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United Starts Terminal 1 Ops At SFO Today  
User currently offlineas739x From United States of America, joined Apr 2003, 6124 posts, RR: 23
Posted (2 years 2 months 3 weeks 1 day 3 hours ago) and read 9635 times:

Today (6/7) United started operating flights from 3 gates in Terminal 1. Note these are ex-CO gates. Other then then a few flights arriving and taxiing the wrong direction it seemed to go relatively smooth. I do not know however how things went on the customer service side.

All SNA/SAN/LAS flights will depart from these gates with remaining SoCal flights moving 7/7 when an additional 3 gates are picked up.

http://blog.sfgate.com/cmcginnis/201...lights-to-terminal-1-at-sfo/?tsp=1

[Edited 2012-06-07 17:34:25]


"Some pilots avoid storm cells and some play connect the dots!"
31 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently onlineJayBird From United States of America, joined Mar 2001, 149 posts, RR: 0
Reply 1, posted (2 years 2 months 3 weeks 1 day 2 hours ago) and read 9368 times:
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wow .. that seriously sucks. Our employes connect through SFO to Vegas all the time for meetings. Correction - use to connect through SFO. I'll have to book them through LAX from now on. Interesting that nothing came down from United Sales about this either.

User currently offlinenycjbird From United States of America, joined Mar 2012, 18 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (2 years 2 months 3 weeks 1 day 2 hours ago) and read 9342 times:

[quote=JayBird,reply=1][/quote

First, this information was made known sometime ago. Second, is it that big a deal? There are shuttle buses being operated from two gate locations in Terminal 3 to Terminal 1 like every 5-10 minutes. No need to go through security again. If you ask me it beats arriving at Terminal 7 or 8 and walking to Terminal 6 in LAX.


User currently offlineCODC10 From United States of America, joined Jul 2000, 2406 posts, RR: 6
Reply 3, posted (2 years 2 months 3 weeks 1 day 1 hour ago) and read 9289 times:

Fortunately, it's not a permanent change. Should be less than a year until the 60s (former AA) gate area is completed.

User currently onlineJayBird From United States of America, joined Mar 2001, 149 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (2 years 2 months 3 weeks 1 day 1 hour ago) and read 9258 times:
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Yeah it is a big deal .. because a lot of times the HNL-SFO flights are late which makes a tight connecting time tighter, and in the reverse a lot of times the LAS-SFO flights are late. When you have to add another mode of transportation (bus) it makes people feel like they don't have control of the situation. At LAX, yes, it is a walk, but the person feels they're in control.

hey - nycjaybird - aloha from hawaii and another jaybird!


User currently offlineas739x From United States of America, joined Apr 2003, 6124 posts, RR: 23
Reply 5, posted (2 years 2 months 3 weeks 1 day 1 hour ago) and read 9118 times:

Quoting JayBird (Reply 4):

Despite the connections, these destinations were chosen as they have the highest amount of O/D passenger and would have the least amount if impact. They also could not use these gates to a destination that occasionally uses a widebody aircraft, since no gates are configured for them over there. Despite the challenges, this will be a temp move till fall '13 when the E concourse opens.

UAL is facing some real challenges at the moment that I am not at liberty to discuss publicly and this was the best that could be made of the situation.



"Some pilots avoid storm cells and some play connect the dots!"
User currently offlineytib From United States of America, joined Nov 2004, 571 posts, RR: 1
Reply 6, posted (2 years 2 months 3 weeks 1 day ago) and read 9066 times:

Quoting JayBird (Reply 4):

Yeah it is a big deal .. because a lot of times the HNL-SFO flights are late which makes a tight connecting time tighter, and in the reverse a lot of times the LAS-SFO flights are late. When you have to add another mode of transportation (bus) it makes people feel like they don't have control of the situation. At LAX, yes, it is a walk, but the person feels they're in control.

Only flights departing to SNA/SAN/LAS will be in T1. If you are coming in from one of those destinations and the aircraft is going elsewhere on the next flight it will be in T3.

