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Indian Aviation Thread: Part 98  
User currently offlineLAXDESI From United States of America, joined May 2005, 5086 posts, RR: 48
Posted (2 years 2 months 3 weeks 2 hours ago) and read 19752 times:

As per AAI, for the fiscal year 2011-2012 ending in March, Indian aviation traffic recorded the following growth:
http://www.airportsindia.org.in/traffic_news/mar2k12annex3.pdf

Domestic 122 million (15% growth)
Intl............ 41 million ( 8% growth)
Total.........163 million ( 13% growth)

For reference, USA which is currently the largest aviation market is about 700 million passengers. One would expect the growth to decline in the future due to expected slowdown in both the Indian and global economy.

DEL at 36 million is about 5 million more passengers than BOM.

205 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineJOYA380B747 From India, joined Mar 2005, 497 posts, RR: 1
Reply 1, posted (2 years 2 months 3 weeks 2 hours ago) and read 19745 times:

Quoting LAXDESI (Thread starter):
DEL at 36 million

Thats some growth over the last fiscal, where it was around 29 million pax.



If it wasn't for AI and those money mongers sitting in the parliament, 9W would have been as big as SQ...:(
User currently offlineLAXDESI From United States of America, joined May 2005, 5086 posts, RR: 48
Reply 2, posted (2 years 2 months 3 weeks 2 hours ago) and read 19726 times:

Quoting JOYA380B747 (Reply 1):
Thats some growth over the last fiscal, where it was around 29 million pax.

My understanding is that DEL has capability to handle nearly 60 million passengers and it has enough land to grow to about 100 million passengers.

Another thing to note about Indian aviation is that the top five airports in India(DEL,BOM,MAA,BLR,CCU) account for 62% of the total traffic. It use to be even higher in the past.

[Edited 2012-06-13 10:20:17]

User currently offlineaeroblogger From India, joined Dec 2011, 1363 posts, RR: 0
Reply 3, posted (2 years 2 months 3 weeks 1 hour ago) and read 19706 times:

Quoting LAXDESI (Thread starter):
One would expect the growth to decline in the future due to expected slowdown in both the Indian and global economy.

While the economy is slowing down, I expect to continue to see growth in the sector, as liberalization continues and demand grows.



Airports 2012: IXE HYD DEL BLR BOM CCU KNU KTM BKK SIN ICN LAX BUR SFO PHX IAH ORD EWR PHL PVD BOS FRA MUC IST
User currently offlineLAXDESI From United States of America, joined May 2005, 5086 posts, RR: 48
Reply 4, posted (2 years 2 months 3 weeks 1 hour ago) and read 19683 times:

Quoting aeroblogger (Reply 3):
While the economy is slowing down, I expect to continue to see growth in the sector, as liberalization continues and demand grows.

I meant to say growth rate will decline and not growth. The current growth rate is less than the average growth rate of recent past. Law of large numbers is coming into play.


User currently offlineBLRAviation From India, joined Feb 2009, 343 posts, RR: 14
Reply 5, posted (2 years 2 months 3 weeks ago) and read 19610 times:

Quoting aeroblogger (Reply 3):
While the economy is slowing down, I expect to continue to see growth in the sector, as liberalization continues and demand grows.

Rohit, there is a direct correlation between rate of GDP growth and air traffic growth. Normally 1.5x ~ 2x. So do not expect too much in 2012~13.



I am on Twitter @BLRAviation
User currently offlinevin2basketball From United States of America, joined Dec 2009, 313 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 6 days 19 hours ago) and read 19498 times:

Quoting BLRAviation (Reply 5):

Rohit, there is a direct correlation between rate of GDP growth and air traffic growth. Normally 1.5x ~ 2x. So do not expect too much in 2012~13.


Which even at the Q1 GDP growth rate implies 7.5-10% traffic growth in 2012. The avg multiplier for India in the last year is somewhere in the range of 1.2-1.3 implying traffic growth rate of around 6% if GDP growth settles at 5%.


User currently offlineLAXDESI From United States of America, joined May 2005, 5086 posts, RR: 48
Reply 7, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 6 days 19 hours ago) and read 19494 times:

Air India pilots suspect ulterior motive in hard stance against them.
http://economictimes.indiatimes.com/...inst-them/articleshow/14108393.cms

Quote:
A no-compromise approach adopted by Civil Aviation Minister Ajit Singh and the Rs 30,000-crore bailout package have allegedly led to the hardening of stance by the government in its dealings with the agitating Air India pilots, which is in sharp contrast to the soft manner in which the government dealt with the striking pilots of erstwhile Indian Airlines a year ago.

Sources in the aviation ministry told ET that the IPG was told clearly that the environment has changed and that they can no longer be treated the same way as the ICPA. Also, much of what is transpiring currently at Air India comes from the fact that Ajit Singh does not share the same sympathy with the unions as former minster Vyalar Ravi.


User currently offlineaeroblogger From India, joined Dec 2011, 1363 posts, RR: 0
Reply 8, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 6 days 15 hours ago) and read 19409 times:

Quoting BLRAviation (Reply 5):

Rohit, there is a direct correlation between rate of GDP growth and air traffic growth. Normally 1.5x ~ 2x. So do not expect too much in 2012~13.

10% growth is nothing to sneeze at...



