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LON Mayor Boris Johnson: Yes 2nd Stansted Runway  
User currently offlineLOWS From Austria, joined Oct 2011, 1141 posts, RR: 1
Posted (2 years 2 months 1 week 4 days 5 hours ago) and read 8111 times:

From this evenings's Evening Standard comes the news that London Mayor Boris Johnson will back a second runway at Stansted:

„The Mayor said another runway at the airport would be a “fantastic step in the right direction” to solving the South-East’s air capacity crisis before building a new hub in the Thames Estuary.“

Also: this revealing quote:

„He said: “We have to have a new airport. One of the only reasons I want to assume supreme power in England is to make sure that happens. For God’s sake, don’t quote me saying that.”

goo.gl/CDT48

41 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlinelightsaber From United States of America, joined Jan 2005, 13011 posts, RR: 100
Reply 1, posted (2 years 2 months 1 week 4 days 5 hours ago) and read 8094 times:
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Quoting LOWS (Thread starter):
The Mayor said another runway at the airport would be a “fantastic step in the right direction” to solving the South-East’s air capacity crisis before building a new hub in the Thames Estuary.“

He is correct. But how likely is there enough political will to pull this off? We just saw the MUC 3rd runway voted down.
 
Quoting LOWS (Thread starter):
“We have to have a new airport. One of the only reasons I want to assume supreme power in England is to make sure that happens. For God’s sake, don’t quote me saying that.”

   He knows it is a very political decision.

I would also like to see a 2nd runway at LTN for future (ok, far future) growth. Then again, I was a huge fan of the idea of a 3rd LHR runway.

Lightsaber



Societies that achieve a critical mass of ideas achieve self sustaining growth; others stagnate.
User currently offlinedavid_itl From United Kingdom, joined Jun 2001, 7370 posts, RR: 14
Reply 2, posted (2 years 2 months 1 week 4 days 5 hours ago) and read 8073 times:
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Quoting LOWS (Thread starter):
The Mayor said another runway at the airport would be a “fantastic step in the right direction” to solving the South-East’s air capacity crisis

And he doesn't want to explain who will pay for this? It's an extra runway at LHR or no deal as that's where the pressing need is. No point having a runway elsewhere when it's predominantly low-cost airlines using it, one of whom is continually vocal about increased airport charges


User currently offlineBMI727 From United States of America, joined Feb 2009, 15735 posts, RR: 26
Reply 3, posted (2 years 2 months 1 week 4 days 5 hours ago) and read 8036 times:

Maybe Europe should start with building a new sidewalk. Then eventually they can work up to a new runway and perhaps even find it within themselves to build a new airport before all of their flag carriers go bankrupt.


Why do Aerospace Engineering students have to turn things in on time?
User currently offlineHPRamper From United States of America, joined May 2005, 4057 posts, RR: 8
Reply 4, posted (2 years 2 months 1 week 4 days 5 hours ago) and read 7994 times:

STN is also the main cargo airport in the area as well, is it not? It's not just Ryanair.

User currently offlineLOWS From Austria, joined Oct 2011, 1141 posts, RR: 1
Reply 5, posted (2 years 2 months 1 week 4 days 4 hours ago) and read 7941 times:

Quoting david_itl (Reply 2):
And he doesn't want to explain who will pay for this? It's an extra runway at LHR or no deal as that's where the pressing need is. No point having a runway elsewhere when it's predominantly low-cost airlines using it, one of whom is continually vocal about increased airport charges

Maybe move the LGW LCCs to STN and then move some LHR traffic to LGW? Make it the unaffiliated and SkyTeam airport?

[Edited 2012-06-18 15:26:23]

User currently offlineJER757 From United Kingdom, joined Jun 2006, 350 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (2 years 2 months 1 week 4 days 4 hours ago) and read 7719 times:

Why why WHY?? LHR is the only LON airport that is at capacity. Even LGW has plenty of open slots.