LAS-SFO-SEA (T3)
LAS-SFO-SAN (T1)


User currently offlinekgaiflyer From United States of America, joined Jul 2008, 4267 posts, RR: 1
Reply 7, posted (2 years 2 months 3 weeks 14 hours ago) and read 8517 times:
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Okay -- I've been checking 'Flight Status' on United.com -- anticipating flying SFO-SNA / SNA-SFO on Sunday morning / Sunday evening. So far for Friday and Saturday, flights are departing / arriving all over F Concourse plus international gates "92B, 92C, and 92D."

Back on May 27th, I changed from UA to USAirways at SFO using an 016 eticket. We were told that the shuttle bus to Terminal 1 "has been suspended." We were asked to exit F Concourse--take the "Red Airtrain" to Terminal 1--then re-enter and go through the long lines in Terminal 1's TSA.

If I said this felt like the world's greatest, unbridled, unplanned bloody mess and that I would fly WN next time, I'd be understating the case since my comrades were cussing like sailors.

Trust me -- no one will do this expected terminal change more than once before they ditch UA and change airlines. It's pretty obvious the folks who planned this thing don't actually do it themselves.

[Edited 2012-06-08 06:04:33]

User currently offlineCODC10 From United States of America, joined Jul 2000, 2406 posts, RR: 6
Reply 8, posted (2 years 2 months 3 weeks 13 hours ago) and read 8394 times:

Quoting kgaiflyer (Reply 7):
So far for Friday and Saturday, flights are departing / arriving all over F Concourse plus international gates "92B, 92C, and 92D."

These are actually 'bus gates'. Passengers will be herded down to buses and sent to T1 from there, elevators are available.

Quoting kgaiflyer (Reply 7):
We were told that the shuttle bus to Terminal 1 "has been suspended."

Not as of yesterday. The bus is back in operation.


User currently offlinekgaiflyer From United States of America, joined Jul 2008, 4267 posts, RR: 1
Reply 9, posted (2 years 2 months 3 weeks 13 hours ago) and read 8346 times:
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Quoting CODC10 (Reply 8):
Quoting kgaiflyer (Reply 7): So far for Friday and Saturday, flights are departing / arriving all over F Concourse plus international gates "92B, 92C, and 92D."These are actually 'bus gates'. Passengers will be herded down to buses and sent to T1 from there, elevators are available.

I'm told there are elevators only on the F Concourse side. On the Terminal 1 side there (allegedly) is only a poorly lighted stairwell.

But . . . I am a loyal 1-K (74 segments so far this year) so I'll give it a chance.  


User currently offlineCODC10 From United States of America, joined Jul 2000, 2406 posts, RR: 6
Reply 10, posted (2 years 2 months 3 weeks 13 hours ago) and read 8325 times:

Quoting kgaiflyer (Reply 9):

I'm told there are elevators only on the F Concourse side. On the Terminal 1 side there (allegedly) is only a poorly lighted stairwell.

It's there. The gate was specifically chosen because an elevator was nearby.

Whether said elevator is actually in operating condition is another story...

[Edited 2012-06-08 07:11:15]

User currently offlinekgaiflyer From United States of America, joined Jul 2008, 4267 posts, RR: 1
Reply 11, posted (2 years 2 months 3 weeks 13 hours ago) and read 8295 times:
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Quoting CODC10 (Reply 10):
Whether said elevator is actually in operating condition is another story...

I'll give it a try once.


User currently offlineKDCA From United States of America, joined Nov 2005, 132 posts, RR: 0
Reply 12, posted (2 years 2 months 3 weeks 9 hours ago) and read 7079 times:

Does anyone know what the timetable is on the old AA gates? I had heard that they would be just for US and AC, but whenever I am at SFO, it looks like UA could use more space.

User currently offlineCODC10 From United States of America, joined Jul 2000, 2406 posts, RR: 6
Reply 13, posted (2 years 2 months 3 weeks 8 hours ago) and read 7036 times:

Quoting KDCA (Reply 12):
I had heard that they would be just for US and AC, but whenever I am at SFO, it looks like UA could use more space.

My understanding is that UA will be the primary tenant of the space, but US/AC will have operations there as well.