Airports 2012: IXE HYD DEL BLR BOM CCU KNU KTM BKK SIN ICN LAX BUR SFO PHX IAH ORD EWR PHL PVD BOS FRA MUC IST
User currently offlineLAXDESI From United States of America, joined May 2005, 5086 posts, RR: 48
Reply 9, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 6 days 14 hours ago) and read 19384 times:

Taxes make Indian airfares 200-300 per cent higher than China: Jet Airways chief Naresh Goyal said on Monday, asserting that the aviation industry could not grow with such taxation.
http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/b...esh-Goyal/articleshow/14024264.cms

Jet Airways' promoter Naresh Goyal changes stand, open to FDI in aviation.
http://articles.economictimes.indiat...esh-goyal-sky-team-indian-carriers


User currently offlineaeroblogger From India, joined Dec 2011, 1363 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 6 days 13 hours ago) and read 19373 times:

Quoting LAXDESI (Reply 9):
Taxes make Indian airfares 200-300 per cent higher than China: Jet Airways chief Naresh Goyal said on Monday, asserting that the aviation industry could not grow with such taxation.

Common sense... If only the government possessed some.

Quoting LAXDESI (Reply 9):
Jet Airways' promoter Naresh Goyal changes stand, open to FDI in aviation.

Now that it's pretty clear that IT won't be able to benefit (nobody in their right mind would invest now), he has no problems with it...



Airports 2012: IXE HYD DEL BLR BOM CCU KNU KTM BKK SIN ICN LAX BUR SFO PHX IAH ORD EWR PHL PVD BOS FRA MUC IST
User currently offlinevin2basketball From United States of America, joined Dec 2009, 313 posts, RR: 0
Reply 11, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 6 days 13 hours ago) and read 19369 times:

Quoting aeroblogger (Reply 8):
10% growth is nothing to sneeze at...

Ehh no, see my post above, but growth isn't likely to be 10%


User currently offlineLAXDESI From United States of America, joined May 2005, 5086 posts, RR: 48
Reply 12, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 6 days 13 hours ago) and read 19356 times:

Quoting vin2basketball (Reply 6):
Which even at the Q1 GDP growth rate implies 7.5-10% traffic growth in 2012. The avg multiplier for India in the last year is somewhere in the range of 1.2-1.3 implying traffic growth rate of around 6% if GDP growth settles at 5%.
Quoting vin2basketball (Reply 11):
Ehh no, see my post above, but growth isn't likely to be 10%

The average GDP growth rate during the aviation fiscal year April 2011-March 2012 was 7.1%. From the OP, aviation sector had a growth rate of 13% which yields a growth factor of 1.83(13/7.1).

Assuming a GDP growth rate of 5-6% and growth factor of 1.8 for the current aviation fiscal year, aviation growth of 9-11% is likely. Time will tell.


User currently offlineBLRAviation From India, joined Feb 2009, 343 posts, RR: 14
Reply 13, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 6 days 12 hours ago) and read 19333 times:

Quoting aeroblogger (Reply 8):
10% growth is nothing to sneeze at...

Please read my interview with Dinesh Keskar. Last year Indian air traffic growth was in the upper teens, yet it was a profit-less growth. Massive growth with massive losses are an oxymoron driven by extreme over-capacity. Both 9W and 6E are guilty of contributing to this over-capacity by adding planes at a breakneck pace.

The fact that the Kingfisher fleet has reduced from 64 to 16 aircraft, with hardly a dent in airfares, shows how much more capacity needs to be removed from the system.

In case of 6E, they placed a massive order, and the world has very little demand for A320 classics now that the neo is 4 years away, so they have to take the aircraft, but I do not understand why Jet is expanding its fleet without a corresponding increase in market share.

Quoting LAXDESI (Reply 9):
Jet Airways' promoter Naresh Goyal changes stand, open to FDI in aviation.

Sorry to say this, but Mr. Goyal is a very big hypocrite in my humble opinion. He has been using his massive political clout and engineering India's civil aviation policy to suit his airline for over 20 years now. He has been blocking FDI since it would badly affect Jet Airways. Now with the writing on the wall he cannot be seen as blocking, plus he realises with the almost demise of IT, 9W valuation has increased dramatically, at least from a business importance view, not a financial view.

Despite all the indirect help Jet and he have received over the years from successive administrations, Jet Airways' performance has plateaued out. Just like Dr. Mallya, the operational control of Jet needs to be removed from the Goyal family and put in to the hands of serious professionals, and not figureheads.



I am on Twitter @BLRAviation
User currently offlinefreqflyer From India, joined Apr 2006, 100 posts, RR: 0
Reply 14, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 6 days 1 hour ago) and read 19141 times:

Quoting BLRAviation (Reply 13):

The fact that the Kingfisher fleet has reduced from 64 to 16 aircraft, with hardly a dent in airfares,

Reduction in capacity should cause an increase in fares - not dents. And an increase is what we are seeing, whatever the reason.

Quoting BLRAviation (Reply 13):
In case of 6E, they placed a massive order, and the world has very little demand for A320 classics now that the neo is 4 years away, so they have to take the aircraft,


IIRC, 6E also ordered 30 new OEOs alongwith the NEOs . There is no indication that they wish they hadn't. Since the productions slots for the NEOs are almost full, the OEOs will continue to be in operation around the world. The lower capital cost for used frames will offset the relatively higher fuel costs.


User currently onlinelightsaber From United States of America, joined Jan 2005, 13046 posts, RR: 100
Reply 15, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 6 days ago) and read 19087 times:
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Quoting aeroblogger (Reply 8):
10% growth is nothing to sneeze at...

That would be *excellent* growth for the US or Europe.

Quoting BLRAviation (Reply 13):
Both 9W and 6E are guilty of contributing to this over-capacity by adding planes at a breakneck pace.

We can debate on the sources of 6E's profit, but as long as they are profitable, why not expand quickly?

