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BER Opening Postponed  
User currently offlineSailorOrion From Germany, joined Feb 2001, 2058 posts, RR: 6
Posted (1 year 11 months 2 weeks 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 20718 times:

According to the AP, the opening date of the "new" Berlin airport will slip by several weeks, apparently due to problems with the fire protection equipment. How embarrassing ...

SailorOrion

[Edited 2012-05-08 04:06:59 by SA7700]

125 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlinevfw614 From Germany, joined Dec 2001, 3905 posts, RR: 5
Reply 1, posted (1 year 11 months 2 weeks 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 20765 times:

At this point, this is just a rumour published by Germany's largest tabloid. There will be an official press conference at 1 pm.

User currently offlineNoUFO From Germany, joined Apr 2001, 7917 posts, RR: 12
Reply 2, posted (1 year 11 months 2 weeks 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 20758 times:

No, it is not just a tabloid. It is AP as the OP has stated, and FAZ reports it too.


I support the right to arm bears
User currently offlineTobias2702 From Germany, joined Sep 2008, 701 posts, RR: 0
Reply 3, posted (1 year 11 months 2 weeks 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 20649 times:

Yes, it's official. Several weeks delayedbecause of unfinished fire protection installations in the terminal building.

That's a mere disaster. Now, just at the amount of re-organization/rescheduling of the overnight move from TXL to BER (staff, ground vehicles etc.) that needs to be done now...

And the costs... Tax money it will be, I guess. What about the airlines? How is this organized? How much will AB/LH lose just because there won't be a working hub airport by 3 June? What about pax who are already booked on connecting flights? TXL just cannot handle connections!!!

What a catastrophe.

edit: and what's more, there is just no definite new opening date, it's just "several weeks later". Incredible.

edit: There will be a press conference this afternoon, at 13:00 local time. Also, the Tagesspiegel newspaper reported about the problems with the fire protection earlier.:

BER To Open With Provisorial "Tent Terminal" (by Tobias2702 Apr 21 2012 in Civil Aviation)?threadid=5444926&searchid=5447600&s=tent+terminal#ID5447600

[Edited 2012-05-08 02:49:08]

[Edited 2012-05-08 02:54:23]


PA, AF, UK, BA, AB, DL, LH, FR, BD, A3, EZY, DY //// A319/320/346, B733/735/73G/738/744/763, AT4, 146, CR2, DH4
User currently offlinevfw614 From Germany, joined Dec 2001, 3905 posts, RR: 5
Reply 4, posted (1 year 11 months 2 weeks 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 20582 times:

Until a few minutes ago, they were all reporting based on a "breaking news" published by BILD at 11 am.

However, in the meantime, there has been independent confirmation from within government sources.


User currently offlineTobias2702 From Germany, joined Sep 2008, 701 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (1 year 11 months 2 weeks 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 20537 times:

The problems seems to be that the smoke venting system in the terminal building isn't working properly, which is why the operating allowance is deied because of the obvious safety concerns.

Here, this gives you an impression on what needs to be reorganized on the passenger side alone...
http://preview.berlin-airport.de/en/...xf/important-information/index.php

As someone who was born in Berlin and spent so much time there, I can only say that I'm ashamed of the city. This will affect travellers/companies worldwide!

[Edited 2012-05-08 02:56:41]


PA, AF, UK, BA, AB, DL, LH, FR, BD, A3, EZY, DY //// A319/320/346, B733/735/73G/738/744/763, AT4, 146, CR2, DH4
User currently offlinevfw614 From Germany, joined Dec 2001, 3905 posts, RR: 5
Reply 6, posted (1 year 11 months 2 weeks 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 20461 times:

No, from what I can gather from the most recent press articles, the airport was unable to submit proper documentation so that the terminal could not be cleared for operations.

http://www.tagesspiegel.de/berlin/sc...d-platzeck-stinksauer/6604068.html


User currently offlineTobias2702 From Germany, joined Sep 2008, 701 posts, RR: 0
Reply 7, posted (1 year 11 months 2 weeks 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 20416 times:

Quoting vfw614 (Reply 6):
the airport was unable to submit proper documentation so that the terminal could not be cleared for operations.

