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Santa Monica(CA) Plans Closure Of Historic Airport  
User currently offlineLAXintl From United States of America, joined May 2000, 26014 posts, RR: 50
Posted (2 years 6 months 3 weeks 5 days 14 hours ago) and read 9898 times:

City leaders in Santa Monica have begun community workshops to present ideas for the future of Santa Monica Airport.

The historic airfield, and founding home of Douglas Aircraft has its lease agreement with the FAA expire in 2015.

While the city and FAA do retain an option of operating a smaller airport with shorter runway and fewer support services, about 2/3 of the airports land will revert to the city for other uses when FAA operating agreement expires.

In community forums, 84% of local residents either wanted the airport to be closed, or largely mitigated to remove the negative impacts on the community.

Much of the post airfield visioning ideas provide for largely green open areas of parks and gardens for the community.

The airports operation has become over more contentious in recent years as the volume of air traffic has shifted from a recreational GA airport, to one of the LA Basins most active corporate business jet airports with the added noise impacts.



Story:
http://la.curbed.com/archives/2012/0...rport.php#4f9f120685216d247201ae41

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From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
41 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlinenorthstardc4m From Canada, joined Apr 2000, 3056 posts, RR: 36
Reply 1, posted (2 years 6 months 3 weeks 5 days 14 hours ago) and read 9861 times:
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Only in California!



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User currently offlinePHXA340 From United States of America, joined Mar 2012, 896 posts, RR: 1
Reply 2, posted (2 years 6 months 3 weeks 5 days 13 hours ago) and read 9692 times:

Quoting LAXintl (Thread starter):
The airports operation has become over more contentious in recent years as the volume of air traffic has shifted from a recreational GA airport, to one of the LA Basins most active corporate business jet airports with the added noise impacts.

Santa Monica airport serves Brentwood, Beverly Hills, Malibu, Pacific Palisades, and pretty much the entire Westside that houses many of these business jet owners with lots of $$$ to make sure Santa Monica airport sticks around for a long time to come ... I predict a lot of nasty debating but in 2020 SM airport looks pretty much just like it does today.


User currently offlinelightsaber From United States of America, joined Jan 2005, 13430 posts, RR: 100
Reply 3, posted (2 years 6 months 3 weeks 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 9640 times:
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My first 'knee jerk' reaction was to rant. But VNY and Inglewood should have the capacity to absorb the Santa Monica traffic.

Question: Does BUR have the space to take the growth pushed from Santa Monica?

Quoting LAXintl (Thread starter):
The airports operation has become over more contentious in recent years as the volume of air traffic has shifted from a recreational GA airport, to one of the LA Basins most active corporate business jet airports with the added noise impacts.

Which means job and wealth creation.

Quoting northstardc4m (Reply 1):
Only in California!

Sigh...

Quoting PHXA340 (Reply 2):
I predict a lot of nasty debating but in 2020 SM airport looks pretty much just like it does today.

I have less faith. I swear the state would expect the traffic to go to Compton or Palmdale...

Lightsaber



Societies that achieve a critical mass of ideas achieve self sustaining growth; others stagnate.
User currently offlinen782nc From United States of America, joined Feb 2012, 73 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (2 years 6 months 3 weeks 5 days 11 hours ago) and read 9492 times:

Quoting northstardc4m (Reply 1):

With all respect, what's that supposed to mean?

Why should Santa Monica continue operating an airport if the costs of keeping it open cannot be justified? If the residents believe it's more beneficial to close the airport, that's their choice (It's not like the LA Basin couldn't use the extra greenery anyway). If SMO is ultimately closed, put a museum, keep the runway, etc. to preserve the historical significance of the area.

IMO, of course...



Stairway to Seven
User currently offlineDashTrash From United States of America, joined Aug 2006, 1550 posts, RR: 2
Reply 5, posted (2 years 6 months 3 weeks 5 days 11 hours ago) and read 9478 times:

I think all but a few in the area are on board with shutting that airport down. My money says it happens. Part of me hates to see it go. The other part of me remembers doing carrier landings on it, using max reverse, early level offs, re-routes, noise police, weight restrictions, second segment climb gradient nightmares when using 3 and shitloads of slow VFR traffic going in and out, 4 degree glidepaths, dirty looks from the neighbors, etc....