Quoting BLRAviation (Reply 13):
The fact that the Kingfisher fleet has reduced from 64 to 16 aircraft, with hardly a dent in airfares, shows how much more capacity needs to be removed from the system.

Air fares went up with the downsizing.

AI's strike helped even more:
http://www.moneycontrol.com/news/cnb...india-strike-continues_716939.html

What is up with searching Google today? I searched for Kingfisher, Indigo, and others airline terms and it found no news documents (limited search to news). Normally I would provide more links... I've done search for work and also no documents were showing up... (very strange...).

Quoting LAXDESI (Reply 12):
Assuming a GDP growth rate of 5-6% and growth factor of 1.8 for the current aviation fiscal year, aviation growth of 9-11% is likely. Time will tell.

Thank you for the numbers.

Lightsaber



Societies that achieve a critical mass of ideas achieve self sustaining growth; others stagnate.
User currently offlinesankaps From United States of America, joined Jan 2008, 2255 posts, RR: 2
Reply 16, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 5 days 22 hours ago) and read 19039 times:

Mallya "too smart to fail"?

See http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/4b43db0c-b...a6-00144feabdc0.html#axzz1xngQtWHl .

Excerpt:

"Kingfisher has never turned a profit since it was founded in 2005 and its market share has shrunk, from the second largest to the smallest among India’s six carriers.

Mr Mallya’s friends say he has performed a miracle keeping the airline aloft, considering its net debt of about $1.5bn, by scaling down its fleet and pruning routes to a handful of profitable links between major cities.

Suhel Seth, managing partner of Counselage, a New Delhi-based marketing consultancy, says Mr Mallya “is too smart to fail”.

He “knows how to work the system and to my mind he was worked it to the advantage not only of himself but even to his customers,” Mr Seth says."

End of excerpt.

I do not place too much faith personally in Suhel Seth's airline business acumen, but it is telling that he can freely make such a claim. And he is a good personal friend of Mallya, judging from how he has hung around with him in the IPL VIP box over the years, so he is hardly unbiased.

Your thoughts?


User currently onlinelightsaber From United States of America, joined Jan 2005, 13046 posts, RR: 100
Reply 17, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 5 days 21 hours ago) and read 19004 times:
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Quoting sankaps (Reply 16):
Mr Mallya’s friends say he has performed a miracle keeping the airline aloft, considering its net debt of about $1.5bn, by scaling down its fleet and pruning routes to a handful of profitable links between major cities.

Suhel Seth, managing partner of Counselage, a New Delhi-based marketing consultancy, says Mr Mallya “is too smart to fail”.

Are they profitable? I seriously question that. Even if the $1.5 billion of debt is ignored.

But that debt cannot be ignored. Over $100 million per operating aircraft in a high cost structured company. Mr. Mallay is obviously smart, but no one can manage a company from that level of debt per narrowbody aircraft to profitability and:
1. In an extreamely competitive environment.
2. Kingfisher airlines currently has a tarnished brand image (results in lower RASM)
3. Kingfisher is cut off from the travel agencies (results in a lower RASM)
4. A reputation for irregular flight schedules (is IT flying with decent ontime and dispatch performance now?).
5. Lack of international transfer customers (should boost RASM, at least for 9W).

At this point, any IT route in the black is just a route waiting for 6E to step in.

I'm impressed IT is still flying. I do not believe in 18 months they still will be flying. If anyone has an aircraft delivery schedule for 9W and 6E, I could fine tune that prediction further.   

Quoting aeroblogger (Reply 10):
Now that it's pretty clear that IT won't be able to benefit

I share that sentiment.


Lightsaber



Societies that achieve a critical mass of ideas achieve self sustaining growth; others stagnate.
User currently offlineHAWK21M From India, joined Jan 2001, 31679 posts, RR: 56
Reply 18, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 18898 times:

Quoting sankaps (Reply 16):
Suhel Seth, managing partner of Counselage, a New Delhi-based marketing consultancy, says Mr Mallya “is too smart to fail”.

Friends will support friends till the end  

Heard that AI might be headed for a temp lockout if the strike continues.



Think of the brighter side!
User currently offlinevin2basketball From United States of America, joined Dec 2009, 313 posts, RR: 0
Reply 19, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 5 days 6 hours ago) and read 18792 times:

Quoting lightsaber (Reply 15):

Traffic growth was 5% in May after 6% in April and 2-3% in March.


User currently offlineaeroblogger From India, joined Dec 2011, 1363 posts, RR: 0
Reply 20, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 5 days 5 hours ago) and read 18771 times:

Quoting vin2basketball (Reply 19):
Traffic growth was 5% in May after 6% in April and 2-3% in March.

That's it? I would have expected it to be higher for May... I understand the low March figure because of the massive decrease in ASKs with IT cutting flights.



Airports 2012: IXE HYD DEL BLR BOM CCU KNU KTM BKK SIN ICN LAX BUR SFO PHX IAH ORD EWR PHL PVD BOS FRA MUC IST
User currently offlineLAXDESI From United States of America, joined May 2005, 5086 posts, RR: 48
Reply 21, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 5 days 2 hours ago) and read 18695 times:

Jet Airways to withdraw JFK flights from September. If they can't make JFK work, why are they planning to add 9 A333?
http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/b...tember-10/articleshow/14151133.cms

Quote:
Jet Airways recently decided to cut money-losing international routes, including long-haul flights to Johannesburg and some short-haul flights to the Gulf as part of a consolidation plan. Jet Airways today said it would withdraw its services to New York (JFK) from September 10, though it would continue to operate to Newark International Airport.

The premier airline, which posted a loss of over Rs 294 crore($53 million) in the quarter ended March 31, said that as part of its "ongoing network evaluation with clear focus on profitability, (the airline) will be redeploying its assets on its existing route network.