But that's unthinkable. If all systems worked as they should, submitting the proper papers cannot be a matter of weeks (as stated above, the problems were known at least since mid-April).

As I read the article, the problems with the venting system are so huge that the airport wasn't able to schedule the needed acceptance test. "Some parts of work properly, but there is a failure with the system as a whole".

[Edited 2012-05-08 03:02:55]


PA, AF, UK, BA, AB, DL, LH, FR, BD, A3, EZY, DY //// A319/320/346, B733/735/73G/738/744/763, AT4, 146, CR2, DH4
User currently offlineTheSonntag From Germany, joined Jun 2005, 3396 posts, RR: 29
Reply 8, posted (1 year 11 months 2 weeks 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 20418 times:

On a positive note, it shows that the government is independant and working. Since we already had several people killed in a DUS fire in 1996, better to do it right.

User currently offlinevfw614 From Germany, joined Dec 2001, 3905 posts, RR: 5
Reply 9, posted (1 year 11 months 2 weeks 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 20388 times:

Quoting Tobias2702 (Reply 7):
But that's unthinkable. If all systems worked as they should, submitting the proper papers cannot be a matter of weeks (as stated above, the problems were known at least since mid-April).

Apparently it was. I am just telling you what the Tagesspiegel write, a very respected broad-sheet.


User currently offlineMadameConcorde From San Marino, joined Feb 2007, 10733 posts, RR: 38
Reply 10, posted (1 year 11 months 2 weeks 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 20324 times:

I just happened to see the information of the new airport opening delay via der spiegel.

http://www.spiegel.de/reise/aktuell/...g-im-juni-verschoben-a-831989.html

Article in German. I had to use the reverso online translation.

I hope all those who had booked your travel can get refunds/reschedulings.

 



There was a better way to fly it was called Concorde
User currently offlineTobias2702 From Germany, joined Sep 2008, 701 posts, RR: 0
Reply 11, posted (1 year 11 months 2 weeks 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 20307 times:

Quoting vfw614 (Reply 9):
pparently it was. I am just telling you what the Tagesspiegel write, a very respected broad-sheet.

Sorry, maybe I got you wrong here. I read your post as if the airport had forgotten to submit the necessary papers. As I read the (indeed respectable newspaper) article, the airport just wasn't able to apply for the acceptance test because the whole installation is f***ed up.

Maybe we should return to discussing my original questions about howe Air Berlin, Lufthansa, other airlines, airport employees, public transport systems (bus/railroad lines were to be ceased/opened) etc. will re-organize that mess.



PA, AF, UK, BA, AB, DL, LH, FR, BD, A3, EZY, DY //// A319/320/346, B733/735/73G/738/744/763, AT4, 146, CR2, DH4
User currently offlinecedarjet From United Kingdom, joined May 1999, 7934 posts, RR: 54
Reply 12, posted (1 year 11 months 2 weeks 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 20313 times:

Air Events have a special "last flight out of TXL" on June 2, glad I didn't book pricey (yet non-changeable) BA LHR-TXL and SXF-LHR flights yet. Hope it works out - but TXL is such a unique, friendly, historic airport, any reprieve, even a couple of weeks, is A Good Thing.


fly Saha Air 707s daily from Tehran's downtown Mehrabad to Mashhad, Kish Island and Ahwaz
User currently offlineTobias2702 From Germany, joined Sep 2008, 701 posts, RR: 0
Reply 13, posted (1 year 11 months 2 weeks 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 20207 times:

Rumors according to Tagesspiegel are that the press conference at 13:00 won't give a new opeing date. That means, the opening of BER is postponed indefinitely. "Hopes are to open the new airport after the summer, but still in 2012".