It's a great place for light piston aircraft and turboprops, but I wish they'd have been successful in kicking jets out. I hated flying in there. Right after they get done neutering SMO, they can drive the bulldozers down to CRQ.


User currently offlineLAXintl From United States of America, joined May 2000, 26014 posts, RR: 50
Reply 6, posted (2 years 6 months 3 weeks 5 days 11 hours ago) and read 9446 times:

Quoting PHXA340 (Reply 2):
I predict a lot of nasty debating but in 2020 SM airport looks pretty much just like it does today.

Might be nasty, but I'd say the city and community desire will prevail at the end.

For about 20-years now, successive City Councils have worked on various measures to limit airport operations, including putting ever more parcels of land to use for non aviation activities.

The airports location is what has made it a more contentious issue in this affluent part of town. Its almost like a Midway airport surrounded on all sides by residential or commercial activity.
Also the fact that there is the annual spate of one or two crashes which further makes airport activity not compatible to its surrounding community and its safety in the eyes of the city.
Even the FAA has raised concerns due to the short (4973 ft) runway and lack of overrun space.



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Quoting lightsaber (Reply 3):
My first 'knee jerk' reaction was to rant. But VNY and Inglewood should have the capacity to absorb the Santa Monica traffic.

Question: Does BUR have the space to take the growth pushed from Santa Monica?

LA basin has tons of runways. Certainly the FBOs at places like Van Nuys, Burbank, or others can handle the added activity, however those airports also are under the target hairs by their own communities as well so any added spill over activity wont be popular.

They can always come to LAX, however the fees are higher which is what drives much of the activity to these nearby community airports to begin with.



From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
User currently offlinePHXA340 From United States of America, joined Mar 2012, 896 posts, RR: 1
Reply 7, posted (2 years 6 months 3 weeks 5 days 11 hours ago) and read 9344 times:

Quoting LAXintl (Reply 6):
Might be nasty, but I'd say the city and community desire will prevail at the end.

Eventually, this will be settled by politics. Cash is king , especially in California. Try convincing a wealthy businessman to sit on the 405 during rush hour to travel to Van Nuys or Burbank to fly out of LA in leiu of SM. While I respect your opinion and for the hope of the surrounding community you are right, I am less optimistic.

Quoting LAXintl (Reply 6):
Its almost like a Midway airport surrounded on all sides by residential or commercial activity.

Yup and Midway isn't going anywhere. People have been trying to get rid of SM for years ... I just don't see it.


User currently offlineDiamondFlyer From United States of America, joined Oct 2008, 1595 posts, RR: 3
Reply 8, posted (2 years 6 months 3 weeks 5 days 10 hours ago) and read 9275 times:

Quoting LAXintl (Reply 6):
LA basin has tons of runways.

Not compared to what it had in the past.

This is a shame, there is no reason to close SMO totally. Want to shorten the runway to limit types of operations, fine. But to totally close it, is criminal, IMO. Imagine some other powerful lobby trying to close a section of the 405 because they didn't like the noise. It's the same issue, but no one in their right mind would close the 405.

-DiamondFlyer


User currently offlineAADC10 From United States of America, joined Nov 2004, 2102 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (2 years 6 months 3 weeks 5 days 10 hours ago) and read 9276 times:

Quoting LAXintl (Reply 6):
They can always come to LAX, however the fees are higher which is what drives much of the activity to these nearby community airports to begin with.

Just 3 miles east of LAX is Hawthore (HHR) which probably has lower fees than its neighbor. There is also Zamperini Field near Torrance, Compton and LGB. If Santa Monica closes, then there will be nothing between LAX and VNY but several GA fields will remain to the south.


User currently offlineLAXintl From United States of America, joined May 2000, 26014 posts, RR: 50
Reply 10, posted (2 years 6 months 3 weeks 5 days 9 hours ago) and read 9122 times:

Quoting PHXA340 (Reply 7):
Eventually, this will be settled by politics. Cash is king , especially in California. Try convincing a wealthy businessman to sit on the 405 during rush hour to travel to Van Nuys or Burbank to fly out of LA in leiu of SM. While I respect your opinion and for the hope of the surrounding community you are right, I am less optimistic.

Dont forget that the airport impacts maybe 100 wealthy persons for each 1 wealthy person that utilizes it.

Way more people suffer with the noise and air pollution the airport generates than those that benefit from its existence.
It came out not too long ago the airport was the number one pollutant on the Westside of LA.