"This has hence necessitated the temporary suspension of the airline's Brussels-New York (JFK) flight effective 10th September 2012." An airline spokesperson said regular daily services would "continue uninterrupted to two major gateways in North America, Newark and Toronto, with its Mumbai-Brussels-Newark and Delhi-Brussels-Toronto routes." Jet would also continue to operate its daily service on the Chennai-Brussels-Chennai route, the spokesperson said.

[Edited 2012-06-15 09:47:08]

User currently offlineLAXDESI From United States of America, joined May 2005, 5086 posts, RR: 48
Reply 22, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 5 days 1 hour ago) and read 18667 times:

IndiGO launches five daily flights to Dubai, Bangkok. Perfect opportunity to take over bilateral slots as others are struggling.
http://economictimes.indiatimes.com/...i-bangkok/articleshow/14151895.cms

Quote:
Expanding its international operations, low cost carrier - IndiGo today announced the launch of five new daily direct flights connecting Dubai and Bangkok with Chennai, Hyderabad, Kochi and Delhi from August.

The airline will launch three new flights to Dubai from Hyderabad, Chennai and Kochi while one additional daily direct from Delhi. It will also begin a new flight on Delhi-Bangkok sector.


User currently offlineJOYA380B747 From India, joined Mar 2005, 497 posts, RR: 1
Reply 23, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 5 days 1 hour ago) and read 18660 times:

Quoting LAXDESI (Reply 21):
Jet Airways to withdraw JFK flights from September. If they can't make JFK work, why are they planning to add 9 A333?

I totally agree, and I don't understand Jet's marketing strategy here by citing JFK as a loss making route. If they are indeed inducting those 333s and deciding to add more flight in North America, why not just say so?
I don't understand but 9W is by now infamous for its conflicting press releases.



If it wasn't for AI and those money mongers sitting in the parliament, 9W would have been as big as SQ...:(
User currently offline777way From Pakistan, joined Dec 2005, 5716 posts, RR: 4
Reply 24, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 18600 times:

MAS cargo have launched once weekly A332F service to MAA as KUL-MAA-CMB-KUL since May.