User currently offlinebioyuki From United States of America, joined Nov 2009, 156 posts, RR: 0
Reply 14, posted (2 years 2 months 3 weeks 8 hours ago) and read 6949 times:

I'm flying SFO-SNA tomorrow. If I already have a boarding pass and only have carryon luggage, can I clear security in T1? Or do I have to still clear security in T3 and take the shuttle bus around?


Next flight: UA 726/84 SFO-EWR-TLV
User currently offlinewarden145 From United States of America, joined Aug 2010, 512 posts, RR: 0
Reply 15, posted (2 years 2 months 3 weeks 8 hours ago) and read 6848 times:

Quoting KDCA (Reply 12):
whenever I am at SFO, it looks like UA could use more space.

Based on how many domestic flights have been sent to the international terminal due to lack of gate space in F Concourse since CO moved to F, I would say that that's an understatement.

With that said, I'm a bit disappointed that UA or SFO didn't let any of the ground transportation companies know what was going on. The only reason I knew that this was even planned was from a-net posts, and this thread's the only reason I knew it had actually been implemented. My colleagues (and probably more than one client) are going to be nice and confused now.  



ETOPS = Engine Turns Off, Passengers Swim
User currently offlineSonomaFlyer From United States of America, joined Apr 2010, 1771 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (2 years 2 months 3 weeks 8 hours ago) and read 6782 times:
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This sounds like another unfortunate side-effect of this merger. It's not on the rank and file UA folks but mid and senior management who should have planned all of this out well in advance. If it was planned out well in advance then they didn't publicize it to minimize confusion.

There should be no reason someone should have to leave the "secured" area of the airport to be "re-screened" while making a connection. Hopefully these "bus gates" solve that issue.


User currently offlinePA110 From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 2000 posts, RR: 23
Reply 17, posted (2 years 2 months 3 weeks 5 hours ago) and read 5955 times:
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I just checked in online for my flight to PHX tomorrow morning and my mobile boarding pass says Gate 92. If I recall, that's in the international terminal. Since when did UA start using gates in the international terminal for domestic flights? Can you get between that terminal and the domestic without having to exit and re-enter security?


It's been swell, but the swelling has gone down.
User currently offlinekgaiflyer From United States of America, joined Jul 2008, 4267 posts, RR: 1
Reply 18, posted (2 years 2 months 3 weeks 5 hours ago) and read 5897 times:
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Quoting CODC10 (Reply 8):
Quoting kgaiflyer (Reply 7):
So far for Friday and Saturday, flights are departing / arriving all over F Concourse plus international gates "92B, 92C, and 92D."

These are actually 'bus gates'. Passengers will be herded down to buses and sent to T1 from there, elevators are available.


I'm guessing everything is not going smooth as silk with this operation today, since a number of SNA-SFO arrivals / departures over the next two days appear to have been moved from shuttle bus gates 92B, 92C, and 92D back to conventional F Concourse gates.

However, if there is a problem, I suspect it is over on the Terminal 1 side and not on the the Terminal 3 side.

Can anyone confirm?


User currently offlinekgaiflyer From United States of America, joined Jul 2008, 4267 posts, RR: 1
Reply 19, posted (2 years 2 months 3 weeks 5 hours ago) and read 5826 times:
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Quoting PA110 (Reply 17):
If I recall, that's in the international terminal. Since when did UA start using gates in the international terminal for domestic flights?


SFO-BWI has been known to arrive-depart the international terminal when the same aircraft will change flight numbers and fly to MEX or SJD.


User currently offlineas739x From United States of America, joined Apr 2003, 6124 posts, RR: 23
Reply 20, posted (2 years 2 months 3 weeks 4 hours ago) and read 5750 times:

Quoting kgaiflyer (Reply 9):
I'm told there are elevators only on the F Concourse side. On the Terminal 1 side there (allegedly) is only a poorly lighted stairwell.

There is an elevator @ gate 36

Quoting PA110 (Reply 17):
I just checked in online for my flight to PHX tomorrow morning and my mobile boarding pass says Gate 92.

There are numerous domestic departures from the Intl terminal due to lack of gate space. Your flight most likely arrives from Guadalajara. Just all depends on a/c routing.