So the community angst has continued to grow against the airport ever stronger year after year. Also the continued string of crashes also does not help the airport endear itself to the dense nearby neighborhood.

Quoting PHXA340 (Reply 7):
Yup and Midway isn't going anywhere. People have been trying to get rid of SM for years ... I just don't see it.

2015 presents a whole new opportunity for the city as 2/3 of the field reverts back from FAA lease.

Attempts to limit activity up to today were about things like noise, aircraft sizing, limiting business at the airport etc.

Post 2015 there still might be an airport if the FAA opts to utilize it, however its foot print, including runway length would be much smaller if Santa Monica carries out its stated plans. This would render the field worthless for many users, especially the jet traffic.

Quoting DiamondFlyer (Reply 8):
Not compared to what it had in the past.

And the fact is that community after community realize that airports are no longer compatible with other land uses in the middle of dense urban areas. Cant really blame them imo..



From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
User currently offlinePHXA340 From United States of America, joined Mar 2012, 896 posts, RR: 1
Reply 11, posted (2 years 6 months 3 weeks 5 days 9 hours ago) and read 9114 times:

Quoting LAXintl (Reply 10):
Dont forget that the airport impacts maybe 100 wealthy persons for each 1 wealthy person that utilizes it.

I think you meant non-wealthy for that first part ? But that is the point I am trying to make. The wealthy ones are the ones that willing to make large political contributions to the SM City Council to retain their airport. I agree with what you say 100% I just, unfortunately, don't think that is the reality of the situation when politics are involved.


User currently offlineLAXintl From United States of America, joined May 2000, 26014 posts, RR: 50
Reply 12, posted (2 years 6 months 3 weeks 5 days 9 hours ago) and read 9083 times:

No I mean wealthy

The airport effects communities like Beverly Hills, Century City, much of West LA plus off course Santa Monica. Some LA's highest average incomes are in these neighborhoods and get to deal with the noise and pollution.

Also to date, the SM City Council has been unanimous. Last time they went toe to toe with the FAA the council voted 7-0. I'm sorry but I don't see Santa Monica backing down, as this topic has had deep community interest, and SM has always been a left leaning, tree hugging environmental types and its elected city council has long reflected such.



From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
User currently offlinePHXA340 From United States of America, joined Mar 2012, 896 posts, RR: 1
Reply 13, posted (2 years 6 months 3 weeks 5 days 9 hours ago) and read 9060 times:

Quoting LAXintl (Reply 12):
Last time they went toe to toe with the FAA the council voted 7-0. I'm sorry but I don't see Santa Monica backing down, as this topic has had deep community interest, and SM has always been a left leaning, tree hugging environmental types and its elected city council has long reflected such.

This is why the city of Santa Monica will lose though (in my opinion):

1. They have been trying to shut down the airport since the 1960s when the imposed a ban on jets (This was overturned)
2. The FAA isn't backing down and even though the land belongs to Santa Monica , a prior agreement between the FAA and the city of SM says that it needs to serve as an airport indefinitely.
3. They already voted unanimously to shut down the airport (Twice) to then later negotiate with the FAA
4. You mention that a lot of the flights go over wealthy areas , and your right ... some do but a lot of the neighborhoods are neither wealthy nor inclined to keep fighting a battle they have been losing for the last 40 years.


User currently offlinedaviation From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 14, posted (2 years 6 months 3 weeks 5 days 8 hours ago) and read 9012 times:

And Santa Monica Airport is featured in the YouTube below, with Barbara Streisand belting out a big number!!! If you go to the 2:00 minute mark, you'll see her board a Ford Tri-Motor (I think), and takeoff on the main runway, all the while holding a high-C or something for the entire takeoff roll!!

http://www.tudou.com/programs/view/WZurn9COXBA/


User currently offlinestasisLAX From United States of America, joined Jul 2007, 3286 posts, RR: 6
Reply 15, posted (2 years 6 months 3 weeks 5 days 6 hours ago) and read 8821 times:

Quoting AADC10 (Reply 9):
There is also Zamperini Field near Torrance, Compton and LGB.

Unfortunately, there is an overload of NIMBYs in Long Beach as well when it comes to jet traffic. I used to live underneath the takeoff pattern (in Bixby Knolls) there - plenty of my neighbors bitched and complain about all of the biz jets AND the commercial jets. My question was always: "Did you live here before the airport was built? Then don't complain!"