25 ojas : 6E to go double daily DEL - BKK eff 10AUG 6E 43 DEL - BKK 1825 0010+1 6E 44 BKK - DEL 0110 0410 Daily A320 operation
26 lightsaber : Thank you. It there a list of bilateral rights 6E has requested? Also, of India's weekly rights to Dubai, how many are unused? I would expect 6E to h
27 aeroblogger : No, overall growth in the Indian sector. It is affected by IT's rapid drawdown, but it also mirrors the slow GDP growth India has had so far this yea
28 Post contains links LAXDESI : Government not waiting for striking AI pilots to return. I hope this tough stance is for real, and will survive political pressure. http://economictim
29 Post contains links LAXDESI : IndiGo, SpiceJet's market share up; Air India, Kingfisher lose ground. Could 2013 be the year Indigo ends up with highest market share? Given the curr
30 aeroblogger : A significant amount of the marketshare drop can be attributed to the strike...
31 777way : AI Cargo have ended freighter operations, any idea where the six 737F went?
32 aeroblogger : Probably retired? They were old... But I'm not sure. Let me see if I can find out...
33 lightsaber : Was is more striking is the unaccounted part of the market is 5.3%. The only missing airline's market share is IT... Amazes me seeing IT going from #
34 HAWK21M : Heard 5 B732F +1 B732C are still stored,But I guess they'll be scrapped for spares.....Only countries Interested would be in Africa & South Ameri
35 mk777 : When does LH start service to DEL with the 748?
36 sturmovik : What happened to all the old pax A310s that were converted to freighters? Didn't Deccan 360 take one or two? Any idea where these aicraft are now? My
37 Post contains links LAXDESI : Air India's contingency plan in peril as 30 executive pilots report sick. http://economictimes.indiatimes.com/...port-sick/articleshow/14282600.cms Qu
38 blrBird : Yes, in winter '12 schedule i think.
39 Post contains links LAXDESI : 14 international flights abroad cause 80% of AI loss. If true, this explains why the management is being tough with the striking pilots. I wonder if A
40 aeroblogger : While I think that coming to this conclusion probably required some creatinve accounting, it certainly wouldn't surprise me. Those ULH flights to the
41 Post contains links LAXDESI : Air India loses around Rs 500 crore, extends contingency plan till July. http://economictimes.indiatimes.com/...till-july/articleshow/14303081.cms Quo
42 lightsaber : Obviously a rationalization must occur. DEL-YYZ is losing ~65 million dollars per year? The purchase price of the airframe quickly drops into the noi
43 Post contains images aeroblogger : Yeah, $60 million a year is ridiculously high. These ULH routes must be rationalized. And it needs to happen soon - the current situation w/r/t ULH r
44 Post contains images lightsaber : Poor AI, the logic escapes me... AI needs to be run like a business. Rationalize hubbing at DEL/BOM to maximize the RASM and cut the routes that will
45 Post contains images aeroblogger : At the beginning, 9W declared that it was like EK and that it would be highly successful alone. After AI and IT were happily in bed with *A and OW re
46 Post contains images lightsaber : I agree 9W could choose their alliance. None want to be left out of India. However, my point is that 9W will see a rapid increase in revenue after jo
47 YTZ : Interesting that ULH to North America is losing money. Any reasons why? One would think, that these would be solid money-makers for any airline given
48 aeroblogger : Everything. AI wanted exclusivity in *A. *A wanted both AI and 9W. MoCA declared the 1 airline per alliance rule. AI's membership was suspended. Very
49 Post contains images lightsaber : I would disagree. The hubs in Europe will continue to funnel a large amount of traffic to India. Right now the issue is the lack of Indian carriers i
50 aeroblogger : Because yields on USA-India are in the toilet, and ULH are incredibly expensive to operate. A well managed carrier would have a lot of difficulty mak
51 kiwiandrew : I think, reading between the lines, they have chosen which alliance they would prefer to join - Star. ( yes, I admit to having a *A bias, but I still
52 Post contains links LAXDESI : Air India (Partially) Reveals Tentative Australia Route Schedule. http://aeroblogger.com/home/ Quote: While Air India continues to wait for approval t
53 tayaramecanici : This has to be viewed alongwith the withdrawl of the JNB flight, both of these decisions have been not too long after the codeshare with EK was inked
54 Post contains links and images lightsaber : Is there a link? I'd like to know more details. The links I found were from 2008! http://gulfnews.com/business/aviatio...ilateral-code-sharing-pact-1
55 LAXDESI : Can AI make money flying B788 to JFK from DEL? Some back of the envelope calculations: DEL-JFK is around 6,500 nm, and at still air AI 256 seat B788 s
56 Post contains images tayaramecanici : 6E is already nibbling into EK's revenue where 9W has been trying to shore up. 9W has pulled out of HYD/MAA - DXB, 6E has quickly added services on t
57 Post contains images JOYA380B747 : I believe 9W is waiting for AI to back off from Star or something, their first choice seems to be Star no matter what, the proof being their recent r
58 Post contains images BLRAviation : The fuel burn is so expensive on these ULH flights that the only way to make money is have a massive business class which goes reasonably full with f
59 Post contains images comorin : I have taken the gutsy move of booking a flight this weekend on AI from BLR to MAA and returning on IT just to save a measly $20! Will let you know ho
60 Post contains links aeroblogger : Welcome To Air India, Your Palace In The Sky (by aeroblogger Jun 22 2012 in Trip Reports)
61 comorin : Thanks for the link. I actually like Air India, except for the ground service. New planes, cheerful interiors and just enough service on board. Also
62 goacom : Yeah, I would amend their tag line with the addition ... Air India .. hell on the ground. BTW, is it legal to take off with a passenger not having a
63 Post contains images comorin : Air India has become the laughing stock of airline forums everywhere, and your brother's tale takes the cake. Somebody, anybody, please put this budd
64 golfradio : If it was the cockpit jump seat, I am sure he would not have complained. I know it is illegal, just saying.
65 JOYA380B747 : Please tell me your brother sued AI.... because though I may not know the laws appropriately, but for something like this you can sue for your trip c
66 aeroblogger : That "passenger" was likely a nonrev - that's the only explanation I can think of...
67 comorin : I think you are right - a friend of mine once had to sit in the jumpseat and he was flying non-rev.
68 LJ : How amny predicted they'll still flying today? BTW Speaking of orders and deliveries, the IT order is still in the order book of Airbus. Aren't they
