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DL Cutting 25 More Flights In MEM  
User currently offlineenilria From Canada, joined Feb 2008, 7036 posts, RR: 13
Posted (2 years 1 month 1 day 17 hours ago) and read 14296 times:

This was inevitable. I think it'll be down to 40-50 pretty shortly. The CRJ retirements are a major driver.

http://www.bizjournals.com/memphis/n...tting-25-more-flights-memphis.html

103 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineSW733 From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 6299 posts, RR: 9
Reply 1, posted (2 years 1 month 1 day 17 hours ago) and read 14240 times:

25 flights, but only one destination being elimated...and a very close one (geographically) at that.

User currently offlineiahworldflyer From United States of America, joined Feb 2012, 216 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (2 years 1 month 1 day 17 hours ago) and read 14204 times:

Was in MEM this past weekend. Even during the early morning DL bank, there was very little automobile drop off/pick up activity out front. I was surprised how few people were there. I think Delta's service cuts, plus high airfares are putting the airport there in a downward spiral for lower passenger numbers and more cuts.

User currently offlinedcaviation From United States of America, joined Aug 2011, 195 posts, RR: 0
Reply 3, posted (2 years 1 month 1 day 17 hours ago) and read 14114 times:

So where are the people that before the merger were saying that MEM will become ATL reliever?  

User currently offlineenilria From Canada, joined Feb 2008, 7036 posts, RR: 13
Reply 4, posted (2 years 1 month 1 day 17 hours ago) and read 14071 times:

Quoting SW733 (Reply 1):
25 flights, but only one destination being elimated...and a very close one (geographically) at that.

It's one out of every 6 DL flights. Kind of significant...I said months ago when they announced AMS would be "seasonally" suspended that it was a harbinger of a huge cut and got the usual fanboy responses that I was crazy.

Quoting iahworldflyer (Reply 2):
I think Delta's service cuts, plus high airfares are putting the airport there in a downward spiral for lower passenger numbers and more cuts.

Passengers are complaining about fares, not flights...so far.

Quoting dcaviation (Reply 3):
So where are the people that before the merger were saying that MEM will become ATL reliever?

They are crying...


User currently offlinemayor From United States of America, joined Mar 2008, 10345 posts, RR: 14
Reply 5, posted (2 years 1 month 1 day 17 hours ago) and read 13989 times:

So, when is the effective date of these cuts? The article doesn't say and res still shows flights a flight to FSM as of October. Right now there are 2x daily MEM-FSM and 1x daily ATL-FSM. In October (according to Delta.com) that changes to 1 out of MEM and 2 out of ATL.


"A committee is a group of the unprepared, appointed by the unwilling, to do the unnecessary"----Fred Allen
User currently offlineSW733 From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 6299 posts, RR: 9
Reply 6, posted (2 years 1 month 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 13955 times:

Quoting enilria (Reply 4):
It's one out of every 6 DL flights. Kind of significant.

I never said it was insignificant. I was just adding a bit of detail.


User currently offlineenilria From Canada, joined Feb 2008, 7036 posts, RR: 13
Reply 7, posted (2 years 1 month 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 13957 times:

Quoting mayor (Reply 5):

So, when is the effective date of these cuts? The article doesn't say and res still shows flights a flight to FSM as of October.

August/September. It is being loaded tomorrow night. It'll be in my OAG thread next week.


User currently offlinemayor From United States of America, joined Mar 2008, 10345 posts, RR: 14
Reply 8, posted (2 years 1 month 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 13816 times:

Quoting enilria (Reply 7):
August/September. It is being loaded tomorrow night. It'll be in my OAG thread next week.

Ok.....is that JUST the service MEM-FSM...........will there still be ATL-FSM?



"A committee is a group of the unprepared, appointed by the unwilling, to do the unnecessary"----Fred Allen
User currently offlineAWACSooner From United States of America, joined Jan 2008, 1882 posts, RR: 1
Reply 9, posted (2 years 1 month 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 13679 times:

Meh...MEM will be another CVG in about 5 more years, bank it!

User currently offlinemetjetCEO From United States of America, joined Jun 2007, 411 posts, RR: 1
Reply 10, posted (2 years 1 month 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 13641 times:

There is a facebook page that was started, where people (on both sides) are getting pretty vocal. There are also political cartoons (I assume from the local paper) on the page too.