STN has been seeing reducing aircraft movements since 2007: http://www.ukaccs.info/stansted/stat1.gif

There would have to be a seismic shift in passenger and airline mentality for STN to be seen as a sensible option for long haul trave (which is what the UK needs growth in)l. The availability is there; the runway is sat unused for plenty of time during the day, the landing fees are cheap (compared to LHR) and public transport is acceptable. Yet how many long haul destinations does the place have? None. not a single one.

Unless you're going to shift BA lock stock and barrel from LHR (you'd have to relocate the flying pig squadron as well), there is no point whatsoever.

Boris is great on Have I Got News For You, however as Mayor of London all he cares about is soundbites to please the tabloids.



Gale force fog... don't you love it?
User currently offlinebennett123 From United Kingdom, joined Aug 2004, 7565 posts, RR: 3
Reply 7, posted (2 years 2 months 1 week 4 days 3 hours ago) and read 7556 times:

"One of the only reasons I want to assume supreme power in England is to make sure that happens. For God’s sake, don’t quote me saying that.”

Says it all really. He wants to be next PM, or should we say "Fuhrer".

The mans ego would fill a barrage balloon, and the amount of hot air he generates would power the UK on it's own.


User currently offlineskipness1E From United Kingdom, joined Aug 2007, 3236 posts, RR: 1
Reply 8, posted (2 years 2 months 1 week 4 days 2 hours ago) and read 7463 times:

Let me translate :

"I say, you know that half empty Stansted Airport, well I have a jolly idea to annoy "call me Dave". Let's build another runway on the beautiful greenfields of Essex, or better still a super floating island in the Thames Estuary. Genius eh? God forbid we annoy the wealthy of West London. Boris for PM."

You know I voted for him but he's got NO concept of what he's talking about. I wonder how a Tory can be so thick headed. Demolishing Sipson for a third runway at LHR versus concreting over Essex is no comparison.


User currently offlineBD338 From United States of America, joined Jul 2010, 703 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (2 years 2 months 1 week 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 7414 times:

Another bonkers idea from Boris, let's expand an airport that less and less people are using. Let's see....Estuary Airport (Boris Island), outside the boundaries of the London Mayor, no votes lost for Boris.....Stansted Airport, outside the boundaries of the London Mayor, no votes lost for Boris....Heathrow Airport, inside the boundaries of the London Mayor, lots of votes lost for Boris. Coincidence?

No wonder he is foisting his hair brained schemes on everyone else...


User currently onlineBasilFawlty From Netherlands, joined Jun 2009, 1325 posts, RR: 1
Reply 10, posted (2 years 2 months 1 week 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 7384 times:

Boris Johnson, what a joke, the only airport that needs a new runway is LHR, everybody knows that!

Quoting lightsaber (Reply 1):
I would also like to see a 2nd runway at LTN for future (ok, far future) growth.

All LTN needs is a taxiway extension to both runway ends, a second runway is not needed for now and the forseeable future.  
Quoting HPRamper (Reply 4):
STN is also the main cargo airport in the area as well, is it not? It's not just Ryanair.

Well, there's GSS with their three 748F's, a daily UPS 763, a few daily FedEx flights and some Jet2 and Titan flights for the Royal Mail in the evening/night and that's about it. Oh, and perhaps an Asiana flight a few times per week and the odd Martinair from South America on their way to AMS. Really, STN is not very big when it comes to cargo.



'Every year donkeys and mules kill more people than plane crashes'
User currently offlinepar13del From Bahamas, joined Dec 2005, 7136 posts, RR: 8
Reply 11, posted (2 years 2 months 1 week 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 7361 times:

Quoting BasilFawlty (Reply 10):
the only airport that needs a new runway is LHR, everybody knows that!

Well, not in Boris defense but if everyone knows this it will happen when exatcly?


User currently offlinepoint2point From United States of America, joined Mar 2010, 2757 posts, RR: 1
Reply 12, posted (2 years 2 months 1 week 4 days ago) and read 7325 times:

I have to say that I'm in much in awe -- of how LHR manages to operate in its monstrous fashion with only 2 runways.....