69 Post contains images lightsaber : Thank you. I enjoyed the read. 6E has an interesting strategy. 9W is trying to get back into the black any way they can. If codesharing with EK/QR/EY
70 Post contains images HAWK21M : Violation by the Airline.....
71 tayaramecanici : Obviously the network has to be spread out beyond the Indian sub-continent to cater to these folks from S.Asia, especially the India Biz & 'F' pa
72 lightsaber : India missed a HUGE opportunity to provide connections. Europe to Australia is shorter via DEL and DEL is better located (closer to Australia, the lo
73 tayaramecanici : Its more than just the issue of CRACKS, which were factored as the largest customer for a yet unproven product the risks were always there, however w
74 HAWK21M : Whats this about KF shutting down temporarily post 1st July until Aviation FDI is permitted.Aircraft not flying will only add to the losses.......wake
75 aeroblogger : I've only heard it on A-India so far. Haven't seen it anywhere else.
76 goacom : According to my brother, he was a regular passenger, but AI had issued two passengers to the same seat. They both had boarding passes, but with the s
77 aeroblogger : How do you know he was a regular passenger? Nonrevs get boarding passes too. I find it very difficult to believe that AI would trash regulations like
78 JOYA380B747 : There is custom of offering one of them a seat in upper classes if they are available, and I'm sure that AI flight had free seats elsewhere.... all a
79 aeroblogger : To a revenue passenger, SOP would be to send the passenger to the ops agent (gate agent), who would rebook the passenger in any available seat, regar
80 HAWK21M : Overbooking to cater to last minute cancellation is an accepted Airline process......in case of overbook pax numbers,some are offered goodies of an up
81 comorin : Hello all. I survived my trip BLR-MAA-BLR on AI and IT: Both trips went very well, and the staff did an excellent job with a smile, even though they m
82 Post contains links and images Cricket : Hey guys, posting after a long time as I recently changed jobs and realised that I have very little spare time on my hands. Came across this story on
83 Post contains links JOYA380B747 : http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indira_Gandhi_International_Airport Wiki data shows Delta restarting JFK-DEL in Jan '13, how solid is this news?
84 ojas : What code share agreement? It's just that one unilateral code share wherein EK puts its code on one of 9Ws BOM - DXB and DEL - DXB flights.
85 Post contains images aeroblogger : Probably via a European SkyTeam hub like their BOM flight. Would be a nice slap in the face of 9W if they routed via MXP
86 ojas : According to the GDS, Effective 01st September BOM, BLR will see 10 weekly services from MH. MH 174 KUL - BOM 0920 1145 We, Fr, Su MH 175 BOM - KUL 12
87 tayaramecanici : Thank god for that, i never expected them to get away with any more from DEL/BOM. These 2 cities feed the most 'J' class pax, codeshare with a FSC al
88 Post contains images JOYA380B747 : Is there any news on AI's 787 delivery dates this month (or ever ) or have they pushed delivery further? The South Carolina facility must be restless
89 aeroblogger : It's gone quiet. I don't expect to hear more about the matter until Ajit Singh gets back from vacation (July 7th).
90 777way : Are mainline AI resuming Kuala Lumpur in August?
91 aeroblogger : I think KUL is completely IX... I might be mistaken though.
92 777way : Etihad Cargo have quit CCU, do they plan to launch passenger service there?
93 aeroblogger : EY will probably return to CCU sooner or later - it's a top 5 metro area...
94 Post contains links Cricket : Whoa! Kingfisher's bankers are talking of selling Vijay Mallya's Goa mansion. Hitting him where it hurts! And also selling Kingfisher House - somethin
95 HAWK21M : Will that suffice......VJMs best bet is to close shop and restart at a later date....
96 anshuk : They say that, but until unless he personally guaranteed a certain part of Kingfisher's loans, they can try to recover from his Goa mansion but will
97 HAWK21M : So whats the latest with the IPG at AI.....Heard the refresher medicals will take 3-4 months to cover all the IPG pilots.....
98 Vimanav : I'm still waiting for somebody to tell me what subject VJM did his PhD in... Vimanav
99 legacyins : Dr Vijay Mallya - Chairman, Kingfisher Airlines Dr. Vijay Mallya holds a PhD in Business Administration, is a well known industrialist and a Member o
100 AirIndia : hopefully he doesnt end up with ruins of UB Group........
101 WestWing : I have a foggy memory from some years back - of some reporter noting that Mr. Mallya's web-bio indicated that he had received a honorary Ph. D. from "
102 aeroblogger : Bharat Bhushan is being replaced by Prashant Sukul. Incredibly sad news for Indian aviation.
103 HAWK21M : Keen to read what the MoCA says is the "real" reason.........
104 aeroblogger : Well, the IT issue is obviously a major theme... Now that Zaidi's term is almost up, I guess he wanted to put his mark. It's a real shame - I was hop
105 Cricket : Zaidi was responsible for the Fake Pilot scam either directly or indirectly by turning a blind eye; Bharat Bhushan had his hands tied many times, but
106 Post contains images aeroblogger : Knowing what kind of person he is, I'm inclined to think that directly being responsible is more likely. Anything for a couple more lakhs in his bank
107 aeroblogger : Ajit Singh has been called into PMO tomorrow regarding decision to replace EKBB.
108 Post contains links Cricket : I have a feeling the government will read the riot act to Ajit Singh, tying up with his party did Rahul Gandhi no favours. I doubt they will get rid
109 aeroblogger : I doubt anything will change. MMS is not the type of person who is going to throw the book at anybody... Hence, underachiever I guess. WHAT? Which ne
110 VIDP : Flew into Delhi yesterday saw 4 Q-400,s parked near T3
111 Cricket : CNBC posted this yesterday on their Twitter feed, but was later removed as I can see. basically, the ministry and Ajit Singh's party is arguing that
112 aeroblogger : Not sure whether it deserves it *arrives next day **From Oct 7 2012 through end of summer schedule, times in Australia to be read 1 hour later ***The
113 JOYA380B747 : Don't understand the logic behind the two stops at SYD and MEL instead of just either of them. Very AI-ish move.
114 VIDP : In early 2005 TG,s late night flight out of SYD which used to be A346 was routed via MEL they used to cater to both the markets i guess thats what AI
115 aeroblogger : It allows AI to serve both destinations daily using only 2 aircraft..
116 lightsaber : In the 1980s that was a great strategy. Now it is forcing an extra stop half the time that will make the route less competitive versus a connecting f
117 aeroblogger : AI's DEL bank to Europe leaves in the afternoon - 1-3 PM. I wouldn't be surprised to see that changed for the winter schedule. AI could fit a DEL-LHR