This is such a disaster. Airlines/Airport Employers etc. just need a date for the planning. Huge losses feared especially for AB/LH. Heck, pax are already booked on BER connections, which won't be possible given the current TXL layout.

LH planned to increase its presence in Berlin, stationing several a/c in BER. At TXL, there just won't be any space. This non-opeing is unprecedented in an "otherwise properly run" country, I suppose?



PA, AF, UK, BA, AB, DL, LH, FR, BD, A3, EZY, DY //// A319/320/346, B733/735/73G/738/744/763, AT4, 146, CR2, DH4
User currently offlinevfw614 From Germany, joined Dec 2001, 3905 posts, RR: 5
Reply 14, posted (1 year 11 months 2 weeks 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 20178 times:

The airport must open in 2012. As far as I know, TXL will be without a licence from Jan 1. 2013 and this cannot be changed easily. My guess is that they will open with effect winter schedule.

User currently offlineTobias2702 From Germany, joined Sep 2008, 701 posts, RR: 0
Reply 15, posted (1 year 11 months 2 weeks 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 20082 times:

What I am hearing is that it will be impossible for airlines to operate according to schedule from 3 June if BER is not open.

I'm still trying to get an overview about the multitude of catastrophic problems this non-opening creates. For example, without BER operational, maintenance schedules have to be redone because there won't be any aircraft around at the hangars...

AB opened its BER hangar yesterday: http://www.airberlin.com/en-DE/site/pressnews_dr.php?ID=3858&LANG=eng

[Edited 2012-05-08 03:31:16]


PA, AF, UK, BA, AB, DL, LH, FR, BD, A3, EZY, DY //// A319/320/346, B733/735/73G/738/744/763, AT4, 146, CR2, DH4
User currently offlinePanHAM From Germany, joined May 2005, 8740 posts, RR: 28
Reply 16, posted (1 year 11 months 2 weeks 2 days 2 hours ago) and read 19974 times:

Quoting TheSonntag (Reply 8):
On a positive note, it shows that the government is independant and working. Since we already had several people killed in a DUS fire in 1996, better to do it right.

The governmen is not independent. The laws they have put in place mandate such things. The reason is that the terminal building, the fire protection system etc. will , at the present stage, not be certified by TUEV. Without that certification the airport cannot open. Whoever would override that would be personally liable if something happens. Haven't we good laws in his country?

Now, why doesn't surprise me this breaking news? I would have won another bet.

And the Berlin Mayor said, just about 2 weeks, ago, of course it will open on time. After all, we have decided that it will open.

See above......and welcome again to Posemuckel.



I'm not fishing for compliments
User currently offlineFN1001 From Moldova, joined Sep 2008, 234 posts, RR: 0
Reply 17, posted (1 year 11 months 2 weeks 2 days 2 hours ago) and read 19872 times:

Quoting Tobias2702 (Reply 13):
This non-opeing is unprecedented in an "otherwise properly run" country, I suppose?

This is no more the Federal Republic of Germany, as it was 25 years ago, it is new Germany, including the former GDR and a bunch of manpower from the eastern part of Europe. Unfortunately the quality and reliability of the products and services has declined dramatically in the last decades.

Long time ago, the label "Made in Germany", was something more valuable than today ISO9001 or other labels. Today they build a new runway in FRA and use it only for departures (in contradiction to the german phrase, which describes the mentality quite good: "keine halben Sahen machen" - don't do things by halves).



Mai bine să-ţi fie rău decît să-ţi pară rău.
User currently offlinealoges From Germany, joined Jan 2006, 8617 posts, RR: 43
Reply 18, posted (1 year 11 months 2 weeks 2 days 2 hours ago) and read 19823 times:

Quoting aloges:
It's about airports in Berlin. Logic does not apply.  

BER To Open With Provisorial "Tent Terminal" (by Tobias2702 Apr 21 2012 in Civil Aviation)

I'm trying hard to suppress quite a lot of hysterical laughter... that is one clusterfuck accomplished, I suppose.   

