Skippy777 From Netherlands, joined Dec 2001, 863 posts, RR: 0 Posted (3 years 11 months 1 week 2 days 10 hours ago) and read 11753 times:
Lufthansa's member of the Board Mr. Casten Spohr talks in this video that Lufthansa is better than Emirates and explains why. The video starts with the delay onboard during a computer failure at Frankfurt Airport. Mr Casten Spohr starts talking about Emirates at 2.42
ju068 From Vanuatu, joined Aug 2009, 3114 posts, RR: 6
Reply 1, posted (3 years 11 months 1 week 2 days 8 hours ago) and read 11354 times:
I do not about long haul but if we compare Lufthansa's and Emirates' business class product on medium haul flights both are mediocre and leave a lot to be desired.
As for economy class, I found Lufthansa's customer approach better. The only advantage Emirates have is that they operate an all widedoby fleet and have inflight entertainment. inflight entertainment is something Lufthansa could use on their longer flights such as those from Germany to the Middle East.
Both EK and LH seem to use less cabin area per J seat (anyone have numbers?) than other airlines. I know for my employer's business class sales, it pays off. Now, I do not know if it is the corporate contract, but for us LAX-FRA/DUS is far cheaper than LAX-AMS. (About 1/3rd less) Thus, LAX-AMS is off limits to most employees due to cost unless the business is in Amsterdam and no rental car is required. (Fly to FRA and drive back if required.)
"They did not know it was impossible, so they did it!" - Mark Twain
sandyb123 From UK - Scotland, joined Oct 2007, 1256 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (3 years 11 months 6 days 19 hours ago) and read 7086 times:
Quoting Skippy777 (Thread starter): The video starts with the delay onboard during a computer failure at Frankfurt Airport. Mr Casten Spohr starts talking about Emirates at 2.42
His main argument in this conversation is that the Lufthansa product is consistent whereas you take a gamble on EK. But the J product is very different between the A388 and 747-8 . EK has varying J products but I would argue that (certainly with widebodys) that they are on a par in terms of the variability of product.
Semaex From Germany, joined Nov 2009, 923 posts, RR: 2
Reply 7, posted (3 years 11 months 6 days 10 hours ago) and read 6303 times:
Quoting sandyb123 (Reply 5): His main argument in this conversation is that the Lufthansa product is consistent whereas you take a gamble on EK. But the J product is very different between the A388 and 747-8
Correct me if I'm wrong but as far as I know the J product on the A388 will be updated in the medium term to be on par with the new 748 J layout.
// You know you're an aviation enthusiast when you look at your neighbour's cars and think about fleet commonality.
ogepma From UK - England, joined Jan 2011, 67 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (3 years 11 months 2 days 16 hours ago) and read 4886 times:
Quoting Semaex (Reply 7): Correct me if I'm wrong but as far as I know the J product on the A388 will be updated in the medium term to be on par with the new 748 J layout.
The A388 will be refitted in the long term with the new J product on the latest A333's (D-AIKP, KQ and KR all based in MUC) which has a 2-2-2 H V H configuration. This is similar to what is on the 748 (V V V). However, sources say the A388's will be refitted last (by 2014). I also think the A388's delivered after this year's batch will have the new C-class. This vid shows the new product on the A330 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4lj_3qEXQrY
Quokkas From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 11, posted (3 years 11 months 2 days 13 hours ago) and read 4563 times:
It is a shame that the video was recorded where it was as I found it difficult to hear what the questions and the answers were. Not that I blame Spohr. He wouldn't necessarily have known what questions would be asked but his responses are predictable. If you collared Tim Clark he would probably emphasize EK's positives to the detriment of LH. Neither would go out of their way to compliment the other airlines positives.
I did catch Spohr's remark that you have various configurations on Emirates in First and Business Class. This is true but it is also true that EK have been upgrading some of their older aircraft and they will retire some of the others. It is also true that LH has had different configurations over the years and with a much bigger diversity within the fleet (and "partners") that is hardly surprising. On a flight from FRA to HAM I will definitely not get the same Business Class that I would on a flight between MUC and BKK. I also noted that when asked why LH doesn't offer first class on many routes that EK does, he countered that no airline in world does, thereby (involuntarily) admitting that even on LH you will not get consistency.