"Those who would give up essential liberty to purchase temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety!" B.Franklin
User currently offlinepenguins From United States of America, joined Mar 2010, 345 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (2 years 6 months 3 weeks 5 days 6 hours ago) and read 8786 times:

I frequent the airport to go plane spotting quite a bit. The area around the airport is not the most wealthy compared to the Palisades. Due to the investments like a new museum of flying and the fact that many of the west sides biz jets reside their, I think we will we money win over the will of the people.

User currently offlineboilerla From United States of America, joined Jul 2010, 374 posts, RR: 0
Reply 17, posted (2 years 6 months 3 weeks 4 days 21 hours ago) and read 8250 times:

Quoting northstardc4m (Reply 1):
Only in California

Wait, so only Californians hate airports in their backyards? Try putting an airfield on the upper west side of Manhattan and see what reaction you'll get from the residents. I can guarantee it own't be pleasant. Not only is the land too valuable for an airport (just like SMO) but no city councilman is going to piss off the richest part of the city.

Let's face it, nobody wants an airport in their backyard. I love aviation just as much as anybody else, but there's no way you could pay me to move to Playa Del Rey--the tagline for some of those condos could be "When you just cant live without the sound of a 747 in your living room".

Quoting PHXA340 (Reply 7):
Yup and Midway isn't going anywhere. People have been trying to get rid of SM for years ... I just don't see it.

Yeah well Midway is one of the the crappiest parts of Chicago. When the people of South Chicago can convince all the other aldermen to close Midway, I'll put on a dress and dance on State Street. Until then, don't compare south Chicago to Santa Monica and Century City.

Quoting PHXA340 (Reply 13):
2. The FAA isn't backing down and even though the land belongs to Santa Monica , a prior agreement between the FAA and the city of SM says that it needs to serve as an airport indefinitely.

The trick is, a good portion of the land does revert back to the city. And the city can vote to biuld up that land, shortening the runways just enough that most jets can't take off. Which means, it's all nice and quiet, but the airport is dead and financially unviable for the FAA, who has no choice but to shut it down.


User currently offlinekaitak744 From United States of America, joined Jul 2005, 2397 posts, RR: 3
Reply 18, posted (2 years 6 months 3 weeks 4 days 21 hours ago) and read 8241 times:

This is stupid. This airport should not close.... It is airports like these that make our city more attractive to businesses.

User currently offlinejporterfi From United States of America, joined Feb 2012, 446 posts, RR: 0
Reply 19, posted (2 years 6 months 3 weeks 4 days 20 hours ago) and read 7976 times:

Quoting LAXintl (Reply 6):
LA basin has tons of runways. Certainly the FBOs at places like Van Nuys, Burbank, or others can handle the added activity, however those airports also are under the target hairs by their own communities as well so any added spill over activity wont be popular.

This is where you run into a paradox. People want airports close to them, but don't like the noise. Personally, however, I can't see BUR, VNY, or HHR going anywhere even if more GA traffic ends up shifting there. You figure that people with the jets that land at SMO have money to spend to find a way to get to LAX, VNY, or BUR to use their jets, but I se it from their POV: it just takes more time, especially in L.A.


User currently offlinePITrules From United States of America, joined Jun 2000, 3236 posts, RR: 6
Reply 20, posted (2 years 6 months 3 weeks 4 days 17 hours ago) and read 7146 times:

Quoting n782nc (Reply 4):

Why should Santa Monica continue operating an airport if the costs of keeping it open cannot be justified?

It doesn't cost Santa Monica, in fact it is Santa Monica which benefits economically:

"According to HR&A, the airport campus has 177 aviation and non-aviation businesses spread across 42 different industry sectors that support 1,487 full- and part-time jobs. For every direct job, an additional 1.66 jobs are created within the economy in terms of support services, according to the analysis.

The annual operation of the airport generates a total economic output of $275.2 million in the local economy, including $187.5 million in annual tenant sales, government expenditures and visitor spending at city businesses.

"Stated another way, the sale of direct economic activity at the airport [$187.5 million] is equivalent to the direct economic output generated by 1,855 average-price hotel rooms, or 1.2 million square feet of general retail or 350,000 square feet of commercial office space," the report reads.