It is of course a shame that thousands of passengers will have to change their travel plans, but on the huge cake of utterly bonkers aviation policy Made in Berlin (and Brandenburg), this is the icing... anyway, they can always turn the unused terminal into a Tropical Island in case it never does get certified.  

Quoting FN1001 (Reply 17):
Today they build a new runway in FRA and use it only for departures

Ummm... sorry, but that runway was built in the early 80s.

[Edited 2012-05-08 03:50:55]


Walk together, talk together all ye peoples of the earth. Then, and only then, shall ye have peace.
User currently offlinePanHAM From Germany, joined May 2005, 8740 posts, RR: 28
Reply 19, posted (1 year 11 months 2 weeks 2 days 2 hours ago) and read 19797 times:

Quoting FN1001 (Reply 17):
FRA and use it only for departures (in contradiction to the german phrase, which describes the mentality quite good: "keine halben Sahen machen" - don't do things by halves).

basically you are right, but we had half a runway for starting saircarft., so we needed the other half for landings here. Makes one now.

The problem is not the industry, which powers hout high quality goods. The prolem are the politicdians who have no clue what they are doing but cave in to each pressure group made up of people who do not know at all what they are doing and what the consequences can be.

BER is a mis-conception from the beginning, that mis-conception includs the closure of the other 2 airports. I hope they can keep TXL open until the new one is ready, because it might be law that TXL has to close June 3trd.

If that happens Germany would be laughing stock all over the world and I would alugh MFAO



I'm not fishing for compliments
User currently offlinepadster From United Kingdom, joined Nov 2005, 76 posts, RR: 0
Reply 20, posted (1 year 11 months 2 weeks 2 days 2 hours ago) and read 19773 times:

http://www.n24.de/news/newsitem_7906945.html now suggests that it could be as long as September to sort out the problem with the ventilation...

sounds like a major problem for all the airlines who were launching new routes from BER ... can TXL cope ?


User currently offlineTobias2702 From Germany, joined Sep 2008, 701 posts, RR: 0
Reply 21, posted (1 year 11 months 2 weeks 2 days 2 hours ago) and read 19655 times:

Quoting padster (Reply 20):
sounds like a major problem for all the airlines who were launching new routes from BER ... can TXL cope ?

As I stated above, TXL alone is not able to hold the BER-scheduled upright:

**not enough facilities for connecting pax (AB connecions might be possible, but LH/Star connecting passengers will face near-impossible conditions). Same for AB-oneworld connections.

**not enough runway capacities to cater for the increased flight numbers of LH/AB

**TXL curfew is 23:00-06:00, BER is 00:00-05:00

**Not enough ramp space at TXL for the aircraft AB/LH plan to station at BER

Quoting vfw614 (Reply 14):
As far as I know, TXL will be without a licence from Jan 1. 2013 and this cannot be changed easily.

You are right.

[Edited 2012-05-08 04:10:06]

[Edited 2012-05-08 04:15:09]


PA, AF, UK, BA, AB, DL, LH, FR, BD, A3, EZY, DY //// A319/320/346, B733/735/73G/738/744/763, AT4, 146, CR2, DH4
User currently offlinealoges From Germany, joined Jan 2006, 8617 posts, RR: 43
Reply 22, posted (1 year 11 months 2 weeks 2 days 2 hours ago) and read 19601 times:

Quoting PanHAM (Reply 19):
If that happens Germany would be laughing stock all over the world and I would alugh MFAO

You aren't already?

Quoting padster (Reply 20):
can TXL cope ?

short answer: not at all

long answer: Its capacity is 12 million passengers per year. It served 16.919.820 in 2011. Fortunately, I haven't had the misfortune of flying through there for years, but the last time it happened, TXL was a mess of long and confusing walks, pedestrian tunnels and terminals that would at best be called shacks elsewhere (Terminal C). Finally, there isn't even any sort of rail link to the place. BER was originally supposed to open late last year, which explains the neglect... well, together with Berlin's debt and the anti-airport policies of the governing parties it does.



