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Hollande's Plane Delay - Lightning  
User currently offlineA320ajm From United Kingdom, joined May 2006, 547 posts, RR: 0
Posted (2 years 4 months 1 week 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 10448 times:

Breaking on Sky News...

http://news.sky.com/home/world-news/article/16228034

I thought all aircraft were protected against lightning? Any ideas what might have been the reason for the return?

Regards,
A320ajm


If the British Empire and its Commonwealth last for a thousand years, men will still say, 'This was their finest hour.'
35 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlinefalkerker From Seychelles, joined Apr 2012, 163 posts, RR: 0
Reply 1, posted (2 years 4 months 1 week 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 10415 times:

AFAIK, they are all protected, it was probably just a precautionary measure. It's the President of France, after all.

User currently offlineA320ajm From United Kingdom, joined May 2006, 547 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (2 years 4 months 1 week 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 10415 times:

Quoting falkerker (Reply 1):
It's the President of France, after all.

Surely it is the same safety measures though regardless of who is flying on the aircraft....

Regards,
A320ajm



If the British Empire and its Commonwealth last for a thousand years, men will still say, 'This was their finest hour.'
User currently offlinedirtyfrankd From United States of America, joined Apr 2011, 190 posts, RR: 0
Reply 3, posted (2 years 4 months 1 week 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 10313 times:

What kind of aircraft was it?

User currently offlinelarshjort From Denmark, joined Dec 2007, 1474 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (2 years 4 months 1 week 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 10226 times:

Quoting A320ajm (Thread starter):
I thought all aircraft were protected against lightning?

Aircraft are protected so lightning strikes do the least amount of damage to the aircraft, but you will always end up with a entry hole where the the lightning hit the aircraft.

/Lars



139, 306, 319, 320, 321, 332, 34A, AN2, AT4, AT5, AT7, 733, 735, 73G, 738, 739, 146, AR1, BH2, CN1, CR2, DH1, DH3, DH4,
User currently offlineBE77 From Canada, joined Nov 2007, 455 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (2 years 4 months 1 week 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 10193 times:

Quoting A320ajm (Reply 2):
Surely it is the same safety measures though regardless of who is flying on the aircraft....

Generally the same for sure.
The aircraft are 'protected' in so much as a strike should not make one crash or explode, but it doesn't mean there is no damage. Parts can fall off, holes burned through, wires get fried, and all sorts of weird and wonderful things can happen that leave the airplane flying, but make it not properly airworthy.



Tower, Affirmitive, gear is down and welded
User currently offlinedirtyfrankd From United States of America, joined Apr 2011, 190 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (2 years 4 months 1 week 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 10148 times:

Does anybody know whether it was his A330 that was struck, or whether it was one of the older A319s or Dassault Falcons?

User currently offlineGCT64 From United Kingdom, joined Nov 2007, 1398 posts, RR: 1
Reply 7, posted (2 years 4 months 1 week 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 10120 times:

Quoting dirtyfrankd (Reply 6):
Does anybody know whether it was his A330 that was struck, or whether it was one of the older A319s or Dassault Falcons?

The BBC news was showing a Falcon 7X, but not clear if that was the original aircraft (that then returned) or the second (replacement) aircraft.



Flown in: A30B,A306,A310,A319,A320,A321,A332,A333,A343,A346,A388,BA11,BU31,B190, B461,B462,(..51 types..),VC10,WESX
User currently offlineN14AZ From Germany, joined Feb 2007, 2715 posts, RR: 25
Reply 8, posted (2 years 4 months 1 week 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 10099 times:

I knew Merkel would send some flashes into his direction but this really goes too far!!!  

User currently offlinecolumba From Germany, joined Dec 2004, 7064 posts, RR: 4
Reply 9, posted (2 years 4 months 1 week 2 days 19 hours ago) and read 10041 times:

Quoting N14AZ (Reply 8):

I knew Merkel would send some flashes into his direction but this really goes too far!!!  