118 JOYA380B747 : They better, because in any case the evening arrival of the SYD and MEL flights don't have any non-stop onward European connections for another 4-5hr
119 aeroblogger : The timings seem aimed at Indian traffic, not so much international transit passengers.
120 NYC777 : When is the GoI goingto approve the Boeing-AI deal? This is getting absurd.
121 aeroblogger : AI is hoping that it will be approved next week, during the CCEA meeting. It is currently awaiting the opinions of a few more committees...
122 lightsaber : I wonder if there is a compatible time at DEL for these flights? There should be; the middle east carriers manage multiple banks to Europe, albeit in
123 Post contains images JOYA380B747 : Exactly my point thanks In fact not jus middle east, but also airports like SIN and BKK have less O&D pax than DEL or BOM to be honest. You are l
124 Post contains links aeroblogger : Agree 100%. Jitender Bhargava's "The Cost of Being a PSU" summarized nicely: http://www.business-standard.com/ind...ender-bhargavacostbeingpsu/390613
125 Post contains images lightsaber : There is a HUGE opportunity for an Indian airline to have rapid growth that would benefit the Indian economy tremendously. Not to mention the airline
126 LAXDESI : My money is on 6E to be a major LCC player, followed by 9W. Public sector AI is unlikely to be competitive. IMO, AI's presence has been detrimental t
127 goacom : It is not going to happen. They have been threatening change for the last 3 decades. It may not have mattered in the past, when the airline business
128 aeroblogger : I agree 100%. The only relationship I have with AI is my Silver Edge status and a bunch of tickets I've yet to fly with them. Certainly not a shill.
129 Post contains images CaliAtenza : what is with the sky high prices ex BLR to the US? It seems unusually high this year .
130 Post contains links sankaps : New terminal at Calcutta opens for trials with positive reviews. Now we have to hope they run and maintain it better than the old terminal, and keep i
131 vin2basketball : Cross posted from India+China thread b/c should make for some interesting discussion:
132 aeroblogger : Quite a statistic, no? It seems that I was vastly overestimating EU traffic...
133 Nimish : Loads going up, and the rupee collapsing. The gulf carriers are of help though - esp to the cities they fly to, you can get pretty good fares on them
134 777way : Mihin Lanka plan to launch Madurai from September.
135 Post contains links aeroblogger : Or not... This document[ lists countries in order of O&D demand to India. 1) UAE 2) United Kingdom 3) United States 4) Saudi Arabia 5) Singapore
136 vin2basketball : Source is private Saying the overall market was an exaggeration, b/c I made the mistake of only looking at FRA+MUC for Germany, discounting BER, HAM,
137 Post contains images lightsaber : I would agree. My question though is what can 6E do for a hub? How true are they to the LCC model? Do they hub? If not, much of my discussion would b
138 Post contains images vin2basketball : Yup, my point remains though; Three cities that compose maybe 4 or 5% of the US population have 2/3s as much O&D traffic as two entire European c
139 Post contains links goacom : Air India bonds have ZERO value without GOI guarantees: http://www.business-standard.com/ind...nd-sale-to-buy-dreamliners/480649/ Some quotes: Air Ind
140 blrBird : Interesting.. may be Intel,Nike,HP etc are contributing to it!
141 JOYA380B747 : Personally I feel, a lot of 'what will happen in years to come' rests on the fate of AI - its privatization (1% chance) and/or its joining an alliance
142 Post contains images CaliAtenza : i checked EK to LAX, the prices are quite rediculous ...even for a one way!
143 aeroblogger : PM me the flight dates you want, and I'll take a look. Shouldn't be too hard to get a reasonable fare with some creativity.
144 Post contains links Cricket : Pretty cool video posted by 9W on YouTube shows VT-JBC being 'Disney-fied' I really liked this, but wouldn't a A332 been more appropriate given that a
145 aeroblogger : I've been sifting through, and it looks like the AI strike is a major culprit - from September 4th (when AI is scheduled to resume normal operations)
146 Post contains images CaliAtenza : unfortunetly i have to leave before September . There are really good prices on Singapore Air ex US to India, but ive been having a hard time finding
147 JOYA380B747 : I totally agree that a 77W or 332 seving HKG should've been painted, but I believe that would either be too expensive or maybe such painting such wid
148 blrsea : mid-june to sept 1st week is high season for US-India travel. The summer holidays in US usually end on first monday of september(US Labor day). So ma
149 CaliAtenza : i figured this, but as recent as two summers ago, i got really good deals on roundtrips heading to LAX ex BLR.
150 aeroblogger : While this is true to an extent, this year is far worse than usual. Capacity discipline, slow economy, crashing dollar/rupee, etc. play a major part
151 CaliAtenza : I had no idea the AI strike could drive fares up like this. Why are fares to the West Coast of the US so high though? AI doesnt fly at all to there.
152 blrsea : I really doubt the AI strike driving fares up. They serve very limited destinations on the east coast. And based on few samples that I have observed a
153 aeroblogger : It's a systemwide impact. The LHR/FRA/SIN/NRT/DXB flights are now carrying the traffic AI normally would as well.... And mind you, I'm greatly oversi
154 HAWK21M : Disney would be paying approx 42L to 9W over two months. Disney spend 23L on decal & its application. Disney paid 9w for 48hrs grounding of the A
155 Cricket : That is a lot of money, but I'm sure they will also use the aircraft in their other marketing activities on their channel and all...
156 JOYA380B747 : Any idea when are the aerobridges going to be installed that are yet to arrive from Malaysia? Thats a lot of money 9W is getting without much of thei
157 Post contains images lightsaber : You made your point well. That traffic will drive the profits in connecting. No wonder *A is screaming over EK. EK provides service to India at far s
158 SLCNate : Hub for what?? For connecting domestic with international, it certainly does not have the advantage compared to MAA (now that KF is in the red and VJ
159 vin2basketball : It needs a strong international full service carrier with integrated domestic to int'l ops, the yields and traffic are there, as of right now, a viab
160 CaliAtenza : why are west coast USA fares from India consistently high? Even more so this year? I dont understand how it could be the olympics. I mean now you hav
161 JOYA380B747 : I have seen the pacific-bound flights from India to US to be especially higher at all times. Don't know why that is the reason. Amongst the atlantic-