Walk together, talk together all ye peoples of the earth. Then, and only then, shall ye have peace.
User currently offlineTobias2702 From Germany, joined Sep 2008, 701 posts, RR: 0
Reply 23, posted (1 year 11 months 2 weeks 2 days 2 hours ago) and read 19393 times:

Berlin Mayor at press conference: So far, no definite new opening date will be given, negotiations with airport holding needed here (new opening planned for "after the summer vacacions"). Decision to be done during the next days.

Governors of Berlin and Brandenburg "furious" that the situation was not recognized/admitted earlier. This will be investigated, of course. Both claim, that there will be no flight disruptions.



PA, AF, UK, BA, AB, DL, LH, FR, BD, A3, EZY, DY //// A319/320/346, B733/735/73G/738/744/763, AT4, 146, CR2, DH4
User currently offlinesomething From United Kingdom, joined May 2011, 1633 posts, RR: 21
Reply 24, posted (1 year 11 months 2 weeks 2 days 2 hours ago) and read 19378 times:

German's are a peculiar people. They can move the temples of Abu Simbel, but they can't build Hamburg's Elbphilharmonie nor open a tiny airport it seems.

This is indescribably embarrassing, but if we're being honest to ourselves, comes to the surprise of the fewest.



..sick of it. -K. Pilkington.
25 PanHAM : I am indeed. When this clown Wowi replied to the reporter about 2 weeks ago (while visiting BER) that of course they will open because they have a re
26 Tobias2702 : 27 Million pax/year and hub of a oneworld member airline is not exaclty what I would call tiny. But anyway, are there any statements from LH/AB yet?
27 Post contains images aloges : It's usually when political prestige (or that of engineers) takes precedence over safety margins and economic/ecologic sense that people mess up like
28 AIR MALTA : It is amazing how nobody has learned from the LHR T5 fiasco. If you intend to open an airport to replace 2 others, better do it in stages and not all
29 smbukas : It is really a huge mess. Now it is a turn for AB and LH to decide what to do with announced huge numbers of new routes/frequencies and what to do wit
30 Post contains links aloges : Not yet, AFAIK, but watch these spaces: http://presse.lufthansa.com/de/meldungen/presseinformationen.html (DE) http://presse.lufthansa.com/en/news-re
31 Tobias2702 : It's already over, nothing really new. No new opeing date so far. According to radio correspondent, Mr Schwarz, the BER airport manager, was -- as of
32 aloges : BER will replace 3 other airports when it finally gets round to opening: THF, TXL and SXF. In its final days, scheduled traffic at THF was a small op
33 vfw614 : It is not. I am still watching it...
34 Tobias2702 : Also, the non-opening of BER / non-closure of TXL means an ATC problem as the regulations concerning the then-valid flight paths are worthless now.
35 CXfirst : Sad news, I looked into booking tickets in June to BER to see the new airport (and a short trip to the city), glad I didn't. Now, I'll wait to a more
36 deltamartin : Very weird situation. Let's see what happens to my scheduled (short) connection at BER on June 17th with AB, I guess we'll have to go via TXL instead.
37 Post contains images N14AZ : Pheew, I don't want to be in the shoes of the Consulting Engineer or in the shoes of the Contractor for the ventilation system. For sure there is a f
38 Post contains images NoUFO : To be honest, the major can only echo what those responsible have told him. Well yes, how's your terminal 5 working by now?
39 Post contains images LOWS : When it hits the non-functioning ventilation system... :D
40 Tobias2702 : According to Tagesspiegel, BER airport has now confirmed that there were also problems with the test runs. So, it seems like the smoke venting system
41 Post contains links Tobias2702 : First official press relase of AB (so far, German only): They won't be able to operate as scheduled, because the waves of arriving/departing aircraft
42 Post contains links Logos : Now saying that the 3rd of August is the new proposed opening date. Quite a disaster for this already much-delayed project. Maybe I can sneak one more
43 Tobias2702 : As I read the source, it only states that the new opening date will be AFTER 3 August, which is when the school holidays end, and which corresponds t