The facebook page is "Delta Does Memphis"


User currently offlineflyguy89 From United States of America, joined Feb 2009, 1899 posts, RR: 9
Reply 11, posted (2 years 1 month 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 13585 times:

I'm just surprised how rapidly they're drawing down MEM, I suppose we can take this to mean MEM-AMS probably won't be returning?

User currently offlinepeanuts From Netherlands, joined Dec 2009, 1438 posts, RR: 4
Reply 12, posted (2 years 1 month 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 13554 times:

Is CLE paying attention?
I hope for them they are hedging for their rainy day. It will come.

Logistically, UA isn't there yet, but they will.

Just inevitable economics at play.



Question Conventional Wisdom. While not all commonly held beliefs are wrong…all should be questioned.
User currently offlineenilria From Canada, joined Feb 2008, 7036 posts, RR: 13
Reply 13, posted (2 years 1 month 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 13510 times:

Quoting AWACSooner (Reply 9):
Meh...MEM will be another CVG in about 5 more years, bank it!

The way it's going make that one year.

Quoting flyguy89 (Reply 11):
I suppose we can take this to mean MEM-AMS probably won't be returning?

I can imagine them doing it next Summer 3/week, and then it never coming back again. That could even be optimistic.


User currently offlineMaverickM11 From United States of America, joined Apr 2000, 17330 posts, RR: 46
Reply 14, posted (2 years 1 month 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 13504 times:

CVG is also being pulled further down, and DTWHKG is canceled.


E pur si muove -Galileo
User currently offlineizbtmnhd From United States of America, joined Aug 2010, 250 posts, RR: 0
Reply 15, posted (2 years 1 month 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 13435 times:

Quoting peanuts (Reply 12):

Economics of a largely O&D hub? It would be better to say that geography is working against CLE, not economics.

Also NE Ohio is a much, much larger market than the Tri-State area. I don't think you can say what happens to MEM will be what exactly happens to CLE, even about a post legacy hub operation.

[Edited 2012-06-22 12:05:09]

User currently offlinerwy04lga From United States of America, joined Jul 2005, 3176 posts, RR: 8
Reply 16, posted (2 years 1 month 1 day 15 hours ago) and read 13317 times:

Quoting MaverickM11 (Reply 14):
DTWHKG is canceled.

What??? Effective when?



Just accept that some days, you're the pigeon, and other days the statue
User currently offlineCubsrule From United States of America, joined May 2004, 22718 posts, RR: 20
Reply 17, posted (2 years 1 month 1 day 15 hours ago) and read 13309 times:

Quoting izbtmnhd (Reply 15):
Also NE Ohio is a much, much larger market than the Tri-State area.

Yes, but no larger (and probably less economically healthy) than southwest Ohio/northern Kentucky.



I can't decide whether I miss the tulip or the bowling shoe more
User currently offlineizbtmnhd From United States of America, joined Aug 2010, 250 posts, RR: 0
Reply 18, posted (2 years 1 month 1 day 15 hours ago) and read 13233 times:

Quoting Cubsrule (Reply 17):


I wasn't aware this a was thread about CVG?

As for the Cleveland metro, it has low unemployment compared to most of the country and the area is doing better than you (and most Americans) probably think as of late.

More people live in NE Ohio than SW Ohio/Northern KY. Not by a ton, but Canton makes a difference

[Edited 2012-06-22 12:39:22]

User currently offlineCubsrule From United States of America, joined May 2004, 22718 posts, RR: 20
Reply 19, posted (2 years 1 month 1 day 15 hours ago) and read 13171 times:

Quoting izbtmnhd (Reply 18):
As for the Cleveland metro, it has low unemployment compared to most of the country and the area is doing better than you (and most Americans) probably think as of late.

I'm fairly conversant with the economic data. Did I say that Cleveland was doing poorly economically? No, but I think Cincinnati is doing somewhat better.

Quoting izbtmnhd (Reply 18):
More people live in NE Ohio than SW Ohio/Northern KY. Not by a ton, but Canton makes a difference

If we are considering CAK bleed for CLE, we need to consider DAY and LEX bleed for CVG.



I can't decide whether I miss the tulip or the bowling shoe more
User currently offlineMaverickM11 From United States of America, joined Apr 2000, 17330 posts, RR: 46
Reply 20, posted (2 years 1 month 1 day 15 hours ago) and read 13145 times:

Quoting rwy04lga (Reply 16):
What??? Effective when?