And amazed that London proper does what its does with it's whole air system with only 6 runways......

Here in DEN, we have 6 runways, and ready to add a 7th, and it's really nowhere near the activity of the entirety of London.

 Wow!


User currently offlineboysteve From United Kingdom, joined Apr 2004, 937 posts, RR: 0
Reply 13, posted (2 years 2 months 1 week 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 7119 times:

Boris may 'support' an extra runway at Stansted, but he has durisdiction over the County of Essex so his opinion does not count.

User currently onlineUA735WL From United States of America, joined Apr 2012, 154 posts, RR: 0
Reply 14, posted (2 years 2 months 1 week 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 7112 times:

Doesn't LGW need a (real) 2nd runway more than Stanstead?


"One test is worth a thousand expert opinions" -Tex Johnston
User currently offlinescouseflyer From United Kingdom, joined Apr 2006, 3389 posts, RR: 9
Reply 15, posted (2 years 2 months 1 week 3 days 19 hours ago) and read 6936 times:

My "two=penneth"

- I thought that "BoJo" has said that he's not going to stand for a third term and can't challenge DC for the top-job unless he's an MP which he won't be able to do until 2016. Meaning if he was party leader he's not going to fight an election until 2020 which is a long time for tempers to cool on unpopular but necessary building works.

- More capacity is needed in the South East of England

- Best place for it is LHR

- BUT that's going to make a god-awful mess of West London and is very unpopular (strange that people who live near an airport are objecting to an airport expanding........."

- Leaving STN or LGW expansion as the only viable options.

- Personally I'd go for STN as it's North of London and thus has a bigger catchment, if lots and lots of land is set aside for it, STN could gradually become like London's CDG (I'm talking over the next 50 years!) and LHR would gradually become the seconadary hub


User currently offlineAS739BSI From United States of America, joined Jan 2012, 132 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (2 years 2 months 1 week 3 days 18 hours ago) and read 6889 times:

Here is what I don't get, if you are living next to a busy airport and motorway, why would you not want to pick up and move elsewhere with less noise?

User currently offliner2rho From Germany, joined Feb 2007, 2618 posts, RR: 1
Reply 17, posted (2 years 2 months 1 week 3 days 18 hours ago) and read 6800 times:

Given the state of the airport situation in the London area, ANY new runway anywhere would be welcome. Having said that, I think a second rwy at LGW should be first on the priority list (I am aware this is not possible before 2019, but that's how long it would take to build anyway). STN has lots of great room for expansion but is placed too out of the way, LTN is actually better placed. LHR I consider a lost case and should not get any new runway.

User currently offlineAirbusA6 From United Kingdom, joined Apr 2005, 2013 posts, RR: 0
Reply 18, posted (2 years 2 months 1 week 3 days 18 hours ago) and read 6768 times:

The issue with LHR isn't just the destruction caused by the building of a 3rd runway, as basically it's in the wrong location. Flights have to go over Central London to reach it - great for views out, not so good for London - and the prevailing wind from the west blows the polution over London instead of away from London. Thus expansion is very controversial.

It's a good question WHY non LCC and Charter flights seemed to have failed to make a go of LGW and STN, LGW has brilliant rail links to London, someone in the financial square mile would get to LGW faster than they would to LHR, and for most people south of the river is far more convenient. LGW has always had this 2nd class image, as the airport for holidaymakers, which EWR doesn't.



it's the bus to stansted (now renamed national express a4 to ruin my username)
User currently offlineclydenairways From Ireland, joined Jan 2007, 1233 posts, RR: 0
Reply 19, posted (2 years 2 months 1 week 3 days 16 hours ago) and read 6533 times:

Borris can say he supports this all he want's, because knowing how long the planning process takes to happen in the UK, he will be long out of office before they actually get started on it.
I'd say 20 years time from now for a second runway to be actually opened.