44 Logos : You're right - serves me right for going with just the headline from the B-Z and a cursory reading of the the first couple of paragraphs. Cheers, Dav
45 Burkhard : The new runway is used for landings only, not for departures, and since there is one runway for departures only, fully busy, this makes sense. But th
46 something : Actually, I drive a Japanese car for its reliability more than anything else. Not the point. German engineering enjoys the best reputation throughout
47 CaptainCrackers : To be fair, Germany's recent history has been dotted with a variety of farcical episodes that don't involve Berlin. Corruption, incompetence, failure
48 Post contains images r2rho : Somehow I am not surprised... The question is, how many of the new ops had AB / LH really scheduled to start from day 1 of the airport opening? Or had
49 Burkhard : You may have a very nice wide broad view of the things from so far away, but from inside Germany, if you ever have to do with any institution based in
50 Post contains images Unflug : Mostly reschedulings, at least until January I wouldn't attribute the failure of the executing companies to the city of Berlin.
51 HT : Airevents, who was organizing two of the farewell-flights from TXL, meanwhile have sent out eMail explaining each passengers options for these flights
52 Blue100 : Interesting news... I'm currently scheduled to fly into BER on July 2nd with AF. If BER isn't open at that time, what is the likelihood that AF will h
53 Post contains links Tobias2702 : Concerning AB, I think LAX is the only new route, and it will be launched on 11 May anyway. Of course, AB needs a well-working hub for its connecting
54 SailorOrion : I think the City of Berlin and its Mayor are the only ones to blame... SailorOrion
55 something : Going by the reports, it will take at least another 2-3 months for BER to open. If you're flying into Berlin on July 2nd, you'll fly into TXL. How AF
56 Post contains links and images lightsaber : Articles are now coming out: http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/...rport-berlin-idUSLNE84701620120508 This is a shame. Berlin would benefit tremendou
57 PanHAM : I know that the new flight paths nhave to be "official", can these simply be postponed until the real opening day? Yes, but he put himself as the fro
58 Unflug : Any specific reason? Or is this personal dislike?
59 ZRH : A question bit off topic: I saw on a picture the new air-bridges off BER. Why does such a new airport not have glass walls on the bridges? Here in ZRH
60 SailorOrion : Both, first of all I hate him with a passion. Second, this project is his baby, so he is responsible if something goes wrong. Remember, a good leader
61 dazeflight : ^ I am sorry for you. Not just for your hate, but also for the fact you seem to have forgotten that the single-airport was initiated by the Diepgen ad
62 Post contains images aloges : It could be due to cost or - wait for it - fire regulations. I beg your pardon?[Edited 2012-05-08 10:06:56]
63 ADent : DIA (KDEN) opened over a YEAR late due primarily to a baggage system that never worked. They are still working out repercussions of that - UA just got
64 dazeflight : @ aloges: Feel adressed? The reason for people who hate (not dislike or something) and demand the resignation of someone who has been re-elected twice
65 Post contains links and images aloges : All will eventually be forgotten, at least by everyone except a.netters with a long memory. However, the damage will only get worse over the next cou
66 dazeflight : ^ Well, then most likely you were not adressed as well. Strange you felt the need to comment that, though.
67 aloges : I simply like to point out nonsense when I see it.
68 SailorOrion : I do not have a personal problem with Berlin, just that the South of Germany has to finance an airport project which almost HALVES existing airport ca
69 PanHAM : As aloges already said, highly likely that glass is more expensive and since they had to keep the tight and tiny budget of 2,5 billion € glass was
70 HT : Air Berlin's shares (AB1000) fell 5.00 % today while Lufti is down 1.81 % -HT
71 Post contains links and images lightsaber : Do you have a link? I no so little of the event; any links are appreciated. What about FR? I thought they were moving on? In other words, they have n