Looks like the last month of operation is AUG12



E pur si muove -Galileo
User currently offlinepeanuts From Netherlands, joined Dec 2009, 1438 posts, RR: 4
Reply 21, posted (2 years 1 month 1 day 15 hours ago) and read 13013 times:

Quoting izbtmnhd (Reply 15):
Economics of a largely O&D hub? It would be better to say that geography is working against CLE, not economics.

Whichever the reason, in the end, the numbers will force UA to determine the fate of CLE.
It's not only up to UA really. They need to stay competitive as well. Looks to me like DL is a leader in cost cutting and finding further efficiencies from the merger. UA is a ways behind. But it is bound to happen.



Question Conventional Wisdom. While not all commonly held beliefs are wrong…all should be questioned.
User currently offlineCubsrule From United States of America, joined May 2004, 22718 posts, RR: 20
Reply 22, posted (2 years 1 month 1 day 15 hours ago) and read 13004 times:

Quoting peanuts (Reply 21):
Looks to me like DL is a leader in cost cutting and finding further efficiencies from the merger. UA is a ways behind. But it is bound to happen.

DL started from a weaker position as far as hub cities and 50 seat operations, though UA probably also has too many 50 seaters. But the reduction in Saab flying as well as possibly growth of the DH4 fleet with YX will help keep more current 50 seater routes flying, I think.



I can't decide whether I miss the tulip or the bowling shoe more
User currently offlinerwy04lga From United States of America, joined Jul 2005, 3176 posts, RR: 8
Reply 23, posted (2 years 1 month 1 day 14 hours ago) and read 12989 times:

Quoting MaverickM11 (Reply 20):
Quoting rwy04lga (Reply 16):
What??? Effective when?

Looks like the last month of operation is AUG12

Thanks! I have to fly that route just to add it to my map.



Just accept that some days, you're the pigeon, and other days the statue
User currently offlinesmoot4208 From United States of America, joined Jan 2010, 1293 posts, RR: 12
Reply 24, posted (2 years 1 month 1 day 14 hours ago) and read 12879 times:

Looks like CMH, DEN, DSM, OMA, PHL, PIT, SGF, TPA, FSM, LIT, and OKC all lose a frequency. Not sure where the other 14 flights are coming from. Also, I don't see any cuts from CVG as of now atleast