"Some pilots avoid storm cells and some play connect the dots!"
User currently offlinelegacyins From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 2070 posts, RR: 0
Reply 21, posted (2 years 2 months 3 weeks 1 hour ago) and read 5212 times:

Quoting PA110 (Reply 17):

I just checked in online for my flight to PHX tomorrow morning and my mobile boarding pass says Gate 92. If I recall, that's in the international terminal. Since when did UA start using gates in the international terminal for domestic flights? Can you get between that terminal and the domestic without having to exit and re-enter security?


They have been using the Int 'l terminal for domestic arrivals/departures for at least five years now. Yes, there is a sterile walkway between UA domestic and The G- gates of the Internatioal terminal. No need to exit security, just follow the signs.



John@SFO
User currently offlineJAAlbert From United States of America, joined Jan 2006, 1583 posts, RR: 1
Reply 22, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 6 days 23 hours ago) and read 5044 times:

Quoting SonomaFlyer (Reply 16):
mid and senior management who should have planned all of this out well in advance.

What plans should they have made? It sounds to me like two airlines with gates on opposite ends of the airport merged. Finding a sufficient number of adjacent gates in an airport that is fully leased sounds like a difficult proposition - at least in the short term. It seems to me United is making the best of a difficult situation.


User currently offlinekgaiflyer From United States of America, joined Jul 2008, 4267 posts, RR: 1
Reply 23, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 6 days 13 hours ago) and read 4798 times:
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Quoting JAAlbert (Reply 22):
What plans should they have made? It sounds to me like two airlines with gates on opposite ends of the airport merged. Finding a sufficient number of adjacent gates in an airport that is fully leased sounds like a difficult proposition - at least in the short term. It seems to me United is making the best of a difficult situation.

The old suspended shuttle that connected UA to USAirways and pmCO meandered all over the airport and took 20-25 minutes to make the trip. In Terminal 1 you were admitted to a dark, dirty portal near gate 21. You were then left alone to climb two flights of poorly lighted steps. There was a person at the top of the steps with a walkie-talkie who certified that you hadn't disappeared in the process.

As of this morning, the shuttle begins at gate 92(A to F) -- continues on to gate 87A to take or deposit passengers -- then wends it way to Terminal 1 to deposit passengers at gate 32.

As of this morning there (appears) to be more than one vehicle involved. That's different than the old days when bored, straight-faced attendents acted as if they really didn't give a s*** if you missed your connection or not.

[Edited 2012-06-09 08:04:14]

User currently offlineSonomaFlyer From United States of America, joined Apr 2010, 1771 posts, RR: 0
Reply 24, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 6 days 13 hours ago) and read 4772 times:
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Quoting JAAlbert (Reply 22):
What plans should they have made? It sounds to me like two airlines with gates on opposite ends of the airport merged. Finding a sufficient number of adjacent gates in an airport that is fully leased sounds like a difficult proposition - at least in the short term. It seems to me United is making the best of a difficult situation.

How about setting up check-in and baggage handling at T1? How about publicizing the changes so people can plan accordingly? How about using the time from 2010 to now to analyze the best way to manage their gate space and perhaps arrange to lease or trade off additional gate space to minimize impact on customers?

Of course its possible there would be no way to do this change any differently but it honestly isn't hard to get the word out and email the affected customers (especially frequent fliers). The email can have a link to a page on UA's website diagramming the process. Their IT section could knock that out in a day.


User currently offlineCODC10 From United States of America, joined Jul 2000, 2406 posts, RR: 6
Reply 25, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 6 days 12 hours ago) and read 4841 times:

Quoting SonomaFlyer (Reply 24):
How about setting up check-in and baggage handling at T1?

I think they considered this and determined that UA signage at curbside in T1 would be confusing to departing passengers since you pass T1 before you get to T3 when driving. Nothing is stopping passengers with a boarding pass and no checked luggage from using the T1 security checkpoint.

Quoting SonomaFlyer (Reply 24):
perhaps arrange to lease or trade off additional gate space to minimize impact on customers?