72 NoUFO : Wrong on two accounts. It is Berlin's and Brandendenburg's airport, so Mr. Platzeck plays a role, too. Besides, as somebody else has just mentioned:
73 Post contains images PanHAM : google Duesseldorf airport fire, you get all the info. The terminal burned down with I think it was 17 death. May be they stop at SXF and continue to
74 SailorOrion : I do not have information about all those points, but from all I know (please correct me if I am wrong): -he strongly opposed any idea to keep THF op
75 Post contains images PanHAM : you sure? Why then was the existing runway at SXF decommissioned ? but still advocates a curfew which is 2400 to 0500 - that in a city which serves b
76 Wsp : During the press conference they mentioned that the involved firms say they might even make the certification before the June 3rd deadline but that t
77 Tobias2702 : Please note that both ideas would have delayed the opening of BER, and by far more than just a few months. The official planning approval for the new
78 OlafW : And rightfully so. At least there seems to be some learning effect from the Düsseldorf events. What I would really like to know is what is the origi
79 L1011 : I have reservations into and out of BER in October, and I have a non-refundable pre-paid reservation for the new hotel at the airport. If BER isn't op
80 vfw614 : I don't think so - why should they if they are already open? It may be slightly more inconvenient, but generally speaking, there is no reason why pas
81 LOWS : Presumably the Sbahn connection isn't yet running, or is it?
82 jumpjets : The comparison with the LHR T5 opening fiasco made in earlier posts is I suppose inevitable - so lets look what happened at T5. In its first full year
83 Post contains images lightsaber : Let me be clear, I do not blame the local certification requirements. If a large public structure has a smoke requirement due to a prior disaster, th
84 RVV2011 : A typically German discussion. So much drama over...well nothing really. Catastrophe! Disaster! What will the world think!? Not much really. Sh*t happ
85 Unflug : The first statement is somehow sad, but nothing I want to discuss further. The second is wrong, the decision for this airport and the closing of the
86 Tobias2702 : First of all, contact the hotel. They will tell you. Secondly, are you referring to the Steigenberger? I've heard that they won't open if the airport
87 PanHAM : Such decisions can always be revised when new data is on hand. The 1995 decision was based on figures which were outdated 2000. Wowereit also manipul
88 r2rho : Good question... they still seem to be offering flights from there, so it looks like they're staying, at least for the summer season(?). We shall see
89 Post contains images JCS : Sad. I'm supposed to fly to BER on June 5th.
90 PanHAM : Desaster is the right word and r2rho has outlined who and what will be affected by the delay. I am sure that this list is incomplete. Now they still d
91 HT : What about FNB ? 150 km using the B96. Perfect distance for FR in order to avoid that pax can spot the city they intend to visit during approach - an
92 PanHAM : ha, why not Cochsted? They wanted to call themselves Berlin South in order to get massive FR business. BER airport sued and won. Anyhow, 150 km is too
93 Post contains links Logos : The Morgenpost has an article today shedding a tiny bit more light on the cause of this (but is mostly a rehash). http://www.morgenpost.de/flughafen-b
94 PanHAM : Normally, such a project must be accompanied by a dedicated team supervising the contractors. Fraport had such a team when building the new landing ru
95 Rafabozzolla : I'm scheduled to fly in July 18th and out on the 25th and I actually don't mind the delay. I'm flying LH (BD operated), so my flight will probably me
96 Post contains links Tobias2702 : Another AB press release: http://www.airberlin.com/en-DE/site/pressnews_dr.php?ID=3866&LANG=eng As expected, all flight bookings remain valid, but
97 Post contains images NoUFO : Funny. Funny too, albeit in a different meaning. Freudian slip? Brandschutz - fire protection Brandschutt - fire debris
98 Post contains images PanHAM : involuntary comic, I admit. I am usually quick with the send key, I admit that sometimes I do not check the spelling and the t and the z are neighbou
99 Post contains images HT : Yep, I know as I was affected by the fire. About a week after the fire I was flying "home" from VRA but our flights's destination (running 7 hours la
