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Flights To Berlin  
User currently offlineFLY777UAL From United States of America, joined May 1999, 4512 posts, RR: 3
Posted (15 years 1 month 2 weeks 6 days 11 hours ago) and read 1139 times:

Why don't any (most) airlines offer service to and from Berlin? I was surprised to see that LH had flights from LAX only to FRA and MUC, but not SXF (Berlin Schonfield).

I think that if an airline in LA flew an A340-200 each day, and offered quick and easy connections onto Deutsche BA throughout Europe, the airline might not do too bad...

What do you all think?

FLY777UAL

11 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineTriStar From Belgium, joined Oct 1999, 848 posts, RR: 1
Reply 1, posted (15 years 1 month 2 weeks 6 days 10 hours ago) and read 1062 times:

I may be mistaken, but I think the Schonfield airport is too small -that is, the runways are too short- to allow heavy traffic. I've heard there will be a new, bigger airport in Berlin in the not-so-distant future, said to be called Brandenburg Airport.

Does anyone else have any input on that?

TriStar


User currently offlineThe777Man From United States of America, joined Jul 1999, 6672 posts, RR: 55
Reply 2, posted (15 years 1 month 2 weeks 6 days 8 hours ago) and read 1061 times:

I think Tristar is referring to Templehof and not Schoenefeld or Tegel. There are no direct or nonstop flights at all from North America to Berlin, not even from the east coast. American, TWA and Delta Air Lines used to fly to Berlin, usually with a stop somewhere but all these carriers stopped three-four years ago. I guess there's not enough traffic. Singapore Airlines also stopped flying to Berlin in the last year. Maybe in a few years when Berlin is more established as Germany's capital, there may be enough traffic to the US eastcoast. I think Lufthansa or United Airlines should start flying LAX-MUC nonstop in addition to the FRA flights. The777Man


Need a Boeing 777 Firing Order....Further to fly....CI, MU, LX and LH 777s
User currently offlineTriStar From Belgium, joined Oct 1999, 848 posts, RR: 1
Reply 3, posted (15 years 1 month 2 weeks 6 days 8 hours ago) and read 1057 times:

I think you may be right, 777Man. ;-)
I probably *was* referring to Tempelhof, basically because that's the airport in Berlin I'm most accustomed with. When I'm on a flight to Berlin, it's always Tempelhof...

What's up with the new Brandenburg thing, though? Does anyone have any news on that? I heard Virgin Express would be flying there. Or have they started flying their B737s to another Berlin airport?

TriStar


User currently offlineFlumuc From Germany, joined Oct 1999, 392 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (15 years 1 month 2 weeks 6 days 7 hours ago) and read 1053 times:

You always fly to Tempelhof??? I think that Tempelhof is the smallest of the Berlin airports, and its not served by Lufthansa and not by Deutsche BA. With which airline do you fly to Tempelhof??
Lufthansa just serves Berlin/Tegel


User currently offlineTriStar From Belgium, joined Oct 1999, 848 posts, RR: 1
Reply 5, posted (15 years 1 month 2 weeks 6 days 6 hours ago) and read 1052 times:

That would be Sabena, Flumuc. Flights are operated with Avro RJs. Small airports often have huge advantages. Look at LCY; good slots and good accessibility to the center of town.

TriStar


User currently offlineSpeedbird988G From Germany, joined Nov 1999, 5 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (15 years 1 month 2 weeks 6 days 3 hours ago) and read 1050 times:

OK, guys here is what I think.
I am from Berlin and I know the Airports here.
Schoenfeld is not to small for the bigger aircrafts. There are some flights
to Singapore served by Singapore Airlines with B747-400.
It's the problem that Germany has a lot of big airports like Munich, Frankfurt
and Dusseldorf and so the airlines fly to these airports and do codesharing
to Berlin.

The other thing is that Berlin will get a big international airport in a few years.

By the way some US airlines took service to Berlin for example Delta Airlines and TWA. But this is long ago.

But it is very sad that you cannot see any big airplanes at Berlin Tegel.
I hope this getting better before the new big airport is build.

Speedbird988G



Always happy landings... Berni
User currently offlineLH423 From Canada, joined Jul 1999, 6501 posts, RR: 54
Reply 7, posted (15 years 1 month 2 weeks 6 days 3 hours ago) and read 1043 times:

The run-down of the three Berlin Airports:

Berlin-Schönefeld: Primarily is served by the former Eastern Bloc countries, and other former communist countries, as Schönefeld was the only airport in the former East Berlin.