25 HPRamper : But MEM is an ATL reliever...in that ATL seems to be relieving itself on MEM.
26 Post contains images MaverickM11 : The idea that an airline would invest so much time, money, and effort into managing a "reliever" hub is so absurd I don't know how it ever gained tra
27 rduddji : That's the bigger news IMO...
28 mayor : But that's just how CVG started as a hub.........as a reliever for ATL.
29 MSPNWA : I agree on both counts. That's a 16.7% reduction just like that. And with a hub structure, that cut just compounds itself and leads to more in short
30 mayor : Is it really "cancelled" or is it just being made seasonal?
31 usdcaguy : When do you think we can start a new thread called,"New WN Destinations from MEM"?
32 SR117 : It still seems to be showing up in schedules beyond August (September) for me.
33 Post contains images point2point : The only question that I would have with these relievers is it that MEM is #1 and CVG #2, or vice-versa? At any rate, sad to see but I think that bot
34 spiritair97 : My money is on very very soon.
35 flyguy89 : What further cuts would that be? The CVG hub is really already as small as it could be.
36 Flighty : Of course. This was part of the DL-NW merger. People knowledgable about the industry knew that MEM would become a defensive focus city and nothing mo
37 boeing6594 : Has DL given up any gates at MEM? If so, where?
38 CompensateMe : It's been pulled from the electronic timetable. Although still available for sale, DL will not sell less than a "B" fare.
39 CompensateMe : As small as it could be, seriously? You do realize DL still serves places like GRR, GSO and GSP from CVG?
40 FWAERJ : IIRC, DL has consolidated at Concourse B at MEM. In other words, there's plenty of open gate space in A and C at MEM.
41 flyguy89 : Yes I'm quite aware, and you do realize DL is only operating ~120 daily flights from CVG right? I would say that is about as small as a hub can be to
42 CompensateMe : A "hub" merely enables connectivity. CVG could handle six flights per day -- for example, inbound arrivials from LGA, BOS & DCA connecting via CV
43 michman : STL was down to 82 flights a day before AA finally pulled the plug on the hub. While CVG and MEM are getting there, they are still above the limit of
44 DeltaL1011man : AUG 29th looks like the last day. Yes but CVG could flow traffic from the NE to the west. MEM is nearly right on top of Atlanta and has pretty much t
45 CompensateMe : How would starting Asia from the West Coast give DL a better chance? SEA has similar O/D to DTW, but signifiantly more compeition. LAX is saturated a
46 DeltaL1011man : And miss out on the high yields of the non-stop PAXs. Lower fuel cost and much better feed. Some the largest marks to Asia have to back track to go t
47 CompensateMe : 1. United does not own "east of the Mississippi to Asia." 2. Geographcilly, connecting through DTW to HKG is more advantagous for nearly every city e
48 SR117 : That's really too bad. I wonder what they'll do with the spare 777. Wish they would provide service from somewhere in the West Coast, the problem is
49 United1 : You are correct they are more then likely going to fly UA or CX out of NYC or Chicago....it's no surprise that a route that depends so heavily on con
50 flyguy89 : Well I guess that's true if DL really wants to play word-games and insist that it's still a hub for them at that point, but it seems ridiculous once
51 Post contains images CompensateMe : As I wrote earlier, a hub is merely an airport whose traffic flow is designed to facilitate connections. A "spoke" is a city which handles only fligh
52 incitatus : Is it a question of when then Southwest comes into the picture?
53 FWAERJ : They are already there (via AirTran), and WN has stated that they will keep MEM. All WN has to do is add some flights and/or switch existing FL fligh
54 DeltaL1011man : sorry, outside of Soul, They own it. and its pretty clear that they do. They have double daily flights to HKG, 1 with a 747 and Delta can't even make
55 crAAzy : Agree this is the bigger news. Except maybe ORD and MSP if we're talking hubs. Certainly you're not suggesting these "high-yield passengers" would ev
56 CompensateMe : Seriously? DL has a very large Asian network; I'll excuse you on this one as I recognize that only one flight operates from ATL, so your knowledge ma
57 enilria : The local market on that one was tiny. It was an oddball. There is no business tie between those cities. PVG is a completely different story and even
58 CompensateMe : I'm referencing persons traveling within the DL network, not referring to general travel between the USA & Asia. My apologies, I thought my posti
59 FSDan : CLT is one of the top five airline hubs in the nation in terms of takeoffs and landings. It's not going anywhere anytime soon. SLC is one of two hubs
60 Post contains images DeltaL1011man : *sigh* I'm done. Really over the fact you think your s**t don't stink. and you will get much better responses from humans if you don't think your the
61 LJ : But the again you mention. The latter remark is probably slightly better than the first as no US airline owns the Asia market. In the HKG - US Mid/Ea
62 slcdeltarumd11 : Sadly MEM cuts are not surprising but they sure are sad to see. CVG and MEM just seem to be a matter of time now theres no stopping that freight train
63 Post contains images point2point : You're probably correct..... You're probably correct here as well...... Although, if somehow (in a hypothetical world) I had to pick one that would g
64 HVNandrew : With these new cuts, it will already be down to the size that CVG is now, and have no international service. Though, others are alluding to more cuts
65 rduddji : Yes, but the traffic is over 90% connections, which can be re-distributed among higher O&D (read: higher revenue) hubs. AA already did this exerc