User currently offlinefcogafa From United Kingdom, joined May 2008, 784 posts, RR: 0
Reply 20, posted (2 years 2 months 1 week 3 days 16 hours ago) and read 6499 times:

Quoting par13del (Reply 11):
Well, there's GSS with their three 748F's, a daily UPS 763, a few daily FedEx flights and some Jet2 and Titan flights for the Royal Mail in the evening/night and that's about it. Oh, and perhaps an Asiana flight a few times per week and the odd Martinair from South America on their way to AMS. Really, STN is not very big when it comes to cargo.

Heathrow is by far the biggest cargo airport in the UK, in fact I believe the second biggest port in the UK. Of course that is mostly via belly freight, not dedicated freighters!


User currently offlineLX138 From United Kingdom, joined Jul 2009, 396 posts, RR: 0
Reply 21, posted (2 years 2 months 1 week 3 days 16 hours ago) and read 6457 times:

Quoting AirbusA6 (Reply 18):
It's a good question WHY non LCC and Charter flights seemed to have failed to make a go of LGW and STN, LGW has brilliant rail links to London, someone in the financial square mile would get to LGW faster than they would to LHR, and for most people south of the river is far more convenient. LGW has always had this 2nd class image, as the airport for holidaymakers, which EWR doesn't.

There are plenty of non-charter and LCC carriers at LGW, including major airlines from the three big alliances.

BAA has been instrumental in maintaining a 'buzz' factor about LHR to keep rates and yields high there, even though its as easy to send major network carriers to STN and LGW. Hopefully this will change as they no longer own LGW.

Quoting r2rho (Reply 17):
Given the state of the airport situation in the London area, ANY new runway anywhere would be welcome. Having said that, I think a second rwy at LGW should be first on the priority list (I am aware this is not possible before 2019, but that's how long it would take to build anyway). STN has lots of great room for expansion but is placed too out of the way, LTN is actually better placed. LHR I consider a lost case and should not get any new runway.

Unless the government seriously intervenes and almost 'tells' the airlines they must now relocate to STN or elsewhere (similar to BKK and Don Muang), then weaning them off the tradition that LHR rules will be a very hard task. So at the moment, airlines won't make use of a new runway at STN because they will say they prefer LHR because that's where the connections are and it's where their 'passengers prefer to fly into'.

LTN - not sure what the restrictions are on even squeezing in another runway there, anybody from LTN know?



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User currently offlineLOWS From Austria, joined Oct 2011, 1141 posts, RR: 1
Reply 22, posted (2 years 2 months 1 week 3 days 15 hours ago) and read 6409 times:

Quoting scouseflyer (Reply 15):
- I thought that "BoJo" has said that he's not going to stand for a third term and can't challenge DC for the top-job unless he's an MP which he won't be able to do until 2016. Meaning if he was party leader he's not going to fight an election until 2020 which is a long time for tempers to cool on unpopular but necessary building works.

No, there could be a by-election that he could stand in, and challenge DC the day after he is elected. He could also resign and stand in the 2015 general election, or not resign and continue to be mayor, if he lost his seat in the House of Commons.

[Edited 2012-06-19 04:54:19]

User currently offlineCHRISBA777ER From UK - England, joined Mar 2001, 5964 posts, RR: 62
Reply 23, posted (2 years 2 months 1 week 3 days 14 hours ago) and read 6245 times:

Less "important" political opposition to a new runway at STN, so it gets backed.

Its pointless as STN has loads of capacity as it is and is too far out for the flag carriers to move to in any meaningful way.

Government paying lip service to transport policy while in actuality just fobbing it off for 20 years for the next lot to deal with.

Meanwhile LHR continues as it is. No new terminal space in the world will help whats happening there. Its not actually the local people who object to LNR expansion - the vast majority of the folks who live nearby are airport employees, but the real opposition comes from the Richmond-Kensington belt.