That isn't a criticism of LH. It simply reflects the fact that not all routes will support First Class. By the same token, can he criticise EK for not offering private suites on all routes? While an overnight flight between PER and DXB may justify one, would a day time flight between DXB and AMM? Can Spohr really criticise EK for offering horses for courses when LH does the same?
ogepma From UK - England, joined Jan 2011, 67 posts, RR: 0
Reply 13, posted (3 years 10 months 3 weeks 2 days 11 hours ago) and read 3325 times:
Quoting Quokkas (Reply 11): This is true but it is also true that EK have been upgrading some of their older aircraft and they will retire some of the others
But is EK planning to offer the J-class seats on the A380 on all of their long-haul fleet? Is EK also planning on offering suits on all "long-haul" flights?
Quoting Quokkas (Reply 11): It is also true that LH has had different configurations over the years and with a much bigger diversity within the fleet (and "partners") that is hardly surprising
But he was speaking specifically of LH. LH has a much lower diversity in configurations within its long haul fleet. On LH, you get a slanted flat seat on all flights (except from the 748s and the latest A330s which offer the new seats). While it may be mediocre when compared to a number of the competition, it is consistent. The number of F seats on the 744s were reduced from 16 seats to 8 seats when the new F was introduced as a way of offering a more consistent product in the interim. 10 744s have the seat and bed configuration while the remaining unconverted 744s have 16 F seats but only 8 are sold. All LH F cabins now have a maximum of 8 passengers. PTV's have been installed in Y-class on almost 80% of the fleet. The conversion process is ongoing. Nothing compared to the latest ICE system found on EK but at least you don't have more then 3 different types of IFE's. On the other hand, EK offers flat seats on the A380, slanted seats on some 777s, cradles seats on some 777s, all a340s, and a330s. All these aircrafts can be used to one destination (MUC, MAN are examples) so a gamble can occur. Passengers who don't know the different products in these aircraft may be lured into purchasing tickets based on what is advertised. On LH, you don't get this as much.
Quoting Quokkas (Reply 11): On a flight from FRA to HAM I will definitely not get the same Business Class that I would on a flight between MUC and BKK.
Very true but a flight from FRA to HAM is considered a short-haul domestic one and the products on short haul flights are consistent across the fleet and even with partner airlines. You cannot expect a long haul product on a flight that's less than 1 hour. On EK, you can book an A330 from DXB to MUC and an A380 on the same route but get totally different products.
Quoting Quokkas (Reply 11): I also noted that when asked why LH doesn't offer first class on many routes that EK does, he countered that no airline in world does, thereby (involuntarily) admitting that even on LH you will not get consistency
I cannot recall the exact routes where he said LH doesn't offer F-class but AFAIK, PHL, NKG, TAO, ATL, SHE and MAA amongst a few others don't have F offered. This does not mean they are inconsistent. They simply do not offer F because demand is generally low. I am almost positive EK doesn't offer F on flights to MAA. I know there are a couple of EK aircraft in 2-class config as well and some A388s are going to be in 2-class as well. So that is a matter of demand and less about consistency. If a passenger wants to purchase F on a route where it is not available, he will choose another route or airline but cannot say they are inconsistent as the product was not available from the start.
Quoting Quokkas (Reply 11): By the same token, can he criticise EK for not offering private suites on all routes? While an overnight flight between PER and DXB may justify one, would a day time flight between DXB and AMM?
Its not necessarily about not offering suites alone but a more consistent product across all classes. I don't think LH is not guilty of this but this is as a result of a conversion process which they have clearly stated on their website. From a personal experience as a passenger, I can attest to his claim. On LH, I expect a reliable, efficient, nice albeit robotic service which I always get while on EK, I have experienced the most wonderful service and some of the worst ones at the same time. I was once on a flight on EK F (night flight) where I asked for a turn down service and was told it wasn't offered on that route. This was in a 77W F Suite. On the return flight (a day flight), it was offered.
From a hard product perspective, that's not hard to do considering EK's product is all over the map, from suites in F to recliners in J to lie-flat that has to be industry leading in terms of narrowness in J on the 380, and everything in between. If an airline puts a consistent lie-flat in F and J and you're already miles ahead of EK in terms of hard product.