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Status Of LOT's SP-LPC: To Be Sold  
User currently offlinehoya From United States of America, joined Jun 2004, 397 posts, RR: 0
Posted (2 years 1 month 3 weeks 4 days 14 hours ago) and read 7718 times:

There have been posts in the past asking about the status of SP-LPC, LO's 767 that performed the belly landing in WAW last year. The plane will be sold, either to a museum or for scrap.

News article (in Polish): http://www.tvn24.pl/lot-sprzedaje-bo...alosci-lub-na-czesci,261056,s.html

Basics:
-Took months of negotiations to determine status of the aircraft
-LO had to pay for maintenance and the leasing fees to Air Castle, the lessor (aircraft was leased until 2015). Lufthansa Group was the insurer.
-Final settlement to LO was in millions of dollars, but it still didn't cover LO's losses, and LO ended up buying the aircraft as part of the settlement.
-Minimum bid will be in the 'millions' of dollars, and as of now there are at least six interested parties, including a museum.
-Aircraft may be sold intact or in parts.
-Aircraft will not fly again, and LO has begun the process of deregistering the aircraft.
-LO will have a farewell ceremony for the aircraft.


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Photo © Jan Ostrowski



[Edited 2012-06-27 01:57:31]

[Edited 2012-06-27 02:48:37]


Hoya Saxa!!
36 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlinena From Germany, joined Dec 1999, 10677 posts, RR: 9
Reply 1, posted (2 years 1 month 3 weeks 4 days 13 hours ago) and read 7598 times:

Thanks for the update! This marks the 14th writoff of a 767.

User currently offlinecat3dual From United States of America, joined Jun 2012, 73 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (2 years 1 month 3 weeks 4 days 10 hours ago) and read 7154 times:

What ever happened to the pilots? Are they still working for LO?

[Edited 2012-06-27 06:21:14]

User currently offlineDelta777Jet From Germany, joined Jun 2000, 1249 posts, RR: 3
Reply 3, posted (2 years 1 month 3 weeks 4 days 2 hours ago) and read 6581 times:

Quoting cat3dual (Reply 2):

What ever happened to the pilots? Are they still working for LO?

Of course, they were declared national heros by the president of Poland.



Fly easyJet
User currently offlinecat3dual From United States of America, joined Jun 2012, 73 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (2 years 1 month 3 weeks 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 6449 times:

Quoting Delta777Jet (Reply 3):
Of course, they were declared national heros by the president of Poland.

Interesting, thanks.  


User currently offlinespiritair97 From United States of America, joined Jan 2011, 1231 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (2 years 1 month 3 weeks 3 days 23 hours ago) and read 6257 times:

Sad for the plane. Whats funny is that I happen to be listening to "Fighter" by Gym Class Heroes while reading this. It is the perfect song for it.

User currently offlineDeltaB717 From Australia, joined Jun 2012, 444 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (2 years 1 month 3 weeks 3 days 22 hours ago) and read 6224 times:
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That's a shame it came to that. What does that mean for their network? Will they lease/buy a replacement or wait for the 787s (doesn't seem like their leased replacement from Aerosvit happened?)?

User currently offlinespiritair97 From United States of America, joined Jan 2011, 1231 posts, RR: 0
Reply 7, posted (2 years 1 month 3 weeks 3 days 22 hours ago) and read 6211 times:

What did ever happen to their leased replacment?

User currently offlineba319-131 From United Kingdom, joined Jan 2001, 8527 posts, RR: 54
Reply 8, posted (2 years 1 month 3 weeks 3 days 15 hours ago) and read 5993 times:
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Quoting Delta777Jet (Reply 9):
Sadly this event could have been easily avoided by checking the fuses behind the F/O seat and moving his pilot suitcase little away to be able to see all fuses. This was the first thing maintenance did on the ground and the gear came out without any problem !