In the 2010-11 fiscal year, the airport managed that with no general fund subsidy, said Susan Cline, assistant director of Public Works.
"

http://www.smdp.com/Articles-c-2011-...analysis-shows-rosy-economics.html

To further the discussion on the economic politics of this airport...

"The power struggle between City Hall and the FAA has led to clashes over the decades, most recently an unsuccessful eight-year court battle over a jet ban which cost over $1.5 million in attorneys' fees alone."

Since it is the local resident we are looking out for, after wasting $1.5 million on attorney fees for an ill-advised campaign against the FAA, perhaps it is city council that should be shit canned, and not the airport.

Quoting n782nc (Reply 4):
If SMO is ultimately closed, put a museum, keep the runway, etc

I agree with keeping the runway to this museum. In fact, how about a living, interacting museum runway, which would include real takeoffs and landings?

Quoting LAXintl (Reply 6):
They can always come to LAX,

You can't seriously be suggesting that LAX add well over 100,000 general aviation operations?

Quoting LAXintl (Reply 10):
Way more people suffer with the noise and air pollution the airport generates than those that benefit from its existence. It came out not too long ago the airport was the number one pollutant on the Westside of LA.

I'm curious to see a source for this, as I find it hard to believe on the noise issue, considering there is a night time curfew. I also find it hard to believe on the air pollution front considering SMO has about 300 daily operations, consisting mostly of single engine props, compared to I-405 which consists of hundreds of thousands of vehicles passing the local area daily.

Quoting boilerla (Reply 17):
Yeah well Midway is one of the the crappiest parts of Chicago. When the people of South Chicago can convince all the other aldermen to close Midway, I'll put on a dress and dance on State Street. Until then, don't compare south Chicago to Santa Monica and Century City.

So South Chicago residents, unlike those in Santa Monica, are mindlessly "putting up with" their airport because it is a crappier neighborhood? Or more deserving of the perceived noise? Sounds like class warfare; but I'm willing to give South Chicago the benefit of the doubt that just perhaps they understand and appreciate the many benefits their airport provides them.



FLYi
User currently offlinecmf From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 21, posted (2 years 6 months 3 weeks 4 days 17 hours ago) and read 7052 times:

Quoting stasisLAX (Reply 15):
My question was always: "Did you live here before the airport was built? Then don't complain!

And when they tell you they are the third generation living at that location you suggest shutting down the airport, or?


User currently offlinediverdave From United States of America, joined Mar 2010, 342 posts, RR: 0
Reply 22, posted (2 years 6 months 3 weeks 4 days 16 hours ago) and read 6981 times:

I love it. Shut the airport down and put up some windmills. California.  

David


User currently offlineKC135TopBoom From United States of America, joined Jan 2005, 12171 posts, RR: 51
Reply 23, posted (2 years 6 months 3 weeks 4 days 15 hours ago) and read 6563 times:

Quoting boilerla (Reply 17):
Quoting northstardc4m (Reply 1):Only in California
Wait, so only Californians hate airports in their backyards? Try putting an airfield on the upper west side of Manhattan and see what reaction you'll get from the residents. I can guarantee it own't be pleasant. Not only is the land too valuable for an airport (just like SMO) but no city councilman is going to piss off the richest part of the city.

There is just a little bit of difference in your analysis. SMO has been there since the early 1920s, and New York City already has an airport on the north side of the city. Perhaps you have heard of it, LGA? EWR could also be called the Upper West Manhattan Airport.

New York closed an airport in the early 1970s, IIRC, but it was next door to JFK. It was called Floyd Bennett Field.

Has the city of SM considered what it will cost, in jobs and future income potential if SMO was 'converted' into an "eco-field"? Do they even care?

There are noise restrictions already in place for a 24/7 maximum noise output of 95dBA, about the same of noise from road traffic on highways. There are other restrictions, like a night curfew, and no touch and gos during the weekends or at night.

As I said, SMO has been there since the 1920s, but here is a picture I found taken sometime in the 1950s that show neighborhoods built right up to the airport fences (also notice the new build DC-6s sitting on the Douglas ramp).

http://jpg1.lapl.org/00088/00088635.jpg

a.neters should remember SMO as the airport fellow a.neter Paulo Emanuele was killed at in an airplane accident there in 2009.

