 13
Reply 7, posted (2 years 3 months 2 days 1 hour ago) and read 5896 times:

Quoting BoeingGuy (Reply 1):
I thought DL canned MEM-SEA. Is it coming back for the Summer season, less than daily?

It was answered below. The only month where it operates every day is July.
Quoting PSU.DTW.SCE (Reply 3):
Quoting enilria (Thread starter):
DL MEM-MSP SEP 3>4 OCT 3>4 NOV 3>4 DEC 3>4

I think the comment was made a few weeks ago that it was shocking to see MEM-MSP drop to 3x per day, granted that looks like that could've been a mistake or oversite at the time.

I was going to make that comment, but didn't. It seemed too thin if you are pulling MEM spokes.

Quoting legacyins (Reply 5):
LA SFO-LIM NOV 0.9>0.7

Just to understand, is LA going to be offering 6 flights per week in November?

I believe is 5/week, but it's a monthly average so who knows the by week details.

Quoting nkops (Reply 4):
Who is TJ again??

JCSI
Jet Charter Service Inc
That's what google tells me.


User currently offlineLAXintl From United States of America, joined May 2000, 24834 posts, RR: 46
Reply 8, posted (2 years 3 months 2 days 1 hour ago) and read 5870 times:

Quoting enilria (Thread starter):
Another gift to VX
*UA LAX-PHL OCT 0.9>0.0 NOV 1.0>0.1 DEC 1.0>0.4

The route for 2-years now is seasonal.
Remember customers have the option of all partner US nonstop flights as well.



From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
User currently offlineBoeingGuy From United States of America, joined Dec 2010, 2983 posts, RR: 7
Reply 9, posted (2 years 3 months 2 days 1 hour ago) and read 5816 times:

Quoting PSU.DTW.SCE (Reply 6):
MEM-SEA comes back daily for the summer season, operating as a red-eye 6/7 - 8/15. They just adjusted up the termination to be mid-August now.

Is that permanently terminated, or just for the season? Will it come back summer of 2013?

Quoting PSU.DTW.SCE (Reply 6):
SJC-ATL is 1x daily 757

This one really bounces around on equipment. I thought it was just an A319 and has also been a 738 very recently. Too bad DL is down to only one SJC-ATL frequency. The remaining single eastbound flight is, or was, a red-eye.

Quoting PSU.DTW.SCE (Reply 6):
SJC-MSP is 2x daily MD-90, I think it was reduced to 1x for the winter though.

I had heard that that SJC did very well for NW on the two MSP flights. Is that still correct? Obviously DL is still keeping the route, but I had heard SJC-MSP performed very well.


User currently offlineMLI717fan From United States of America, joined Oct 2006, 247 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (2 years 3 months 2 days 1 hour ago) and read 5816 times:

Quoting enilria (Thread starter):

DL ATL-BMI SEP 4>3 OCT 4>3 NOV 4>3 DEC 4>3

Ouch! BMI went from 3x 717 (FL) and 5xCR7 (DL) to 2x CR7 and 1x CRJ within just a few months. 676 daily seats down to 180. That'll leave BMI with just 3x ATL, 2x DTW, and 1x MSP this winter on DL.

Quoting enilria (Thread starter):
*DL MEM-PNS AUG 1.0>0.4 SEP 1.0>0 OCT 1.0>0 NOV 0.9>0 DEC 1.0>0

Another spoke... gone.

Quoting enilria (Thread starter):

A number of additional DEN frequencies... nice to see.


User currently offlineFlyPNS1 From United States of America, joined Nov 1999, 6578 posts, RR: 24
Reply 11, posted (2 years 3 months 2 days 1 hour ago) and read 5728 times:

Quoting MLI717fan (Reply 10):
Ouch! BMI went from 3x 717 (FL) and 5xCR7 (DL) to 2x CR7 and 1x CRJ within just a few months. 676 daily seats down to 180. That'll leave BMI with just 3x ATL, 2x DTW, and 1x MSP this winter on DL.

You knew this would happen once FL left. DL's fares rise and the market shrinks.

Quoting MLI717fan (Reply 10):
Another spoke... gone.

No surprise...the hub slowly dies.