- Now this is interesting, must have missed this, makes the whole accident pilot/crew error



111,732,3,4,5,7,8,BBJ,741,742,743,744,752,762,763,764,772,77L,773,77W,L15,D10,30,40,AB3,AB6,A312.313,319,320,321,332,333
User currently offlineba286 From United States of America, joined Jul 2006, 114 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (2 years 1 month 3 weeks 3 days 15 hours ago) and read 5962 times:

Quoting ba319-131 (Reply 10):
- Now this is interesting, must have missed this, makes the whole accident pilot/crew error

If it can be confirmed, that is.



E190 A318 A319 A320 A343 ATR42 717 732 733 734 735 737 738 744 752 772 DC-10 MD-11
User currently offlinepsimpson From United Kingdom, joined May 2006, 320 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (2 years 1 month 3 weeks 3 days 11 hours ago) and read 5405 times:

Quoting DeltaB717 (Reply 7):
That's a shame it came to that. What does that mean for their network? Will they lease/buy a replacement or wait for the 787s (doesn't seem like their leased replacement from Aerosvit happened?)?

Lot will wait for the B787 as a replacement for the B767 SP-LPC.
They are however wet-leasing Aerosvit B767-300ER UR-AAH for some flight to Toronto and Hanoi See below link.
I have view this Aerosvit B767-300ER on a number of occasions on the Planeplotter MLAT network operating LOT042
CYYZ-EPWA
http://www.flightglobal.com/airspace...n-additional-boeing-767-80046.aspx


User currently offlinejreuschl From United States of America, joined Jul 2009, 545 posts, RR: 0
Reply 11, posted (2 years 1 month 3 weeks 3 days 11 hours ago) and read 5370 times:

If this was all caused by fuses, isn't there a manual override that would bypass the fuses?

User currently offlinelonghauler From Canada, joined Mar 2004, 4926 posts, RR: 43
Reply 12, posted (2 years 1 month 3 weeks 3 days 10 hours ago) and read 5288 times:

Quoting ba319-131 (Reply 8):
Now this is interesting, must have missed this, makes the whole accident pilot/crew error


Sincerely, I don't know how you could have missed this, it was a huge issue during the investigation. It was confirmed that the electric alternate gear extension was not successful as a result of the open circuit breaker.

But, as a (B767) pilot, I think the bigger issue was when did the circuit breaker open? Was it open for the duration of the flight? Was it open for several flights, but unmissed ... until it was needed? Or (what would be my concern) did it pop during the first attempted electric alternate gear extension, indicating a problem in the system?

Something for which I never did get an answer: Was it legal, after the loss of a hydraulic system to continue across the Atlantic, on an ETOPS flight? I understand that Polish law is different. Under Canadian Air Regs, an ETOPS flight could not be performed under such a failure.



Never gonna grow up, never gonna slow down .... Barefoot Blue Jean Night
User currently offlinespiritair97 From United States of America, joined Jan 2011, 1231 posts, RR: 0
Reply 13, posted (2 years 1 month 3 weeks 3 days 10 hours ago) and read 5284 times:

I'm surprised AeroSvit leased out the only 767 with the new colorscheme and winglets. I would think that they would want that plane being recognized in their own regions.

User currently offlinedcaviation From United States of America, joined Aug 2011, 198 posts, RR: 0
Reply 14, posted (2 years 1 month 3 weeks 3 days 9 hours ago) and read 5247 times:

Actually this is on the front pages of today's papers in Poland.
LOT hired two law firms (one British and one US).
LOT will sue Boeing and American company who undertakes service of LOT's B767s at Newark.
LOT said that they will not sue capt. Wrona and rest of the heroic crew.

Unfortunately this article is only in Polish.

http://wiadomosci.gazeta.pl/wiadomos...Wrony_stoja_potezne_prawnicze.html


User currently offlinespiritair97 From United States of America, joined Jan 2011, 1231 posts, RR: 0
Reply 15, posted (2 years 1 month 3 weeks 3 days 9 hours ago) and read 5235 times:

Quoting dcaviation (Reply 14):
LOT will sue Boeing and American company who undertakes service of LOT's B767s at Newark.