Where is the like button  



It will forever be a McDonnell Douglas MD 80 , Boeing MD 80 sounds so wrong
User currently offlineMadameConcorde From San Marino, joined Feb 2007, 10899 posts, RR: 37
Reply 10, posted (2 years 4 months 1 week 2 days 19 hours ago) and read 9945 times:

There was no lightning only a "risk of lightning". The Falcon 7X went back to Villacoublay after which Mr Hollande boarded a Falcon 900 and started back to Berlin again.

Le Point is a serious publication. I don't put them into doubt.

Quote
Le Falcon 7X a fait demi-tour alors qu'il était en route pour Berlin, de peur d'être frappé par la foudre. Un front de cumulonimbus traverse, en effet, l'est de la France. Les risques étaient pourtant quasi nuls
English:
The Falcon 7X made a turnaround while it was on its way to Berlin by fear of being struck by lightning. A cumulo-nimbus front crossed the East of France. However the risks were almost nil.

http://www.lepoint.fr/politique/avio...cautions-15-05-2012-1461835_20.php

I looked at my own airport live departures and arrivals online. I did not see any of the Air France or Lufthansa flights headed to all the airports in Germany having any delays about that same time or before or after.



There was a better way to fly it was called Concorde
User currently offlineAesma From France, joined Nov 2009, 6669 posts, RR: 11
Reply 11, posted (2 years 4 months 1 week 2 days 19 hours ago) and read 9845 times:

Reports are indeed contradictory. But here, we know about planes. If the 7X hadn't been hit, then it wouldn't have made a U-turn, but merely a detour. Furthermore, there wouldn't have been a change of plane. François Hollande took an older Falcon 900 for the successful trip.


New Technology is the name we give to stuff that doesn't work yet. Douglas Adams
User currently offlineA320ajm From United Kingdom, joined May 2006, 547 posts, RR: 0
Reply 12, posted (2 years 4 months 1 week 2 days 19 hours ago) and read 9806 times:

Quoting MadameConcorde (Reply 10):
English:
The Falcon 7X made a turnaround while it was on its way to Berlin by fear of being struck by lightning. A cumulo-nimbus front crossed the East of France. However the risks were almost nil.

Are certain aircraft better equipped to deal with lightning/bad weather as this suggests? Or is there another reason?

A320ajm



If the British Empire and its Commonwealth last for a thousand years, men will still say, 'This was their finest hour.'
User currently offlineAesma From France, joined Nov 2009, 6669 posts, RR: 11
Reply 13, posted (2 years 4 months 1 week 2 days 18 hours ago) and read 9672 times:

Quoting A320ajm (Reply 12):
Are certain aircraft better equipped to deal with lightning/bad weather as this suggests? Or is there another reason?

The Falcon 7X is very similar to the Falcon 900 so I doubt there is much difference in the way they handle lightning. And the 7X being newer it would have benefited from things learned with previous aircraft, including possibly tighter regulations.

No, the reason there was a change is that the 7X (dubbed Carla One) has been hit.



New Technology is the name we give to stuff that doesn't work yet. Douglas Adams
User currently offlineMadameConcorde From San Marino, joined Feb 2007, 10899 posts, RR: 37
Reply 14, posted (2 years 4 months 1 week 2 days 18 hours ago) and read 9596 times:

Quoting Aesma (Reply 13):
No, the reason there was a change is that the 7X (dubbed Carla One) has been hit.

Many sources saying different things. I looked at the Ministry of Defense website there is no official report on the flight to Berlin.

Le Monde and Liberation the two most notorious left wing news sites are not reporting the flight either.

Le Parisien, the widely read Parisian newspaper has this information
http://www.leparisien.fr/election-pr...elon-jouyet-15-05-2012-2001104.php

Quote:
l'avion du président de la République a été... touché par la foudre au bout de quatre minutes de vol. Il a dû faire demi-tour et prendre un avion de secours
English:
the presidential aircraft was... hit by lightning after 4 minutes of flight. He (the President) had to catch a substitute aircraft.