User currently offlineFlyPeoria From United States of America, joined Oct 2005, 430 posts, RR: 1
Reply 12, posted (2 years 3 months 2 days 1 hour ago) and read 5654 times:

Quoting FlyPNS1 (Reply 11):
Quoting MLI717fan (Reply 10):
Ouch! BMI went from 3x 717 (FL) and 5xCR7 (DL) to 2x CR7 and 1x CRJ within just a few months. 676 daily seats down to 180. That'll leave BMI with just 3x ATL, 2x DTW, and 1x MSP this winter on DL.


You knew this would happen once FL left. DL's fares rise and the market shrinks.

Yep...not to mention DL starting (er, resuming) 3X daily PIA-ATL on April 9. After FL's announcement, DL had no reason to put all of its ATL central Illinois flights into BMI.

Unless AA adds an ORD and/or DFW frequency and/or G4 and F9 increase service, BMI is going to have just 4 AA, 6 DL, 2-weekly G4 and 1-2 F9 to DEN or MCO depending on the day of the week.

Which begs the question, why is BMI replacing two of three jetways and adding three more to its terminal? This was announced recently. Either BMI believes it can attract another LCC, persuade WN to start BMI-BNA/BWI/DEN or has something else up its sleeves.


User currently offlineWA707atMSP From United States of America, joined Oct 2006, 2211 posts, RR: 8
Reply 13, posted (2 years 3 months 2 days 1 hour ago) and read 5602 times:

Quoting enilria (Thread starter):
*DL COS-MSP AUG 1.0>0.4 SEP 1.0>0 OCT 1.0>0 NOV 1.0>0 DEC 1.0>0

This cut seems strange. Does anyone know more about why the route is being dropped?



Seaholm Maples are #1!
User currently offlinePSU.DTW.SCE From United States of America, joined Jan 2002, 7521 posts, RR: 28
Reply 14, posted (2 years 3 months 2 days ago) and read 5543 times:

Quoting WA707atMSP (Reply 13):
This cut seems strange. Does anyone know more about why the route is being dropped?

My guess is that this route is no longer economical to operate with the bloodbath that is DEN. With the low fare and availability out of DEN, MSP-COS would need to be competive on price with MSP-DEN but also be competitive on connections and schedule out of DEN.


User currently offlineflyguy89 From United States of America, joined Feb 2009, 1899 posts, RR: 9
Reply 15, posted (2 years 3 months 2 days ago) and read 5450 times:

Quoting enilria (Thread starter):
DL CVG-SAN AUG 0.9>0.4

Interesting that they operated the route seasonally last year, but have so far kept it year-round this year.


User currently offlineNWBOS From United States of America, joined Aug 2005, 157 posts, RR: 2
Reply 16, posted (2 years 3 months 2 days ago) and read 5431 times:

Quoting PSU.DTW.SCE (Reply 3):
Granted BOS-LGA is switching from A319 to E75.

On a related note all BOS-JFK flights are being upguaged from all DCI to all mainline service beginning June 11. A huge boost in capacity. Hopefully the yields will support it.


User currently offlinePSU.DTW.SCE From United States of America, joined Jan 2002, 7521 posts, RR: 28
Reply 17, posted (2 years 3 months 2 days ago) and read 5412 times:

Quoting flyguy89 (Reply 15):
Quoting enilria (Thread starter):
DL CVG-SAN AUG 0.9>0.4

Interesting that they operated the route seasonally last year, but have so far kept it year-round this year.

It ends for the season on 8/13. Operates daily and then ends, like last year.


User currently offlineflyguy89 From United States of America, joined Feb 2009, 1899 posts, RR: 9
Reply 18, posted (2 years 3 months 2 days ago) and read 5377 times:

Quoting PSU.DTW.SCE (Reply 17):
Quoting flyguy89 (Reply 15):
Quoting enilria (Thread starter):
DL CVG-SAN AUG 0.9>0.4

Interesting that they operated the route seasonally last year, but have so far kept it year-round this year.

It ends for the season on 8/13. Operates daily and then ends, like last year.

Well they must have switched the cut-off dates then because last year it was suspended ~JAN-APR but has been operating every month since then to the present.


User currently offlineMLI717fan From United States of America, joined Oct 2006, 247 posts, RR: 0
Reply 19, posted (2 years 3 months 2 days ago) and read 5291 times:

Quoting FlyPNS1 (Reply 11):
You knew this would happen once FL left. DL's fares rise and the market shrinks.