I'm one of the few people who likes the idea of an enormous intermodal transport hub including massive new aiport at least as big as LNR is now, new super post-Panamax container port, LNG terminal at Canvey Island etc, rail hub, super-high speed rail links into London itself, plus high speed rail links a-la Eurostar to Paris and Brussels etc so we start clawing back the transit pax market. I think its a fantastic idea. It wont ever get built because nobody will let it happen and by the time the government has fought it through courts, appeals, more courts, more commissions and more courts it will take 30- years and untold dozens of billions - which we cant afford.

We cant afford not to of course, but nobody thinks ten years ahead these days. Sad.



What do you mean you dont have any bourbon? Do you know how far it is to Houston? What kind of airline is this???
User currently offlineAirbusA6 From United Kingdom, joined Apr 2005, 2013 posts, RR: 0
Reply 24, posted (2 years 2 months 1 week 3 days 14 hours ago) and read 6038 times:

Quoting LX138 (Reply 21):
It's a good question WHY non LCC and Charter flights seemed to have failed to make a go of LGW and STN, LGW has brilliant rail links to London, someone in the financial square mile would get to LGW faster than they would to LHR, and for most people south of the river is far more convenient. LGW has always had this 2nd class image, as the airport for holidaymakers, which EWR doesn't.

There are plenty of non-charter and LCC carriers at LGW, including major airlines from the three big alliances

I was thinking of the various carriers that tried to compete against BA using LGW that are no more, BCal, Air Europe, Dan Air.
VS started at LGW but moved into LHR as soon as it could.
The way the US carriers moved out of LGW as soon as they could...
BA's half hearted route network at LGW.

Yes there are intercontinental flights there, but they are mainly in addiition to LHR ones, not instead...



it's the bus to stansted (now renamed national express a4 to ruin my username)
25 LX138 : I'm a fan of that idea too. Yes, it's true. The focus on LHR as I said earlier has not been helped by BAA encouraging it though. It's also fair to sa
26 Giancavia : We have no room for another runway.. we do have room for an extension and are close to getting the go ahead for extended taxiways which will be major
27 jumpjets : ..maybe you'd think differently if it's the home you have lived in for 30 years that's going to be demolished to make way for the extra runway. I wis
28 crj200faguy : I support a 2nd runway at LCY!!!
29 Post contains images brilondon : That has less of a chance of happening then the third runway option at LHR.
30 crj200faguy : Come on now it's entirely plausible. lol
31 CambridgeFlyer1 : There is no point in building a second runway at STN, the airport is quiet as it is and no where near capacity. Airlines don't want to go to Stansted,
32 gingersnap : I agree with you there. It was never going to be a popular decision, but surely anyone who moves near to an airport should expect at some point that
33 HPRamper : If at some point another airport is going to have to replace LHR, at what point do you decide to bite the bullet and build the damn thing? Consider t
34 connies4ever : Absent building a 3rd runway at LHR it seems to me that a 2nd at LGW makes the most sense, notwithstanding the current legal agreement. STN as has be
35 GDB : Quite. Cannot piss off your voting base Boris? Not that his colleagues/rivals in Government are much better. They are going to have to u-turn on the
36 Post contains links skipness1E : There's a wonderful piece in tonights London Evening Standard on the son of a billionaire, MP Zac Goldsmith, looking every inch the powerful miilionai
37 col : Best option is to tell the people you are building three new runways at LHR, making 5 in total. Then negotiate down to 1 or 2 new ones. Anyway this is
38 jumpjets : As a Putney voter I'd dispute that - its more likely she got her seat because the residents of Putney finally forgave the Tories for the David Mellor
39 Post contains links VV701 : I have a slight sense of deja vu. Back in March 1991 when the current passenger terminal at STN was completed no airline wanted to use it.. BAA, the
40 LX138 : Yes, so to clarify, it should be built at LHR if they cannot be bothered to tell airlines to use STN. If they can be bothered, or if the inappropriat
41 skipness1E : It's more a matter of favouring who to leave at Heathrow with a competitve advantage over who gets deported to Stansted, skewing the market and falli
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