100 PanHAM : Just reading in a Sunday paper that actually only 52% of the new terminbal / runway that make up BER are finished and ready. Amazing. There are detail
101 LOWS : This is actually starting to make VIE's SkyLink (3 years late and 100%+ over budget) look less bad.
102 flyingAY : Do you mean that in today's world it's impossible to build an airport with 2,5 billion euro budget or it's impossible to make a budget that will hold
103 PanHAM : Depends on what has to be build. In Berlin it was a new runway, taxiways, upgrading an old runway including taxiways, a complete new apron, a complete
104 speedbird128 : It was designed from the outset as a landing only runway, just like 18 is solely a departure runway... All by design. Not half-measures...
105 steman : Haven´t they planned already to build satellite buildings, like LHR T5b or c, west of the main terminal? There is certainly enough space for that and
106 L1011 : Yes, I am referring to the Steigenberger. I'll be flying into BER one night and out the next morning, so I figured that hotel would be the most conve
107 standby87 : Being an "anorak", I booked on what was supposed to be the last ever Swiss flight to Tegel, returning to Zurich via the new BER Airport. To say I'm gu
108 Post contains links Wsp : What they actually said was that only 52% of all processes were working flawlessly while the rest had problems that were to be compensated with tempo
109 VV701 : Terminal 5 at LHR together with associated terminal aircraft stands and taxiways was budgeted at and actually cost £4.3 billion (euro 5.4 billion).
110 PanHAM : I would not trust the airport website, reports in the Sunday press mentioned that the low cost pier was and still is a construction site. When the me
111 Tobias2702 : But anyway, Stuttgart 21 is currently being built. A "screaming, ranting minority" won't be able to prevent the construction of the satellite concour
112 Unflug : Steigenberger reservation says they will not open before the opening of the airport. So they'll definitely have to change your booking if you are not
113 Post contains links Wsp : The website link is to the public broadcaster. And my point was not that one should trust the airport speaker but that you or your sources misreporte
114 PanHAM : Don't you have phons in berlin? Yes, rbb almost looks like fbb. Fact is, 3 weeks before the attempted opening, 52 % of the buildings / installations
115 Post contains links Wsp : What? Frantic phone calls could have solved the problems? Can you link to a source for that fact. As I pointed out the only 52% figure that I found d
116 PanHAM : HJave a look at yesterday's airliners.de newsletter. The LH passenger airline CEO says that not even their lounge was finished. IT does not work prop
117 Post contains links Wsp : Unfortunate, but hardly something that would delay the opening. Vague. This could mean anything on a scale from complete crash every 5 minutes to for
118 PanHAM : well, OK, so LH tells their premium customers to buy a burger at McDee's? That's not your home PC, if IT in a project like that dos not work properly
119 PanHAM : Latest news on-line this morning in "WELT" is that the new airport might not open this year and could be delayed until 2013. Total chaos and no one ca
120 Post contains images VV701 : Did we? I thought we had establishred that a stand-alone terminal designed to handle up to 30 million passengers a year that was completed a few year
121 Tobias2702 : A press conference will be held at around 18:00 local time, so maybe we will see a bit clearer by then. The rumors circulating so far are that nobody
122 Post contains images PanHAM : April 1 2013 would be an ideal date, indeed. That leaves open a lot of excuses. Usually the summer schedules start last Sunday in March, when time sw
123 Aquila3 : Not surprising. We are speaking of two Kaiser's capitals, I believe.... While a small trouble like this would go completely unnoticed here, I find yo
124 Post contains images lightsaber : Please pass on any information. Lightsaber
125 Post contains links Wilco737 : Please continue discussion here: BER Opening Postponed Part 2 - Not Before 2013! (by Delta777Jet May 15 2012 in Civil Aviation)
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