[Edited 2012-05-02 06:55:07]

User currently offlinelightsaber From United States of America, joined Jan 2005, 13430 posts, RR: 100
Reply 24, posted (2 years 6 months 3 weeks 4 days 15 hours ago) and read 6343 times:
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Quoting AADC10 (Reply 9):
Just 3 miles east of LAX is Hawthore (HHR) which probably has lower fees than its neighbor.

HHR is trying to expand....

Quoting AADC10 (Reply 9):
There is also Zamperini Field near Torrance, Compton and LGB.

Compton and LGB could take a bit. Recall Zamperini has successfully banned the sale of jet fuel and that limits ops (intentionally).

Quoting LAXintl (Reply 10):
Dont forget that the airport impacts maybe 100 wealthy persons for each 1 wealthy person that utilizes it.

And how many jobs does it provide those wealthy people? I know people wanting to shut down the airport who then turn around and brag about the business deal closed on "so and so's" business jet flying into the field!

Quoting LAXintl (Reply 12):
I'm sorry but I don't see Santa Monica backing down

Sadly, I must agree. At this point, the business must go elsewhere. The issue for California is that there is no magical barrier at the state line. While the impact will be small.. there is a benefit to attracting the wealthy to fly in near the beach and do the $5k meal for a negotiation.

The question is will this cost or benefit Santa Monica and the nearby communities in the long run?

Quoting kaitak744 (Reply 18):
It is airports like these that make our city more attractive to businesses.

Looking at the drop in state tax revenue post a tax hike, there are indications California has gone too far.  
Quoting KC135TopBoom (Reply 23):
SMO has been there since the early 1920s

Unfortunately, that will not change anything. While I agree with your logic... This won't be solved by logic.

Quoting KC135TopBoom (Reply 23):
Has the city of SM considered what it will cost, in jobs and future income potential if SMO was 'converted' into an "eco-field"? Do they even care?

They do not care.

Lightsaber



Societies that achieve a critical mass of ideas achieve self sustaining growth; others stagnate.
25 rcair1 : I think he was referring to the impression given in the image of an active runway surrounded by windmills. Certainly if they build windmills, they wo
26 fly4film : If anyone is interested, a movie called "One Six Right" hits on the topic of closing an airfield in the LA basin. Some interesting point of views on t
27 Post contains links N62NA : Thanks for posting that. It's interesting how Hollywood films end up - unintentionally - documenting places for us to refer back to decades after tho
28 PPVRA : All that greenness will surely require a lot of irrigation, in arid southern California. . . just throw in some wind power and call it environmentall
29 n782nc : Midway is a major commercial airport handling nearly 20 million pax annually with an economic impact of somewhere in or near the billions. SMO is a s
30 Post contains links and images LAXintl : The 2015 lease ends provides the city with the unique opportunity to take away 2/3 of the already shrunk airport grounds and redesignate them into ot
31 CXB744 : To keep SMO open there will probably be some kind of slot control like Long Beach to curb the jet traffic. What has to be different from last time th
32 cmf : Blind support is never good. You should never let your interest in one thing allow it to dominate over other peoples rights. Everything must be in ba
33 LAXintl : The report for community visioning process which involved the city hosting a series of 32 facilitated community discussion groups over 3-months is rea
34 tugger : Honestly, beyond all the doom and gloom in some posts above, with what you show here there appears to be a good chance (I wanted to say "60-80% chanc
35 Post contains images lightsaber : Santa Monica is the highest density of affluent folks I know of in LA. By affluent, I mean $150k+ household incomes. So they will 'make noise' about
36 LAXintl : My personal take is as step one, the city will in 2015 take back the 2/3 of land that reverts from the FAA, leaving a much smaller airport foot print
37 PHXA340 : I believe that is incorrect. From my understanding is that the city of SM must use the land that reverts back to them for aviation purposes only. The
38 Post contains links LAXintl : In continued action regarding the airport, the Airport Commision voted to recommend the city proceed and seek "declaratory relief" judgement from a co
39 Post contains links koruman : I'd move into Surfridge in a heartbeat! http://www.lakata.org/arch/surfridge/
40 Mir : If they do that, I hope the airport decides to target itself to helicopters. Get some of those buzzing around and people will wish they had to listen
41 LAXintl : One proposal in an attempt to cut down on air traffic around Santa Monica Airport city officials are proposing to pay flight schools to either vacate
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