Oh, I know I've watched it happen at home as DL cut MLI-MEM completely and sliced out an MLI-ATL frequency. We're down about 20% since FL's cancellation of the MLI-ATL flights. It looks like it's going to be really bloody at BMI though. Frontier and Allegiant stepping in do little to replace the BMI-Southeast flying that FL walked away from.

Quoting FlyPeoria (Reply 12):
Yep...not to mention DL starting (er, resuming) 3X daily PIA-ATL on April 9. After FL's announcement, DL had no reason to put all of its ATL central Illinois flights into BMI.

Unless AA adds an ORD and/or DFW frequency and/or G4 and F9 increase service, BMI is going to have just 4 AA, 6 DL, 2-weekly G4 and 1-2 F9 to DEN or MCO depending on the day of the week.

Which begs the question, why is BMI replacing two of three jetways and adding three more to its terminal? This was announced recently. Either BMI believes it can attract another LCC, persuade WN to start BMI-BNA/BWI/DEN or has something else up its sleeves.

I've wondered that myself, it seems like a massive waste of money... However, this is Illinois we are talking about, it really shouldn't be a surprise to anyone.


User currently offlineenilria From Canada, joined Feb 2008, 7036 posts, RR: 13
Reply 20, posted (2 years 3 months 2 days ago) and read 5274 times:

Quoting LAXintl (Reply 8):
The route for 2-years now is seasonal.

It's still well timed to help VX. They could have stayed and pressured VX.

Quoting BoeingGuy (Reply 9):
Quoting PSU.DTW.SCE (Reply 6):
MEM-SEA comes back daily for the summer season, operating as a red-eye 6/7 - 8/15. They just adjusted up the termination to be mid-August now.

Is that permanently terminated, or just for the season? Will it come back summer of 2013?

Who knows, but I'd bet it's less than 50% that MEM will have a "hub" next Summer.

Quoting FlyPNS1 (Reply 11):
Quoting MLI717fan (Reply 10):
Ouch! BMI went from 3x 717 (FL) and 5xCR7 (DL) to 2x CR7 and 1x CRJ within just a few months. 676 daily seats down to 180. That'll leave BMI with just 3x ATL, 2x DTW, and 1x MSP this winter on DL.

You knew this would happen once FL left. DL's fares rise and the market shrinks.

This is why LCC mergers are a bad idea. Less competition is clearly very bad for demand/customer options/fares.

Quoting FlyPNS1 (Reply 11):
Quoting MLI717fan (Reply 10):
Another spoke... gone.

No surprise...the hub slowly dies.

Agreed...maybe not that slowly...

Quoting DTW.SCE" class="quote" target="_blank">PSU.DTW.SCE (Reply 14):
Quoting WA707atMSP (Reply 13):
This cut seems strange. Does anyone know more about why the route is being dropped?

My guess is that this route is no longer economical to operate with the bloodbath that is DEN.

So, do we think F9 adds it from their new focus city in COS? I predict DL returns if they do.


User currently offlinegreggariouspdx From United States of America, joined Jan 2012, 61 posts, RR: 0
Reply 21, posted (2 years 3 months 1 day 23 hours ago) and read 5112 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

*NK DFW-PDX JUL 0>1.0 AUG 0>1.0 SEP 0>1.0 OCT 0>1.0

I am glad to see some competition on this route that AA has owned since 2005. I fly this route often and the tired Mad Dogs are always packed. But Spirit's flights are red-eyes both ways and they have a limited operation in PDX so I suspect little or no impact in the market.


User currently offlinePHX787 From Japan, joined Mar 2012, 7204 posts, RR: 17
Reply 22, posted (2 years 3 months 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 4888 times:

Sorry, at the risk of sounding ignorant, what is the airline that flies under 7I ??

Quoting enilria (Thread starter):
*DL LAX-SFO SEP 11>12 OCT 11>12 NOV 11>12 DEC 7>8

What equipment is flown on this route? looks quite excessive to me.

Quoting enilria (Thread starter):
NH HNL-HND OCT 0.8>1.0 NOV 0>1.0 DEC 0>1.0

Nice to see this going daily.