I'm surprised they have not done this already. Though I guess they had to figure out their losses and other things that might make a difference in court.

Quoting dcaviation (Reply 14):
LOT said that they will not sue capt. Wrona and rest of the heroic crew.

Good. They do not deserve to be sued. They did save the lives of everybody on the plane.


User currently offlinen471wn From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 1526 posts, RR: 2
Reply 16, posted (2 years 1 month 3 weeks 3 days 6 hours ago) and read 5108 times:
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Quoting spiritair97 (Reply 15):
Good. They do not deserve to be sued. They did save the lives of everybody on the plane.

No but they should no longer fly when they did not know to reset the curcuit breakers


User currently offlinespiritair97 From United States of America, joined Jan 2011, 1231 posts, RR: 0
Reply 17, posted (2 years 1 month 3 weeks 3 days 5 hours ago) and read 5034 times:

Quoting n471wn (Reply 16):
No but they should no longer fly when they did not know to reset the curcuit breakers

Yes, or they could just undergo retraining to make sure they know how to do everythnig. Not jus tthem, but all of the 767 crews. Just to make sure.


User currently offlinelonghauler From Canada, joined Mar 2004, 4926 posts, RR: 43
Reply 18, posted (2 years 1 month 3 weeks 3 days 5 hours ago) and read 5022 times:

Quoting n471wn (Reply 16):
No but they should no longer fly when they did not know to reset the circuit breakers

It is SOP at most airlines NOT to reset a popped circuit breaker. In this instance, I could see many reasons NOT to reset that particular circuit breaker.

Also remember, the flight circled Warsaw for about an hour, conferring with their maintenance experts. The subject of that circuit breaker was not brought up.

Curiously enough, that circuit breaker is not labeled "Alternate gear extension", it is labeled something completely different, as it protects more than one circuit. If during troubleshooting, one were to see it popped, one might also think it had something to do with the hydraulic issue 7 hours earlier. And ... not knowing exactly what it does ... it would take a brave soul to just merrily push it back in with fingers crossed!



Never gonna grow up, never gonna slow down .... Barefoot Blue Jean Night
User currently offlinecat3dual From United States of America, joined Jun 2012, 73 posts, RR: 0
Reply 19, posted (2 years 1 month 3 weeks 3 days 5 hours ago) and read 5022 times:

If the choice was between resetting a popped circuit breaker and landing my heavy 767 on its belly, I would opt to reset the circuit breaker every time.

"Heroic crew" - give me a break.

Herp derp.


User currently offlinespiritair97 From United States of America, joined Jan 2011, 1231 posts, RR: 0
Reply 20, posted (2 years 1 month 3 weeks 3 days 5 hours ago) and read 5000 times:

Quoting cat3dual (Reply 19):
"Heroic crew" - give me a break.

They were heroic in a way, in the same way that Captain Sully is a hero. It is not so much because of what they did, but how they did it. Many pilots could have attempted that belly landing, but these pilots pulled it off flawlessly. They saved 231 lives that day and I think it is wrong of you to dispel there actions that day the way you did.


User currently offlineKLASM83 From United States of America, joined Aug 2005, 628 posts, RR: 0
Reply 21, posted (2 years 1 month 3 weeks 3 days 5 hours ago) and read 4988 times:

If I was stupidly rich, I'd buy this 763 and turn it into a wide airplane mansion.   

At least LOT has some clear direction on where to go, now with LPC and how to get some of the $ it lost with its unfortunate landing.



Don't you want to hang out and waste your life with us?
User currently offlinespiritair97 From United States of America, joined Jan 2011, 1231 posts, RR: 0
Reply 22, posted (2 years 1 month 3 weeks 3 days 5 hours ago) and read 4984 times:

Quoting KLASM83 (Reply 21):

If I was stupidly rich, I'd buy this 763 and turn it into a wide airplane mansion.