The Falcon 7X can't have reached a high altitude after only 4 minutes in flight. I see them taking off from Nice airport all the time when I am there.

These jets all belong to the Ministry of Defense. The Falcons are based at Villacoublay (an air base West of Paris).
http://www.ba107.air.defense.gouv.fr/
The A-330 stays at an air base in Evreux. The two Falcon 7X were bought new during Nicolas Sarkozy's presidency.

  

[Edited 2012-05-15 11:39:39]


There was a better way to fly it was called Concorde
User currently offlineA320ajm From United Kingdom, joined May 2006, 547 posts, RR: 0
Reply 15, posted (2 years 4 months 1 week 2 days 17 hours ago) and read 9408 times:

Quoting MadameConcorde (Reply 14):
The Falcon 7X can't have reached a high altitude after only 4 minutes in flight. I see them taking off from Nice airport all the time when I am there.

With all due respect, I don't see how you seeing them take off can lead you to deduce they can't be high after only 4 minutes in flight. The Dassault website states the rate of climb of the Falcon 7x is 3000 ft/min. That would be 12,000 feet after 4 minutes. I'd say that was a fairly high altitude. Although I don't really see the relevance of this to the story unless you are referring to the height of cumulonimbus clouds, but if I remember my Meteorology classes correctly, they can form from around 500-13,000 feet and I'm sure up to 70,000 feet in some extreme cases.

Regards,
A320ajm



If the British Empire and its Commonwealth last for a thousand years, men will still say, 'This was their finest hour.'
User currently offlineLOWS From Austria, joined Oct 2011, 1158 posts, RR: 1
Reply 16, posted (2 years 4 months 1 week 2 days 16 hours ago) and read 9100 times:

I had just read on Twitter on the way home that it was an A320. Is this true or the Dassault?

Does it concern anyone that he was going to a conference on Greece and was struck by lightning?


User currently offlineFN1001 From Moldova, joined Sep 2008, 234 posts, RR: 0
Reply 17, posted (2 years 4 months 1 week 2 days 16 hours ago) and read 9085 times:

http://www.spiegel.de/fotostrecke/sp...-hollande-fotostrecke-82390-5.html

According to a photo in a german newsmagazine, the plane reaching Berlin was

F-RAFP

http://www.airliners.net/search/photo.search?regsearch=F-RAFP



Mai bine să-ţi fie rău decît să-ţi pară rău.
User currently offlineAesma From France, joined Nov 2009, 6669 posts, RR: 11
Reply 18, posted (2 years 4 months 1 week 2 days 14 hours ago) and read 8210 times:

I studied one year at a technical school parallel to Villacoublay airbase's runway (and live under the path of the runway) so I'm used to seeing them. They can climb for sure, especially with a light load.

But of course lightning strikes can happen at any altitude, even 0 feet !



New Technology is the name we give to stuff that doesn't work yet. Douglas Adams
User currently offlineairproxx From France, joined Jun 2008, 636 posts, RR: 0
Reply 19, posted (2 years 4 months 1 week 2 days 13 hours ago) and read 7587 times:

Quoting Aesma (Reply 11):
François Hollande took an older Falcon 900 for the successful trip.

Good old metal never dies!



If you can meet with triumph and disaster, and treat those two impostors just the same
User currently offlinefrancoflier From France, joined Oct 2001, 3766 posts, RR: 11
Reply 20, posted (2 years 4 months 1 week 2 days 5 hours ago) and read 5445 times:

Quoting LOWS (Reply 16):
Does it concern anyone that he was going to a conference on Greece and was struck by lightning?

If that isn't a sign that he shouldn't try to mess with the policy already set by Merkel and Sarkozy, I don't know what it is...
 