Berlin-Tempelhof: Was the major airport of West Berlin (american sector) up until the past 15 years. Still seved today by GA, and small European commuters.

Berlin-Tegel: Is the newest airport, as well as the biggest, airport in the Berlin area. Built by the French in the former French sector of West Berlin, today serves as the main airport to Berlin. Tegel is served by most major European airlines, but is very limited to long-haul. Delta used (maybe they still do, i dont know) to fly into Tegel, but through either Amsterdam or Frankfurt and Munich.

LH423



« On ne voit bien qu'avec le cœur. L'essentiel est invisible pour les yeux » Antoine de Saint-Exupéry
User currently offlineGardermoen From Australia, joined Jul 1999, 1523 posts, RR: 1
Reply 8, posted (15 years 1 month 2 weeks 6 days ago) and read 1041 times:

In the early 90s, Berlin also received Air Lanka(weekly from Colombo) and Japan Airlines from Tokyo.

I am confused as to how many airports there are in Berlin. There's Templehof, Tegel and Schonefeld, right? Are they all civilian airports? And when will Brandenburg open?


User currently offlineFlumuc From Germany, joined Oct 1999, 392 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (15 years 1 month 2 weeks 6 days ago) and read 1040 times:

i dont think that they will build the big airport, its too big. There are 2 very huge airports in germany and thats enough and i dont think that a new airport is a reason for an airline to fly to the city where the new airport is.

User currently offlineCedarjet From United Kingdom, joined May 1999, 8197 posts, RR: 54
Reply 10, posted (15 years 1 month 2 weeks 6 days ago) and read 1039 times:

Without even seeing this post, I just did an exhaustive reply to another post about why ex-commie airlines still use Schonefeld. Here's what I put:
Berlin has three airports - Tegel, Templehof and Schonefeld. Before the Iron Curtain came down, Schonefeld was in East Berlin and Tegel was in West Berlin, as was Templehof, which is smaller. Schonefeld is the biggest of the three, and was the hub for Interflug, the East German (commie) national airline. It was a fully-fledged international airport, with Interflug operating scheduled flights to Havana and other parts of Central and South America, throughout Africa and to places like Hanoi and North Korea. All the Commie Bloc airlines used it, and since it is an equal distance from the centre of Berlin, there was no need for them to move to the more congested Tegel. That is why even after the Wall came down, the old Eastern Bloc countries continued using it. I think Schonefeld is going to be the one to be developed now that Berlin is becoming the capital of the reunified nation, since it's got two really long runways (god bless those old Il62s)and masses of room for expansion as it's in open countryside. Tegel is a pain in the arse, really congested and over-stretched.

Tegel and Templehof never developed because West Berlin was a Western enclave within a Communist country, and to get there by air you had to descend to 10,000 feet and fly through one of three designated 'corridors' at a slower speed (220 knts, sometimes 250). This made it unsuitable for long-haul services, so these two airports never grew beyond 737-type flights. I guess there would have been long-haul charters and VIP flights, but FRA was always the long-haul port of entry to West Germany. Templehof was the airport used in the Berlin Airlift, when the city was completely cut off and everything including all food, fuel, coal etc had to be flown in. The airport is small and surrounded by apartment buildings and is like London City airport, a commuter and GA facility with props and BAe 146s. The approach is really steep because of the obstacles. Lots of history at all three."

I don't know why Berlin is so unprofitable nowadays for airlines, arrival restrictions having been lifted ten years ago. When I worked in aviation between 1990 and 1995, many airlines attempted London to Berlin (including LH) and the route was always dropped. Heathrow has a service but probably only on or two a day, but Gatwick lost it's LH flight, and since then a number of others have lost money, such as Dan-Air and latterly AB Airlines, who downgraded from 737s to BAC111s and since their bankruptcy the route authority remains dormant. Same with long-haul services such as SQ and the US airlines mentioned above.




fly Saha Air 707s daily from Tehran's downtown Mehrabad to Mashhad, Kish Island and Ahwaz
User currently offlineThe777Man From United States of America, joined Jul 1999, 6672 posts, RR: 55
Reply 11, posted (15 years 1 month 2 weeks 5 days 20 hours ago) and read 1035 times:

Brandenburg Airport is the new name for a refurbished Schoenefeld which will get a new terminal among other things. I think they will close Templehof and Tegel when Brandenburg opens in a few years.The777Man


Need a Boeing 777 Firing Order....Further to fly....CI, MU, LX and LH 777s
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