The issue is, where? The renovation of the 60-gates is why there is such a crunch to begin with, as UA will move in there after completion, solving this terminal shuffle. UA already uses the common-use G concourse to the extent possible, but even that is limited because international operations have priority. T2 is occupied by VX and AA, who use that space quite extensively. The 40-gates are mostly DL, and it would be exceedingly unlikely for a competitor to relinquish space simply for the convenience of the incumbent airline. The A concourse is outside the sterile area of G, so that would require the same transfer as is currently in place. All that remains is the vacant T1 space, which is probably the best option from a set of less-than-favorable alternatives.

[Edited 2012-06-09 08:00:48]

User currently offlineSonomaFlyer From United States of America, joined Apr 2010, 1771 posts, RR: 0
Reply 26, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 6 days 11 hours ago) and read 4744 times:
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Quoting CODC10 (Reply 25):
The issue is, where? The renovation of the 60-gates is why there is such a crunch to begin with, as UA will move in there after completion, solving this terminal shuffle. UA already uses the common-use G concourse to the extent possible, but even that is limited because international operations have priority. T2 is occupied by VX and AA, who use that space quite extensively. The 40-gates are mostly DL, and it would be exceedingly unlikely for a competitor to relinquish space simply for the convenience of the incumbent airline. The A concourse is outside the sterile area of G, so that would require the same transfer as is currently in place. All that remains is the vacant T1 space, which is probably the best option from a set of less-than-favorable alternatives.

I appreciate the clarification. All that leaves is the communication issues which continue to crop up at UA.


User currently offlineCODC10 From United States of America, joined Jul 2000, 2406 posts, RR: 6
Reply 27, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 6 days 10 hours ago) and read 4656 times:

Quoting SonomaFlyer (Reply 26):
All that leaves is the communication issues which continue to crop up at UA.

With that, you've arrived at the very root of the problem...  


User currently offlinemalaysia From United States of America, joined Nov 1999, 3343 posts, RR: 0
Reply 28, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 6 days 9 hours ago) and read 4566 times:

I am wondering if they can extend a published option for UA to US pax to use this shuttle?


There Are Those Who Believe That There May Yet Be Other Airlines Who Even Now Fight To Survive Beyond The Heavens
User currently offlinekgaiflyer From United States of America, joined Jul 2008, 4267 posts, RR: 1
Reply 29, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 6 days 8 hours ago) and read 4557 times:
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Quoting malaysia (Reply 28):
I am wondering if they can extend a published option for UA to US pax to use this shuttle?

As of this morning, such an explanatory sheet comes out of your printer with your boarding passes


User currently offlineRoseflyer From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 9607 posts, RR: 52
Reply 30, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 6 days 8 hours ago) and read 4504 times:

Quoting SonomaFlyer (Reply 24):

How about setting up check-in and baggage handling at T1? How about publicizing the changes so people can plan accordingly? How about using the time from 2010 to now to analyze the best way to manage their gate space and perhaps arrange to lease or trade off additional gate space to minimize impact on customers?

SFO was a mess even before the merger with a lack of gate space during the international departure bank and associated domestic arrivals and departures. UA was a big proponent of Terminal 2 renovation to get AA out of Terminal 3. With the CO merger, the gate squeeze became more of a problem. UA already got Air Canada out of Terminal 3. They had the intention of having Air Canada and Continental in Terminal 3 after AA moved. The unfortunate state of the terminal required major renovations.

It's just a temporary problem. It has been known for a while that gate space issues in SFO would be a problem. They are doing the best they can with renovations but it takes time. With the challenges they faced, I am not surprised there have been problems.



If you have never designed an airplane part before, let the real designers do the work!
User currently offlinekgaiflyer From United States of America, joined Jul 2008, 4267 posts, RR: 1
Reply 31, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 5 days 7 hours ago) and read 4035 times:
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As it turned out, my boarding pass said "gate 92B". However, since the shuttle (apparently) runs in only one direction, you can board at gate 87A, 92, or 36. All areas seem to have fresh paint and lighting and brand new seating. I spotted four busses in operation and one parked, so waits are minimal. So far, so good.


[Gate 92B -- Actually gate 33 shared with both FL, WN]


[New paint, lighting, and furniture in Terminal 1 area]

[Edited 2012-06-10 13:00:16]

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