Quoting flyguy89 (Reply 18):
Quoting PSU.DTW.SCE (Reply 17):
Quoting flyguy89 (Reply 15):
Quoting enilria (Thread starter):
DL CVG-SAN AUG 0.9>0.4

Interesting that they operated the route seasonally last year, but have so far kept it year-round this year.

It ends for the season on 8/13. Operates daily and then ends, like last year.

Well they must have switched the cut-off dates then because last year it was suspended ~JAN-APR but has been operating every month since then to the present.

There's a lot of demand in the 'Nati for this route as well, IIRC



One of the FB admins for PHX Spotters. "Zach the Expat!"
User currently onlineck8msp From United States of America, joined Oct 2010, 72 posts, RR: 0
Reply 23, posted (2 years 3 months 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 4840 times:

Quoting WA707atMSP (Reply 13):
Quoting enilria (Thread starter):
*DL COS-MSP AUG 1.0>0.4 SEP 1.0>0 OCT 1.0>0 NOV 1.0>0 DEC 1.0>0

This cut seems strange. Does anyone know more about why the route is being dropped?

This would be my question as well. Just flew this route 2 weeks ago and fly often. Have been bumped before and trucked down to DIA because they only have the 6:05 departure. What kind ouf routing will I have to deal with in the future? MSP-SLC-COS? All the way to ATL?


User currently offlineSANFan From United States of America, joined Aug 2006, 5353 posts, RR: 15
Reply 24, posted (2 years 3 months 1 day 21 hours ago) and read 4778 times:

Quoting enilria (Thread starter):
DL CVG-SAN AUG 0.9>0.4
Quoting flyguy89 (Reply 15):
Interesting that they operated the route seasonally last year, but have so far kept it year-round this year.
Quoting PSU.DTW.SCE (Reply 17):
It ends for the season on 8/13. Operates daily and then ends, like last year.
Quoting flyguy89 (Reply 18):
Well they must have switched the cut-off dates then because last year it was suspended ~JAN-APR but has been operating every month since then to the present

This route is a bit of a head-scratcher. The average O&D PDEW for the last year of available DOT stats is 75-80 so there's got to be still be some connecting traffic being carried on the flights, or something... We just never know if the flight is staying or not...

Quoting enilria (Thread starter):
VX SAN-SFO DEC 4>5

Looks like maybe SAN will remain at 5 flights/day (more or less) from now on. Glad to see our station has (apparently) performed well enough for Virgin to be back up to the frequency of flights that we started with 4 years ago!

bb


User currently offlineScottB From United States of America, joined Jul 2000, 6710 posts, RR: 32
Reply 25, posted (2 years 3 months 1 day 21 hours ago) and read 4694 times:

Quoting PHX787 (Reply 22):
what is the airline that flies under 7I ??

Insel Air


User currently offlineyellowtail From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 6044 posts, RR: 2
Reply 26, posted (2 years 3 months 1 day 20 hours ago) and read 4699 times:

Quoting SANFan (Reply 24):
This route is a bit of a head-scratcher. The average O&D PDEW for the last year of available DOT stats is 75-80 so there's got to be still be some connecting traffic being carried on the flights, or something... We just never know if the flight is staying or not...

yields must be just north of trashy



When in doubt, hold on to your altitude. No-one has ever collided with the sky.
User currently offlineBeechToBus From United States of America, joined Nov 2011, 298 posts, RR: 0
Reply 27, posted (2 years 3 months 1 day 20 hours ago) and read 4683 times:

looks like a slight net gain in DEN for UA, maybe 4 flights or so. Good to see.

User currently offlineCIDFlyer From United States of America, joined Apr 2005, 2272 posts, RR: 3
Reply 28, posted (2 years 3 months 1 day 20 hours ago) and read 4589 times:

Quoting MLI717fan (Reply 10):
Quoting enilria (Thread starter):*DL MEM-PNS AUG 1.0>0.4 SEP 1.0>0 OCT 1.0>0 NOV 0.9>0 DEC 1.0>0

sad to see this route go, I have flown in many times under back in the late 90's and early 00's...Im somewhat surprised a little, this was the only city DL was serving on the Gulf Coast between JAX and MSY (having already pulled TLH, ECP, VPS, MOB and GPT), and PNS is a very strong DL station, so I thought they were trying to consolidate most of those markets (especially ECP/VPS/MOB) through PNS since its also the busiest airport between JAX and MSY. But I suppose 1x CRJ through MEM makes no sense when you have 10x or so mainline between PNS and ATL, and ATL really isnt out of the way to capture midwest and westbound traffic from PNS. Still sad to see it go though, just another long time route gone from MEM. Hate to see what it will look like there in a year or so...I always liked going through there, just has a feel to it that you know your in the south and the smell of bbq adds appeal, not to mention its a breeze to connect through.