Good idea, if I were rich, I'd probably fight ya for it  


User currently offlinecat3dual From United States of America, joined Jun 2012, 73 posts, RR: 0
Reply 23, posted (2 years 1 month 3 weeks 3 days 4 hours ago) and read 4933 times:

How a trans-atlantic ETOPS flight was allowed to continue with the center hydraulic system failed departing EWR is beyond me. Needless to say, LOT isn't on my list of airlines to fly on as a passenger.

Any other carrier would've turned around immediately and put the plane on the deck at the departure point. It calls into question the safety culture there. "Get-there-itis" no doubt played a role, given how far stretched the LOT 767 fleet is - they only have a handful of airframes and the pressure to get the bird back to WAW probably played a role. They got it back to WAW alright, on its belly.

You're right. They were heroic in that their ineptitude in piloting SP-LPC didn't result in the deaths of 231 lives.

[Edited 2012-06-28 11:33:39]

User currently offlinedcaviation From United States of America, joined Aug 2011, 198 posts, RR: 0
Reply 24, posted (2 years 1 month 3 weeks 3 days 4 hours ago) and read 4864 times:

Quoting cat3dual (Reply 23):
How a trans-atlantic ETOPS flight was allowed to continue with the center hydraulic system failed departing EWR is beyond me. Needless to say, LOT isn't on my list of airlines to fly on as a passenger.

Any other carrier would've turned around immediately and put the plane on the deck at the departure point. It calls into question the safety culture there. "Get-there-itis" no doubt played a role, given how far stretched the LOT 767 fleet is - they only have a handful of airframes and the pressure to get the bird back to WAW probably played a role. They got it back to WAW alright, on its belly.

You're right. They were heroic in that their ineptitude in piloting SP-LPC didn't result in the deaths of 231 lives.

Get your facts straight before you start mumbling nonsense here. Read the report first, then talk here.


25 cat3dual : What facts do I not have straight? 1. The crew opted to fly across the ocean with degraded hydraulic systems. This alone did not cripple the airplane
26 longhauler : Not saying you are wrong ... but a few points to ponder ... There is a possibility of a center hydraulic system leak, where the fluid remained? Who k
27 Post contains images PHX787 : Sad to see it go That photo taken of the evacuation is going to be #1 on the photos for months, i think.
28 dcaviation : 1. According to LOT's manual. It was safe to continue to its destination. 2. The plane landed belly DOWN. If it landed belly UP, probably nobody woul
29 cat3dual : LOL, good point. You got me there but you understand what I was getting at. Is it safe to fly the 767 with the center system failed? Sure. Should you
30 bennett123 : What I find puzzling is that this issue was fixed so quickly when the plane was on it's belly at Warsaw, but the crew + maintenance had hours to fix i
31 cat3dual : If there is exposed wiring in the area of the hydraulic components, I shudder to think of the maintenance practices underway in the LOT hangars.
32 cat3dual : Exactly. If there was pooling hydraulic fluid around exposed electrical components, the c/b would have tripped immediately ASSUMING the exposed elect
33 Post contains images airliner777 : I've seen this happen twice on our B767s. Always keep an eye at the RAT C/B on the P6 panel. It is very exposed due to its location. Fly safe! Airlin
34 RVV2011 : That's assuming they knew that they lost the hydraulic system and that it was indeed lost prior to the crossing. Some questions: Is a system fault th
35 cat3dual : I'm glad you chimed in here. When I saw the video of SP-LPC belly landing for the first time, I immediately thought of this panel and its exposed c/b
36 Post contains links kwidenka : Yes it did happen,not long after the accident. UR-AAH & UR-AAI are regular in WAW and I believe is mostly deployed on the WAW-YYZ service. http:/
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