66 michman : I wouldn't say that's true. MEM was never a big hub for NW like CVG was for DL. I believe that MEM was at the 220-250 daily departure range for most
67 AVLAirlineFreq : I'm a little surprised that MEM-COU wasn't chopped as well, at least not yet. Much like FSM, DL has added ATL-COU in recent months.
68 lightsaber : Probably joining their STL breathren weeping. Low O&D hubs are called Wayports and they just will not survive a downturn. The only official desti
69 brilondon : It seems obvious to me that MEM is just too close to ATL to have so many mainline flights. Just like CVG is too close to DTW. It is economics and the
70 michman : Just pulled down the latest electronic timetable and the only interesting thing was that CVG-SYR is being dropped (has this been announced already?).
71 smoot4208 : Nothing as of yesterday from the OAG changes involved CVG.
72 alggag : I don't think that MEM is going to be a particularly big WN station. At least STL and BNA have gone on to become rather respectable stations in WN's
73 lat41 : How many remember when MEM was a Southern SO hub full of DC-9s and Martins. Then came Republic RC , a merger of North Central and Southern. Along came
74 iahworldflyer : I think WN could make money flying to MDW , MSY , HOU , along with seasonal service to NW Florida/Destin from MEM. I'm not sure how much yield they co
75 Post contains images CompensateMe : Wayports were envisioned to handle wholly connections (of course, they never came into existence in passenger transport although they exist in cargo
76 Post contains images MaverickM11 : There were some reductions that were pretty significant; I can't remember most of them other than IAH going to 5/wk and I think DEN was less than dai
77 F9animal : Kinda wish F9 would have had a crystal ball when it tried MEM years ago. I would think now is a good time to give it another shot. I remember how mass
78 michman : Neither DEN nor IAH currently operate on Saturday's. IAH is losing the Tuesday departure in September. The only thing possibly new would be DEN also
79 flyguy89 : I think I'd disagree, with some low-fare market stimulation, I think MEM could do well, it's much more of a destination city than say SDF or other su
80 Post contains links lightsaber : Agreed. The FAA just has definitions based on what percentage of the outbound seats are connecting. One could have four flights a day and qualify as
81 Cubsrule : It's more of a destination city than SDF, sure, but I bet it's less of a destination than a place like STL (much bigger) or BNA (probably equal as fa
82 sdoyon : According to the Delta.com booking engine, it looks like SEA and PNS are also being cut from MEM come the middle of August. Not sure if these are seas
83 Futureuscapt : An added tidbit some people may find interesting which wasn't mentioned in the article/thread is that in addition to these 25 cuts, DL will implement
84 FWAERJ : And of those 12 cities, seven are DL hubs or focus cities (ATL, DTW, JFK, LAX, LGA, MSP, and SLC). I suspect that DCA is there for slot-keeping reaso
85 nwaesc : ??? Did you mean ARJ's? Wow! O_o
86 Cubsrule : Well, those cuts should put to rest any claim that DL has an interest in Cincinnati O&D traffic (or at least Cincinnati business passengers). CVG
87 FlyPNS1 : But how many business travelers are there on Tuesdays? I'll bet it's less than 80 PDEW. It's a pretty small local market especially when you have two
88 Joeljack : I checked OMA-MEM Tuesday Sept 25th and I'm still seeing 2x daily in the delta.com timetable and when booking. Where are you seeing the data you're re
89 flyguy89 : I don't think it's so much that as it is more a side-effect of DL's typical price skimming pricing strategy at CVG. They're not nor ever have been in
90 Post contains images slcdeltarumd11 : Its kind of hard to tell deltas strategy here with CVG but i think it will change fast if oil shoots thru the roof so lets hope we dont see a huge sp
91 Post contains images FutureUScapt : The Tuesday cuts are CVG centric; the new Saturday cuts are all MEM centric. In other words, try checking CVG-OMA on 25Sep or MEM-OMA on 29Sep.
92 mayor : Seem like nitpicking, but actually, it's 1x737-800 and 1xA320.........that's the current schedule and the schedule change in Sept.
93 JayinKitsap : I flew SEA-SLC-MEM on Delta (& connector) the end of May. SEA-SLC was sold out, SLC-MEM was pretty full going out but like 1/2 full coming back. G
94 alggag : Yes if you count FL, not there yet as WN. MEM did survive the station cuts so WN is coming at some point in the next year or two.
95 Cubsrule : I'm not saying it's huge, nor am I saying that they are necessarily making money on the route. What I'm saying is that if you want to foment business
96 Post contains images MaverickM11 : Westbound. Eastbound it's two 320s, at least this week
97 tommy767 : SEA is seasonal for certain. Very sad to see MEM go like this. I flew LAX-MEM-EWR in April 2010 and it was still bustling around the 6pm bank. Now th
98 FlyPNS1 : But how many business passengers from CVG need to go to IAH? Just because IAH is a big city doesn't mean lots of people in CVG want to go there. Judg
99 F9animal : Yes! LOL! Stupid auto correct. Constantly having to correct auto correct!
100 Post contains images izbtmnhd : Whichever the reason? Yet, you clearly said economics. Smisek just made your original comment look schoolboy foolish. Canton is 50 miles from Clevela
101 Cubsrule : I don't see the math. Cleveland + Akron/Canton MSAs are about 3.1 million. Cincinnati + Dayton + Springfield MSAs are about the same. Moreover, to yo
102 Jetmatt777 : According to the latest timetable update, the following MEM cities end on 12/21/2012. OMA, OKC, TUL, LIT, MSY, DFW, CVG, DSM, CLE, TPA, IAH, AUS, SAT,
103 FutureUScapt : It's not an error per se, but these aren't permanent discontinuations as it stands now. DL is implementing a reduced schedule in MEM over the trough
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