User currently offlineFlyPNS1 From United States of America, joined Nov 1999, 6578 posts, RR: 24
Reply 29, posted (2 years 3 months 1 day 19 hours ago) and read 4544 times:

Quoting enilria (Reply 20):
This is why LCC mergers are a bad idea. Less competition is clearly very bad for demand/customer options/fares.

Why is this true of only LCC mergers? Couldn't the same be said of legacy mergers too. DL merged with NW and is now shutting down NW's MEM hub. Markets like PNS lose MEM as a connecting option and are forced through ATL. How is that any better? PNS will have fewer options and fewer seats because of the DL/NW merger.


User currently offlineMLI717fan From United States of America, joined Oct 2006, 247 posts, RR: 0
Reply 30, posted (2 years 3 months 1 day 4 hours ago) and read 2738 times:

Quoting CIDFlyer (Reply 28):
I always liked going through there, just has a feel to it that you know your in the south and the smell of bbq adds appeal, not to mention its a breeze to connect through.

I've flown MLI-MEM-MSY several times and always enjoyed the connection in MEM. I'm not a huge BBQ fan, so the food at MEM left something to be desired, but I liked the airport. It was kind of funky/dated in a cool way, and it made for a really easy connection. I used to go out of my way to schedule my flights through there.

Quoting CIDFlyer (Reply 28):
Hate to see what it will look like there in a year or so

No kidding. I checked the other day, and I was kind of surprised to see that one of the DSM-MEM flights is still a CR9, I was half expecting to see it at 2x CRJ. Either way, it's already a shell of what it used to be.


User currently offlinelaca773 From United States of America, joined Nov 2004, 4002 posts, RR: 2
Reply 31, posted (2 years 3 months 1 day 2 hours ago) and read 2461 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

Quoting BoeingGuy (Reply 9):
This one really bounces around on equipment. I thought it was just an A319 and has also been a 738 very recently. Too bad DL is down to only one SJC-ATL frequency. The remaining single eastbound flight is, or was, a red-eye.

This route has stayed at one daily rotation for quite sometime now. It has been upgauged during the Summer season to a 757 then back down to a 738.

I'm glad SJC-MSP has been working well for DL. It's a nice option for those who need to get to the midwest or connect via MSP when the other choice, ORD has been scaled back markedly. Perhaps one day we'll see DL add an additional frequency.


Top Of Page
Forum Index

This topic is archived and can not be replied to any more.

Printer friendly format

Similar topics:More similar topics...
OAG Changes 3/16/2012: AA/DL/US posted Wed Mar 14 2012 10:28:41 by enilria
OAG Changes 3/30/2012: AA/DL/F9/UA/US posted Tue Mar 27 2012 09:58:59 by enilria
OAG Changes 3/23/2012: AA/DL/FL/NK/US/ZK posted Wed Mar 21 2012 14:59:46 by enilria
OAG Changes 2/10/2012: AM/CO/DL/FL/UA posted Thu Feb 9 2012 06:20:30 by enilria
OAG Changes 1/27/2011: AM/FL/HA/Y4 posted Wed Jan 25 2012 09:23:14 by enilria
OAG Changes 1/12/2012: F9/UA/US posted Tue Jan 10 2012 10:31:02 by enilria
OAG Changes 2/24/2012: AA/CO/DL/FL/F9/UA/US posted Tue Feb 21 2012 12:25:46 by enilria
OAG Changes 2/17/2012: AA/CO/DL/F9/UA/US posted Tue Feb 14 2012 10:49:54 by enilria
OAG Changes 6/4/2010: AA/AM/CO/DL/FL/UA/US/VX posted Wed Jun 2 2010 12:06:05 by enilria
OAG Changes 3/26/2010: AM/AS/DL/FL/UA/US/VX posted Fri Mar 26 2010 12:50:40 by enilria