Looks like I picked the wrong week to quit posting...
User currently onlinePanHAM From Germany, joined May 2005, 9401 posts, RR: 29
Reply 21, posted (2 years 4 months 1 week 2 days 5 hours ago) and read 5378 times:

Quoting francoflier (Reply 20):
If that isn't a sign that he shouldn't try to mess with the policy already set by Merkel and Sarkozy, I don't know what it is...

absolutely, but I rather think that it was

Quoting N14AZ (Reply 8):
I knew Merkel would send some flashes into his direction but this really goes too far!!!

ZEUS sending the message.....

 

Anyway, nice start.

BTW, for dinner they had fresh asparagus with sauce Hollandaise....
 



E's passed on! That parrot is no more! He has ceased to be! E's expired and gone to meet 'is maker!
User currently offlinechieft From Germany, joined Jun 2005, 357 posts, RR: 0
Reply 22, posted (2 years 4 months 1 week 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 4771 times:

Quoting N14AZ (Reply 8):
I knew Merkel would send some flashes into his direction but this really goes too far!!!

Well, heaven cried and it was a wet day anyway, when Mr. Hollande had its introduction as president. Thus, the flashes were then logical, weren't they? ;-D





Aircraft are marginal costs with wings.
User currently offlinechieft From Germany, joined Jun 2005, 357 posts, RR: 0
Reply 23, posted (2 years 4 months 1 week 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 4745 times:

Quoting dirtyfrankd (Reply 3):
What kind of aircraft was it?

A german newspaper showed this photo and the article said, that this Falcon was the aircraft affected by the lightning strike:





Aircraft are marginal costs with wings.
User currently offlineMadameConcorde From San Marino, joined Feb 2007, 10899 posts, RR: 37
Reply 24, posted (2 years 4 months 1 week 2 days 1 hour ago) and read 4062 times:

What's the big deal? Lightning hits planes all the time.

Planes are designed/built to take lightning strikes. I have been in at least a dozen of them in my life once was in really crazy weather on a United flight. The captains/pilots kept the airplanes flying. There was no turn around back to the airports.

Lightning strikes on airplanes are nothing unusual, and generally there is no damage. This is not news. It happens all the time. They only made it a big deal as it was the new French president's inaugural day followed by a flight to Berlin. I wonder what it cost to the taxpayers to charter a 7X and a 900 for this one trip. Can't he just fly on Air France same as everybody else? They can block the front cabin for him and his people.



There was a better way to fly it was called Concorde
25 GCT64 : The 7X and the 900 are both part of the French presidential/VIP fleet (which is much larger than just those two aircraft and extends up to an A330),
26 Post contains images MadameConcorde : This is true but same as for Air Force One they all cost money to run. They don't fly on water tanks, no remote control, they need ground staff, main
27 PanHAM : you should be able to read that in the national budget which is public domain and can be viewed by each and every citizen. Might be a bit difficult i
28 Aesma : You're saying that implying he earned this money by some legitimate way. And it's a bit rich of you, after supporting Sarko and Carla, the ones that
29 BrouAviation : I am sure he costs of the tickets, the security measurements around the flights at the airports of departure and arrival and all the other consequenc
30 Post contains images MadameConcorde : Family money is legitimate. Prince Albert's travels and personal jets maintenance come out of his own pocket, his personal security is reduced to a d
31 Post contains images falkerker : Yeah, the money he earns by his hard work every day... Presidents need security, specially if your the President of the French Republic, his meetings
32 breiz : The reason I have heard, is that, although planes are structurally safe to sustain lightning strike, the electronics on board may be affected. As a sa
33 Post contains links Viscount724 : Fatal crashes have also been caused by lightning strikes, including this Pan Am 707 in 1963 that killed all 81 aboard. The lightning strike ignited f
34 Post contains links and images MadameConcorde : Hollande is on board the A330 today on the way to the G8 and NATO summits. Also travelling with him on the A330 are his concubine and a number of gove
35 Post contains images BE77 : Good luck with that Should get the sales team from Airbus pretty excited - sounds like there is another A380 order coming in soon.
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