162 HAWK21M : That was the purpose,added revenue....but only on the outside,no alteration to the Inside cabin. In fact longer the ground halt,varied the location,m
163 blrsea : Check out fares after sept 10th, and you will see a drastic drop, differences in range of $400-500.
164 777way : EVA Air Cargo have resumed service to DEL according to their schedules, service was suspended last year.
165 Post contains links tayaramecanici : http://ibnlive.in.com/news/bhushan-s...missing-dgca-says-no/272537-3.html http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/b...-Airlines/articleshow/15063094.cms It
166 Post contains links LAXDESI : Indigo Airlines's Rahul Bhatia alleges government favouring a select few airlines. http://economictimes.indiatimes.com/...-airlines/articleshow/150822
167 Post contains links LAXDESI : AAI against Kolkata, Chennai airport privatisation. http://economictimes.indiatimes.com/...-airlines/articleshow/15082224.cms Quote: Airports Authorit
168 Cricket : Rahul Bhatia has a point, I was surprised that SpiceJet got so many more international routes in its second (or third) batch of routes and Indigo did
169 tayaramecanici : GOI is planning a bond sale for financing AI. It will be interesting to know the buyers of this bond. As mentioned in my earlier posts, The survival
170 Post contains links goacom : Flying low India’s flag carrier is in big trouble Jul 21st 2012 | MUMBAI | from the print edition WELL-TO-DO Indian graduates used to line up to joi
171 lightsaber : From your link:"On Indigo offering new international routes, Bhatia said "On paper we are allowed to fly to other countries. "But when we make an app
172 Cricket : How bad is it? Well I'm flying DEL-BOM-DEL Thursday out Friday in, and AI was cheaper than both SG and 6E. Sure IT was cheaper, but my hosts have an
173 aeroblogger : *facepalm* What the quote was pointing at was corruption - to get rights to fly internationally, you have to go through various ministries, which wil
174 Post contains links LAXDESI : Chennai airport to be part privatised. http://ibnlive.in.com/news/chennai-a...part-privatised/273382-60-120.html Quote: Ending months of speculation,
175 Post contains links lightsaber : The GoI doesn't have India's business interests at heart either. They do protect AI by slowing and limiting competition. Or why isn't 6E receiving mo
176 Cricket : Today was the last day, Spicejet has operated earlier, the cancellation seemed to be an interesting way of getting them in again this year, but given
177 goacom : This is huge. AI would be able to raise a total of ZILCH if it had no backing of the GOI. Over the life time of he loan, this amounts of hundreds of
178 lightsaber : Wow... what a disconnect. One would expect higher due to AI's richer pay scales and more long haul, but not a 5:2 ratio. I'm very curious how the Haj
179 Post contains links NYC777 : According to PTI the GoM is to take up the issue of the AI-Boeing compensation deal. I don't know what that means in terms of finally having these air
180 aeroblogger : There are approvals left before CCEA can make a decision, GoM being one of them. Currently, it is hoped that all approvals will be taken care of this
181 Cricket : Correct, between AI and IT there are over Rs 40,000 crores that have been sucked out of the economy - money that could have been spent on much needed
182 Post contains links LAXDESI : Mumbai-Delhi flights to take direct route. It will save fuel, and possibly increase fleet utilisation. http://www1.economictimes.indiatimes...ect-rout
183 Post contains images HAWK21M : Maybe Mumbai can do something about the NOTAM between 0330-0400hrs for runway friction testing.....Is the testing actually being carried out...
184 tharanga : What was the impact of recent widespread power outages?
185 Lutfi : Dragonair will start HKG-CCU in November, 4 flights a week
186 Post contains links tayaramecanici : http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/c...-packages/articleshow/15320934.cms Lalit Sheth, the doyen of the Indian travel and tourism industry, is perhaps
187 Boeing747_600 : I thought MH operated KUL-BLR with a 332
188 Post contains images JOYA380B747 : The first LH 748i FRA-DEL flight is on 6th Aug, too bad its arrival will be shrouded by the darkness. Hoping for pictures from any spotters at DEL.
189 Post contains links LAXDESI : CCEA gives go-ahead to Air India for Boeing 787 Dreamliners delivery. http://www1.economictimes.indiatimes...-delivery/articleshow/15342584.cms Quote:
190 Post contains links lightsaber : Air India to wait for NTSB probe: http://www.firstpost.com/business/ai...ivery-after-ntsb-probe-402517.html "A recent incident in which debris fell o
191 Post contains links WestWing : Bloomberg News spoke to Dinesh Keskar about AI's 787 deliveries and they that AI "will start making plans next week to take delivery". With such caref
192 aeroblogger : Delivery dates are expected to be confirmed next week. Currently, AI delivery dates are TBD.
193 Post contains images HAWK21M : AI has only planned.....The def dates are awaited
194 Cricket : Noticed something the other day while flying international out of BOM - a lot of remote stands are being used for international flights - saw a LH 343
195 Post contains links BLRAviation : Photos and video of Lufthansa B748i arriving at DEL and getting a water cannon salute. http://www.bangaloreaviation.com/201...d-video-lufthansas-boein
196 Post contains links BLRAviation : I wrote this as a proposal (may be for the DGCA to consider). Sorry, last time I posted the whole story, it got canned due to A.Net rules. So this tim
197 Cricket : The biggest problem this will raise in India is the 'Do you know who I am?' syndrome and misuse. I have missed flights thanks to traffic - waterloggi
198 BLRAviation : Could you please expand this statement? I am not quite understanding how is it different from right now? This seems to be the general consensus among
199 aeroblogger : Air India already has a similar policy - it dates back from a legacy policy years ago which IC had. You get waitlisted for free, or you get confirmed
200 NYC777 : Is there any word on 787 delivery dates to AI? I thought that it would have been decided by now?
201 aeroblogger : Quick chart: Aircraft # - Estimated Delivery 1| Aug 2012 2 |Aug 2012 3 |Aug 2012 4 | Sep 2012 5 | Oct 2012 6 | Nov 2012 7 | Nov 2012 (although some a
202 NYC777 : Thansk! Do you have dates for this months deliveries?
203 aeroblogger : Still TBA as far as I know.
204 Post contains links aeroblogger : We've hit 200 posts, so to the new thread we go! Indian Aviation Thread # 99 (भारतीय विमानन # ९९) (by aeroblogger Aug 8 20
205 Post contains links and images SA7700 : This thread will be closed as it has run its course. Please feel free to continue your discussion in part 99 which can be found here: Indian Aviation
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